Forums > Social Discussion > A Terrfying Prophecy *DELETED*

Login/Join to Participate

inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
Post deleted by Sunbird

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


polaritySILVER Member
veteran
1,228 posts
Location: on the wrong planet, United Kingdom


Posted:
I would say that only that which is dead decays, and it is of no use to the living until it has decayed fully, at which point it supports life.

Until then it will continue to be offensive, and short of incinerating it or sterilising it by other means, avoiding it until the process is completed is the best way to deal with it.

You aren't thinking or really existing unless you're willing to risk even your own sanity in the judgment of your existence.

Green peppers, lime pickle and whole-grain mustard = best sandwich filling.


StoutBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
It looks like this should be two threads actually.

First the 'behaviour gene" I dunno, would you put free thinkers in the same category as psychopaths/sociopaths?

As to the human/rabbit, the article states this is geared towards stem cell research. It's kind of a funny way to go about it seeing as there are a lot cheaper and easier ways to get stem cells, but these are the cloning guys. Chances are, if it's hitting the mainstream media now, it's not really new.

Splicing human genes into animal cells has been going on for quite some time now

inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
regardless, it's disgusting! they are creating embryos, embryos are alive, are actual beings with a right to live are they not? but should such a thing ever be created in order for this question to be raised in the first place?

As for the ASBO babies, is that not another form of wthnic cleansing? did not Hilter and Millosovich do that, did we not condemn it as evil? so, is it evil only when someone else does it, but when we do it it's good? NO! Unlike them, I wouldn't say wipe out babies with the a******e politician gene, I'd say let them be br born, let them live, but make sure they are properly educated to be compassionate and also let them live as the average people do, if they live in a council estate with barely enough to get by, and if they are brought up being able to see the mistakes of other politicians in this way, they'd be, I feel more realistic and helpful to society. My solution to ASBO kids is to give them a damn good slap when they are out of order, it worked, but now it's illegal?!

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
Looks to me like human DNA in rabbit cells. Cheap and easy way to study early developement and stem cells, and no theoretical possibility they could advance past a few dozen cells. Anime style rabbit people arn't going to happen this way, since they are still geneticaly human and could never reach full term. I don't think it'd work as as research tool because there will probably be incompatability between the species.

What society does with a test for anti-social behaviour disorder (ie. sociopathy) will be a reflection of what society is, since it will happen regardless. It could lead to early intervention to prevent a damaging mental condition, or to gene based imprisonment. Which it'll be will come down to whether we are resonable and compassionate people or reactionary and callous.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


spinningstarletSILVER Member
enthusiast
271 posts
Location: Bradford *rolls eyes*, United Kingdom


Posted:
Ok, but is creating something knowing that it will not survive, just as a "Cheap and easy way" to do something moraly right?

the anti-social behaviour gene test immediatly brings to mind the Nature Vs Nurture argument...

how can you be SURE that one or the other is the independant cause for anti-social behaviour?

jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
 Written by: toobie


Ok, but is creating something knowing that it will not survive, just as a "Cheap and easy way" to do something moraly right?


Yup. Human dna isn't sacrosanct, it doesn't imbue a cell with some vital spark that makes it comparable to a human being. Morally this is the equivalent to cooking with live yeast.

 Written by: toobie


how can you be SURE that one or the other is the independant cause for anti-social behaviour?


No-one is saying that they are. A gene "for" sociopathy may only come into effect in the correct environment, or in the prescence of other unidentified genes. Perhaps diet, upbringing or chance may have a vital effect. Likewise people without the hypothetical genes may well become sociopaths regardless. What matters is that it's a statistical clue. If you can show that someone has a 70% chance of developing the condition, that's a good reason to ensure that they recieve good conditions and counseling to cut the odds.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


87wt2gxq7veteran
1,502 posts
Location: Birmingham


Posted:
just to pick up on one point, I never thought of Brave New World as a dystopia...

ben-ja-menGOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia


Posted:
 Written by: Sunbird

One wass of Testing unborn ASBO babies, trying to find the gene that causes "antisocial" behaviour, why would they do this? it seems to me a step toward erradicating the free thinking people and those who allthough are diruptive to some, would stand up for their rights and what they believe, how long after the disovery would they be convincing parents to have their children "modified" or terminated?



um ...... what are you basing this on?

 Written by: the scotsman article


The new test works in two stages: first, the mother is given a ten-minute psychological questionnaire on her own personality to assess how she will relate to her own child.

If mothers are judged to be at risk then videotaping her with her child can be the next stage. Psychologists then "code" the tape to assess the health of the relationship.



if you read further down Dr Bjarne Holmes the psychologist who the article referes to comments that

"I must respond that unfortunately, what was published in the Scotsman today only contains small fragments of what I or any of my colleagues agreed to. I take distance from the way this article is framed, the ridiculous picture, and the sensational title."

as for the rabbit thing i think you have taken that out of context to

"They will never grow beyond the 200 cell stage and they will have no human features," said Prof Shaw."

Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?


ben-ja-menGOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia


Posted:
oh and just to add

sensationalism == the news == huuuuuuuge distortion of the truth to get outraged and interested

like seriously as if you believe anything written in the news, half of what reseachers publish is bollox cos they turn a blind eye to the results that didnt work, but the media deliberately go out of their way to distort the truth, until you see a giant bunny man hopping down the street or a super nanny on roids runny round the poor areas of towns stealing dna and handing out abortions for potential ASBO babies i think you can rest easy.



"trying to find the gene that causes "antisocial" behaviour"
where did you even get that idea from? like thats such a serious strech of the sensationalism in those articles

the only possible phrase i can think that might have lead you to this is
"'pre-birth' action would be taken if necessary." but taken in the context of the article this means providing young mums with more support and education so that learn how to bond effectively with their children

Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?


StoutBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
Jeff, do you figure this is actually a cheaper and easier way to obtain stem cells when compared to traditional methods? Sell them to the Americans, maybe.

Unfortunately, there is a need for super nannies, as some people have a focus other than doing a proper job of raising their children. frown

lilith_in_londonSILVER Member
member
149 posts
Location: floating about, United Kingdom


Posted:
this is a massive argument, but the main points i wanted to make are these -

there is a duty of care to those people who are already here, suffering much and dying earlier. if we have the possibility to cure them, should we not do so?

an embryo has a small chance of developing into a fetus in vivo. this is even slimmer if the conception happens in vitro (as it does with embryos from which stem cells are taken).

the even greater question: why does nobody care about the normal fate of these unwanted embryos (the incinerator) that are instead requested for research?

plus, i think it's silly to add the biological argument to the mess of fetus ASBOS. that has nothing to do with genes for this or that.

more generally, this is a really important argument. how are we going to deal with the endless ethical maze that genetics and other technology are going to bring about?

i think it's necessary for people to be aware of how research is done, what it may contribute and especially of its limitations. everybody should have a say as to how they think we should handle the possibilities and problems that come with genetics medicine. make noise, become involved in health policy, write letters...

this debate must be based in solid information, tho. better than the sources above, which are quite poor examples of science journalism.

sorry, rant over rolleyes

night night ubbangel

c'est pas nous qui sommes la rue, c'est la rue ktanou!

1st official camden town (uk) meet 21st october! see the events bit


inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
Ben-Ja-Men, call me a seer.

Jeff, it's still human and still living,

Lilith, why don't you sign up for testing, it's much more accurate when dome on a full adult human, that on a hybrid embryo.

I'm in a bad mood today, this world is falling to bits anyway, all these experinments and ASBO testers etc are gonna be burned up in nuke blasts from Korea, or more likely from America when it runs out of oil anyway.

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
It's not human, it only has human dna. There is more to humanity than dna.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
 Written by: jeff(fake)


It's not human, it only has human dna. There is more to humanity than dna.



ditto ditto ditto ditto ditto

couldn't agree more.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


ben-ja-menGOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia


Posted:
 Written by: Sunbird

Ben-Ja-Men, call me a seer.



you understand that the article is talking about environmental factors right? ...... the babys genes dont determine these.

Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?


lilith_in_londonSILVER Member
member
149 posts
Location: floating about, United Kingdom


Posted:
 Written by: Sunbird



Another was of Scientists poised to create Human/Rabbit hybrid Embyos, WHY THE HECK WOULD THEY DO SUCH A DISGUSTING THING? Was one of Hitler's own experinments just that? did we not call him evil? Needless to say it would create a docile human hybrid, most likely easily influenced and with a capacity to do nothing more than obey orders.







whaaaaa?



actually, no. it would be just that, a human "program" running on a rabbit "hardware". same difference whether you run Linux on a computer of any brand. does that make sense? it would NOT be a "docile semi-human". it would probably not survive beyond a few cells, but then neither would most of "normal" human embryos.

the whole point of this experiment is to avoid the lack of human egg cells necessary for stem cell research.



And please hand down some sources on that Hitler thing - would you believe, can't find these "experiments" anywhere. Hitler did much, much, much worse things to people. Alive, breathing, felling people.



Oh and the reason why people use embryos is because adult cells don't work! Or you thought that big, evil scientists do it for fun?



And where is your rant against nuclear physics? And GM? And biochemical WMD? And the inherent evilness of humanity?





edit: i stand by all of that ^ but everybody's opinion is different, etc, and it's not my thing to antagonise people. please don't take it personally. hug





(mellower) lilith
EDITED_BY: lilith_in_london (1160599538)

c'est pas nous qui sommes la rue, c'est la rue ktanou!

1st official camden town (uk) meet 21st october! see the events bit


Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
 Written by: lilith_in_london


And please hand down some sources on that Hitler thing - would you believe, can't find these "experiments" anywhere.



yeah, would be interesting to see them... i'm sure (although i'm willing to be proved wrong!) that they didn't actually have the capability do to that back then.

haha. unless you mean he experimented with cross breeding which really would be odd.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


FireTomStargazer
6,650 posts

Posted:
But isn't cloning the answer to one of the last questions of mankind?

