SpinnerofDetroit
SpinnerofDetroit

All High Dude, Ruler of What You Want
Location: Trenton, MI, USA
Member Since: 25th Oct 2009
Total posts: 2280
Posted:Ok, I have 0 experience choreographing and I would like to know. How do you go about choreographing a routine to a song? How do you put it down on paper? What kind of format do you write it in? It has me stumped because there's no way I can just start making one from doing moves and building on it because I won't remember unless it's written down, and I have no idea how to go about doing this. If you have a written example of something you did that would help a lot.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass grin

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This Jaded Flesh
This Jaded Flesh

One soul is as good as another...
Location: England, Durham
Member Since: 30th Oct 2009
Total posts: 323
Posted:Have you read any of the few books on poi? Some have good sections regarding the subject. Most songs are created on a 4by4. You must map out the song according to its beats and points of interest and build your routine around said map. There's no need to have it all down on paper. As long as you know your sequence the timing will find itself. No doubt you'll change alot at the begining, but don't get discouraged about it. Pick a song not that you like, but one you're indifferent too. Otherwise you'll be jaded as quick as though you hated it in the begining. Treat it as a business and not play. Fun can come after you've layed the foundation of the work.

"I may lack virtue, but I'm penitent"

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SpinnerofDetroit
SpinnerofDetroit

All High Dude, Ruler of What You Want
Location: Trenton, MI, USA
Member Since: 25th Oct 2009
Total posts: 2280
Posted:Umm, is there a beginner way? XD I was thinking about writing down a list of moves or descriptions of what I'm doing and how many cycles I do it and keep building and when I do it, just do it to the beat of the song, which what I planned it to be is "Shake It" by Gaudi because it would be easy.such as somewhere in there something like:
...
Extended Windmill x5
Vertical whirl in circle x3
...
That was a couple of things I thought on, would that work for something not really complicated?


The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass grin

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This Jaded Flesh
This Jaded Flesh

One soul is as good as another...
Location: England, Durham
Member Since: 30th Oct 2009
Total posts: 323
Posted:Ummm... Just rock out to the song. Keep an eye on what you are doing and just try to be in sync with the music while you spin. You will in time find a preference to what moves you feel is suitable at a point in the song to perform. You can build your routine that way.

Get familiar with your camcorder. When watching back seriously look objectively as you can to what you see on the screen. As though you were judging for a comp or something. Don't worry about the timing in the beginning. Just the flow of the performance.

How long/many cycles should I spend in this move?
What should I use as a transition to the next move?
What am I aiming for my performance to be? Fast paced? Rigid? Fluid? Shy? Sexual? Reposed?
What are my feet doing?
What is my Face doing?
What are my hands doing? I personally don't like the look at closed fists unless it's necessary but whatever lol



Unless a move looks better with your back towards the imaginary audience try not to spend too much time with your back to them unless you have specifically made a routine or part of it that showcases your body line, to which you shouldn't be wearing a shirt in that case, or atleast something tight.

Seriously, there's so much to say and I'm a terrible teacher. If you can't dance naturally then you're going to find it difficult.

EDITED_BY: This Jaded Flesh (1261365462)


"I may lack virtue, but I'm penitent"

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SpinnerofDetroit
SpinnerofDetroit

All High Dude, Ruler of What You Want
Location: Trenton, MI, USA
Member Since: 25th Oct 2009
Total posts: 2280
Posted:Sometimes I can dance naturally, but sometimes I find it near impossible, like a little while ago, i was in my basement rocking to a song I've never heard and I zoned out and forgot about the headheight ceiling and hit my hand on the tiles.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass grin

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This Jaded Flesh
This Jaded Flesh

One soul is as good as another...
Location: England, Durham
Member Since: 30th Oct 2009
Total posts: 323
Posted:Just remember your body is just as much as the performance as the poi. If your whole body is rigid and only moving when going for a move or turn then it's going to look forced and lack grace. In all seriousness I would point you to watch basically anything involving movement with the body. Not just watch but mess about and try it out. This is where you truly earn your stripes and start to pick up and develop your own style. Anyone can learn to do tricks but no one can learn to move like another. Maybe researching classical art would be good. The nakey kind of art. Develop your own taste, what body forms are pleasing to your eye. and no, not just breasts.

"I may lack virtue, but I'm penitent"

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SpinnerofDetroit
SpinnerofDetroit

All High Dude, Ruler of What You Want
Location: Trenton, MI, USA
Member Since: 25th Oct 2009
Total posts: 2280
Posted:I was actually thinking about making it for a certain person, and from what I've noticed is that you don't need to do anything special at all to impress people when you use fire. But as I get more comfortable with fire, my style will start to shine through. It seems at times to be something along different mixes of, Nick Woolsey, Poiboy (yes I saw some of your vids), Sage, and my old exchange student. And other times none of it and just me prancin around being me. It's usually pretty different every time I get to the point where I zone out and just go with the music. I guess it depends on what I'm listening to.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass grin

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This Jaded Flesh
This Jaded Flesh

One soul is as good as another...
Location: England, Durham
Member Since: 30th Oct 2009
Total posts: 323
Posted:I hope this journey you're on gives you what you seek.

