Forums > Social Discussion > Following Your Own Path - Discussion on Self-Based Religion
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Discoverer of Rainbow Cheese
143 posts
Location: Inverness, Scotland.
Discoverer of Rainbow Cheese
143 posts
Location: Inverness, Scotland.
Posted:
Hey all! First, thanks for reading this post and I hope the subject interests you. This thread is about what has become known to people as "unofficial religion", or as the school computers tell me when I try to do research on it; "Unofficial/Indigenous/Occult Beliefs".
After being a Buddhist for 2 years, I have found deep satisfaction in my life. Everything has changed for the better. However, I feel that there is more to the story than Buddhism tells. I believe, unshakably, that there is a God, which Buddhism attempts to, in a sense, dispel.
I find it extremely interesting that some of the people I know and love follow their own paths; their own beliefs, which no-one can distort with their own. I find these people admirable and, to say the least, courageous.
What do all of you beautiful people think about this topic?
Peace & Love
Hey all! First, thanks for reading this post and I hope the subject interests you. This thread is about what has become known to people as "unofficial religion", or as the school computers tell me when I try to do research on it; "Unofficial/Indigenous/Occult Beliefs".
After being a Buddhist for 2 years, I have found deep satisfaction in my life. Everything has changed for the better. However, I feel that there is more to the story than Buddhism tells. I believe, unshakably, that there is a God, which Buddhism attempts to, in a sense, dispel.
I find it extremely interesting that some of the people I know and love follow their own paths; their own beliefs, which no-one can distort with their own. I find these people admirable and, to say the least, courageous.
What do all of you beautiful people think about this topic?
Peace & Love
Time does not exist. In theory, everything with a beginning has an end. Therefore, only things with an end can have a beginning. As time has no end, it has no beginning, therefore does not exist. GO PHILOSOPHY!!!
Brittle Week was the shizz!!!
BRONZE Member
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
I am Pagan sure its not my own 'path' buts it works for me. thats all that should matter. its more of a family if any tradition i follow as my grandma was wiccan and the rest of that side of the family were farmers.
i bring my children up in the same way. i am not going to go into the full detail of what we do as i would be here for ages. but i will say thats its probably not your average way of following an earth based religion as i know that making an offereing to a 'god/godess' will not improve my crops but that making sure the soil is good will. yet we honour the rituals and gods/godess that our ansestors used to before they knew the science so to speak. I think its realy important to remember our ansestory adnw hat they all went through and believed to get us all where we are now.
I am Pagan sure its not my own 'path' buts it works for me. thats all that should matter. its more of a family if any tradition i follow as my grandma was wiccan and the rest of that side of the family were farmers.
i bring my children up in the same way. i am not going to go into the full detail of what we do as i would be here for ages. but i will say thats its probably not your average way of following an earth based religion as i know that making an offereing to a 'god/godess' will not improve my crops but that making sure the soil is good will. yet we honour the rituals and gods/godess that our ansestors used to before they knew the science so to speak. I think its realy important to remember our ansestory adnw hat they all went through and believed to get us all where we are now.
Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Goth - maybe I am misunderstangin the term "paganism"... could you please point out what that means?
I'm curious, as I heard about it, but actually don't know what it really is
Goth - maybe I am misunderstangin the term "paganism"... could you please point out what that means?
I'm curious, as I heard about it, but actually don't know what it really is
the best smiles are the ones you lead to 
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
Hi tim, I agree that by following Buddha’s teachings you can create a future not dictated by the past, but I was thinking more along the lines of meditation and other mental tools like koans.
faithinfire, what you say about the past is true, but it is often the meaning that we attach to past events, that shapes how we act in the present.
FireTom, I don’t think completely neglecting ones past is the answer either, but I agree with the scholars, and suggest you have to get over the stories; like there is an all-powerful supreme being, self-soul and world-soul, before you can move on. You don’t need to understand the universe to reach enlightenment – That’s the red-herring.
GothFrogette, I think there is much to be learnt from the earth based religions especially as they encourage living in harmony and personal development. Understandings like ‘starlight' vision also help people see the world differently than the current paradigm.
FireTom paganism was termed for country people who followed the old religions and were reluctant to convert to Christianity.
Hi tim, I agree that by following Buddha’s teachings you can create a future not dictated by the past, but I was thinking more along the lines of meditation and other mental tools like koans.
faithinfire, what you say about the past is true, but it is often the meaning that we attach to past events, that shapes how we act in the present.
