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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:Right, this is not the place for discussing why people should/shouldn't/do/don't use the search engine, there's enough of that in other threads.



I was planning to write a post about how to use it and try to make it as comprehensive as I could, but then I realised that there are plenty of people here who know more than I do, so I'm throwing it out to everyone who has a handy tip about how to get the search results that you want. Chuck in as many as you can, and feel free to suggest ways to reword bits to make them clearer but please don't start dragging the topic anywhere else smile



** Checking the 'in subject' option that's just underneath 'Keyword Search Terms' makes the search engine only search through the titles of threads and not the posts in the thread.

This is pretty handy for cutting down on the random threads that keep popping up in the search results because of a word buried deep in the thread in a context you really don't want to read.



** Putting a + before words makes the search engine find threads that contain that word.

Usually, if you put two words into the search, it'll find threads with either of the words, but not always both.

For example, putting 'music spinning' in the search engine will get loads of threads containing the word 'music', loads containing the word 'spinning' and a few that contain both.

If you put '+music +spinning' in though, it'll only bring back threads that contain both the word 'music' and the word 'spinning'



** Putting a - before words makes the search engine ignore any threads with that word in.

As an example, searching for 'weave -antispin' will give threads that contain the word 'weave' but not the word 'antispin' - handy for cutting down the threads you don't want to read from the search results if there are lots of results that are on a slightly different topic than what you want to read.



** Putting quotation marks around a phrase searches for that exact phrase.

For example, searching for 'fairy lights' would give you a list of every thread containing the words 'fairy', every thread containing 'lights' and every thread with both.

Searching for '+fairy +lights' would give you a list of every thread that contained both words, but not necessarily in the same sentence.

Using "Fairy lights" would give you a list of every thread in which the word 'fairy' was immediately followed by 'lights'.



Note, this can also be used to cut out words that are extensions of the word you're looking for.

As another example, searching for "spin" would give you a list of threads containing the word spin anywhere, including in other words like spinners, spinning, antispin etc..

Searching for " spin " (note the spaces), only brings back a list of threads containing the word 'spin' without all the other words that contain 'spin' somewhere.



** Picking the right search engine.

We've currently got two search engines on this site:

i) Google. It's fairly obvious sitting in the top right hand corner of the page. This searches the whole of the Home of Poi site, including the shop and the articles as well as the forum.

ii) The Forum Search. This isn't quite so obvious to find - it's slightly below the google search, it's a fairly unobtrusive link that's just the word 'Search', between Main Index and My Home.

As it's name suggests, this one only searches the forums, so if you're wanting to find threads in the forums and not articles on different parts of the site, this is the search engine you should be using as it won't fill up the search results with pages from anywhere but the forums.

EDITED_BY: TheBovrilMonkey (1139619056)


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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onewheeldave
Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield
Member Since: 28th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3252
Posted:Strictly speaking, not a search engine tip, but one which fulfills the same function:



use 'bookmarking/favourites' to create folders of relevant HOP threads of special interest (in 'interent explorer', 'right-click' on a blank area of the page and select 'add to favoutirtes')



Then, if, two years down the line, you want to find a particular thread, you can get it from your 'favourites'.



It's important though, to structure them well in folders/sub-folders, otherwise they'll become an unusable mess.


"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


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dani_babyboo
dani_babyboo

addict
Location: Cannock, staffordshire
Member Since: 23rd Feb 2005
Total posts: 667
Posted:thats all good info but if search engines were so easy why is there so much to memorize to use them...
i wouldnt even remember the first sentance of that no matter how many times i read it


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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:Written by: myself, merely three posts up

Right, this is not the place for discussing why people should/shouldn't/do/don't use the search engine, there's enough of that in other threads.




But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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dani_babyboo
dani_babyboo

addict
Location: Cannock, staffordshire
Member Since: 23rd Feb 2005
Total posts: 667
Posted:im only saying that people would need that at the actual search engine as a step by step guide that dont know it

enticed, entrapped, entombed.
intoxicated, impaled, ingested.
bewitched, beaten, broken.
enter the love realm...
insert ur token

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Skulduggery
Skulduggery

Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
Location: Wales
Member Since: 12th Aug 2004
Total posts: 8428
Posted:There is a link next to the words keyword search terms that leads you to THIS PAGE. So there already are some of these tips there Dani. I think what this thread is trying to do is come up with a group of suggestions on how to make searches easier and the results more useful that could also be included on that page.



I think what would also make the search function work better is if people rate threads that they themselves find useful once they have searched and found them. If you are a newbie that hasn't posted over 50 times you don't have the ability to rate a thread, but there is nothing stopping you from private messaging an older member with a link to the thread so they can rate it for you.



I would be willing to do that for people.



Its also important to rate threads that are NOT useful. Give them a bad rating. This will drop them to the bottom of the list of searches.


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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:Print it off or open it in a new window then.

But after complaining that people don't know how to use the search engine, just don't complain that the help I'm trying to offer isn't good enough.


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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Skulduggery
Skulduggery

Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
Location: Wales
Member Since: 12th Aug 2004
Total posts: 8428
Posted:Bov hun, the info you have posted up already has helped me. Thank you. I'm sure that more helpful hints will get added as the thread goes on, so to all those people that post up tips and hints I thank you in advance.

