Forums > Beginner Poi Moves > Beats 4 moves and Beats 4 music
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56 posts
Location: United States, WA
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
Posted:
Sup Fellas?
Alright, I've been spinning for quite some time now, and I just read the post about slow versus fast, and some of u mention going with the beat of the music.
Now I do this as well, but I like to Climax with a new move as the music Climaxes.
All Techno (which is what I spin to) goes in 4 beats then every 16 or 32 something happens then on the 64th something major changes. So, there are certain things that will come out just perfect to the music.
I will share an example:
Alright you take the TTN which is normally basically a 2 beat move in my eyes, forward and back alternating. To mix this up to the music I like to start doing the TTN for 8 Beats, (Forward Back Forward Back, Forward Back Forward Back)then I throw in some wraps, (this'll be hard to explain) I wrap right poi over left arm on top, then pull out with right hand and push forward (1st beat) Then I wrap my left poi over right arm pull back and Push forward (2nd Beat) Then I put the right poi under my left arm and wrap it, pull it out and push forward (3rd Beat) Then I take my left arm and wrap that under my right arm (Beat 4). Do it 2 times, then you have 8 beats ontop of the 8 original beats from no wraps and you have 16 beats which will climax to the music, thus allowing u to bust out something cooler Like BTB weave or 5 Beat Weave circles, which don't go to the music at all becase 5 does not equal 4, and neither does a normal 3 beat weave.
I would Like to here some of the other peoples combos that go well with the music because I notice that people Love watching people climax with the music because it is a whole different element of control, and takes extreme concentration!
Please Share!
Peace,
SaggyD
Sup Fellas?
Alright, I've been spinning for quite some time now, and I just read the post about slow versus fast, and some of u mention going with the beat of the music.
Now I do this as well, but I like to Climax with a new move as the music Climaxes.
All Techno (which is what I spin to) goes in 4 beats then every 16 or 32 something happens then on the 64th something major changes. So, there are certain things that will come out just perfect to the music.
I will share an example:
Alright you take the TTN which is normally basically a 2 beat move in my eyes, forward and back alternating. To mix this up to the music I like to start doing the TTN for 8 Beats, (Forward Back Forward Back, Forward Back Forward Back)then I throw in some wraps, (this'll be hard to explain) I wrap right poi over left arm on top, then pull out with right hand and push forward (1st beat) Then I wrap my left poi over right arm pull back and Push forward (2nd Beat) Then I put the right poi under my left arm and wrap it, pull it out and push forward (3rd Beat) Then I take my left arm and wrap that under my right arm (Beat 4). Do it 2 times, then you have 8 beats ontop of the 8 original beats from no wraps and you have 16 beats which will climax to the music, thus allowing u to bust out something cooler Like BTB weave or 5 Beat Weave circles, which don't go to the music at all becase 5 does not equal 4, and neither does a normal 3 beat weave.
I would Like to here some of the other peoples combos that go well with the music because I notice that people Love watching people climax with the music because it is a whole different element of control, and takes extreme concentration!
Please Share!
Peace,
SaggyD
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
have you heard of professor klaus...?
if you can figure it out, you'll be the shit
have you heard of professor klaus...?
if you can figure it out, you'll be the shit
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,009 posts
Location: Bristol, UK
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,009 posts
Location: Bristol, UK
Posted:
Klaus is a very nice man!
It was interesting to see him teaching beats and variable timing from the word go.
Klaus is a very nice man!
It was interesting to see him teaching beats and variable timing from the word go.
mushroom collector
208 posts
Location: JHB, South Africa
208 posts
Location: JHB, South Africa
Posted:
well shaggD why not do a 4b weave instead of a 5b then do that twice brings you to 8 beats, or do a five beat 4 times brings you to 20 multiple of 4 so mabey that works, i dont know, im an idiot i cant count for shit!!!!
well shaggD why not do a 4b weave instead of a 5b then do that twice brings you to 8 beats, or do a five beat 4 times brings you to 20 multiple of 4 so mabey that works, i dont know, im an idiot i cant count for shit!!!!
JinX : If it doesnt kill you it makes you stronger
The spin cycle on the washing machine does not make earth worms dizzy.
It will however make cats dizzy and cats throw up twice their bodyweight when dizzy.
