Forums > Beginner Poi Moves > History_of_the_Fire_Arts
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20 posts
20 posts
Posted:
Greetings poi lovers of HoP. Curses to us all.
I am in search of knowledge. I am writing a book, "The History of The Fire Arts", and I am presently looking for information about those early people who first started playing with a fire poi, who were NOT polinesien, around the late 80's, or early 90's.
They may be from Australia or New Zealand. They also may have been, or may be now, professional street performers(busker).
They may also have been one of the first teachers of the art. I already know the history of the poi up until it's recent popularity. I just need to fill in a few blanks.
If you would like to know a little bit more about me, I am in the intro section under, "please allow me to introduce myself...
I also have a thread in 'staff movements' which is the art object I lean towards. I've tried poi, but I just keep bashing myself.
A lot of what I am looking for has already been explained in my staff thread, so I need not repeat myself here.
Any reliable information, or just good leads, would be soooo appreciated
I hope to hear from you soon
Historian
Greetings poi lovers of HoP. Curses to us all.
I am in search of knowledge. I am writing a book, "The History of The Fire Arts", and I am presently looking for information about those early people who first started playing with a fire poi, who were NOT polinesien, around the late 80's, or early 90's.
They may be from Australia or New Zealand. They also may have been, or may be now, professional street performers(busker).
They may also have been one of the first teachers of the art. I already know the history of the poi up until it's recent popularity. I just need to fill in a few blanks. If you would like to know a little bit more about me, I am in the intro section under, "please allow me to introduce myself...
I also have a thread in 'staff movements' which is the art object I lean towards. I've tried poi, but I just keep bashing myself.
A lot of what I am looking for has already been explained in my staff thread, so I need not repeat myself here.
Any reliable information, or just good leads, would be soooo appreciated
I hope to hear from you soon
HistorianThe pen is mightier than the sword
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,750 posts
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,750 posts
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Posted:
theres a guy in london, really smooth, lovely style, no tricks, grey hair....
never posts here tho....
T
p.s. helpfull int i?
theres a guy in london, really smooth, lovely style, no tricks, grey hair....
never posts here tho....
T
p.s. helpfull int i?
This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti
BRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
Posted:
"History is mirror of the future"
light,
:R
EDITED_BY: Richee (1134786208)
"History is mirror of the future"
light,
:R
EDITED_BY: Richee (1134786208)
POI THEO(R)IST
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Obviously Burningman was the big influence here. There's a ton of history and documentary information on the origins of that.
Obviously Burningman was the big influence here. There's a ton of history and documentary information on the origins of that.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
geek, level 1
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
Posted:
and www.beltane.org for some of the first fieries in the uk.
and www.beltane.org for some of the first fieries in the uk.
Holistic Spinner (I hope)
newbie
20 posts
20 posts
Posted:
Thanks for responding, folks. What I really need, however, are people's names with a way to get a hold of them. I have been hearing quite a bit about people who might know, but if I can't get a hold of them, welllll....?
As far as Burning Man goes, there have been way many poi spinners before that event became popular. I am trying to find my way back to those people that got it going within this family.
I want to ask them "Why poi?", when there was an abundance of other fire objects to explore. Who was da foist ones! Wanna know!
Peace begins with me, the karma stops here.
Thanks for responding, folks. What I really need, however, are people's names with a way to get a hold of them. I have been hearing quite a bit about people who might know, but if I can't get a hold of them, welllll....?
As far as Burning Man goes, there have been way many poi spinners before that event became popular. I am trying to find my way back to those people that got it going within this family.
I want to ask them "Why poi?", when there was an abundance of other fire objects to explore. Who was da foist ones! Wanna know!
Peace begins with me, the karma stops here.
The pen is mightier than the sword
GOLD Member
still can't believe it's not butter
6,978 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
still can't believe it's not butter
6,978 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
anne rice too describes a sect of wicked night time dwellers whose lineage could be traced from person to person to the ancients.
I was taught by cpt_shiner, who was taught by Pyroptix, and so on..
perhaps we can ask as far back as the first?
The easiest way would be to ask Arashi to drink the water of life, thus illuminating the lives of the anicents through Other Memory. many have tried and failed...
anne rice too describes a sect of wicked night time dwellers whose lineage could be traced from person to person to the ancients.
I was taught by cpt_shiner, who was taught by Pyroptix, and so on..
perhaps we can ask as far back as the first?