FireTom, I don’t think completely neglecting ones past is the answer either, but I agree with the scholars, and suggest you have to get over the stories; like there is an all-powerful supreme being, self-soul and world-soul, before you can move on. You don’t need to understand the universe to reach enlightenment – That’s the red-herring.
GothFrogette, I think there is much to be learnt from the earth based religions especially as they encourage living in harmony and personal development. Understandings like ‘starlight' vision also help people see the world differently than the current paradigm.
FireTom paganism was termed for country people who followed the old religions and were reluctant to convert to Christianity.
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
BRONZE Member
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
there are a few definitions of paganism, one is to denote people who follow any religion that is not Christian, Jewish, nor Muslim.ather is country folk. ie farmers and people who worked with the land.one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks. Its also used as an umberella term that many earth based belief systems such as Wicca, Druidism, Asatru, Shamanism, Neo-Paganism fall under. (there are other traditions too but i honestly can not remember all of them)
so i guess it depends on which deffenition you use.
i personaly have quite an Animistic view on things but do not follow a tradition as such as non actually sat well with me. you see for me to follow a belief system that follows nature and the earth i could never understand why humanity had to put rules there for others to follow.
hope that made it a little clearer?
oh by the way i am a Pagan Witch... and the term witch is given to anyone practicing magic/magick (not the stage form either)and its not just given to us peeps who get accused of riding on broom sticks
and just to add one more thing, not all pagans are witches and not all witches are pagan.
there are a few definitions of paganism, one is to denote people who follow any religion that is not Christian, Jewish, nor Muslim.ather is country folk. ie farmers and people who worked with the land.one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks. Its also used as an umberella term that many earth based belief systems such as Wicca, Druidism, Asatru, Shamanism, Neo-Paganism fall under. (there are other traditions too but i honestly can not remember all of them)
so i guess it depends on which deffenition you use.
i personaly have quite an Animistic view on things but do not follow a tradition as such as non actually sat well with me. you see for me to follow a belief system that follows nature and the earth i could never understand why humanity had to put rules there for others to follow.
hope that made it a little clearer?
oh by the way i am a Pagan Witch... and the term witch is given to anyone practicing magic/magick (not the stage form either)and its not just given to us peeps who get accused of riding on broom sticks
and just to add one more thing, not all pagans are witches and not all witches are pagan. Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows
SILVER Member
artisan
1,576 posts
Location: Berkshire, UK
artisan
1,576 posts
Location: Berkshire, UK
Posted:
pushing the discussion onto magick.... and the word occult too look their meanings up in the dictionary. You'll meet some generalised terms including 'unknown'...
In other words we make our own magick anyways. As HoPers I'm sure you're well aware of jaw drops and wows from people who haven't seen you spin/juggle before or even seen it but haven't learnt how to do so. Its our own form of magick, as is art, music etc etc.
pushing the discussion onto magick.... and the word occult too look their meanings up in the dictionary. You'll meet some generalised terms including 'unknown'...
In other words we make our own magick anyways. As HoPers I'm sure you're well aware of jaw drops and wows from people who haven't seen you spin/juggle before or even seen it but haven't learnt how to do so. Its our own form of magick, as is art, music etc etc.
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Meaning that "paganism" goes with polytheism/ animism?
Stone: If one detaches from the sizzling experience of touching a red hot oven, one will get burnt again.
And what then is the definition (of which version of Buddhism) about what we are experiencing here and why - what then is the purpose of life? (apart from detaching from desire - if that is not the only purpose itself)
Meaning that "paganism" goes with polytheism/ animism?
Stone: If one detaches from the sizzling experience of touching a red hot oven, one will get burnt again.
And what then is the definition (of which version of Buddhism) about what we are experiencing here and why - what then is the purpose of life? (apart from detaching from desire - if that is not the only purpose itself)
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
BRONZE Member
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
it can do yes, but not all pagans believe or follow the same set of beliefs, hense the different definitions of paganism.
i do not follow any gods or godesses
it can do yes, but not all pagans believe or follow the same set of beliefs, hense the different definitions of paganism.
i do not follow any gods or godesses
Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
...
What means Paganism to YOU then?
...