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14 posts
Location: England (N.E. lincs)
14 posts
Location: England (N.E. lincs)
Posted:
good advise thanx
any suggestions on some music that fits to the beats
good advise thanx
any suggestions on some music that fits to the beats
[_ [] 5 t K @ (_) s E
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
I understand about going with the beat.. personally I just like to take and adjust my speed so that the moves that I do always fit the beats that I'm going for.. mainly using wraps (regular and air), and transitions to accent..
after all beats are what help us keep things straight, but don't really play in with non poi people.. Because they see the circles and not the actual poi, most non poi onlookers can't tell the difference between a 3 and a 5 bt unless you did them back to back.. and because the poi get lost in the tracer of light.. I find it easy to make any move fit any beat..
quote:whoa there killer.. Electronic music.. aka techno, does not just go on 4's, 8's, etc.. trance yes.. but not all techno.. lots (especially house) will fall on odd beats like 5 or 3 6 bt riffs to total 18.. not to mention drum n bass etc...
Originally posted by SaggyD:
All Techno (which is what I spin to) goes in 4 beats then every 16 or 32 something happens then on the 64th something major changes. So, there are certain things that will come out just perfect to the music.
I understand about going with the beat.. personally I just like to take and adjust my speed so that the moves that I do always fit the beats that I'm going for.. mainly using wraps (regular and air), and transitions to accent..
after all beats are what help us keep things straight, but don't really play in with non poi people.. Because they see the circles and not the actual poi, most non poi onlookers can't tell the difference between a 3 and a 5 bt unless you did them back to back.. and because the poi get lost in the tracer of light.. I find it easy to make any move fit any beat..
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
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member
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
Posted:
Rev I highly dissagree with you about the beats. Rave DJ's go by 4 Beats with vinyl, which is called a Bar, regardless of whether it is house or DnB or Trance. Matching the tempo of the 2 songs is easy, if that was all you had to do there would be no trick to DJing, the complicated thing with DJing is matching the Bars, or the 4 beats in order to make it that one song drops out or climaxes when the other does the same or the opposite, depending on what kind of effect the DJ is going for. That's how DJ's can predict what will happen in the music. Eventually once a DJ gets good enough they wont have to know what the song is like they can just mix it, and predict what's going to happen.
So I'll I'm saying is learning to do the same thing that DJ's do with Poi.
Peace
Please reply REV I want u do give me an example of a electronic song that doesn't go by 4/4 timing
Rev I highly dissagree with you about the beats. Rave DJ's go by 4 Beats with vinyl, which is called a Bar, regardless of whether it is house or DnB or Trance. Matching the tempo of the 2 songs is easy, if that was all you had to do there would be no trick to DJing, the complicated thing with DJing is matching the Bars, or the 4 beats in order to make it that one song drops out or climaxes when the other does the same or the opposite, depending on what kind of effect the DJ is going for. That's how DJ's can predict what will happen in the music. Eventually once a DJ gets good enough they wont have to know what the song is like they can just mix it, and predict what's going to happen.
So I'll I'm saying is learning to do the same thing that DJ's do with Poi.
Peace
Please reply REV I want u do give me an example of a electronic song that doesn't go by 4/4 timing
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
nah... I'm afraid not.. when producing a track the main beat doesn't always land on 4/4.. its nice to shoot for.. but not the case.. and as far as beat matching.. you can adjust the tempo to get the beats to line up.. the equalizers and effects will help subtract out unwanted noises and beats and bam... although if you adjust the tempo right you really shouldn't have to tweek too much out..
eidt: and example being that you can take a 5 bt house riff..
1..2..3.4.5.
and make it fit a 4 bt by adjusting the tempo to make your 4 bts hit like so:
1..2..3..4..
bts.. and tempo are two different things.. I can make a track 4/4 with different beat... and when I do poi I follow beats, not timing..
[ 19. August 2003, 11:38: Message edited by: Rev ]
nah... I'm afraid not.. when producing a track the main beat doesn't always land on 4/4.. its nice to shoot for.. but not the case.. and as far as beat matching.. you can adjust the tempo to get the beats to line up.. the equalizers and effects will help subtract out unwanted noises and beats and bam... although if you adjust the tempo right you really shouldn't have to tweek too much out..
eidt: and example being that you can take a 5 bt house riff..
1..2..3.4.5.
and make it fit a 4 bt by adjusting the tempo to make your 4 bts hit like so:
1..2..3..4..
bts.. and tempo are two different things.. I can make a track 4/4 with different beat... and when I do poi I follow beats, not timing..