The easiest way would be to ask Arashi to drink the water of life, thus illuminating the lives of the anicents through Other Memory. many have tried and failed...
Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Yep. All poi originated with Arashi. He taught the Maori.
He's actually very old. That's why he's so skinny.
Yep. All poi originated with Arashi. He taught the Maori.
He's actually very old. That's why he's so skinny.
Getting to the other side 
SILVER Member
Geek
1,261 posts
Location: Manchester, UK
Geek
1,261 posts
Location: Manchester, UK
Posted:
Probably not much use to you but if you want the history of poi (and fire spinning in general) in the UK I'd say that Glastonbury and Covent Garden Market are the places to research.
That said - Fire has played a massive part in British festivals since pagan times. You may struggle to find someone who remembers that far back though
Probably not much use to you but if you want the history of poi (and fire spinning in general) in the UK I'd say that Glastonbury and Covent Garden Market are the places to research.
That said - Fire has played a massive part in British festivals since pagan times. You may struggle to find someone who remembers that far back though
BRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
Posted:
oh, i forgot that you can ask Mr. Le Skunk.
:R
oh, i forgot that you can ask Mr. Le Skunk.
:R
POI THEO(R)IST
Pooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
Posted:
little whippersnappers.
gaze into that place within yourself where you dare not go, and you will see me there staring back at you- QH
just for that firepoise i'm making you SWEAT at your next uberpoi class. the class will be on moving your hips in a lewd manner while spinning, and guess who will be the example at the head of the class!!! in a bikini. 
little whippersnappers.
gaze into that place within yourself where you dare not go, and you will see me there staring back at you- QH
just for that firepoise i'm making you SWEAT at your next uberpoi class. the class will be on moving your hips in a lewd manner while spinning, and guess who will be the example at the head of the class!!!
in a bikini. -Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.
newbie
20 posts
20 posts
Posted:
All honor Arashi! All honor our ancestors, past and present, who have passed the torch, literally, from one generation to another, the magic flame. But there within lies my point, to honor those who have inspired us presently, because they are within our grasp. Who among us have not been inspired by the teachings of; Gandhi, Jesus, Buddha, Martin Luther King, etc.?
Does a person have to die before we will recognize them for their contribution? My point is this: Someone recently spun a poi, in the last twenty years it seams, in a way that inspired a lot of people to say "teach ME so that I can experience for myself the same intense feelings that you are obviously enjoying". I want to meet that person, interview them. Who or what inspired them, if anyone! Did they even know that the Maori had been doing it for hundreds of years.
I KNOW that fire/fire performance has been an important part of rituals in just about every culture that has ever existed. I am familiar now, thanks largely to a lot of you, of all the objects that can be lit on fire. I want to see the fire boomerang!
I'm just saying, and I don't know why this is, that sometimes, someone is, well..., blessed, touched, pushed into doing something that makes a difference for all of us. Not everyone of us becomes a Gandhi, although to some extent, I believe that we all have the potential. (oh, how I would have loved to have interviewed him). I just want to know what kind of challenges, obsticles, motivations, WHATEVEEEERRRR!, that that person faced that allowed them to..."Break on through to the other side.."
I'm a writer. I dabble in the fire arts as a hobby. I am amazed and intreged by this new international fire culture/community that has now decided to become, in ALL of times, what it is today
I don't want to write in my book, "...and then somewhere in the 80's it took off". YOU, and this family, may not care to ever know who may have been the inspiration behind a movement. But I, and a lot of people that I will be writing this book for, WILL want to know.
I wasn't kiddin' when I said that I would LOVE to interview the FIRST person who took apart a pair of girl's rollar skates; screwed them to a two by four, and became the FIRST person to ride a skate board. Look how HUGH that industry has become world wide. Some of you might suggest that it was a bunch of people at the same time, in a lot of places, that arrived at that same point.
And then again, maybe not. What if that person expressed so much JOY and fun when he/she rode it, that everyone that saw him/her that was of a similar nature, just HAD to do it. One inspiring others, who inspire others, who..... :rollseyes.
I've got four names of people for the staff: Thor, Jimbo, Heart, and Alex Elixor.
Now I'm alookin' for da poi people. All the people above are street performers. That's why I think that maybe the poi people that I seek, are also street performers. Shop around for me folks, PLEEEASSEEEE!! I'll make it worth your wild. 