Once all the ideas and tips are posted can we ask for Malcolm to add them to the advanced search tips please biggrin


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dani_babyboo
dani_babyboo

addict
Location: Cannock, staffordshire
Member Since: 23rd Feb 2005
Total posts: 667
Posted:did i say it wasnt good enough ??? i actually said it was good but maybe needed as a step by step onb the search section, as for opening in new page my laptop is on work mode all the time and so when i do come on here it isnt for long mainly to find info and catch up with clapham meets, but i havent got time to print stuff off or have multiple pages open that could cause my laptop to crash and lose my work 1 page gets opened at a time i browse and move on as im working

enticed, entrapped, entombed.
intoxicated, impaled, ingested.
bewitched, beaten, broken.
enter the love realm...
insert ur token

o jej, ale bym ci wylizal ten pepek

stepped up promotions

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{anthrax}
{anthrax}

Look I've changed my title!
Location: England
Member Since: 10th Aug 2004
Total posts: 209
Posted:And for those that still can't find the search engine.... Here is a link biggrin

anthrax.... it infects, then spreads..... fast

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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:Written by: dani_babyboo

did i say it wasnt good enough ??? i actually said it was good but maybe needed as a step by step onb the search section, as for opening in new page my laptop is on work mode all the time and so when i do come on here it isnt for long mainly to find info and catch up with clapham meets, but i havent got time to print stuff off or have multiple pages open that could cause my laptop to crash and lose my work 1 page gets opened at a time i browse and move on as im working



I don't mean to be rude, but could you please just stop posting in this thread if all you're going to do is fill it up with the kind of off topic posts that you've already complained about in another thread.
I don't need to hear any more reasons why you find searching so difficult - that's not what this thread is for.


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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newgabe
newgabe

what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali
Member Since: 3rd Mar 2005
Total posts: 4030
Posted:Great thread, thanks Bovril. Do these hints apply generally to search engines or are they specific to HoPs?

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....

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fNi
fNi

master of disaster
Location: New York
Member Since: 8th Mar 2004
Total posts: 3354
Posted:Don't limit where you think the information might be. As an example, just because you think w*re w**l info might be in the tech forum, doesn't mean there won't be valuable results in social discussion.

ubbangel


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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:There's a degree of overlap between search engines, but they're not all the same.

Google for example doesn't use the + in quite the same way, it's used to add common words that it would usually ignore into the search.

So, if you're going to be using a particular search engine more than a few times it's probably worth looking up the details of how it works.


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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onewheeldave
Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield
Member Since: 28th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3252
Posted:Not a tip for search engines, rather some thoughts on friendly alternatives to the 'do a search you lazy newbie!' habit.



Having today encountered a new thread on an issue that's been previously covered-



Written by:




Would any of you consider Poi as a candidate for an olympic sport? It's already very international, very physical, requires much skill and training, and is known all over the world and practiced as an art.

For those who consider Poi as a dance, not a sport, what would you consider choreographed ice skating to be? Would any of you support the idea of poi in the olympics?



Why or why not?



Just curious wink





I found myself thinking of a way to reply politely, yet also in a way which may encourage future use of the search engine; here's what i came up with-



Written by: OWD






some opinions in this thread-



http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubbthreads/show...rev=#Post263878




(So Why is Poi/staff/fire toys not an Olympic Sport? )



(search was done using "+poi +olympics ")



IMO, this is also relevant-



http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubbthreads/show...rev=#Post568252




('Sport' juggling & the WJF )



because there has been interest for some time amongst some jugglers about getting 'sport juggling' into the olympics.



I think it would be either/or (poi or juggling) and, if so, juggling is, IMO, far more likely, due to the fact that much of the organisation/infrastructure is in place and well established.



My own personal feelings are that I don't care for me, much of the beauty of poi/juggling/similar skills is precisely the fact that they aren't sports (with all that goes along with being a sport) and provide an alternative to those who wish to progress in a skill but who feel excluded from traditional sports.







The theory being that-



1. it's not rude

2. it clearly shows the usefulness of the search engine and

3. use of appropriate search terms and use of '+', to narrow the results

4. engages with the question so as to emphasise that I'm not simply saying 'do a search' in a polite guise and also to indicate that, personally speaking, I don't mind a repeat thread on this one.


"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Ange_GSC
Ange_GSC

HOP's glowstick ambassador!!
Location: Bay Area, California
Member Since: 16th Aug 2005
Total posts: 128
Posted:I would say thats a perfect way to deal with it, seeing as how I was the one who posted the thread (I'd used the search before I posted the thread, but didn't enter keywords right) and I wasn't insulted or smashed down at all, I was able to look at the links you gave and learn instead of feeling stupid and new.



More people should do this, it definitely made me feel more welcome here and helped a lot more than just "use the search next time you n00b"



Thanks for being polite.

EDITED_BY: AngeDeLumiere (1139952041)


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flash fire
flash fire

Sporadically Prodigal
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Member Since: 25th Jan 2001
Total posts: 2758
Posted:Thanks Bov - your search tips are wonderful! We'll try and integrate them into an easily accessible page, so that people may link to it with a simple clicky clicky smile

OWD - that is also perfect. Your post highlights the aspects we need to promote when encouraging newbies to utilise the resources here correctly. I wonder if you can dissect it into something generic so that people may use it as a template?


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