Forums > Beginner Poi Moves > idea involving antispin and flowers

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oli
not with cactus
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devo...
Member Since: 24th Jul 2003
Total posts: 2052
Posted:ok this is one for those of you into your long arm stuff. i cant do this, dont even know if its doable, last night was feeling thoughtful and i thought it should be doable.



what i reckon would be cool. is both arms doing same time same direction long arm circles with lockouts every 90 degress, but with one poi going one way and the other going the other way. so basically one arm is doing antispin and the other isnt.



this possible? id like to know what it looks like.



you could do arms going different ways and poi going same way to.


Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

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DeepSoulSheep
DeepSoulSheep

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Berlin
Member Since: 25th Sep 2002
Total posts: 2617
Posted:Both of these are easier than arm same direction anti-spin flowers...for me anyway.

The most difficult is arms going opposite ways and poi going opposite ways to arms. IE buttefly arms and butterfly poi with both anti-spinning....don't I'll get that soon me thinks... smile


I live in a world of infinite possibilities.

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Dentrassi
Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane
Member Since: 9th Apr 2003
Total posts: 3044
Posted:i vaguely remember thinking about something similar to this spontaneously one during a spin ages ago, and did it perfectly once.

ive never been able to do it smoothly since though, then again, i havent had time to practice poi for a many months... *le sigh*


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:Ok, I've been practicing these for the past few days, working on all the possible combinations I can think of and yes, some I find more difficult than others but that's why I've been practicing. But what I can't help wondering is,,,,,,do the different variations of direction look and different? I mean does spinning both poi forward while making big arm circles forward look and different than say spinning both poi forward while spinning both arms backward?

I also do a butterfly version of this move, the "easy" way but I have been practicing the anti spin variation as well, but just practicing it for the sake of ,,,well,,,practice but I really can't picture myself performing any but the " easy" ways with fire

Am I selling myself short here?


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[Nx?]
[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Member Since: 5th Nov 2001
Total posts: 3749
Posted:yes.

yes and yes.

anti spinning works all ways, and butterfly spin with weave arms is freaky, and paralell arms even more so.

stout, it does look a lot diffrent, uh huh.

i think ive only got turning splitime anti spin to go, but it will be next year again before its all smooth.

t wave


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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:You can see these butterfly/chase flowers in action in Dervishly Yers...

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We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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oli
not with cactus
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devo...
Member Since: 24th Jul 2003
Total posts: 2052
Posted:no - these arnt on dervishly yers i dont think, this is arms doing weave, poi doing butterfly. or opposite, so only one poi is antispinning.

or i might not have watched dervishly yers properly.


Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:Yes, its definately on Dervishly Yers. Check again smile



EDIT: Check it out at 0:53

EDITED_BY: ICoN (1098651670)


Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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oli
not with cactus
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devo...
Member Since: 24th Jul 2003
Total posts: 2052
Posted:o yea... smile with split time arms?

thanks


Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:Ok, thanks for the input I'll keep practicing these then, and coincidentaly it was Nick who turned me on to these longarm techniques last week and I never posed the why question to him. I got the forwards with antispin no problem but the backwards with antispin sure feels like I'm violating some law of nature,,,but it's comming, I think.

I find it's most comfortable to do six circles per arm rotation, I can't get the hang of four,,dunno why,,, but I'll work on that too as I have another pattern I'm working on that's kinda similar but involves short poi , the butterfly, the butterfly buzzsaw and making a combination of these moves into a larger circle spun in front.

Sorry if that didn't make any sense, but if the antispin on longarm looks different than no antispin then I'll find a way to work it into my fire routine rather than just keeping it as a drill for controlling my planes. Now for the longarm butterfly variations,,,with turns you say, this'll keep my busy

Cheers


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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:the bf/chase flower patterns are hardcore - one poi has to speed up if you want the wicks to keep meeting in the middle.



check the discussion in the jedi set maybe?



never seen your last suggestion spun though oli: "you could do arms going different ways and poi going same way".

now that would be a headf*ck...



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i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dunc
Dunc

playing the days away
Location: The Middle lands
Member Since: 19th Aug 2003
Total posts: 7263
Posted:I've been practising the "arms going the same way and poi going different ways" infront of my in butterfly, it's actually nice and easy, but long arm and "arms going different and poi going same way" fries my brain and refusing shoulder muscles into submission!

Let's relight this forum ubblove

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Durbs
Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Member Since: 23rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 5688
Posted:My shoulders are weird and physically can't do this with any neatness frown

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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:nah man - i reckon having weird shoulders is a prerequisite for doing this.

it certainly isn't within a body's normal range of movement and getting your shoulders that supple takes *ages*.

i can't do it and keep clean planes and i know only a handful of people that can...

my shoulders go crunch anyway from doing too much longarm into ww type stuff.


*repeats matra*
must, warm, up...
*repeats matra*


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dunc
Dunc

playing the days away
Location: The Middle lands
Member Since: 19th Aug 2003
Total posts: 7263
Posted:Written by: coleman

it certainly isn't within a body's normal range of movement and getting your shoulders that supple takes *ages*.




