Forums > Technical Discussion > GIANT Fire balls without breathing

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PoiBoxmember
85 posts
Location: Bangkok


Posted:
I saw this in Singapore : One guy holding a torch up and another guy thorwing from below a hand full of ??? out of a bag through the flame. Would say a 5 meter+ flameball

My question to you now. What did they use (Lycopodium ?!?) and have you ever done something like this by yourself?
Seems to be a good choice for those who dont want to take the risk of Fire-breathing.

enjoy

Josphinmember
18 posts
Location: Calgary


Posted:
my first thought as too what would have been thrown through the flame would be flash powder, i could be wrong, but thats my first thought, best bet of finding it would be asking around at magic supply type shops.

Bender_the_OffenderGOLD Member
still can't believe it's not butter
6,979 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia


Posted:
i read that it's phlogiston! it's fire y'know!

Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always


polytheneveteran
1,359 posts
Location: London/ Surrey


Posted:
Magic shops do sell it, and it is lycopodium powder. Some magic supplies places sell it in a squirt bottle (seen it sold in this way as 'dragon's breath'), so that all you have to do is 'squirt' the powder through a naked flame!

The optimist claims that we are living in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this is true.

Always make time to play in the snow.


Jomember
517 posts
Location: Sheffield, England


Posted:
I've seen it done with cornflower at the BM.

The flame wasn't as dramatic as 5m though.

Jo.

Educate yourself in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
I have done that with dragon's blood and the ball is not that big at all. With the tube it is fun.
Careful though...I know of a couple people who've had the powder in the air ignite and follow the cloud back to the powder in the hand...not a pretty result.

When you do something like this it is important to close your throwing hand and put it behind your back immediately after release. Just like with wiping your chin and stepping back from a fire breath.

For something flashier and without that risk...ball up flash paper and throw it through a flame.

Kitchen Flour and other such substances are also igniteable, btw.

Play safe all!

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


Posted:
Powdered coffee-whitener works too!

WintermuteLost in the world but loving it :)
119 posts
Location: Maybe Oxford, maybe Brighton ;)


Posted:
Custard powder works really really well, you can put it in tubes capped at both ends and keep them in your pocket, then just pop them out and blow hard, most impressive

If fishes were wishes we'd all cast nets


frostypawGreat balls of fire
643 posts
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent


Posted:
quote:
Kitchen Flour and other such substances are also igniteable, btw.
some are highly explosive definately test with caution!

i want some dragon's breath

small question for those in the know - could you transfer the squirty container to your mouth and bite down on it to shoot it out? then just open mouth and let it drop to get it clear of blowback risk - would that work?

I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
You could bite it. I wouldn't, but you could.

Just to let ya'all know..there is an incense that is called Dragon's Blood as well. It is a resin so it does not "blow up", so if you are looking for that specifically, make sure you get the correct one!

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


AchluophobiaBRONZE Member
Magical Sock Dancer
255 posts
Location: Newfoundland, Canada


Posted:
Flash Paper? Cooking stuff that's explosive?
Why did I not learn about this before?
So whats flash paper? And what cooking stuff is explosive?

arashiPooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx


Posted:
quote:
Powdered coffee-whitener works too!

just to clarify this... non dairy creamer works really well and it is really cheap. you can even get handfuls of packets from taco bell for free

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by arashi:
quote:
Powdered coffee-whitener works too!

you can even get handfuls of packets from taco bell for free

First of all, that is funny as hell. Secondly, I think we are jipped. Our taco bell doesn't have any. I was just there for lunch! It's all good though, I have a giant thing of coffee mate in the cupboard!

Flash Paper is available from magic shops. Makes a *really* bright flash of light and disappears when exposed to flame.

Kitchen Stuff...

Corn Starch/Powder
Flour (explosive actually)
Non Dairy Coffee Creamer, etc....

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


AchluophobiaBRONZE Member
Magical Sock Dancer
255 posts
Location: Newfoundland, Canada


Posted:
Thanks um... wow.... flour is explosive....
The next time I burn anything I'm going to throw some flour on it. We are talking about flour used to make bread here right?

[ 14. August 2003, 08:54: Message edited by: Achluophobia ]

PoiBoxmember
85 posts
Location: Bangkok


Posted:
Just re-watched the Video and would say that the the flame comes close to 10 meters. Told you it was BIG. The thrower uses both of his hands. So I think it is something more powerfull than flour. And the flame is normal orange, so i dont think its flash paper as well.
What is this dragons breath you were talking about ? Couldnt find what it is in the Internet.