[ 19. August 2003, 11:38: Message edited by: Rev ]
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
member
42 posts
Location: hobbs NM
42 posts
Location: hobbs NM
Posted:
i don't know man i think almost all house is 4 on the floor...but i do know there are other beat measures, but i wouldn't call them house...maybe techno but not house...i definitly agree that dnb is not in measures of 4 usualy more like 32 or 64 beats per measure...and when it's going that fast you can usualy hit any move to match that beat...wich is why i find it easier to break to dnb cuz your feet can hit the floor easier on beat when there or 32 or 64 beats than when there are only four...
i don't know man i think almost all house is 4 on the floor...but i do know there are other beat measures, but i wouldn't call them house...maybe techno but not house...i definitly agree that dnb is not in measures of 4 usualy more like 32 or 64 beats per measure...and when it's going that fast you can usualy hit any move to match that beat...wich is why i find it easier to break to dnb cuz your feet can hit the floor easier on beat when there or 32 or 64 beats than when there are only four...
posi vegan straight edge
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56 posts
Location: United States, WA
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
Posted:
Rev are you including Half Beats? or Beats the DJ makes up? DJ's can only Manually drop beats if they literally rip up the tempo or put their hand on the record, Tweaking the noise doesn't drop beats if the song is going the same tempo it always has been. These "Riffs" that u speak of, is it like the actually Bass u tap yer feet to or is it like:
Dun Dun dididi Dun, Dun dun dididi Dun. because regardless u still tap yer foot 8 times when u hear it
Like most techno has "Riffs" or beats that have multiple beats in one beat, like a quad snare hit or whatever. but they eventually land on the same thing like a 32 or 64 or a 128 Do you agree?
Peace
SaggyD
Rev are you including Half Beats? or Beats the DJ makes up? DJ's can only Manually drop beats if they literally rip up the tempo or put their hand on the record, Tweaking the noise doesn't drop beats if the song is going the same tempo it always has been. These "Riffs" that u speak of, is it like the actually Bass u tap yer feet to or is it like:
Dun Dun dididi Dun, Dun dun dididi Dun. because regardless u still tap yer foot 8 times when u hear it
Like most techno has "Riffs" or beats that have multiple beats in one beat, like a quad snare hit or whatever. but they eventually land on the same thing like a 32 or 64 or a 128 Do you agree?
Peace
SaggyD
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
First of all house and techno are 2 seperate things. Secondly house is also 4 beat. All of it is. I think the confusion is coming from house music having the snare noise on the 3rd of the 4/4 timing (this is what actually defines house music as being house music...)
So if you take the house beat and ignore the snare you would just hear the beats *boom* *boom* *boom*. But with house music there is always a snare noise exactly three quarters of the way through the beat. This snare isn't a beat though. You don't dance and therefore don't swing toys to the snare. Sure you can put some movement on it but it is secondary to the main beat (the bass).
Hope that makes some sense.
First of all house and techno are 2 seperate things. Secondly house is also 4 beat. All of it is. I think the confusion is coming from house music having the snare noise on the 3rd of the 4/4 timing (this is what actually defines house music as being house music...)
So if you take the house beat and ignore the snare you would just hear the beats *boom* *boom* *boom*. But with house music there is always a snare noise exactly three quarters of the way through the beat. This snare isn't a beat though. You don't dance and therefore don't swing toys to the snare. Sure you can put some movement on it but it is secondary to the main beat (the bass).
Hope that makes some sense.
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
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56 posts
Location: United States, WA
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
Posted:
So then Technically I am correct when I said that all Genres of electronic music go by 4/4 timing?? Because that's what I've been saying for the entire time.
Now as for House Music, I am listening to a house mix right now recorded live, and I don't hear a snare hit on the 3/4ths. I always thought that what determined HOUSE music was basically what happened to Disco music during the 80s then what evolved into the different Genres of house we have now, like Progressive House and such.
And I know that "Techno" is more trance even tho it is a very wide genre of electronic music.
What I"m saying is that The beats in all electronic music is 4/4 and someone still has to prove me wrong with an electronic song that has a different beat than 4/4. In all Rave music I hear the 4 beats, I tap my foot 16 times before something happens ALWAYS. I don't understand how it could be any other way. because that's just the way it works.
Like I said everyone please give me an example of an electronic song that doesn't use 4/4.
Peace
SaggyD
So then Technically I am correct when I said that all Genres of electronic music go by 4/4 timing?? Because that's what I've been saying for the entire time.
Now as for House Music, I am listening to a house mix right now recorded live, and I don't hear a snare hit on the 3/4ths. I always thought that what determined HOUSE music was basically what happened to Disco music during the 80s then what evolved into the different Genres of house we have now, like Progressive House and such.