What means Paganism to YOU then? the best smiles are the ones you lead to
BRONZE Member
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
i am sure i have already said
i am sure i have already said
Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows
Carpal \'Tunnel
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
Posted:
i don't know what i am..................some call me agnostic, others aithiest (even i know that is false)
i don't believe in any one god, and certainly not a christian or islamic go as i believe people of such faiths have lost their way. i follow some buddist teaching, some hindu and some others but i DO NOT follow nor practice any one religeion.
i believe "if to yourself and the earth you stay true, you can harness the power around and in you"
i don't know what i am..................some call me agnostic, others aithiest (even i know that is false)i don't believe in any one god, and certainly not a christian or islamic go as i believe people of such faiths have lost their way. i follow some buddist teaching, some hindu and some others but i DO NOT follow nor practice any one religeion.
i believe "if to yourself and the earth you stay true, you can harness the power around and in you"
SILVER Member
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
Posted:
That's a really nice quote.
That's a really nice quote.
Idolized by Aurinoko
Take me disappearing through the smoke rings of my mind....
Bob Dylan
Carpal \'Tunnel
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
Posted:
"if to yourself and the earth you stay true, you can harness the power around and in you"
you mean this one??
it's by BRAINS KAN
Written by: The Tea Fairy
That's a really nice quote.
"if to yourself and the earth you stay true, you can harness the power around and in you"
you mean this one??
it's by BRAINS KAN
SILVER Member
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
Posted:
Yep, that's the one.
Yep, that's the one.
Idolized by Aurinoko
Take me disappearing through the smoke rings of my mind....
Bob Dylan
Carpal \'Tunnel
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
7,193 posts
Location: in the trees
Posted:
it's from a song called "druid dub" by BRAINS KAN
i couls msn you a copy but it's protected so you'd need to use limewire to ge the certificate
it's from a song called "druid dub" by BRAINS KAN
i couls msn you a copy but it's protected so you'd need to use limewire to ge the certificate
SILVER Member
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
old hand
853 posts
Location: Behind you...
Posted:
I don't even know what a limewire is...
I'm very, very behind in technology at the moment, so I think I'll have to look up this Brains Kan on some future occasion!
I don't even know what a limewire is...
I'm very, very behind in technology at the moment, so I think I'll have to look up this Brains Kan on some future occasion!
Idolized by Aurinoko
Take me disappearing through the smoke rings of my mind....
Bob Dylan
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
Hi FireTom, I’m not sure what you mean when you say “If one detaches from the sizzling experience of touching a red hot oven, one will get burnt again.” As far as the dog biting experience goes, it would only turn you into a victim-pattern if you let it.
I agree that “Neither religion, nor science in itself came back with a 'sufficient' answer of what life is really about and how to become "truly" happy.” That’s why I find Buddhism, and for me Western Buddhism, to be so helpful.
In Western Buddhism there is no bullcrap, no moralizing, putting people down, no good and evil, only enlightenment. Enlightenment is available to anyone, though from all accounts it takes a paradigm shift in thinking to get it. That’s what Buddha did, and that’s why he stuck around to teach us. Meditation and koans are also important because they help free us from the traps of conventional (deterministic) thinking of persistent egos and an “all powerful God”.
Hi FireTom, I’m not sure what you mean when you say “If one detaches from the sizzling experience of touching a red hot oven, one will get burnt again.” As far as the dog biting experience goes, it would only turn you into a victim-pattern if you let it.
I agree that “Neither religion, nor science in itself came back with a 'sufficient' answer of what life is really about and how to become "truly" happy.” That’s why I find Buddhism, and for me Western Buddhism, to be so helpful.
In Western Buddhism there is no bullcrap, no moralizing, putting people down, no good and evil, only enlightenment. Enlightenment is available to anyone, though from all accounts it takes a paradigm shift in thinking to get it. That’s what Buddha did, and that’s why he stuck around to teach us. Meditation and koans are also important because they help free us from the traps of conventional (deterministic) thinking of persistent egos and an “all powerful God”.
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Obviously that didn't clarify it - but maybe that's just me
Sorry, but I'd call this a vast generalisation and may have not attended enough schools, or met enough individuals as to side that statement.
Personally I only meet individuals and experience each and every to still have their individual approach.
As to the terms "Enlightenment", "truely happy" - what does that mean to you (or have I missed out on you stating what this means before)? I already said, that I regard it as a merry go round and usually one that is likely to put scholars in submission (which may be due to "destroy their ego")
If one is scared due to the memory of having been attacked by a dog, it (most likely) will put one in a victim pattern, as fear might kick in when being approached by another one - and this is the wrong reaction, likely to put the dog in a perpetrator-pattern...