"I may lack virtue, but I'm penitent"

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_Poiboy_
_Poiboy_

bastard child of satan
Location: Raanana, Israel
Member Since: 12th Jan 2004
Total posts: 1113
Posted:SoD, I find it pretty cool being mentioned in the same breath as Nick when it regards body movement and style smile

anyhow, if you can't be bothered to count beats, get music with a few high points, and spin to the general feel of the song, and do big moves whenever there's a big beat.

If you look at my routine here:


It's mostly unchoreographed except for the first 40 seconds or so, but I still try to "hit" all the big beats with big moves. I pay attention to things that stand out in the song, and use whatever I think goes with that point in the song. Once I have a move planned, I add footwork and body movement to it, also according to the song. Even this way of writing takes a lot more time than what I used to do- random moves in order, with barely paying attention to the song.

Another good example is Nick here:


Since his music has a faster beat, and a lot of big beats, he doesn't always do big moves when ever there's a big beat, instead, whenever he does do anything, like stalls or direction changes with the arms, it's always on the beat. I'm not sure whether or not it's choreographed, but he clearly has listened to the song a lot before performing with it.

Yet another good example is Thomas here:


He's great at doing things to music, his moves are perfectly synchronised with the music, and this one's choreographed and awesome.

Last one, G:


This one's perfectly choreographed, G actually makes it seem the music was built around his routine, as he uses every beat and every part of the music to full extent. His footwork is also great here, despite being a floating torso.

I hope these give you some inspiration on routine-writing, good luck smile


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aston
aston

Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
Location: South Africa
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2007
Total posts: 4061
Posted:If you are just trying to get a routine sans music, then just write down some moves and get all of your transitions clean and so on.

I tend to do semi-choreographed stuff: I will have certain points that I want to hit with moves built around them and between will just do what I like for 20 seconds.

eg: 20 seconds to get from here to point x, spinning in split-time opposites. Do set-piece. Then I have 10 seconds to get to point y in same-time.

It might be a worthwhile way to do things.


'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:The *easiest* way to go about it to pick a few key sections in the song and do a significant transition when the music *changes*.

This will give you a starting framework which you can tighten up and make more complicated as develop your routine. The key (IMHO) is to not make it too complicated from the get go.

Good Luck


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SpinnerofDetroit
SpinnerofDetroit

All High Dude, Ruler of What You Want
Location: Trenton, MI, USA
Member Since: 25th Oct 2009
Total posts: 2280
Posted:I like aston's idea the best wink And I've seen all those video's except for G's, I decided I don't like his style in the least bit. And as for Poiboy, some of your style seems to come out when I practice. I still am cleaning up my stalls, but I'm finally getting the hang of them and can finally do the horizontal coming from the bottom, it doesn't look too pretty, but I can do it grin

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass grin

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aston
aston

Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
Location: South Africa
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2007
Total posts: 4061
Posted:I pick the points using Stout's suggestion, but go a few seconds on either side.

As you get more practice I guess you can start cutting down the free time between each one point and end up with a complete routine. Have not bothered myself.


'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland

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Sister Eleven
Sister Eleven

owner of the group property
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 3rd Aug 2009
Total posts: 1277
Posted:Some extremely general tips I got from a member of the group I'm auditioning with may help in addition to what others have noted. The position of your poi, your posture, your position on stage, and the speed of your motions are some of the primary things you can vary with the music. He also said a common choreography trick is to block out "phrases" of movements that flow well and recycle them by repeating them at different angles; it varies their appearance and lets you drag out a short combination into a slightly longer action.

I hope this is good advice, 'cause it's a big part of what I'm basing my approach on. tongue2


p|.q|r:|::s|.s|s:|:.s|q.|:p|s.|.p|s

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Sister Eleven
Sister Eleven

owner of the group property
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 3rd Aug 2009
Total posts: 1277
Posted:Omfg, G's video has some of the most amazing stall work I've ever seen. Drool.

p|.q|r:|::s|.s|s:|:.s|q.|:p|s.|.p|s

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WoodlandApple
WoodlandApple

addict
Location: Australia
Member Since: 1st Dec 2009
Total posts: 474
Posted:a good way to find the beat and timing to music is to look at the sheet music/tab, it shows you pattern breakdown, the beat count, lets you knw if it is upbeat or downbeat focused (raggae music for example is based on the upbeat - in a four beat 1and2and3and4and, the notes are played on the and.)

if you time your poi movements to the beat as well, when your poi head is down its a down beat, up is an upbeat then you will stay in time for the whole song, transition when the song changes chord progression,

you can double the speed of the poi so your head is down on the down and the up beat (8x)

try to avoid 3beat songs for now. You dont have to be able to read sheet music for this either.

if what I have written doesnt make much sence, then another way of putting it is if you are counting the seconds till the next change in the song like people have suggested, then a look at the tab will give you the exact seconds that these things happen.


sticks and stones my break my bones, but ski patrol will save me.

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Midkiff
shadow stranger
Location: Carmi, Illinois
Member Since: 29th Nov 2009
Total posts: 462
Posted:wouldnt this get in the way of flow? choreographing that is

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able, and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" - Epicurus

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Sister Eleven
Sister Eleven

owner of the group property
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 3rd Aug 2009
Total posts: 1277
Posted:On the contrary, flow requires some kind of structure, some framework that provides challenges and a way of evaluating how one's response measures up to those challenges. Choreography may not be everyone's route, but it has all the marks of being conducive to flow.

p|.q|r:|::s|.s|s:|:.s|q.|:p|s.|.p|s

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