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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:Anyone know much about buddhism and/or the buddha?

I need to gather some info on the topic and focus on something specific within this area. I am aiming to produce an educational piece (animation, website, worksheet for example) i have about four or five weeks to to complete it but i need some ideas sparkers.

Anyone anyone?

cheers peeps


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flid
BRONZE Member since Aug 2002

flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire, United Kingdom

Total posts: 3136
Posted:Google is a great piece of kit, there's also been quite a bit of info on here over the years.

http://www.fwbo.org/
is as good a place to start as any


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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:thanx flid did youfind that on google? wink

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flid
BRONZE Member since Aug 2002

flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire, United Kingdom

Total posts: 3136
Posted:nah, i've been an on/off (depending how lazy I am to go to meditation) practacing WBO person for the past few years.

The other main Buddhist sect in the UK is SGI (SOKA GAKKAI INTERNATIONAL - http://www.sgi-uk.org/),
of which I know of at least one other HoPper that follows. They have a really nice country mansion near Slough which I've visited. Personally thou I think they're all hippies tongue


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_pOp_
BRONZE Member since Aug 2003

Playing OldSchool Poi
Location: amsterdam, Netherlands

Total posts: 593
Posted:there is sooooooo much to find about buddhism/the buddha.
do you know already what part your focus is going to be on?
maybe then I can try to help you...


meditate eRic.

I'm not normally a religious man, but if you're up there, save me, Superman!

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:still dont know, i need to do some more research, i want to do something like they have done on the british museum website, where you have to spot the buddhist symbol, something like that

sorry i'm being very vague, i will post agian when i can be more specific lol

thanx for listening


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jims
BRONZE Member since Apr 2004

member
Location: portsmouth/cambridge, United K...

Total posts: 7
Posted:ok dont know whether this will be of any use but this site has a fair amount of basic info.... http://www.zenguide.com
br>


james x

EDITED_BY: jims (1101151428)


enjoy boredom.its all you have to look forward to

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:woo cheers james will take a look

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flid
BRONZE Member since Aug 2002

flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire, United Kingdom

Total posts: 3136
Posted:as you've already mentioned it, the british museum does have an excellent collection of buddhist statues and figurines that we've robbed, pilliaged and traded for opium over the years on the first floor by the north entrance. It's free and well worth a visit if you're in London anytime soon.

The main point that i'd make about buddhism is that it's roots are very old and thus over time it has developed many sects due both to evolution in different areas of asia and differences of view. Not all sects beleive the same things and with all religions (taking Henry 8th's cult The Church of England as a prime example), some have been more corrupted by politics and the country's own myths and legends. WBO is an interesting one to look at as whilst it isn't the largest, it was created in the west in the last century as a result of a lot of research and archeology on the basis of buddhism. Far from being just a bunch of hippies in the UK, it has since taken off in many asian countries including India and is an excellent source of impartial information.

If you're serious about this assignment then I'd suggest attending an introductory session at your local buddhist centre. They normally cost a couple of quid which helps pay the rent and bills and offer free introductory meditation and talks about buddhism. I've never attended one where I've found people try to 'convert' others, whilst very friendly and open they won't go looking for you or invite you there. The one I attended (in Colchester) took the form of 1.5 hours meditation, a break when anyone who was just there for meditation class could leave (and the others sit around on sofas and drink tea!), then 1 hours talk and discussion. You don't have to want to be buddhist to attend and no one will care what religion you are (provided you don't try and convert them!). smile


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mech
BRONZE Member since Jun 2003

mech

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: "In your ear", United Kingdom

Total posts: 6207
Posted:jem

i would suggest

http://search.about.com/fullsearch.htm?terms=buddhism
br>
its quite a good site, i have given you alink that has alreay got a buddism search going on

this site will go into great detail or just quick info, depending on how far down you go

its been a source for much info for me


Step (el-nombrie)

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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:http://www.religioustolerance.org
is great for looking up religions for specific purposes, or for just browsing out of interest


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:ooh sweet thanks guys smile

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Written by: Rouge Dragon

http://www.religioustolerance.org
is great for looking up religions for specific purposes, or for just browsing out of interest



Agreed! Thanks for the link Rouge!