Written by: Gothfrogette
I am Pagan sure its not my own 'path' buts it works for me. thats all that should matter. its more of a family if any tradition i follow as my grandma was wiccan and the rest of that side of the family were farmers.
i bring my children up in the same way. i am not going to go into the full detail of what we do as i would be here for ages. but i will say thats its probably not your average way of following an earth based religion as i know that making an offereing to a 'god/godess' will not improve my crops but that making sure the soil is good will. yet we honour the rituals and gods/godess that our ansestors used to before they knew the science so to speak. I think its realy important to remember our ancestory and that they all went through and believed to get us all where we are now.
there are a few definitions of paganism, one is to denote people who follow any religion that is not Christian, Jewish, nor Muslim.ather is country folk. ie farmers and people who worked with the land.one of a people or community observing a polytheistic religion, as the ancient Romans and Greeks. Its also used as an umberella term that many earth based belief systems such as Wicca, Druidism, Asatru, Shamanism, Neo-Paganism fall under. (there are other traditions too but i honestly can not remember all of them)
so i guess it depends on which deffenition you use.
i personaly have quite an Animistic view on things but do not follow a tradition as such as non actually sat well with me. you see for me to follow a belief system that follows nature and the earth i could never understand why humanity had to put rules there for others to follow.
hope that made it a little clearer?
oh by the way i am a Pagan Witch... and the term witch is given to anyone practicing magic/magick (not the stage form either) and its not just given to us peeps who get accused of riding on broom sticks and just to add one more thing, not all pagans are witches and not all witches are pagan.
Obviously that didn't clarify it - but maybe that's just me
Written by: Stone
In Western Buddhism there is no bullcrap, no moralizing, putting people down, no good and evil, only enlightenment. Enlightenment is available to anyone, though from all accounts it takes a paradigm shift in thinking to get it. That’s what Buddha did, and that’s why he stuck around to teach us. Meditation and koans are also important because they help free us from the traps of conventional (deterministic) thinking of persistent egos and an “all powerful God”.
Sorry, but I'd call this a vast generalisation and may have not attended enough schools, or met enough individuals as to side that statement.
Personally I only meet individuals and experience each and every to still have their individual approach.
As to the terms "Enlightenment", "truely happy" - what does that mean to you (or have I missed out on you stating what this means before)? I already said, that I regard it as a merry go round and usually one that is likely to put scholars in submission (which may be due to "destroy their ego")
If one is scared due to the memory of having been attacked by a dog, it (most likely) will put one in a victim pattern, as fear might kick in when being approached by another one - and this is the wrong reaction, likely to put the dog in a perpetrator-pattern...
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
i don't see my religion as putting me down but myself doing so...we have the tools to live an "enlightened life" but let worldly desires come before spiritual ones
people are good, we make decisions that hurt ourselves and others though
just mho
i don't see my religion as putting me down but myself doing so...we have the tools to live an "enlightened life" but let worldly desires come before spiritual ones
people are good, we make decisions that hurt ourselves and others though
just mho
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
SILVER Member
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Posted:
Here's the question. Are any of you Right or are you Wrong?
Here's an answer: in my humble opinion...
Using the fantastic tool known as Pete's Logic (thats mine)
The "you" in this is a collective. That means everyone...
If "you" are "right", then by inference the person next to "you" is "right" too... because if I ask them what is right, then they'll be right too.
Which, in turn, indicates that "everyone" is "right"
Which means that whichever opinion you choose, whichever method you use to connect with a group of people, and by inference connect with a wider world, whichever way you label yourself to help you understand and feel comfortable with how you feel, as long as you have an opinion you have a way.
Now the problems set in when someone decides that "you" are "wrong"
This then leads into conflict. If anyone decides that, then the whole world leads into people putting themselves into boxes where you must convince people, either to "save" them from "sin", or just to create conflict (because it has been inflicted upon you, by other people who think "you" are "wrong")
Because our instincts tell us that we must have something to disagree with to be able to differentiate between "good" and "bad"
And the cycle starts. Then we have to ability to ask whether we are "right" or "wrong".
Then we get that infinitismal examining of every tiny aspect of our life to make us "good", because once we know this difference between good and evil, we can't choose evil.
If "you" accept that the fact that other people, whoever they may be, whatever they believe, are "right", then we lead to a complete dissolution of "right" and "wrong", because everyone must be "right".
Boom. The power of religion goeth out of the window.
Consider the story of Adam and Eve and the Fall as a metaphor. Why did the serpent choose the tree of Knowledge to temp Eve with? Why not the Tree of Life?