"There is more to human than DNA" - and this is exactly the question. Is there? And "how do you know?" Do you dream it up? Is the soul something genetical, or something different? Not sure, but guess that even the DNA of identical twins has some differences. Naturally they are not identical persons. Now what happens with personalities inside bodies with IDENTICAL codes? (Nature vs. nurture)

However, IF trusting government and parents: What's the deal? I might look exactly the way my parents want me to, may have talents never imagined and am even able to dive 5 hours at 40m's (without gear)... umm

I know it sounds contradictory to oppose GMF (in the way it's proceeded and dealt with today) and not genetical engeneering... IMO Both might be a key to survive the (environmental) challenges that lie ahead of us...

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink


dreamSILVER Member
currently mending
493 posts
Location: Bristol, New Zealand


Posted:
 Written by: sunbird

all these experinments and ASBO testers etc are gonna be burned up in nuke blasts from Korea, or more likely from America when it runs out of oil anyway.




ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol

it must be the apocalypse

ubbidea

don't know about anyone else's thoughts but North Korea possessing as many as eight nuclear warheads, each with about 1/15th the power of the bomb dropped on hiroshima 50 years ago clearly spells the start of nuclear armageddon

ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol ubblol

Also you might want to look into the Korea's lack of intercontinental ballistic missiles before predicting that they could hit the UK

ubbloco ubbloco ubbloco

seriously though... put down your copy of the Daily Mail and think a bit harder before claiming the end of the world is upon us.

He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.

Nietzsche


Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
 Written by: FireTom


But isn't cloning the answer to one of the last questions of mankind?

"There is more to human than DNA" - and this is exactly the question. Is there? And "how do you know?"



true, although he did say this...

 Written by:

It's not human, it only has human dna. There is more to humanity than dna.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


FireTomStargazer
6,650 posts

Posted:
redface thanks Tao... small, but significant difference... Hence for me, both goes up the same alley... and further: IMO there is more to being human, than the body only...

What exactly scares you so much?

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink


inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
Gee, thanks Lilith and Dream, I must be a real idiot eh? gods, stupid me! brand stupid into my head someone, I mean, how stupid can I be? <--- sarcasm

I don't know exactly what hilter did, I do know I've heard some pretty freaky stuff. I don't actually read the papers, I just got drawn to read these ones, anyway, I doubt I'll ever bother expressing my opinions, visions or thoughts here again.

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


StoutBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
I wouldn't be so hasty there Sunbird, this is what discussion is all about. Discussing.

Your "seer" self conjectured up a few motivations and end results that clearly weren't true. Maybe your visions of our species are a little too dark.

As to not reading the papers ( or doing your research ) that's your problem. You may find it appropriate to state that "you heard somewhere" that Hitler was experimenting with human/animal hybrids, but a few minutes perusing online sources will convince you that they didn't have the technology back then, unless, of course you were suspecting that someone was boinking a bunny.

What do you figure is going to happen when they find the gene that codes for homosexuality?

Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
 Written by: Sunbird

I don't know exactly what hilter did, I do know I've heard some pretty freaky stuff. I don't actually read the papers, I just got drawn to read these ones, anyway, I doubt I'll ever bother expressing my opinions, visions or thoughts here again.



hey, sorry! i wasn't trying to dismiss what you said, it's just that on here most people will ask for sources as it's so easy to link to something.

In a discussion like this where people are talking about such emotive subjects is really important to back up what you're saying, otherwise we would all just be guessing which is no basis for a discussion smile

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
Ok guys, I'm sorry, I'm not used to chatting a lot about my visions and other stuff.

Ok, before I say anything else I'm gonna have a bit more af a thorough read. as for my visions of our species being dark, you're right, I always say our reality is defined by what we choose to see, I'm one for dwelling int the dark so when bad things happen I'm not dissapointed. But saying that, world leaders and certain other individuals and groups in the world have hardly been light workers, I wouldn't put this kind of stuff past most of them. That being said, perhaps that's what I choose to see? lol.

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


daizeSILVER Member
member
175 posts
Location: Falmouth, Cornwall, England (UK)


Posted:
Sunbird you seem to have some very extreem, intolerant views.

Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
 Written by: daize


Sunbird you seem to have some very extreem, intolerant views.



that was a bit unecessary. any views yourself? or did you just come here to comment on other people.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


inactiveSILVER Member
old hand
722 posts
Location: United Kingdom


Posted:
See, this is what I find upsetting.... did daize go to my profile before deciding to say that? does daize actually know the kind of person I am? I doubt it. When people argue they seem to do it without any forethought, without and knowledge of the person and thus their relation to the argument.

To you who has been accessing my online accounts, changing my login details, locations and posting censored about me, realise, you are not worth revenge, you are not worth my attention, you are nothing, and that is all you ever will be.


StoutBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
Sunbird, I can see how you'd be upset, but here in discussion, it's not really about you as a person. It's about opinions and facts, and differentiating the two.

If I spent more time in chat and intro threads maybe I could sympathize that it's a "personal" thing between you and Daize, but I don't, so I can't.

I don't actually know what Daize was on about, maybe you could try asking her. The extreme part of her comment is debatable, but the intolerant part completely eludes me.

HOP Newsletter
Sign up to get the latest on sales, new releases and more...