Forums > Technical Discussion > Orbitals damage chains... how NOT to?

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TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Is it possible to do Fire Poi orbitals without damaging the chains or is it inevitable? How can I minimize all forms of damage to my chains from orbitals?

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John was taken before his time.
Mother_Natures_SonSILVER Member
Rampant whirler.
2,418 posts
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!


Posted:
Make sure they're oval link? Its only really ball chain that considerably suffers from degradation by way of orbitals.

Make sure you're using good swivels, if the swivels aren't swivelling well enough, energy will be transferred to the chains and in that way cause friction, causing wear. -Ball chain do not need swivels.

hug


TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
I'm using oval links, and I'm even using two swivels - one at the Poi, one at the handle. My "test set" for orbitals has been scratched to the bone, literally! I have a second set that's untarnished by inexperience.

But yeah, I do have a swivel-heavy build. I think a possibility is that it lies in my technique because for some reason, I catch it and when I do the jolt it rips down the chain's length until it "finds" a good spot to stop.


Though, thanks for the answer!

EDIT!
Part of a solution I'm thinking of. Ignoring the whole conservation of energy thing, is it possible to pull LESS hard yet get MORE spin out of an orbital? I'm not talking about hyperloops (ironically which I can't do).
EDITED_BY: Tide (1253005695)

This statement is false...?


John was taken before his time.
Mother_Natures_SonSILVER Member
Rampant whirler.
2,418 posts
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!


Posted:
Are you at the same length up the Poi on each chain? Sounds like they are slipping til they're even... I've never heard of wearing on oval link chain... what're they made of?

hug


TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
These are HoP's chains. Yeah, it's reaching at the same length. Although, when I do the jolt and it's even, it pulls even further down the chain.

Am I doing something wrong?

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UCOFSILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
15,414 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
You won't damage your cahins from doing orbitals smile

noramosGOLD Member
stranger
20 posts
Location: USA


Posted:
Yes you will, I have the same problem. Mine are starting to show damage. The plating is coming off of the chain.

TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Mine's come to the extent that they're bare to the bone but that's probably because I go over the top with my equipment.

Not that the problem's good, but it's comforting to know someone else is having the same issue.

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UCOFSILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
15,414 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
Yeah, nickel plated will - get chains with diamond filaments and you can orbital 'til your fall over.

They might cost about guoergaeovadbfadfboadbf wef svnio ji9 hjio0 dbkdbkljop ssg nip.

/brainfart



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Huh?

noramosGOLD Member
stranger
20 posts
Location: USA


Posted:
Figured this out last night. Catch the orbitals further down the chains, closer to the wicks. There will be less tugging on the chains. Less energy put into the orbital will minimize damage.

TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Ah, that's something I'll take note of.

UnscrupulousChavOffersFoot, where could I get this... magical diamond filament stuff?

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UCOFSILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
15,414 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
You know the drill:


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TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
The Wizard of Oz? But seriously, where?
EDITED_BY: Tide (1253186135)

This statement is false...?


69 on the beach
MynciBRONZE Member
Macaque of all trades
8,738 posts
Location: wombling free..., United Kingdom


Posted:
Jon stop making me laugh so hard at work, people are looking at me funny laugh3

Ball chain should be fine. I know someone who does orbitalls, air wraps, hyperloops etc all the time and their ball chain is 4 years old and still good.

To be fair Step killed my ball chain by gently shaking it but that's besides the point...

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


JayKittyGOLD Member
Mission: Ignition
534 posts
Location: Central New Jersey, USA


Posted:
I think I've had the same pair of ball chain leashes since I started doing Poi about 5 or 6 years ago. Everyone says that you need to replace it every so often, but its held up fantabulously

Don't mind me, just passing through.


GeezaGOLD Member
addict
694 posts
Location: Leeds, United Kingdom


Posted:
When i do orbitals with my hop chains and no10 swivels i can literally see the coating/metal coming off. It also seems to slip down the chain and grind them to bits.

I can orbital easily with colecords, for around 15 seconds

Geometry Of Fire
_Poiboy_PLATINUM Member
bastard child of satan
1,113 posts
Location: Raanana, Israel


Posted:
I can see the coating coming off with mine too, but I'm wondering if that has any effect? I mean the chains are still intact, and they'll end up black anyway, so what's the difference?

TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Yeah, it's not killing the chains but the plating is scratching the hell off. I cut myself today.

I know I shouldn't encourage the plating to come off, but should I have a piece of sand paper ready to shave off any sharp bits?

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16.15.8GOLD Member
I cant think therefore Im not
291 posts
Location: In my backpack, United Kingdom


Posted:
Stop doing orbitals or get a diamond chain, hmmmmm!? Someone want to share the cost of a bulk order with diamond chains tongue2

But seriously, the black color of the chains goes away fairly soon, never experienced any problem with the color wearing down though and the cost of a new chain is like nothing +/- X.
Changed chain a couple of times but usually just for the pleasure of getting new stuff and consuming grin

"I dont like shoes, definitely not spinning with shoes, they make my feet feel flat, my feet are not flat...."


TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Yeah, I had a similar idea at hand, to replace the chains every so often.

So do orbitals cause any MAJOR damage over long periods of time or is it just a scratching nuisance?

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Geometry Of Fire
_Poiboy_PLATINUM Member
bastard child of satan
1,113 posts
Location: Raanana, Israel


Posted:
I've never heard of any major damage done to chains, stainless steel should be durable enough to survive the friction. The plating, however, isn't.

TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Not quite on the topic of the chains, but how much do you have to spin the Poi off to make sure it doesn't projectile vomit fuel into your face? I did a fair bit and every second until the end it spat fuel.

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FireTomStargazer
6,650 posts


Posted:
I only say: chaincondoms... sorry - no picture for obvious reasons. tongue2

Tide: recommend to spin off "enouff" wink ... *cough* snip spank I mean "quite well", 'cause when you light them up, the fuel will expand due to the heat, so even when not that much is dribbling anymore, when lit much more excess will be produced - hope that helped.

btw - ball chains are most likely to "peel off" and that's a major bummer, because one cuts his fingerx!

Great thread hug

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink


foggy soxGOLD Member
stranger
14 posts
Location: las vegas usa


Posted:
i had oval chain's and i could still pump the orbital with out leaking fuel. Now im useing this rope i got from work called tech12. it is the [censored] totaly flame retardant and verry verry strong. It is almost like cole cord but for fire.i work backstage on the phantom of the opera Las Vegas. one of the automation tech's from my work gave me 50ft. this rope was holding a 4ton chandiler that flys around our theater. From what im told its like 2-3$ usd a foot, and worth its weight in gold. i still use one of my oval chanis to spinout my heads then i attach the tech12 leashes and it on. I do soak for about 15min and i spin them so hard when i do my spinoff. i did make my Poi heads tho and i folded them in a way that they would have little to no spinoff in the first place.
EDITED_BY: foggy sox (1255814564)

ravers dont trip they drop and roll


FireTomStargazer
6,650 posts


Posted:
rrrrrrrrrope.... *eyes widening* - where ... to ... get ... ???

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink


noramosGOLD Member
stranger
20 posts
Location: USA


Posted:
Originally Posted By: TideNot quite on the topic of the chains, but how much do you have to spin the Poi off to make sure it doesn't projectile vomit fuel into your face? I did a fair bit and every second until the end it spat fuel.

Let them burn longer before you attempt the orbital. You can test how much fuel the wicks may or may not spit into your face by doing a buzzsaw of variable speed. If you do a fast buzzsaw and no fuel spins off, go ahead and do the orbital.

TideGOLD Member
Future pyrotechnician...? Or something.
111 posts
Location: Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Posted:
Hm, that's a good idea, but orbitals tend to be a few times faster than the fastest buzzsaw most people can do. Still, good idea.

This statement is false...?


noramosGOLD Member
stranger
20 posts
Location: USA


Posted:
If your orbitals are noticeably faster than your fastest buzzsaw then that is your reason for damaged chains.

The lower down the chain, closer to the wick, you initiate the orbital the less energy is placed into it. The closer to the handles the orbital is started, the more reduction on orbital radius you have as you pull it tight. This causes the orbital speed to increase, thus causing more friction on the chain: eroding, and weakening the plating on the chains.

foggy soxGOLD Member
stranger
14 posts
Location: las vegas usa


Posted:
hey fire tom i have a bunch of this tech12 rope i could send you some you would have to pay the shipping charges tho.

ravers dont trip they drop and roll



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