And I know that "Techno" is more trance even tho it is a very wide genre of electronic music.
What I"m saying is that The beats in all electronic music is 4/4 and someone still has to prove me wrong with an electronic song that has a different beat than 4/4. In all Rave music I hear the 4 beats, I tap my foot 16 times before something happens ALWAYS. I don't understand how it could be any other way. because that's just the way it works.
Like I said everyone please give me an example of an electronic song that doesn't use 4/4.
Peace
SaggyD
member
22 posts
22 posts
Posted:
I think you guys are getting confused over the term beat. ie. All the electronica I have ever hear is done in 4/4 time, meaning the temp is counted in four beats : 1234|2234|3234|4234
MOST house and trance is "4 on the floor" the bass kicks on the beat every beat:
1234|2234|3234|4234
xxxx|xxxx|xxxx|xxxx
DnB/Breaks/2step etc are off beat genre's the bass kicks on off beats:
1-2-3-4-|2-2-3-4-|3-2-3-4-|4-2-3-4-|
x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|
Jungle is just nutz and you'll sometimes get 3-5 kicks per beat.
That said I have heard some experimental/ambient tracks that are on 3/4 time but they are extrememly hard to mix with 4/4 tracks.
Anyhow, all the "techno" you hear is done in 4/4 meter and usually introduces a new sound every 8 bars until the song is developed and will build to climax over 16 or 32 bars etc etc. This "formula" for trax is a general on and gets broken farely frequently. ie. I have some track that only climax for 8 beats then regress into what would be called the body of the song for an odd number of bars, though they are always some number divisable by 4.
I think you guys are getting confused over the term beat. ie. All the electronica I have ever hear is done in 4/4 time, meaning the temp is counted in four beats : 1234|2234|3234|4234
MOST house and trance is "4 on the floor" the bass kicks on the beat every beat:
1234|2234|3234|4234
xxxx|xxxx|xxxx|xxxx
DnB/Breaks/2step etc are off beat genre's the bass kicks on off beats:
1-2-3-4-|2-2-3-4-|3-2-3-4-|4-2-3-4-|
x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|x--xx-x-|
Jungle is just nutz and you'll sometimes get 3-5 kicks per beat.
That said I have heard some experimental/ambient tracks that are on 3/4 time but they are extrememly hard to mix with 4/4 tracks.
Anyhow, all the "techno" you hear is done in 4/4 meter and usually introduces a new sound every 8 bars until the song is developed and will build to climax over 16 or 32 bars etc etc. This "formula" for trax is a general on and gets broken farely frequently. ie. I have some track that only climax for 8 beats then regress into what would be called the body of the song for an odd number of bars, though they are always some number divisable by 4.
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Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
I'm not arguing with you I never disputed the 4 beats. All I'll add is if the snare isn't there it's not house. Whether, it's progressive house, hard house, deep house or tech-house whatever, doesn't matter. Doesn't matter anyway really does it?
I'm not arguing with you I never disputed the 4 beats. All I'll add is if the snare isn't there it's not house. Whether, it's progressive house, hard house, deep house or tech-house whatever, doesn't matter. Doesn't matter anyway really does it?
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
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big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
yep, i'd agree that nearly all modern dance music is in 4/4.
i think rev is getting the time signature of the tune (those two numbers that tell you how many beats are in a bar and what those beats are - 4/4 would be four beats to a bar with each beat being a crochet) with the general rhythm of a tune, that being the distribution of the sounds over the specified time signature (straight beats, breakbeat, swing, claves and so on).
for example, a simple 4/4 breakbeat (a simple, classic dnb style one) pushes the bass drum to get that tension and release feel that breakbeats have. so there are four beats to each bar, we start with a flat rhythm so the bass hits are on the first and third beats and snare hits are on the second and fourth beats.
to change this into a breakbeat we move the second bass drum hit forward by half a beat.
to see where the bass hits now for each bar we count we count "one and two and three and four and...".
the bass hits on the 'one' and on the 'and' between three and four.
it has different rhythm but it is still in 4/4 timing.
spinning to music that isn't 4/4 feels lovely. also, tunes that change tempo (something dance music rarely does as it tends to f*ck with dj's ) can be loads more fun to play with.
try a waltz tune (3/4) or for the real challenge try spinning in time to tunes with messed up time signatures and tempo's; like TooL (mostly 5/4 with tempo changes all over the place).
and for the record freyr, jungle is drum and bass (and vice versa)
yep, i'd agree that nearly all modern dance music is in 4/4.