Because, IMHO, the knowledge of "right" and "wrong", and the ability to make a differentiation between the two, is our greatest gift, and our greatest weakness. Imagine if we had no wars... But also imagine if we had no community, no shared sense of belonging?
So, to decide what "you" believe in matters not. Its just a box to make "you" comfortable.
But then in turn, if you weren't comfortable, then how would you feel if you had no direction, nowhere to face, nothing to decide?
So belief, or faith, is binding. It is a part of all of us, to make us who we are. WIthout that, we would be lost. Hell, we wouldn't be where we are today!
Thats my little contribution to this thread. I hope you get some idea of what I think, and my "way".
Now I need a lie down, and something to eat.
Here's the question. Are any of you Right or are you Wrong?
Here's an answer: in my humble opinion...
Using the fantastic tool known as Pete's Logic (thats mine)
The "you" in this is a collective. That means everyone...
If "you" are "right", then by inference the person next to "you" is "right" too... because if I ask them what is right, then they'll be right too.
Which, in turn, indicates that "everyone" is "right"
Which means that whichever opinion you choose, whichever method you use to connect with a group of people, and by inference connect with a wider world, whichever way you label yourself to help you understand and feel comfortable with how you feel, as long as you have an opinion you have a way.
Now the problems set in when someone decides that "you" are "wrong"
This then leads into conflict. If anyone decides that, then the whole world leads into people putting themselves into boxes where you must convince people, either to "save" them from "sin", or just to create conflict (because it has been inflicted upon you, by other people who think "you" are "wrong")
Because our instincts tell us that we must have something to disagree with to be able to differentiate between "good" and "bad"
And the cycle starts. Then we have to ability to ask whether we are "right" or "wrong".
Then we get that infinitismal examining of every tiny aspect of our life to make us "good", because once we know this difference between good and evil, we can't choose evil.
If "you" accept that the fact that other people, whoever they may be, whatever they believe, are "right", then we lead to a complete dissolution of "right" and "wrong", because everyone must be "right".
Boom. The power of religion goeth out of the window.
Consider the story of Adam and Eve and the Fall as a metaphor. Why did the serpent choose the tree of Knowledge to temp Eve with? Why not the Tree of Life?
Because, IMHO, the knowledge of "right" and "wrong", and the ability to make a differentiation between the two, is our greatest gift, and our greatest weakness. Imagine if we had no wars... But also imagine if we had no community, no shared sense of belonging?
So, to decide what "you" believe in matters not. Its just a box to make "you" comfortable.
But then in turn, if you weren't comfortable, then how would you feel if you had no direction, nowhere to face, nothing to decide?
So belief, or faith, is binding. It is a part of all of us, to make us who we are. WIthout that, we would be lost. Hell, we wouldn't be where we are today!
Thats my little contribution to this thread. I hope you get some idea of what I think, and my "way".
Now I need a lie down, and something to eat.
ohmygodlaserbeamspewpewpew!
BRONZE Member
Member
128 posts
Location: USA
Member
128 posts
Location: USA
Posted:
Religion is all useless. religion causes wars, Famine, and of course ignorance. the whole world would be better with religion especially Christianity they killed a lot of people and destroyed many cultures just because they thought different. so many horrible things were carried out in the name of "god" and honestly i hate it!
Religion is all useless. religion causes wars, Famine, and of course ignorance. the whole world would be better with religion especially Christianity they killed a lot of people and destroyed many cultures just because they thought different. so many horrible things were carried out in the name of "god" and honestly i hate it!
Ich brauche Zeit
Kein Heroin kein Alkohol kein Nikotin
Brauch keine Hilfe
Kein Koffein
Doch Dynamit und Terpentin
Ich brauche Öl für Gasolin
Explosiv wie Kerosin
Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei
Einen Kraftstoff wie Benzin
BRONZE Member
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
grumpy poorly froggy
3,999 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
religions do not cause wars, there are plenty of christaians for examble out there who have not gone round killing people. its man who causes wars.
no ONE religiong is right for the world, however if its right for the individual then that is all that matters. i am a believer of freedom of ALL religions even if i don't agree with the way they go about doing things. Every one should be alowed to belive what they what.
Fire Tom perhaps i didn't expalin it properly i shall give it another go.
Paganism for me is a natural set of beliefs that follow and honor the universe but mainly the earth that we are on. I do not believe that there are outside dieties who control what we do, but i still honor them for the 'traditional side' of things. mainly as our ansestors did beleive and follow them. i am a strong believer in acknowledging what our ansestors did. without them we would not be where we are now and to ignor that just shows ignorance which unfortuently is so apparent in this day and age.