Peace in our time, the karma stops here. Historian
All honor Arashi! All honor our ancestors, past and present, who have passed the torch, literally, from one generation to another, the magic flame.
But there within lies my point, to honor those who have inspired us presently, because they are within our grasp. Who among us have not been inspired by the teachings of; Gandhi, Jesus, Buddha, Martin Luther King, etc.?Does a person have to die before we will recognize them for their contribution? My point is this: Someone recently spun a poi, in the last twenty years it seams, in a way that inspired a lot of people to say "teach ME so that I can experience for myself the same intense feelings that you are obviously enjoying". I want to meet that person, interview them. Who or what inspired them, if anyone! Did they even know that the Maori had been doing it for hundreds of years.
I KNOW that fire/fire performance has been an important part of rituals in just about every culture that has ever existed. I am familiar now, thanks largely to a lot of you, of all the objects that can be lit on fire. I want to see the fire boomerang!
I'm just saying, and I don't know why this is, that sometimes, someone is, well..., blessed, touched, pushed into doing something that makes a difference for all of us. Not everyone of us becomes a Gandhi, although to some extent, I believe that we all have the potential. (oh, how I would have loved to have interviewed him). I just want to know what kind of challenges, obsticles, motivations, WHATEVEEEERRRR!, that that person faced that allowed them to..."Break on through to the other side.."
I'm a writer. I dabble in the fire arts as a hobby. I am amazed and intreged by this new international fire culture/community that has now decided to become, in ALL of times, what it is today
I don't want to write in my book, "...and then somewhere in the 80's it took off". YOU, and this family, may not care to ever know who may have been the inspiration behind a movement. But I, and a lot of people that I will be writing this book for, WILL want to know.
I wasn't kiddin' when I said that I would LOVE to interview the FIRST person who took apart a pair of girl's rollar skates; screwed them to a two by four, and became the FIRST person to ride a skate board. Look how HUGH that industry has become world wide. Some of you might suggest that it was a bunch of people at the same time, in a lot of places, that arrived at that same point.
And then again, maybe not. What if that person expressed so much JOY and fun when he/she rode it, that everyone that saw him/her that was of a similar nature, just HAD to do it. One inspiring others, who inspire others, who..... :rollseyes.
I've got four names of people for the staff: Thor, Jimbo, Heart, and Alex Elixor.
Now I'm alookin' for da poi people. All the people above are street performers. That's why I think that maybe the poi people that I seek, are also street performers. Shop around for me folks, PLEEEASSEEEE!! I'll make it worth your wild.
Peace in our time, the karma stops here. Historian
The pen is mightier than the sword
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
"just for that firepoise i'm making you SWEAT at your next uberpoi class. the class will be on moving your hips in a lewd manner while spinning, and guess who will be the example at the head of the class!!! in a bikini. "
I thought you could only learn such things in workshops in America and BM?
Cos, y'know, we're all repressed.
Though I wouldn't recommend the bikini. The world has suffered enough
PS: good luck on your quest historian.
"just for that firepoise i'm making you SWEAT at your next uberpoi class. the class will be on moving your hips in a lewd manner while spinning, and guess who will be the example at the head of the class!!! in a bikini. "
I thought you could only learn such things in workshops in America and BM?
Cos, y'know, we're all repressed.
Though I wouldn't recommend the bikini. The world has suffered enough
PS: good luck on your quest historian.
Getting to the other side
member
150 posts
Location: Aotearoa
150 posts
Location: Aotearoa
Posted:
Hey man,I started doing fire in Auckland in 1995 which is possibly a little later than you looking for,But I knew all the old hands that created the NZ fire scene in the late 80s,early 90s.
Most of the early fire crew were related to the trance scene of the times.Partys like Entrain,Stompings,Normanby rd,Nixon st,The Compound,And outdoor partys to many to name...
Peeps like Raoul Mcfarout,Fly Sy,Andrew Bowlsworth(naked fire expert!)Mikey Ray,JME,Zoltan,Lucy,Leon & Becky,Mike Twist, Tim West The Firestorm,Redfeather,Thermotology,Kelly(and Dave),Scott devilstick master,Nyge.
Then later.. Alex Thornly,Me,Twisty,Pauly Paul,senor Karl,Steve(9 finger) and so many more along the way,sorry if i missed you out
As that scene droped off,Fire night started in Ak which has been making history ever since!!