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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Kat
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Kat

Pooh-Bah
Location: London, Wales (UK)

Total posts: 2211
Posted:Hmm, maybe go visit the Buddhist Temple in Wimbledon. Think its a Tibetan temple.

Buddhism is a very broad topic - Origins generally traced back to Siddharta in Northern India, which is now the home of the Dalai Lama. While India is the home - I think other Asian countries have more wealth of art left, probably as buddhism was quite overwhelmed by Hindu / Islamic religion.

Tibetan and Japanese Buddhism are quite different, not just in the views but in the art work itself. Japanese temples, statues have more clean lines and elegance - the epitome of zen, Tibetan art, temples are more colourful and vivavcious imo, and not as expensive looking. I think the art work can in many ways be representative of the character of the religion in each country as well (though saying that I met a few zany colourful monks in Japan!).

I got a beautiful thanka from a friend from Nepal, I might be able to scan it for you. Though I'm sure you'll find loads of info on the net. Do a search for Mandala / Thanka along with the country you want the info about: India / China / Tibet / Nepal / Japan / and you should get an idea of the different images.
Some links for you:
http://www.jyh.dk/indengl.htm
br>http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/george/mandala.html
http://www.thethankahouse.com/gallery.html
br>
Have fun - sounds interesting


Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.

- W B Yeats

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:sweet thankies kat, i have heard of mandalas,i am sure i have a book on sand mandalas somewhere, not heard of thankas before.

thanks again

xx hug


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FireNix
BRONZE Member since Apr 2001

FireNix

old hand
Location: India/Bristol

Total posts: 904
Posted:I have a series of workshops on Buddhism and meditation which I prepared and deleivered as part of my Teaching qualifcation. I think I may have it on disk so if you PM me with your email, I may be able to send it to you.
Ive also spent alot of time in McLeod Gang (the Tibetan Govt in exhile and Delai Lama reside there) and in Thailand and have attended many teachings and Meditation Retreats.
I'd be happy to help you in any way.
Peace, Love and Happiness


Feel the Flame
Phirenix

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:exellent,i have realised that i need to either focus on ancient buddhism, or buddhism in a particular country at a particular time, or compare the differences in some way.

Apparrently the laughing buddha, is the more modern "commercialised" icon used today, but the more traditional one, is more sultry looking. Again it varies across different cultures at different times !


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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:okay...........after some general familliarisation on the subject i have decided to focus on the image of the buddha, how its material presence started out and what it is today. There seems to be a "commercial" image of the buddha in the west today, which is quite different to what the buddha should look like to buddhists.

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_pOp_
BRONZE Member since Aug 2003

Playing OldSchool Poi
Location: amsterdam, Netherlands

Total posts: 593
Posted:and don't forget to mention that he wasn't "the buddha".
he was the man that most of us call "buddha".
there was no ONE buddha, buddha is just a state of mind.


meditate eRic.

I'm not normally a religious man, but if you're up there, save me, Superman!

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:aha yes because it means the enlightened one

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Xopher (aka Mr. Clean)


enthusiast
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA

Total posts: 456
Posted:I think most people mean Siddartha Gautama when they say "the Buddha." But the Buddha of Compassion was a Buddha too, and he's still with us -- or rather with us again: he's His Holiness the Dalai Lama.

"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:so any enlightenedd one is a buddha, who is the smiling plump buddha that we see commercially? where did he come from?

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flid
BRONZE Member since Aug 2002

flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire, United Kingdom

Total posts: 3136
Posted:that's supposidly Prince Gautama.

As i said before, buddhism is an old religion, it has a lot of regional differences and interpriations, even down to how it came about in the first place. It's also been incredibly warped and corrupted by politics and rulers for their own means. Many people associate buddhism with huge golden temples etc, which are really no different to cathedrals, stone hendge etc - people trying to redeem themselves by devouting huge amounts of wealth and worship towards religion - which totally misses the point of the core buddhist teachings! Siddartha Gautama wasn't a god, he was a normal living human. Buddhists who have statues in their home use them for focus, reminder etc, like a shrine for meditation, not for worship. It doesn't really matter what it looks like, it's just a representation


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Xopher (aka Mr. Clean)


enthusiast
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA

Total posts: 456
Posted:I don't think he's a Buddha, actually. The one with his arms spread out is a minor Hindu deity whose name escapes me. Starts with K. Komura? Can't remember.