(And for those who want to check. Its a 17MB Quicktime vid. Whom to send ???
Or how can I make it smaller - its only the 2 seconds in the beginning.)

PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Dragon's Breath is a nickname for Lycopodium Powder which in the magic world is known as Flash Powder.
Just to recap


Oh, and it is available at magic suppliers globally.

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


frostypawGreat balls of fire
643 posts
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent


Posted:
Methinks Pele likes this way of stopping us putting paraffin in our mouths

quote:
The next time I burn anything I'm going to throw some flour on it. We are talking about flour used to make bread here right?
DO NOT do this - there's a story of a performer who discovered flour was flammable so decided to do this

his act was basically playing the piano and at the end there'd be a small explosion in the piano - enough to shake the keys and no more just using a teaspoon of black powder.

so he added an equal amount of flour - when the explosion came it was over ten times as powerful as expected - two audience members were killed by shrapnel and many injured by all the flying bits of wood, and the pianist was never found, presumably completely ripped to smithereens by flying piano keys and wire

eyarg. hope that makes you think twice or experiment VERY carefully first!

I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!


onewheeldaveGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by frostypaw:


so he added an equal amount of flour - when the explosion came it was over ten times as powerful as expected - two audience members were killed by shrapnel and many injured by all the flying bits of wood, and the pianist was never found, presumably completely ripped to smithereens by flying piano keys and wire


Where did you hear this story. I find it a bit unlikely that the pianist was never found.

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


frostypawGreat balls of fire
643 posts
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent


Posted:
From chemists on why not to mix fine powders...

I'm sure they woulda found some "bits" but bits aren't much use

I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Hey frostypaw...sounds very Urban Mythish to me. Especially since I have heard the same story but with an amatuer magician.
However, like all Urban Myths, there is still a pretty decent moral to the story on playing with explosive stuff.

I also don't encourage this...I actually don't encourage people to use fire poi either. All of it is stupid and dangerous and I tell people to not be as stupid as I am....Real Flesh, Real Fire, Real Stupid (my show chant)

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


frostypawGreat balls of fire
643 posts
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent


Posted:
It may be in part urban-myth and has no doubt had names etc changed but it'll happen - and dispersal of a liquid/powder explosive before igniting it is how those fuel-air bombs we hear about work (the daisy cutter anyone?)

As ya say so rightly it's all pretty stupid guess we're just doing our bit for natural selection

I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!


DeepSoulSheepGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland


Posted:
Well the anarchists cookbook says it's extremely explosive. Thats about all I know I afraid.

I live in a world of infinite possibilities.


BigDavmember
175 posts
Location: Derry, N. Ireland


Posted:
i tried fire breathing last night with custard powder. It was a good effect but the flame was not very big. I used a spoonful of power and blew it out through the torch and was quite shocked that it worked, but im quite happy with it. Its much better than parafin. The bad taste of power only lasts until you rinse your mouth out, so have a bottle of water handy as i had a mouthful of really thick custard in my mouth for a couple of minutes until i ran inside and got water hahaha.

How much custard powder should you actually use? I was using a full tea spoon full and im unsure if it was enough.

Also is there any risks of blow backs with custard powder and flour etc?

Be Good, and if you DONT be Good, Buy a Pram!


Jai - Staffmember
85 posts
Location: Gold Coast


Posted:
There is always a risk of blow backs with any sort of firebreathing you do. Knew a guy once who did fire breathing with a powder of some sort, he burnt his whole inside of his mouth because there was a whole lineing of powder in his mouth and the fire came back inside. Although he was only a newbie it couldve been prevented if he had been doing it with someone who was experienced.

All you people out there who are experienced fire breathers, when someone comes up to you and asks if u can show them how to fire breath, plz just show them. Or else they will just go off somewhere else and do it by themselves. If you show them the propper way to do it then it will be twice as safe.

I can't wait to die, I'm going to Hell. They have fire down there!


ImmortalAngelSILVER Member
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada


Posted:
Jai - Staff You are completely wrong with your idea of just showing every person who asks on how to do it.