i think rev is getting the time signature of the tune (those two numbers that tell you how many beats are in a bar and what those beats are - 4/4 would be four beats to a bar with each beat being a crochet) with the general rhythm of a tune, that being the distribution of the sounds over the specified time signature (straight beats, breakbeat, swing, claves and so on).
for example, a simple 4/4 breakbeat (a simple, classic dnb style one) pushes the bass drum to get that tension and release feel that breakbeats have. so there are four beats to each bar, we start with a flat rhythm so the bass hits are on the first and third beats and snare hits are on the second and fourth beats.
to change this into a breakbeat we move the second bass drum hit forward by half a beat.
to see where the bass hits now for each bar we count we count "one and two and three and four and...".
the bass hits on the 'one' and on the 'and' between three and four.
it has different rhythm but it is still in 4/4 timing.
spinning to music that isn't 4/4 feels lovely. also, tunes that change tempo (something dance music rarely does as it tends to f*ck with dj's ) can be loads more fun to play with.
try a waltz tune (3/4) or for the real challenge try spinning in time to tunes with messed up time signatures and tempo's; like TooL (mostly 5/4 with tempo changes all over the place).
and for the record freyr, jungle is drum and bass (and vice versa)
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
veteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
Posted:
Yeah, apart from a very few experimental techno tracks I've never heard of any non-4/4 dance music at all.
Yeah, apart from a very few experimental techno tracks I've never heard of any non-4/4 dance music at all.
"Moo," said the happy cow.
member
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
56 posts
Location: United States, WA
Posted:
Awesome guys, thanks for Clearin' things up.
Now that everything is cleared up, does anyone have any moves or combos that go well with 4/4 timing?
Peace!!!!!!!
SaggyD
Awesome guys, thanks for Clearin' things up.
Now that everything is cleared up, does anyone have any moves or combos that go well with 4/4 timing?
Peace!!!!!!!
SaggyD
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
Thanks Cole, that waz very informative. I always get a bit confused by this beats/tempo etc. Now, I don’t know much about this stuff, but I’m pretty sure were spinning to some pretty wicked 7/8 drumming at easter. I was also told, that 7/8 is a an old dance beat. Anyhow, it’s great to spin to, and I’ll try and fine out a bit more about it
Thanks Cole, that waz very informative. I always get a bit confused by this beats/tempo etc. Now, I don’t know much about this stuff, but I’m pretty sure were spinning to some pretty wicked 7/8 drumming at easter. I was also told, that 7/8 is a an old dance beat. Anyhow, it’s great to spin to, and I’ll try and fine out a bit more about it
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
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Member
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Member
16 posts
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posted:
Am flicking through song list now looking for music with 5 beats, but Yes they do exist, heard them many a time at clubs, parties etc. Ill try to put up a name some day so help ya out Rev. Plus, the good thing about 5 beat music is that you can pull weaves to it
(3 / 5 beat weave)
EDITED_BY: Thunder-From-Down-Under (1087651407)
Am flicking through song list now looking for music with 5 beats, but Yes they do exist, heard them many a time at clubs, parties etc. Ill try to put up a name some day so help ya out Rev. Plus, the good thing about 5 beat music is that you can pull weaves to it
(3 / 5 beat weave) EDITED_BY: Thunder-From-Down-Under (1087651407)
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c) Those who can't, Read It.
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Member
16 posts
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posted:
Ok one other thing I have against all the people in this post is Techno Techno Techno, gah put some smoother music into it, still with a beat, but with words to it
That and make 2 song lists, one for learning moves, one for using moves. Give us a PM if you want a couple of ideas... Like Banana Phone
EDITED_BY: Thunder-From-Down-Under (1087652976)
Ok one other thing I have against all the people in this post is Techno Techno Techno, gah put some smoother music into it, still with a beat, but with words to it
That and make 2 song lists, one for learning moves, one for using moves. Give us a PM if you want a couple of ideas... Like Banana Phone
EDITED_BY: Thunder-From-Down-Under (1087652976)
a) Those who can, Do It.
b) Those who know, Post It.
c) Those who can't, Read It.
d) Those with ego's, Argue It.
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journeyman
84 posts
Location: Ubud, Bali, Indonesia
journeyman
84 posts
Location: Ubud, Bali, Indonesia
Posted:
From HOP's site rules: Threads must stay on topic. Please may sure your reply is relevant and on topic.
For SaggyD:
I usually poi to African drumming, which comes in a variety of time signatures and phrasing structures, but I do something similar to your techno technique...
