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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:Quite simple in Theory but difficult in practice:

One hand spinning 3 Beat Weave (1left : 2right) the other 5 Beat (2left : 3right)
all together (5+3)/2 = 4 Beat Weave isnt it ubbloco
HOP Beat-Commissioner NYC - whats your oppinion ?
Havent got it down really clean yet, but working on it ... anybody with me ?

cheers

andy


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .

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meep
SILVER Member since Jul 2004

....
Location: Midlands - nr cov

Total posts: 344
Posted:That's called "can't quite do 5 beat on both sides" ubblol

(at least, it's what my 5beat looked like for ages biggrin)


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:if you do a 3 beat and then transition to a 5 beat, you actually have a single 4 beat weave on one side in between. the 5th beat doesn't come till you already have the extra twist from the otherside to unwrap. so what you are descibing is alternating 3 beats and 4 beats (so (3+4)/2 = 3.5!). the transition from 5 beat down to 3 beat also includes a single 4 beat weave. it is not possible to do continuous 4 beat weaves though.

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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

veteran
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:Written by: vanize

it is not possible to do continuous 4 beat weaves though.



that's not true, i can


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:oops - actually you are totally correct! silly me - just have to wrap on one side and unwrap on the other without wrapping again, repeat ad nauseum!



it isn't symmetric though - which is sort of what I meant... er, I mean, yeah, that's what I meant - you can't do a symmetric 4 beat continuously!



(... I think...) redface



well, or course you can do a symmetric 4 beat butterfly weave, but I wasn't talking about butterfly weaves.


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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

veteran
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:that makes no sense to me whatsoever biggrin ubbloco

i find all this definition and terminology malarky so difficult to follow. when i learn a new trick i depend on muscle memory. my hands remember what they're supposed to do, but it won't actually register in my brain until sometimes months later. that's one of the reason's i can never teach anyone a trick i've just recently learned.

in fact the whole "am i doing 4 beats or 5 confused" drove me quite demented at the beginning ubblol

i can't explain what i do in the same way that you guys can, but i can definitely do a continuous 4bt and continuous 5bt weave, though only forwards....


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:so now I wonder if you are doing 5 beats and 7 beats instead of 4 and 5s? confused ubbloco

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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

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Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:hmmm.... now there's a thought.... biggrin ubblol

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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:Written by:
so what you are descibing is alternating 3 beats and 4 beats (so (3+4)/2 = 3.5!).


Not quite. I am talking about a x:y weave here: The one hand is spinning 5/3 faster than the other. In the time my left hand does 3 circles the right does 5.
One "round" would therefore be 8 full circles aka a 4 beat weave . . .


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:I also agree that the whole moves definitions thing is pretty much like trying to heard cats and also is never particularly enlightening once things get beyond the basics except to the person doing the describing and maybe a few others whose synapses fire ina similar pattern. But I also think that mentally analysing moves in some form or another does help you see what things are related and sometimes even opens up whole new doors of perception into poi moves. I find that I can perfect moves faster if I try to teach them to other soon after beginning to work on them.



But when I read an advanced poi moves thread, I usually can't decipher what is going on even even if I know the move. what I do get out of it is generally an inspiration for a totally different move because of my misinterpretations!


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

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Location: Austin, Texas

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Posted:never mind - I see what you are saying.
EDITED_BY: vanize (1093870995)


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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:Written by:
unless you are are doing something really insane



It is


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:ok, but I wouldn't call that a 4 beat weave since that means something else.



just tried what you are talking about. so to clarify, you are doing 3 beats with you your right on the left side (for example) and two with the right on the right side, and two with the left hand on the right side and one on the left?



we can certainly call that something besides a 4 beat weave!



edit: now that I think about it, I played with that like a year ago and forgot about it...

EDITED_BY: vanize (1093871378)


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:maybe should call it a "5:3 weave"?
so then you could have right handed and left handed forward and backward 5:3 weaves.

of course I bet coleman and spiralx or someone else will have a name for it already.