"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations

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jemima (jem)
SILVER Member since Dec 2002

jemima (jem)

Pooh-Bah
Location: london, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1750
Posted:great thanx guys

i am finding this pretty useful at the mo www.kadampa.org


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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:*bump*



Maybe it's annoying to bump old threads, but I reckon that a thread about the question "is Buddhism a religion or a way of life?" is not tackling the aspects of "soul", "worship", "faith" or "devotion" - but is merely asking whether one can regard Buddhism a religion or a philosophy.



Therefore if one wants to discuss the principle aspects of Buddhism, another thread is needed and this one carries the 'correct' OP. Agree? Disagree? I just feel that many threads loose their essence, if we start talking about completely different aspects - they get watered down.



Reference to "Buddhism, religion or way of life?"



At first I like to find consensus on core aspects (which I might have a misconception about)



Is it correct that in Buddhism the "ego" is the source of all desires and cravings? Whereas "ego" is a recent conception only, 'invented' by Sigmund Freud. "Ego" is not the "self" (Please also check Atman in Hinduismand Atman in Buddhism)



Is it further correct to assume that cravings and desires are the source of suffering according to Buddhist doctrines and that eradicating desires and cravings are the road to "liberation", "enlightenment" and "Nirvana"?



The Buddha allegedly said that "the existence of a soul is irrelevant to the practice of Buddhism". Here I have to disagree. When I said that "Buddhism first promotes schizophrenia and then offers the remedy for it", I mean:



IF there is no "soul", then what



- 'suffers' in the first place. Who is it, that experiences 'suffering'? Who comes up with turning the acute sensation of 'pain' into the enduring concept of 'suffering'?

- gets "enlightened" and "liberated from suffering" through the practice of Buddhist doctrines?



Just to clarify: "pain" = IMO is a warning sign that something in the meta/physical body needs (urgent) attention. It directs our attention. After we have noticed and directed our attention to its origins, "pain" itself is no longer needed. Hence if we experience chronic or excessive pain, the (useful) sensation "pain" might turn into "suffering". Is "suffering" a concept of the mind? Any which way, what 'qualities' does "suffering" have to the individual?



[edit]*oops - wrong forum, notifies mods*[/edit]

EDITED_BY: FireTom (1204605711)


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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newgabe
SILVER Member since Mar 2005

newgabe

what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali, Australia

Total posts: 4030
Posted:I sincerely believe this thread is in the wrong forum and am writing to mods to ask it to be moved to discussion. smile

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....

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FireTom


Stargazer


Total posts: 6650
Posted:Thanks for moving... mod- hug

I for my part have said 99.9% on "why I regard Buddhism to be as much of a religion as a way of life (philosophy)". The only thing I'm getting confused about is why do I equal 'philosophy' and 'way of life'?

*prepares table with cookies, tea and sound bowls (or soundbowls?)*


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 2830
Posted:Hi, Gabe smile





Fire Tom, thanks for your hospitality.



Ill try to answer some of you questions.



 Written by:

Q. Is it correct that in Buddhism the "ego" is the source of all desires and cravings? Whereas "ego" is a recent conception only, 'invented' by Sigmund Freud. "Ego" is not the "self" (Please also check Atman in Hinduismand Atman in Buddhism).





A. Yes. Freud was not the first person to try and figure out the workings of the human mind, nor will he be the last. Buddha actually figured it out a long time before Freud. As you referenced in wiki: The word ego is taken directly from Latin, where it is translated as "I myself" to express emphasis. The Latin term ego is used in English to translate Freud's German term Das Ich, which literally means "the I".