I'll start with a simple move and turn with it, making my beats match the djembes (high accent drum) if I can. While I'm doing this, I listen for the length of the phrase in the djuns (low drum) and start repeating a sequence of moves and turns, changing it up as I feel the need to until the drummers start doing something else, at which point I'll switch to a different move family.
Sometimes, I'll be treated with a talented drummer who can solo for me while I poi. On some of these occasions, I slip into something of a trance and end up doing some crazy, wack jive - often leading me to find a new move (to me) in the process.
From HOP's site rules: Threads must stay on topic. Please may sure your reply is relevant and on topic.
For SaggyD:
I usually poi to African drumming, which comes in a variety of time signatures and phrasing structures, but I do something similar to your techno technique...
I'll start with a simple move and turn with it, making my beats match the djembes (high accent drum) if I can. While I'm doing this, I listen for the length of the phrase in the djuns (low drum) and start repeating a sequence of moves and turns, changing it up as I feel the need to until the drummers start doing something else, at which point I'll switch to a different move family.
Sometimes, I'll be treated with a talented drummer who can solo for me while I poi. On some of these occasions, I slip into something of a trance and end up doing some crazy, wack jive - often leading me to find a new move (to me) in the process.
Genuineness only thrives in the dark -- like celery.
enlightened
187 posts
Location: montreal
187 posts
Location: montreal
Posted:
i think yur all a bit crazy bout the constantly folowing the beats of the music, i am not entering the argument bout beats/timing/tempo but i'de like to point out that lets say your spinning to an average trance song( bout 124bpm's ) yur telling me that for 1 minute straight you can maintain yur speed so thatu mathc all 124 beats in that song?
hmm thats 124 circles unless its a wrap
**sigh anyways.. the discussion may continue! 
EDITED_BY: joulz (1087857216)
i think yur all a bit crazy bout the constantly folowing the beats of the music, i am not entering the argument bout beats/timing/tempo but i'de like to point out that lets say your spinning to an average trance song( bout 124bpm's ) yur telling me that for 1 minute straight you can maintain yur speed so thatu mathc all 124 beats in that song?
hmm thats 124 circles unless its a wrap
**sigh anyways.. the discussion may continue! EDITED_BY: joulz (1087857216)
it must be green
GOLD Member
master of disaster
3,354 posts
Location: New York, USA
master of disaster
3,354 posts
Location: New York, USA
Posted:
ok, maybe i'm in the minority ;here, but i put on whatever music i want and let that guide what i'm doing. I don't concentrate on getting a move exactly in time, but rather making things nice and flowy. In the end, it looks better than having a bunch of moves so precisely timed out that it leaves no room for creativity.
ok, maybe i'm in the minority ;here, but i put on whatever music i want and let that guide what i'm doing. I don't concentrate on getting a move exactly in time, but rather making things nice and flowy. In the end, it looks better than having a bunch of moves so precisely timed out that it leaves no room for creativity.
kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
I think I naturally move in a 4/4 beat pattern. I noticed that when I edit video of me spinning together with music, I often go along with whatever song it is even though I was listening to NO music at the time I was spinning. I think thats the key. Just do everything in even numbers and youll look good regardless
I think I naturally move in a 4/4 beat pattern. I noticed that when I edit video of me spinning together with music, I often go along with whatever song it is even though I was listening to NO music at the time I was spinning. I think thats the key. Just do everything in even numbers and youll look good regardless
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and torch the rough patches.
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veteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
Posted:
Damn that's one slow trance tune!
But you don't have to complete a circle on every beat - I generally complete one every 2 or 4 beats I guess.
Written by: joulz
i think yur all a bit crazy bout the constantly folowing the beats of the music, i am not entering the argument bout beats/timing/tempo but i'de like to point out that lets say your spinning to an average trance song( bout 124bpm's ) yur telling me that for 1 minute straight you can maintain yur speed so thatu mathc all 124 beats in that song?
hmm thats 124 circles unless its a wrap
Damn that's one slow trance tune!
But you don't have to complete a circle on every beat - I generally complete one every 2 or 4 beats I guess.
"Moo," said the happy cow.