Anyway we follow the seasons and keep a balance within our lives. everyone should be equal and i bring my children up very open minded and to shopw respect to others. i understand that this is not just a religious thing buit part of being a good parent.The Animistic part i am not sure where it comes from with me. it just what i beleive and like beliving. everything that is natural has a soul. its just nice and well seems that its my life so i will belive what i want.
sorry if its seems a bit all over the place, i am going to stop there as i have 4 eggs waiting for me to tuck into and i am rather hungry.
in short believe what you want to. if it makes you happy that is all that matters
religions do not cause wars, there are plenty of christaians for examble out there who have not gone round killing people. its man who causes wars.
no ONE religiong is right for the world, however if its right for the individual then that is all that matters. i am a believer of freedom of ALL religions even if i don't agree with the way they go about doing things. Every one should be alowed to belive what they what.
Fire Tom perhaps i didn't expalin it properly i shall give it another go.
Paganism for me is a natural set of beliefs that follow and honor the universe but mainly the earth that we are on. I do not believe that there are outside dieties who control what we do, but i still honor them for the 'traditional side' of things. mainly as our ansestors did beleive and follow them. i am a strong believer in acknowledging what our ansestors did. without them we would not be where we are now and to ignor that just shows ignorance which unfortuently is so apparent in this day and age.
Anyway we follow the seasons and keep a balance within our lives. everyone should be equal and i bring my children up very open minded and to shopw respect to others. i understand that this is not just a religious thing buit part of being a good parent.The Animistic part i am not sure where it comes from with me. it just what i beleive and like beliving. everything that is natural has a soul. its just nice and well seems that its my life so i will belive what i want.
sorry if its seems a bit all over the place, i am going to stop there as i have 4 eggs waiting for me to tuck into and i am rather hungry.
in short believe what you want to. if it makes you happy that is all that matters
Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
obviously i do think one religion is better than others and is better than self-based or lack of faith, but i know that other faiths have merit to them and appreciate them...i expect also that others think they are right and i have to respect that
in the end, i think all you can do is lead by example. telling someone they are wrong and going to hell or whatever doesn't do anything but get a few scared sheep in your herd.
leading by example is what jesus did, and he didn't force his teachings on anyone just those graceful enough to listen either because they heard of him or saw how he acted
right now things are a little more do as i say not as i do, but i am trying to make it do as i do
we can all learn from each other
obviously i do think one religion is better than others and is better than self-based or lack of faith, but i know that other faiths have merit to them and appreciate them...i expect also that others think they are right and i have to respect that
in the end, i think all you can do is lead by example. telling someone they are wrong and going to hell or whatever doesn't do anything but get a few scared sheep in your herd.
leading by example is what jesus did, and he didn't force his teachings on anyone just those graceful enough to listen either because they heard of him or saw how he acted
right now things are a little more do as i say not as i do, but i am trying to make it do as i do
we can all learn from each other
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
SILVER Member
lurking like a ninja with no camouflage..
926 posts
Location: over yonder, New Zealand
lurking like a ninja with no camouflage..
926 posts
Location: over yonder, New Zealand
Posted:
ravehead absolutely right. nicely simply put.
religion has been the reason for wars, simply because one side does not follow the same religion as the other, and both believe that theirs is the correct and ONLY path to take. thus ensues a cold hearted battle of who is 'right'. maybe if they read ravehads post and in fact this thread in general they might change their views.... 
ravehead absolutely right. nicely simply put.
religion has been the reason for wars, simply because one side does not follow the same religion as the other, and both believe that theirs is the correct and ONLY path to take. thus ensues a cold hearted battle of who is 'right'. maybe if they read ravehads post and in fact this thread in general they might change their views....
on spam robots - "Burn the robot! Melt him down, and then we can make lots and lots of money from his shiiiny juices!"
Owned by Brenn 
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
religion is not the reason for wars, the human element of religion is the reason
(don't kill me-guns don't kill people, people kill people)
if it wasn't religion, people would find another reason to war
religion is not the reason for wars, the human element of religion is the reason
(don't kill me-guns don't kill people, people kill people)
if it wasn't religion, people would find another reason to war
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
SILVER Member
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Posted:
Yeah sorry, i made my point poorly.
It is the part of us that needs to belong, and turns us away from other ideas cos ours is "right" that causes conflict.