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:hey! it's really cool when you shift back and forth between right and left handed 5:3 weaves.



of course I doubt a layman could see what was special about it, but fun for us!



edit: also nice if you isolate the transitions between the faster hand. (I'd better stop now - my co-workers caught me doing sock poi in the break room!).

EDITED_BY: vanize (1093872346)


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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

veteran
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:ubblol ubblol ubblol
the day my electro-glo's arrived i was caught practicing in the dispatch area with all the lights off ! ubblol the guy who walked in was quite impressed though.....


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spritie
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

spritie

Pooh-Bah
Location: Galveston, TX

Total posts: 2014
Posted:The easiest way for all your coworkers (and bosses) to know about spinning poi is to have an article with lots of pictures appear in the local paper. I'm labeled around here as the girl with the cool hobbies, and everyone I work with now wants to see me spin fire because they all think it would be so cool. So, now I have to arrange a gathering for my friends to meet my bosses and everyone I work with -eek! eek I'm open to suggestions as to how to make that one go smoothly (and to top it off, I'm thinking of doing it on my 30th b-day).

I also agree with both you and Vanize that the technical discussion of moves is complicated for my head to get a grasp on. It's so much easier to just make stuff up on your own than worrying about what you are doing is called, or how to do it properly. If it feels good to you, and others think it looks neat, then it works for me.


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Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001

Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England

Total posts: 5688
Posted:Anyone else think it's funny that Vanize speaks to himself alot? wink ubblol

Anyway, just to clarify - this is 5:3 weave not a 4-beat isn't it?


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spritie
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

spritie

Pooh-Bah
Location: Galveston, TX

Total posts: 2014
Posted:I think it's better than talking to inanimate objects, which I seem to be afflicted with. biggrin

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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:It is a 5:3 - but 4 in average wink

Anybody really playing with these? 2:1 is already hard to get clean imo
Small but significant riddle: What is the difference between a 2:1 parallel and splittime weave ?

vuu


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .

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Rev
BRONZE Member since Mar 2003

Rev

Bastard Newbie Messiah
Location: Apparently lost in my ego

Total posts: 1269
Posted:Written by: vanize


- you can't do a symmetric 4 beat continuously!





that's debatable... I really don't believe in the 5bt 3bt viewpoint on 4bt weaves.. save the one andy poses here.. I mean when you do a normal 4bt weave.. you are doing 4bts per side not 5 and 3... even though that's how the motions feel..



nice one andy...



though I do call my offset weaves (the ones that are both hands done a 5bt right and a 3bt left side) 5-3 but thats just me.. perhaps we should say something to note that itsa two different weaves.. and not two different beats side weaves..


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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:Written by: Faberg

in fact the whole "am i doing 4 beats or 5 confused" drove me quite demented at the beginning ubblol




That still is driving me mad!! I can't count the beats (although I know how to... i read it in FAQ bit like a good girl biggrin) I'm just... rubbish at counting it seems and i go through various phases of thinking that my weave is 4 bt for a week, and trying to do something with extra beats, and then the next week deciding that maybe it is the 5bt anyway and there's no point in bothering with the extra beats because my retarded left wrist doesn't like it..... if a 4 bt continuous weave is not possible, then its a 5bt and i don't have to worry about it no more.............. or i just carry on as i am, and end up inventing an amazing arm twisty weave which i shall call the "shoulder dislocation weave" and become famous for it biggrin


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:Written by: Rev


Written by: vanize


- you can't do a symmetric 4 beat continuously!





that's debatable...





and I think that debate would probably be entirely dependant on differences in definitions! ubbloco ubbloco ubbloco



we just all need live video hook up in the poi moves section! then we wouldn't argue at all!



edit: well, I guess we'd still argue about what to call something, but at least we'd all know what we are arguing about!

EDITED_BY: vanize (1093952999)


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_Clare_
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002

_Clare_

Still wiggling
Location: Belfast

Total posts: 5967
Posted:Hey Andy, how are you this weather?