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
thx mate.. I appreciate it.. I hear [censored] ALL the time at parties.. well not all the time as in throughout the whole aprty but all the time as in at most all the parties I've ever gone to.. and the 5bt weave is exactly what made me notice otherwise I prolly would have just zoned out.. now if it came across digitalimport or something I could throw some names up.. but I don't think I've really heard anything like that through them. but its all gravy..
to get back to the topic at hand though... I've gotten to the point in my style where I don't match much up beat for beat.. but rather as the music i listen to has various compnents.. different drum patterns, atmospheres, melodies etc.. I find it nice to flow between some of the patterns and let the music accent the spin.. I mean I am still spinning with the music.. but I don't try and hammer on for this or that, but rahter let the music accent it for me you know.. I dunno reading what I just wrote almost doesnt make sense to me.. but I'm serious.. just like on the 5bt thing.. lol..
one day I'm just going to spontaneously beomce telepathic.. and I'll jsut send you people thoughts instead of posts..
Written by: Thunder-From-Down-Under
Am flicking through song list now looking for music with 5 beats, but Yes they do exist, heard them many a time at clubs, parties etc. Ill try to put up a name some day so help ya out Rev. Plus, the good thing about 5 beat music is that you can pull weaves to it
thx mate.. I appreciate it.. I hear [censored] ALL the time at parties.. well not all the time as in throughout the whole aprty but all the time as in at most all the parties I've ever gone to.. and the 5bt weave is exactly what made me notice otherwise I prolly would have just zoned out.. now if it came across digitalimport or something I could throw some names up.. but I don't think I've really heard anything like that through them. but its all gravy..
to get back to the topic at hand though... I've gotten to the point in my style where I don't match much up beat for beat.. but rather as the music i listen to has various compnents.. different drum patterns, atmospheres, melodies etc.. I find it nice to flow between some of the patterns and let the music accent the spin.. I mean I am still spinning with the music.. but I don't try and hammer on for this or that, but rahter let the music accent it for me you know.. I dunno reading what I just wrote almost doesnt make sense to me.. but I'm serious.. just like on the 5bt thing.. lol..
one day I'm just going to spontaneously beomce telepathic.. and I'll jsut send you people thoughts instead of posts..
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
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NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
I'm a big fan of spinning to the beat. Or attempting to anyway. I think wraps look best when done on the beat.
I think that moving your body to the beat is more important than moving the poi to the beat. In other words, switching sides on a weave on the beat I think looks prettier than getting every swing of the poi on the beat.
"In time" or "Parallel" stuff looks way better on the beat.
Of course, I respect those that ignore the music and 'just flow' but I think the marriage of music and dance is beautiful and something I try, though sometimes fail, to obtain.
Actually, that's why I have trouble spinning at odd speeds. If a tune is at a speed that I can't spin to (or wrap to) I find it tough to spin at all.
I'm a big fan of spinning to the beat. Or attempting to anyway. I think wraps look best when done on the beat.
I think that moving your body to the beat is more important than moving the poi to the beat. In other words, switching sides on a weave on the beat I think looks prettier than getting every swing of the poi on the beat.
"In time" or "Parallel" stuff looks way better on the beat.
Of course, I respect those that ignore the music and 'just flow' but I think the marriage of music and dance is beautiful and something I try, though sometimes fail, to obtain.
Actually, that's why I have trouble spinning at odd speeds. If a tune is at a speed that I can't spin to (or wrap to) I find it tough to spin at all.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
enlightened
187 posts
Location: montreal
187 posts
Location: montreal
Posted:
yur right.. very trancy, mellow but it was jsut to show that even for a slow song it would be difficult to keep on going.
+ wtv i cant do it lol i wouldnt want to my moves have a flow and depend on wtv i feel like linking the current move to
but... music does influence alot
Written by:
Damn that's one slow trance tune!
But you don't have to complete a circle on every beat - I generally complete one every 2 or 4 beats I guess.
yur right.. very trancy, mellow but it was jsut to show that even for a slow song it would be difficult to keep on going.
+ wtv i cant do it lol i wouldnt want to my moves have a flow and depend on wtv i feel like linking the current move to
but... music does influence alot
it must be green
BRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
Posted:
Psytrance and absolutely getting into it. In my way music brings me into a trance, like physical and fysical trance and without just logic exploring (nice otoo.).
Poi like the rhythm :]
Psytrance and absolutely getting into it. In my way music brings me into a trance, like physical and fysical trance and without just logic exploring (nice otoo.).