Mail me for more [censored]....
Hey man,I started doing fire in Auckland in 1995 which is possibly a little later than you looking for,But I knew all the old hands that created the NZ fire scene in the late 80s,early 90s.
Most of the early fire crew were related to the trance scene of the times.Partys like Entrain,Stompings,Normanby rd,Nixon st,The Compound,And outdoor partys to many to name...
Peeps like Raoul Mcfarout,Fly Sy,Andrew Bowlsworth(naked fire expert!)Mikey Ray,JME,Zoltan,Lucy,Leon & Becky,Mike Twist, Tim West The Firestorm,Redfeather,Thermotology,Kelly(and Dave),Scott devilstick master,Nyge.
Then later.. Alex Thornly,Me,Twisty,Pauly Paul,senor Karl,Steve(9 finger) and so many more along the way,sorry if i missed you out
As that scene droped off,Fire night started in Ak which has been making history ever since!!
Mail me for more [censored]....
Kia Ora from the Central City Circus
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
Interesting proiect,
a contact that you might find useful is Pi Oud in Bangkok. Concerning Firespinning in SEA, especially Thailand he is the one to approach. He might have some of the information you are looking for. And if he cannot help you directly he would be the one who has the contacts you are looking for
And if he cant help you I think the mysteries of the history will always be lost beteween the Spirits of Sang Som, Pot and Hed
And send him greetings from me when you see him
Pi Oud:
Thanon Samsen Soi 3, Opposite Julidis River Mansion, Lower floor
Best be contacted everyday in the Park at the end of Thanon Phra Athit after 17:00 if the weather and the mood is good
(*edit*) PM if you need more contacts
Hope that can help you
Good luck
andy
PS: A question: Are you are firedancer yourself?!?
PPS:
EDITED_BY: PoiBoxII (1130534521)
Interesting proiect,
a contact that you might find useful is Pi Oud in Bangkok. Concerning Firespinning in SEA, especially Thailand he is the one to approach. He might have some of the information you are looking for. And if he cannot help you directly he would be the one who has the contacts you are looking for
And if he cant help you I think the mysteries of the history will always be lost beteween the Spirits of Sang Som, Pot and Hed And send him greetings from me when you see him
Pi Oud:
Thanon Samsen Soi 3, Opposite Julidis River Mansion, Lower floor
Best be contacted everyday in the Park at the end of Thanon Phra Athit after 17:00 if the weather and the mood is good
(*edit*) PM if you need more contacts
Hope that can help you
Good luck
andy
PS: A question: Are you are firedancer yourself?!?
PPS:
Written by: ArashiBeen there, done that. Was btw the day i lost faith in the human race
and guess who will be the example at the head of the class!!! in a bikini
EDITED_BY: PoiBoxII (1130534521)
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
I would pay good money to see photos of that Andy.
I would pay good money to see photos of that Andy.
Getting to the other side
Pooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
Posted:
you might want to pm that info to him rather than put it up or pi will get junk mail...
you might want to pm that info to him rather than put it up or pi will get junk mail...
-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,750 posts
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,750 posts
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Posted:
and a head of spinners turning up at his door for the next few years....
T
and a head of spinners turning up at his door for the next few years....
T
This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti
BRONZE Member
old hand
904 posts
Location: India/Bristol
old hand
904 posts
Location: India/Bristol
Posted:
Well youre not having my Red Biikini Arashi- Anyway weren't you wearing a Loin cloth? - The Red Bikini's are saved for those, who stare back from that space, with eyes watering 
Well youre not having my Red Biikini Arashi
- Anyway weren't you wearing a Loin cloth? - The Red Bikini's are saved for those, who stare back from that space, with eyes watering Feel the Flame
Phirenix
Pooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
Posted:
how soon we forget.
it was a union jack g-string!
how soon we forget.
it was a union jack g-string!
-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.
SILVER Member
with added berries
1,365 posts
Location: Manchester, England (UK)
with added berries
1,365 posts
Location: Manchester, England (UK)
Posted:
mmm.....
anyway, interesting idea, would be very keen to buy the book when its done. I'm afraid as a relativly new spinner of a year and a half, I do not hold the information you require.