Now I don't agree with this, I think it's well within the "normal" range of shoulder movement it's just the activity of doing it that's hard. The brain is programmed and muscle memory is a hard thing to fight but if you do the arms without the poi it's snatch! But your brain fights all the way thinking it's doing the right thing cuz it's been going normal ways for soooo long


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Durbs
Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Member Since: 23rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Hyper-mobile joints - "Dey is fooked"

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fluffy napalm fairy
fluffy napalm fairy

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Brum / Dorset / Fairy Land
Member Since: 12th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3638
Posted:long arm antispin split time butterflies suck.

Geologists do it in the dirt................ spank

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Durbs
Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Member Since: 23rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Agreed

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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
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Posted:dunc - i reckon they aren't something your body can just do if you just think about it hard enough.

for some people, quite a bit of stretching will be needed before you can get flat planes.



i used to do opposite full arm circles as part of my warm-up back in the day when i wore a gi and stuff.



there were tonnes of people who couldn't physically get their arms to swing in flat planes.



i guess its like the splits - with enough stretching you'll eventually get your balls to touch the floor, but for most people that flexability isn't there naturally.



plus the requirement of the turn makes it a bitch-ass co-ordination issue too like you said.


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Durbs
Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Member Since: 23rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Written by: coleman

there were tonnes of people who couldn't physically get their arms to swing in flat planes.




*Raises hand sheepishly*


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Rev
Rev

Bastard Newbie Messiah
Location: Apparently lost in my ego
Member Since: 14th Mar 2003
Total posts: 1269
Posted:Ive found that getting nice straight planes with longarm stuff is all in the torso...

itf you angle your torso 15 degrees left, it helps your left arm get a clean rear part.. and then turn so that your torso is 15 degrees right and you get a clean rear plane on the right side.. wihtout having to have limber shoulders... think of using your arms like the oar in a kayak..

by onyl turnning that little bit you get straightplanes while stillfacingthe same direction.. hardly noticeable methinks.. but methinks a lot wrong too wink..


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[Nx?]
[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Member Since: 5th Nov 2001
Total posts: 3749
Posted:so, cole, what was it you wanted to see?

I got all the variations solid now..... wink

tomorow i will be looking at antispin buzzsaw fountains ubbloco

T wave


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:I would really like to see a vid or animation of an anti spin move aside from extensions/flowers. I just cant picture an anti spin weave or TTN and even with all the great explanations, I just cant understand. Anti-spin long arm stuff is understandable but I really dont get normal ones. I do one move that I THINK might be half of an anti-spin weave but Im not sure and I cant really get myself to do it fluidly on both sides. So if anyone can help me out with a vid/anim, it would be fantastic.

Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

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Rev
Rev

Bastard Newbie Messiah
Location: Apparently lost in my ego
Member Since: 14th Mar 2003
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Posted:hey nix.. how do you antispin a circle.. which is what a buzzsaw is?

antispin needs something to move in relation too... for flowers.. its poi vs arms... in weaves and ttns, its poi vs hand motions (ie. forward weave hands and reverse poi) but a buzzsaw.. well now your just antispinnig a circle.. with no relation to anything.. I mean when I think buzzsaw fountain I think forward buzzsaw, down, rev buzzsaw, up, repeat.. or forward buzzsaw, up, reverse buzzsaw, down...

you can bf weave icon... like the weave hand motions.. butterfly pattern.. if so you have antispin.. take the side with the reverse bf.. the hand that comes over.. is antispinning.. wink


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[Nx?]
[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Member Since: 5th Nov 2001
Total posts: 3749
Posted:rev, you just answered your own question.

"I mean when I think buzzsaw fountain I think forward buzzsaw, down, rev buzzsaw, up, repeat.. or forward buzzsaw, up, reverse buzzsaw, down... "

the second of thease two is antispin, think about it.

T wave


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: [Nx?
]
so, cole, what was it you wanted to see?

I got all the variations solid now..... wink

tomorow i will be looking at antispin buzzsaw fountains ubbloco

T wave



*all* the variations!
nice one tom hug

i can spin antispin buzzsaw fountains tho biggrin
and anti-spin fountains but i've been able to do both of those for ages.

i can't do any of the rest of this anti-spin lark except a few beats of an anti-spin flower.

what i really wanna see is what an anti-spin weave looks like...


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Rev
Rev

Bastard Newbie Messiah
Location: Apparently lost in my ego
Member Since: 14th Mar 2003
Total posts: 1269
Posted:damn it... I kinda figured that was what you meant nx but here I was thinking that people did those already.. and I guess I've always just thought of them as doing a buzzsaw fountain and a rev buzzsaw fountain rather than a normal and antispin..



sigh..



I need to see if this antispi stuff works with split threading.. and if split threading works with same direction ttns.. crap... ignore this last bit.. I don't mean to derail the topic..


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"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
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