Poi like the rhythm :]
POI THEO(R)IST
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
Yeah, almost all modern dance music is in 4/4, which sucks a bit (I'm a drummer, and I love interesting time signatures...). The most common variant is probably 12/8, which is still 4 beats in a bar, but each beat is divided into three, rather than 2 or 4. Best example off the top of my head is nellie the elephant
Fortunately, there's lots of things people do to make it all a bit more interesting. There's generally some kind of pattern of accents for a given piece - for example the archetypal house/techno tune will have the snares on 2 and 4 - the backbeats. The rest of the tune doesn't have to follow this, though - rev was talking about 5 beat riffs, and it's quite common to have a riff where the main accents don't line up with each bar. A 2 bar riff (8 beats) could have it's main accents on the 1 and the 6, so it feels like a 5 beat pattern then a 3 beat pattern.
The first cunning trick is then Segmentation - take your bar (or two or four) and chop it up so that you put accents on different beats. You can try all kinds of different divisions. This gets particularly interesting with more funky time signatures (There's a Don Ellis tune in 19 which he chops into 3 3 2 2 3 2 2 2...)
Related, but with a slightly different feel, is Displacement. If you put a 3 beat pattern over a 4 beat pattern, after you go through the 3 beat pattern 4 times you're back in time with the 4 beat. It can be tricky to get this quite right, as a lot of stuff is structured in blocks of 4/8/16 bars. So you could go round a 3 beat pattern 4 times, and then do a 4 beat one and that gives you a nice 4 bar block.
This applies just as much to spinning as it does to music I think, except that you can get away with out of time spinning a lot more. And where I've been talking about accenting, that's not always just about playing a loud note - sometimes there's something about the structure of what's been played that puts more emphasis on a certain beat. Similarly with spinning, it's up to your synesthetic sense how to get accents across - a stall, a pose, a throw, etc... One of my personal missions is getting spinning and music more tightly interwoven - so that in some way they are both expressions of the same ideas.
(And if you want a challenge, anyone who can give me a breakdown of the time signatures in this piece of electronica gets lots of respect...)
Yeah, almost all modern dance music is in 4/4, which sucks a bit (I'm a drummer, and I love interesting time signatures...). The most common variant is probably 12/8, which is still 4 beats in a bar, but each beat is divided into three, rather than 2 or 4. Best example off the top of my head is nellie the elephant
Fortunately, there's lots of things people do to make it all a bit more interesting. There's generally some kind of pattern of accents for a given piece - for example the archetypal house/techno tune will have the snares on 2 and 4 - the backbeats. The rest of the tune doesn't have to follow this, though - rev was talking about 5 beat riffs, and it's quite common to have a riff where the main accents don't line up with each bar. A 2 bar riff (8 beats) could have it's main accents on the 1 and the 6, so it feels like a 5 beat pattern then a 3 beat pattern.
The first cunning trick is then Segmentation - take your bar (or two or four) and chop it up so that you put accents on different beats. You can try all kinds of different divisions. This gets particularly interesting with more funky time signatures (There's a Don Ellis tune in 19 which he chops into 3 3 2 2 3 2 2 2...)
Related, but with a slightly different feel, is Displacement. If you put a 3 beat pattern over a 4 beat pattern, after you go through the 3 beat pattern 4 times you're back in time with the 4 beat. It can be tricky to get this quite right, as a lot of stuff is structured in blocks of 4/8/16 bars. So you could go round a 3 beat pattern 4 times, and then do a 4 beat one and that gives you a nice 4 bar block.
This applies just as much to spinning as it does to music I think, except that you can get away with out of time spinning a lot more. And where I've been talking about accenting, that's not always just about playing a loud note - sometimes there's something about the structure of what's been played that puts more emphasis on a certain beat. Similarly with spinning, it's up to your synesthetic sense how to get accents across - a stall, a pose, a throw, etc... One of my personal missions is getting spinning and music more tightly interwoven - so that in some way they are both expressions of the same ideas.
(And if you want a challenge, anyone who can give me a breakdown of the time signatures in this piece of electronica gets lots of respect...)
monkeys ate my brain
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
that's what I was getting at about letting the music accent me.. as long as you keep with the music.. there's many patterns that are and aren't being accented... that come out in spinning... now I understand why..
Written by: mo-seph
This applies just as much to spinning as it does to music I think, except that you can get away with out of time spinning a lot more. And where I've been talking about accenting, that's not always just about playing a loud note - sometimes there's something about the structure of what's been played that puts more emphasis on a certain beat. Similarly with spinning, it's up to your synesthetic sense how to get accents across - a stall, a pose, a throw, etc... One of my personal missions is getting spinning and music more tightly interwoven - so that in some way they are both expressions of the same ideas.
that's what I was getting at about letting the music accent me.. as long as you keep with the music.. there's many patterns that are and aren't being accented... that come out in spinning... now I understand why..
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
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"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
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