Not necessarily war. just conflict. Might just be not talking to someone for a week, but the principle, i feel, is sound
Its just the differences that make us who we are. Taken to extremes, we get fight.
Yeah sorry, i made my point poorly.
It is the part of us that needs to belong, and turns us away from other ideas cos ours is "right" that causes conflict.
Not necessarily war. just conflict. Might just be not talking to someone for a week, but the principle, i feel, is sound
Its just the differences that make us who we are. Taken to extremes, we get fight.
ohmygodlaserbeamspewpewpew!
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
i don't know that it is someone is right but that the "others" are wrong
edit
like democrats, they didn't have a platform of ideas showing what they were but what they weren't...anyone who was what they weren't was then the enemy-aka republicans and conservatives
EDITED_BY: faithinfire (1171221096)
i don't know that it is someone is right but that the "others" are wrong
edit
like democrats, they didn't have a platform of ideas showing what they were but what they weren't...anyone who was what they weren't was then the enemy-aka republicans and conservatives
EDITED_BY: faithinfire (1171221096)
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
Err Fire Tom, sorry but that vast generalization was how I see Western Buddhism. To quote from The History, Philosophy and Practice of Buddhism “There is currently an emerging Western Buddhism which is simple, uncluttered, and goes to the core of the teaching of the Buddha. Many concepts and practices, difficult for Westerners are left out. Rituals such as the chanting, the music and dancing, which form part of the Oriental culture are often not found in this new Western Buddhism, which will become a new style in the Buddhist movement.”
To answer your question- What does Enlightenment mean to me? I’d say it is awakening from the "sleep of ignorance" by directly realizing the true nature of reality. As said earlier, “One explanation of enlightenment is the extinction of desire, the extinction of hate and the extinction of illusion. For example, "If a man speaks or acts with a pure thought, happiness will follow him, like a shadow that never leaves him. "He abused me, he beat me, he defeated me, he robbed me" – in those that harbour such thoughts hatred will never cease. For hatred does not cease by hatred at any time. This is an old rule. "
I’m not sure I agree about your biting dog scenario. You really only establish a victim pattern if you think the dog bit you because of you. Alternative meanings could be the dog bit me because it was sick and irritable, it was miss treated by it’s owner, or it just bit me.
Flashpoint, getting over our instincts that tell us that we must have something to disagree with to be able to differentiate between "good" and "bad" is what Buddhism is all about.
On the conflict between good and evil. I said earlier that a key to enlightenment is overcoming dualism, without merely substituting it with monism or pluralism. Thinking in opposites (right and wrong, good or evil) makes it difficult to achieve a sense of non-duality. Buddhism does not have a notion of sin because there is no such thing as sin. There is only ignorance and false views. Evil does not spring for the devil, bit from ignorance. There will be no evil left in the world when ignorance and false views are eradicated. Imagine, a world with out conflict.
I’m not sure if you read earlier posts on the Tree of Knowledge, but I disagree with your statement: “….the knowledge of "right" and "wrong", and the ability to make a differentiation between the two, is our greatest gift, and our greatest weakness.” Because, this to me is the trap we need to avoid. Just don’t eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. That path leads to death and destuction. If you want an example, just look at how the children of the book (Jews, Christians and Muslims) are slaughtering each other today in the Middle East.
Old Zen Poem
The perfect way is without difficulty,
Save that it avoids picking and choosing.
Only when you stop liking and disliking
Will all be clearly understood.
A split hairs difference
And heaven and hell are set apart!
If you want to get to the plain truth,
Be not concerned with right or wrong,
The conflict between right and wrong is a sickness of the mind.
Err Fire Tom, sorry but that vast generalization was how I see Western Buddhism. To quote from The History, Philosophy and Practice of Buddhism “There is currently an emerging Western Buddhism which is simple, uncluttered, and goes to the core of the teaching of the Buddha. Many concepts and practices, difficult for Westerners are left out. Rituals such as the chanting, the music and dancing, which form part of the Oriental culture are often not found in this new Western Buddhism, which will become a new style in the Buddhist movement.”
To answer your question- What does Enlightenment mean to me? I’d say it is awakening from the "sleep of ignorance" by directly realizing the true nature of reality. As said earlier, “One explanation of enlightenment is the extinction of desire, the extinction of hate and the extinction of illusion. For example, "If a man speaks or acts with a pure thought, happiness will follow him, like a shadow that never leaves him. "He abused me, he beat me, he defeated me, he robbed me" – in those that harbour such thoughts hatred will never cease. For hatred does not cease by hatred at any time. This is an old rule. "
I’m not sure I agree about your biting dog scenario. You really only establish a victim pattern if you think the dog bit you because of you. Alternative meanings could be the dog bit me because it was sick and irritable, it was miss treated by it’s owner, or it just bit me.