Except to say, it would be very interesting to look at how the different fields of poi spinnong developed, theres 2 very definate groups (with overlaps), of the trance branching into glow stringing poi spinners, and the tai chi-linked poi spinners.
It would be interesting to know if these two different scenes originate from the same point or whether they have quite clear and separate origns
[quote Seye
Probably not much use to you but if you want the history of poi (and fire spinning in general) in the UK I'd say that Glastonbury and Covent Garden Market are the places to research] (sorry can't do this properly without retyping)
grr. sorry, not directed at you but bit of a bugbear of mine, after spinners from London came up to Glasgow and were like, oh, didn't think you would have heard of it up here.
I'd say that one of the biggest fire spinning scenes in the UK is Edinburgh (home of uberpoi and uberstaff). I'm not sure when Tepooka was established, but I bet someone from there may have more information.
Another hotspot, not yet mentioned is in Canada, with meenick running his studio (although not sure thats still going).
Perhaps a good plan o action would be to contact the well established, well known groups that have been around for ages, there is probably someone in each organisation, who was, or knows one of the first people in that area to start off poi.
Good luck, hope that helps!
mmm.....
anyway, interesting idea, would be very keen to buy the book when its done. I'm afraid as a relativly new spinner of a year and a half, I do not hold the information you require.
Except to say, it would be very interesting to look at how the different fields of poi spinnong developed, theres 2 very definate groups (with overlaps), of the trance branching into glow stringing poi spinners, and the tai chi-linked poi spinners.
It would be interesting to know if these two different scenes originate from the same point or whether they have quite clear and separate origns
[quote Seye
Probably not much use to you but if you want the history of poi (and fire spinning in general) in the UK I'd say that Glastonbury and Covent Garden Market are the places to research] (sorry can't do this properly without retyping)
grr. sorry, not directed at you but bit of a bugbear of mine, after spinners from London came up to Glasgow and were like, oh, didn't think you would have heard of it up here.
I'd say that one of the biggest fire spinning scenes in the UK is Edinburgh (home of uberpoi and uberstaff). I'm not sure when Tepooka was established, but I bet someone from there may have more information.
Another hotspot, not yet mentioned is in Canada, with meenick running his studio (although not sure thats still going).
Perhaps a good plan o action would be to contact the well established, well known groups that have been around for ages, there is probably someone in each organisation, who was, or knows one of the first people in that area to start off poi.
Good luck, hope that helps!
Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.
“What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.”
Ralph Waldo Emerson
Pooh-Bah
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
2,364 posts
Location: austin,tx
Posted:
"Curses to us all."
huh?
"Curses to us all."
huh?
-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.
BRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
Posted:
I remember first time I was just watching and listening Poi in a motion with a lot of emotions, undescribable feeling. Than I've tryed and lm trying till now.
:R
I remember first time I was just watching and listening Poi in a motion with a lot of emotions, undescribable feeling. Than I've tryed and lm trying till now
.:R
POI THEO(R)IST
BRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA
Posted:
My understanding is that it actually hit the US in the 70's. Robert Hart claims that is when he started and brought it to the US, but...well...there isn't anything to support that. I found this out when I started spinning in the 90's, and there was already a small (very small) global community exsisting then.
Concidering how many people are self taught, and how many people were inspired by some obscure performer somewhere you will have a hard time tracing lineage.
There are also several exsisting threads on this topic. Many people here have written papers, and some have even attempted books.
The other thought, you may want to contact those who are professionals in oral fire. Many cross those lines, or know people who did this back when type stuff. I know that several of us in the circus/sideshow arts have a totally different spin on fire than the people you will find here and that the history there is something quite different, including the people involved in the history...the versions you get will change drastically.
Best of luck.
My understanding is that it actually hit the US in the 70's. Robert Hart claims that is when he started and brought it to the US, but...well...there isn't anything to support that. I found this out when I started spinning in the 90's, and there was already a small (very small) global community exsisting then.
Concidering how many people are self taught, and how many people were inspired by some obscure performer somewhere you will have a hard time tracing lineage.
There are also several exsisting threads on this topic. Many people here have written papers, and some have even attempted books.
The other thought, you may want to contact those who are professionals in oral fire. Many cross those lines, or know people who did this back when type stuff. I know that several of us in the circus/sideshow arts have a totally different spin on fire than the people you will find here and that the history there is something quite different, including the people involved in the history...the versions you get will change drastically.
Best of luck.
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
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