Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
I have done a few searches for this and cant find anything. I can do normal barrel rolls, can some explane how to do the butterfly one or even better give me a link to an existing thread. thank you. biggrin

spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
They can be done, but explaining them is beyond me right now at work as they're a bit tricky. But they're sort of a cheat, one poi will be threaded through the middle so travels inbetween the other poi and the arm that's holding that other poi. There's not an awful lot of space there though, nor time to get them past each other...

"Moo," said the happy cow.


RicheeBRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic


Posted:

Here is link for video where Rev is doing butterfly wall plane inversions.

They can be done wall plane with inversions from side
to side and split the butterfly helps a lot.

Barell roll is static, where this move is not.

lightning,

:R

POI THEO(R)IST


faith enfireBRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA


Posted:
link doesn't work

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


oliSILVER Member
not with cactus
2,052 posts
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devon, United Kingdom


Posted:
i just tried to write a description of how to do this that made sense, but i couldnt. so i made a vido of them which is https://www.homeofpoi.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10663
< there ...

that might not help either your hands seem to have to move pretty quickly through the move..

good luck smile

Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no


faith enfireBRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA


Posted:
got it, the link, not the move, so don't have the move

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
 Written by: oli


i just tried to write a description of how to do this that made sense, but i couldnt. so i made a vido of them which is https://www.homeofpoi.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10663
< there ...

that might not help either your hands seem to have to move pretty quickly through the move..

good luck smile



cheers oli and spiralx, helped me understand a bit better. i see and understand it, but doing it will be a different matter, i will try though, i think this moves looks amazing. the video has helped alot, now i'm gonna try reply it as many times as poss in slow, very slow motion. ubbloco

animatEdBRONZE Member
1 + 1 = 3
3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK


Posted:
Oli, Is that a split time butterfly there?

Also, sorry to be a pain in the ass, but is it possible to have a better quality, longer video, where we can see better what you're doing? Maybe spinning even slower if you can...

Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.


Disc0annoying boy
160 posts
Location: Sweden


Posted:
seems to be split time, i have trouble imagining what it would look like in same time.

spinning slower isn't needed, if you got a good media-player that has slow-forward-playing features (like vlc got...)

apologies for bad grammar and spelling.

fire is just light and heat.
it's you friend!


DuncGOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom


Posted:
I'm sure there's a video of T&B doing it somewhere....

I'll go make one too I think smile

Let's relight this forum ubblove


AcciaioSILVER Member
Tangled into my spins
187 posts
Location: Italy


Posted:
Thanx oli your video open my mind in butterfly inversions!!!
Now I can go to try atoms in inversion is the same principle or I don't understand it???

Thanx

Acciaio devil

DuncGOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom


Posted:
Arse! I can't get the video to upload to HoP frown It's definately small enough to fit too....poo



Any one wanna host it for me? It's 2meg
EDITED_BY: Dunc (1146234098)

Let's relight this forum ubblove


Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
dunc, try www.youtube.com

SymBRONZE Member
Geek-enviro-hippy priest
1,858 posts
Location: Diss, Norfolk, United Kingdom


Posted:
I can host it mate, or Play can wink

There's too many home fires burning and not enough trees


fNiGOLD Member
master of disaster
3,354 posts
Location: New York, USA


Posted:
ditto

kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more


DentrassiGOLD Member
ZORT!
3,044 posts
Location: Brisbane, Australia


Posted:
are they any handy vids/threads that just show basic barrel rolls and perhaps some variations? im pretty sure im doing them right - at least how i visualise those descriptions - but it would be good to check.

Searching for threads revealed some bewildering theoretical poi discussions/debates ill maybe try to comprehend when i understand more of the basics - a simply video would be infinitely more useful.



thanx.

E ubbrollsmile
EDITED_BY: Dentrassi (1146370133)

"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.


DuncGOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom


Posted:
I remember Icon posted a barrel roll video about 2 years or so ago at least, but I've searched and can't find it in moves or video forum. I'm sure if you pm him he'll be able to give you a link or bump the thread perhaps smile

Right I've tried emailing it but my computer seems to hate uploading of any sorts. I even thought perhaps it just took a while cuz it was 2meg so I set it to run when I went to bed and when I got up 6 hours later it was still arsing about, so I'll bung it onto CD and upload it to play or into my gallery when I'm back in work on Tuesday.

Stoopid f#cking computer...grr....

Let's relight this forum ubblove


Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
cheers to all the help, i've cracked it now! got it going both ways like your vid oli, cheers!

arashiPooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx


Posted:
hate to throw a wrench into the mix... but here goes

anyways dentrassi there's some basic follow time "barrel roll" inversions in my "fuse" vid at www.firecircus.com

however the moves oli is doing are almost the exact same thing as bfly inversions so learn them cause they are fun, but technically they aren't inversions, they are thru-wrapped inside butterflies smile

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.


arashiPooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx


Posted:
p.s. feel free to totally ignore that BTW wink

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
 Written by: arashi


.. but technically they aren't inversions, they are thru-wrapped inside butterflies smile



HAhaha, i'm guessing this is the terminology you and rev have been, ahem ...discussing...

Can't view those vids so i can't say either way. But i see how there may be a subtle variation between an inversion and a thru wrap... however that seems exceptionally subtle difference to me, especially in a move that goes as quick as this.

Anyhoo, excellent patterns, open up a whole can of worms. (plenty on the dvd wink )


m

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


oliSILVER Member
not with cactus
2,052 posts
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devon, United Kingdom


Posted:
arashi, why is the move in that video not inverted, why is it inside? what is a butterfly inversion in your terms?

you can do that move with no thru wraps, it is just slightly easier with thru wraps.. possibly...

Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no


Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
whats the main differerence between thru wraps and inversions, i see them as the same thing almost. correct me please if i'm wrong but i thought an inversion was when one was inside and the other was on the outward side. this is how i see thru wraps being done. confused2
EDITED_BY: nickwidd (1147127763)

DuncGOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom


Posted:
I guess it helps to describe the wrap part as aposed to just "being inside"
Inverted Wrap, thru wraps, I guess they mostly describe the same thing, although not always ie outside to outside thru wraps

I just uploaded (now my computer is finally let me move big files) a butterfly barrell roll tutorial to my gallery HERE

Let me know what you think smile

Let's relight this forum ubblove


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
Good vid dunc, and the first one i've ever managed to grab from the hop gallery. Never worked for me before and i'm not sure why that one worked but it's all good.

Anyhoo. It's interesting how you do them cos you use long socks and there's definitely a couple of thru wraps going on (the poi bend in the middle)

Thats i bit different to how i do them. I use shorter poi and kinda isolate around the arm that's in the way. ie the poi don't bend (much) in the middle. My wrists do the bending instead. This i think is the subtle difference arashi is talking about. But since i rarely know what arashi is talking about i'll not put words in his mouth.

Also i move the position of my hands a lot more than when you do it. You make it look too damn easy wink

Nickwidd, i described what i think the difference between thru wraps and inversions a little while back in this thread or the butterfly hyperloop thread, i'll dig it out.

m

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


fNiGOLD Member
master of disaster
3,354 posts
Location: New York, USA


Posted:
okay, i'm confused because the video said hyperloop, but the poi aren't actually wrapping around each other..

kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more


arashiPooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx


Posted:
gorgeous vid dunc, such clarity! i can actually see what you're doing!
well i'll give this another try, i dunno lessee if this works this time.

let me preface that these are just words, but if you understand where i'm going then you may see why i feel the need to differentiate between the two concepts. the idea of polarity to me is the crux of the theory, and the theory is manifested in MY poi at least but i'm open to having the theory proven wrong!

1) first would be to get you to repeat the move you are doing so that as soon as you exit the isolationy part you go right back in to the pattern, like as your black poi unwraps and goes around, bring it right back around your left wrist and do the same with the white. this would be a barrel rolled inside, showing that the barrel roll isn't what makes an inversion. and if you can do that then the next paragraph will make even more sense (i hope tongue)

2) even without that maybe you can see this: by being close to each other, your hands are forming a hypothetical pole between them, which you need for an inversion to happen, but the whole pattern is rotating on an axis parallel to the pole between your hands instead of rotating directly around the pole itself. IOW the larger pattern may be flipping around the pole, in the barrel roll, but the actual planes of the poi are not facing the pole. if you did the same move with your hands facing 90degrees left or right, with the poi in the same planes, it would be inverted because the planes would then be facing contrary to each other AND revolving around the pole itself, rather than alternating facing forward and backward and revolving parallel to the pole.

*
now that same pattern if done as an airwrap, by using your chains instead of the wrists, will come out as an 2nd degree _airwrap_ and not as any kind of hyperloop. freeze the knot midway through it's course and look at it, it will be a twist (thru, airwrap) instead of a tangle (inversion, hyperloop). it's a second degree so you have to go all the way around before it comes undone, unlike a simple follow time airwrap which just comes across the pole and comes undone.
but that's a whole other thread wink

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.


Mr_widdeat my face before i eat yours
253 posts
Location: Torquay, UK


Posted:
Cheers for the video Dunc, its great. Really helps and you wave made me feel like i really had to pay attention as if it was a childrens show about to start. wave I have been having so much trouble trying this with long poi and have been doing this the same way as TheWibbler has described his version of this move with using the wrists and more or less icolating the poi around the arm. I tried it again with the longer poi the way in which you showed dunc and made more of a wrap with the poi. I can see the difference between the two moves much more now as it is very subtle to begin with.
I have been able to do duncs version, the thru wrap, more or less straight infront of me, where the version i feel oli and thewibbler seems to go from left to right and back again which i have done before. I am going to work on both as they both seem to be completely different to me now.
Arashi, i am still trying to get my head around what you have wrote there but i get the main jist of what your theory is. I must appoligise to all for being slow to understand much of the theory of poi as it all seems new to me. I just did what i saw before and learnt that way. Recently posting on this board has opened my mind to endless possibilities.

DuncGOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom


Posted:
 Written by: fireNice



okay, i'm confused because the video said hyperloop, but the poi aren't actually wrapping around each other..





redface redface redface redface



Ooops!! Sorry must have had hyperloops on the brain, I've edited the description now to be Butterfly Barrell Roll (with thru wraps)



Matt - I used to isolate them nearly all the way round but I got lazy ubbangel And long socks are purely because I have long arms. Remember our sock comparison at berpoi? I think mine doubled the length of yours!! It took about 8 more knots so we could wibble pass ubblol

As for the hands moving lots/not a lot. I think that's because I let the thru wrap do the work for me where as the full isolations takes a lot more effort. I'll try to post a iso vid too to show the difference if I can still do them that is!!



Arashi......awesome points my friend. I think I agree whole heartedly with what you've written about the key differences between the two different executions. AND I now understand what you mean about the "inside" version, I've tried it a few times in the past when trying to keep it continuous but not for a long long time. I think I'll try it again at the weekend smile

Let's relight this forum ubblove


faith enfireBRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA


Posted:
ooooh
i still can't do it but i know what you're talking about now bounce bounce

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


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