Hope all is well and you're having fun in SE Asia... I can't really picture this move, but no doubt it's funky and Jedi-like - will hopefully be out your way in the new year, so maybe you'll show me then biggrin



Take care, safe travels

Clare

xx


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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:Written by:
how are you this weather?

I know my english sucks biggrin so what does this mean? And not SE Asia, but almost as good - enjoying the amazing Barcelona at the moment! Looking forward to see you in the city of Angels, or at some amazing beach, or in the hills, or . . . ubblove Thailand!

Back to the topic:
Split-timing moves (ok, that name would be bad as well i think wink how you call them?) are fun and are becoming more and more imprtant for me. The problem is to keep the timing really clean, everything else looks sloppy! Just to speed up one Poi and slowing it down again while the other spins constant looks quite nice too (other people say so).

Still: What is the difference between a 2:1 parallel and splittime weave tongue ?

salut


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_Clare_
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002

_Clare_

Still wiggling
Location: Belfast

Total posts: 5967
Posted:Lol, sorry Andy, 'how are you this weather' just means 'how's things' or 'how are you?' biggrin I'm back in Ireland now, so am getting back to using all the phrases ubblol

What are you doing in Barcelona?! Hope you have a great time and let me know if you're coming over to Ireland!! I'm going back to Thailand (or maybe India) in January, so hopefully we can meet up somewhere.

Split time moves are important to you because you can do everything else - backwards and inside out biggrin
It's so hard to keep control of the split-time thing unless you're in front of a mirror and can see what you're doing, I think anyways. But then, I'm nowhere near getting the control you have redface

And I'd love to give you an answer, but I didn't even understand the question!! ubblol Are 2:1 parallel and split-time weave not the same thing?!!!

Take care and good luck
Clare xx


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Rev
BRONZE Member since Mar 2003

Rev

Bastard Newbie Messiah
Location: Apparently lost in my ego

Total posts: 1269
Posted:oops... I forgot...

1- there is offset weaves... which could be 5:3
2- there are ratio weaves... which could be 5:3
3- then there is this weirdness... which could be 5:3

off topic:
and vanize... it all comes down to the same problem I had with many descriptions.. as much as people loathe to look at it this way it is entirely mathematical (multivariable) and must be discussed in terms of some variable.. which is essentially where we all get confused.. see the above... and so yes a 4bt can be done symetrically as in 4bts per side.. as opposed to asymetrical which would be one of those above things.. now... when you talk with respect to hand movements.. its still can be argued symetrical or asymetrcial and still have merit.. about the only way I've ever understood the "it not symetrical" is if you say that each hand does the exact same hand motion (in relation to each other on each side) rather then each side.. that's all that I meant by the comment "its debatable"

we now return you to your previously scheduled thread nonsense.. wink


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Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
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"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown

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MikeIcon
GOLD Member since Mar 2003

MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA

Total posts: 2109
Posted:Written by:
you can't do a symmetric 4 beat continuously!



That is 100% false. I can do a symmetrical 4 beat continuously but theres a trick to it. Cookie to the first person to figure it out tongue



PS - It doesnt involve oddly timed beats either. Just a straight split time symmetrical 4 beat weave continuously.


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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne

Total posts: 2830
Posted:I show my ignorance,

and suggest that its all just singles and doubles.



rolleyes


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:...or a technicality based on something different than what I meant (which was meant to only refer to the basic weave and nothing fancy-schmancy that you could call a weave)...

so no cookie for me - especially if it really is from a basic weave.

rev: good summary of what I meant to say but didn't have the brain power to articulate!


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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:if what i am in fact doing is not 5bt weave like a suspect it might be then it's a 4 bt weave, and it's entirely possible to do a continuous one which has equal beats on each side......... if the truth be told, i don't know what it is, so i shall remove my person from this debate, as of now.... weavesmiley if only there was a 4bt and a 5bt smiley too, then we'd all have the answer biggrin

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