Flashpoint, getting over our instincts that tell us that we must have something to disagree with to be able to differentiate between "good" and "bad" is what Buddhism is all about.
On the conflict between good and evil. I said earlier that a key to enlightenment is overcoming dualism, without merely substituting it with monism or pluralism. Thinking in opposites (right and wrong, good or evil) makes it difficult to achieve a sense of non-duality. Buddhism does not have a notion of sin because there is no such thing as sin. There is only ignorance and false views. Evil does not spring for the devil, bit from ignorance. There will be no evil left in the world when ignorance and false views are eradicated. Imagine, a world with out conflict.
I’m not sure if you read earlier posts on the Tree of Knowledge, but I disagree with your statement: “….the knowledge of "right" and "wrong", and the ability to make a differentiation between the two, is our greatest gift, and our greatest weakness.” Because, this to me is the trap we need to avoid. Just don’t eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. That path leads to death and destuction. If you want an example, just look at how the children of the book (Jews, Christians and Muslims) are slaughtering each other today in the Middle East.
Old Zen Poem
The perfect way is without difficulty,
Save that it avoids picking and choosing.
Only when you stop liking and disliking
Will all be clearly understood.
A split hairs difference
And heaven and hell are set apart!
If you want to get to the plain truth,
Be not concerned with right or wrong,
The conflict between right and wrong is a sickness of the mind.
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
addict
614 posts
614 posts
Posted:
if we change right and wrong for love and fear,i believe we have a much more useful way of looking at the world,it we were all motivated by love rather than fear perhaps we would all be better off?
if we change right and wrong for love and fear,i believe we have a much more useful way of looking at the world,it we were all motivated by love rather than fear perhaps we would all be better off?
SILVER Member
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Pasta of Muppets
2,722 posts
Location: in the interwebs..., United Kingdom
Posted:
Damn you tim. Thats what i was thinking about! Not right and wrong, more "positive" and "negative". Then you get into yin/yang stuff, and thats where my brain breaks
Damn you tim. Thats what i was thinking about! Not right and wrong, more "positive" and "negative". Then you get into yin/yang stuff, and thats where my brain breaks
ohmygodlaserbeamspewpewpew!
SILVER Member
lurking like a ninja with no camouflage..
926 posts
Location: over yonder, New Zealand
lurking like a ninja with no camouflage..
926 posts
Location: over yonder, New Zealand
Posted:
I have sidled off the path a little. In the last few weeks I've lost my own path, gotten confused by it and doubted it, before returning to a part of it I had already walked on. I had to stop thinking about it to give my brain a break. It feels like I now have to learn a few lessons again that I thought I had learned before but seem to have forgotten. This problem with intuition and thought has come up again...my head was disconnected from my heart.. I'm still in the flow and think my life is fairly synchronistic, I have a big belief in positive vibes, universal love
and world energy but when I started thinking of things on a bigger universal scale and the possibility of other dimensions of the universe my mind seemed to explode a little.
So back to a smaller scale 
what I think I've learned from this though is to keep focusing on the positive no matter how depressed you feel, always try to re-channel the negative energy into something more positive...there was a point i just didnt feel like i wanted to be happy. but the more i thought about that the more i realised it would just depress me for longer...
I have sidled off the path a little. In the last few weeks I've lost my own path, gotten confused by it and doubted it, before returning to a part of it I had already walked on. I had to stop thinking about it to give my brain a break. It feels like I now have to learn a few lessons again that I thought I had learned before but seem to have forgotten. This problem with intuition and thought has come up again...my head was disconnected from my heart.. I'm still in the flow and think my life is fairly synchronistic, I have a big belief in positive vibes, universal love
and world energy but when I started thinking of things on a bigger universal scale and the possibility of other dimensions of the universe my mind seemed to explode a little. So back to a smaller scale what I think I've learned from this though is to keep focusing on the positive no matter how depressed you feel, always try to re-channel the negative energy into something more positive...there was a point i just didnt feel like i wanted to be happy. but the more i thought about that the more i realised it would just depress me for longer...
on spam robots - "Burn the robot! Melt him down, and then we can make lots and lots of money from his shiiiny juices!"
Owned by Brenn
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