You should not just show someone how to fire breath and you say. You should take them through all the risks, dangers, hazards, short term and long term health risks as well as any scare stories you can. If they are still willing to learn after knowing as much as there is to know about it then you should take them through a process similar if not the same as the one described in the HoP guide. You shouldn't abandon them to do it on their own, your right, but you should make sure they are well aware of what they are getting into. Fire Breathing is the most dangerous of the fire arts and even if done properly has high risks for long and short term health risks, not to mention death.
There are dozens of Fire Breathing professionals who have been injured or killed as a result of Fire Breathing. We are lucky to have one of the survivors of such an incident on our boards with us, and to have shared her story and experiences with Fire Breathing with us.

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> STAY SAFE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug.gif" alt="" />


darkpoetBRONZE Member
Irish
525 posts
Location: Dallas.........ish, USA


Posted:
Written by: frostypaw


Methinks Pele likes this way of stopping us putting paraffin in our mouths [Smile]

quote:
The next time I burn anything I'm going to throw some flour on it. We are talking about flour used to make bread here right?
DO NOT do this - there's a story of a performer who discovered flour was flammable so decided to do this

his act was basically playing the piano and at the end there'd be a small explosion in the piano - enough to shake the keys and no more just using a teaspoon of black powder.

so he added an equal amount of flour - when the explosion came it was over ten times as powerful as expected - two audience members were killed by shrapnel and many injured by all the flying bits of wood, and the pianist was never found, presumably completely ripped to smithereens by flying piano keys and wire

eyarg. hope that makes you think twice or experiment VERY carefully first!





mythbusters anybody??

flour is explosive but only in the right conditions
using black powder for anything is retarded most especially when your not cert. in pyrotechnics..
.....and throwing a powder 10m and having it explode seems strange......
and personally...i wouldnt EVER put a powder in my mouth to blow with..you dont have the same control over a powder that you do a liquid....its like playing with vapour fires, always a bad idea...

Jesus saves sinners and redeems them for cash and
prizes

Co-Founder of Keepers of Light

Educate yourself about the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


ImmortalAngelSILVER Member
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada


Posted:
Darkpoet is right wink Flour is explosive and if you check out the MSDS (yes, Flour has an MSDS too) it has the exact concentration needed to make it flamable. It's got to be like a cloud floating in the air with a source of ignition, won't just blow up or light up everytime.
And I agree with DP's view on no powder blowing. Powders/dusts are to light to controll the same way as water, and would be incredibly risky to do anything with let alone spit out of your mouth into a flame.

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> STAY SAFE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug.gif" alt="" />


MikeIconGOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA


Posted:
Although Ive never breathed fire with a powder, I would say its fine. Powder is controled differently than liquid, but not necessarily harder to control. Im sure if someone practiced a lot with powder (read, practice just like you have to practice before breathing with liquid) you could get the hang of it and have just as much control. Its just that most people dont do it enough and the people who do, probably started with a liquid and just arent used to the change.

Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me


ImmortalAngelSILVER Member
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada


Posted:
It's like the difference in breathing colemans and lamp oil/kero. I'm sure that anyone could master it, but there are still alot more risks involved (more so than normal, which is alot of risks to begin with) with a powder because of how it spreads/poofs in air. Plus you'd be alot more liable for a blow back, and sustains would be alot harder. Humans weren't meant to have mass amounts of powder in their mouth. Well, humans weren't really meant to be spewing fire from their mouths in the first place if you want to get into it ^.^' But I think my point was still there...

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> STAY SAFE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug.gif" alt="" />


FIRE_SPINNERBRONZE Member
member
87 posts
Location: New South Wales


Posted:
i think that if powder is blown from the hand it is completely safe

for a couple of reasons

1.no risk of blow back as powder will only ignite in the dust form so any powder left in your hand will act more as a shield from the flames

2.A. Death

B. Severe burns

C. Cancer

D. Dental Problems

E. Stomach and tissue ulcers

F. Fuel Poisoning

G. Chemical Pnuemonia or Acute Respiratory Distress

H. Dry Cough

I. Headache, dizziness, drunken ill feeling

J. Nausea, diarrhea, vomiting, stomach ache

K. Dry mouth/ Cotton Mouth

L. and topical heat burns

alot of these effects are preventable the solution is do not breath in any dust it is simple

UCOFSILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
15,414 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
confused

what?

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