So what is the ego? Here are two definitions:



Ego - Conscious thought, at least the way we usually do it, is the manifestation of ego, the you that you usually think that you are. Conscious thought is tightly connected with self-concept. The self-concept or ego is nothing more than a set of reactions and mental images which are artificially pasted to the flowing process of pure awareness (urbandharma.org).



Ego - Object relations theory has become the dominant psychoanalytic theory of ego development. Its main insight is that the ego develops, primarily through the integration of early experiences, into organized mental structures. These mental structures, termed ego structures, are systems of memories that have become organized through the processes of assimilation or introjection, identification, integration, synthesis, and so on, into an overall schema patterning the self (ahalmaas.com/glossary).



You could also look at the ego as your inner robot or just that little voice in the head.



Buddhism is about being aware or mindful of the I, the self, the ego. They are really the all the same, and uncontrolled they run the whole show. Learning a mindfulness meditation like Vipassana, is all about liberated from the ego.



Buddhism is not for everybody because it is challenging, and people are required to get out of their comfort zones. Some are just not open to accepting new ideas. Instead, they remain recalcitrant, fixed that their view of the world, is the only view of the world. Others are not prepared to accept the self-realization of the ego. Instead they cling to Im special, Im better, Im different.



 Written by:

Q. The Buddha allegedly said that "the existence of a soul is irrelevant to the practice of Buddhism". Here I have to disagree. When I said that "Buddhism first promotes schizophrenia and then offers the remedy for it", I mean:



IF there is no "soul", then what - 'suffers' in the first place. Who is it, that experiences 'suffering'? Who comes up with turning the acute sensation of 'pain' into the enduring concept of 'suffering'? gets "enlightened" and "liberated from suffering" through the practice of Buddhist doctrines?





A. Its as you said before, "suffering" is a concept of the mind. Its the ego craving for immortality, as a soul, that causes the suffering. There is a great definition of soul at the skeptics dictionary. As it says, "If ever there were an entity invented for human wish-fulfillment, the soul is that entity.



The pain is not physical pain, you could think of craving as a thirst. For more information I suggest you read up on dependent origination (Pratitya-samutpada). Once you get conditional existence, it all starts to make sense.



One thing to get, is that Buddha never the denied the existence of the soul or God. He just said that belief in souls and immortal beings was a waste of time. Perhaps, you can only know the truth when you become liberated.



For me, the starting line was the The Turing test.


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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la_genie
BRONZE Member since Jan 2008

la_genie

member
Location: , USA

Total posts: 73
Posted:don't forget the whole idea was to end samsara and achieve moksha... thus reuniting our Atman with Brahman in nirvana, and this is achieved by eliminating desire by following the eightfold path.
this is i understood it in my philosophy of religion class.


Be aware, the evil flowers may eat your toes....
Have no friends not equal to yourself...
Feed your mind, read a book

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FireTom


Stargazer


Total posts: 6650
Posted:Stone, the three of us (me, myself and I) are puzzled what the "Turing Test" has got to do with anything here? When it comes to 'black box experiments', I personally favour the "Voight-Kampff Test" as to determine whether one is human or artificial... after all "empathy" is one of the highest qualities.

If "Ego" is merely "conscious thought" then we're not talking about the same 'thing'. In my understanding of "Self" there are different 'levels':

- "it": the 'animalistic' root, primal instincts of self-endurance, sexuality and the like, vital nerve system, representative of your body(ly functions).
- "higher self": the idealised version of the 'self', the own projection of the 'ultimate being', 'god'.
- the "ego" or "self": is the 'diplomatic unit' managing (inner) conflicts between the two other 'institutions'. As being a diplomat it's "face" is not always nice, its the liar, trickster, 'selfish' finder of compromises, the one who is doing the 'sweeping', judges upon others and finds forgiveness for ones own "it".

This is what I extracted from Freuds concept, maybe I have to do a little more reading into it... but "that little voice" can originate variably within your 'self', could be your "intuition" as well as your "robot".

"Personally" I feel repulsed by most Buddhist' approach to the 'outside world' as to me they appear being "psycho-teasers": "Buddhism is not for everybody because it is challenging, and people are required to get out of their comfort zones." Yaddayadda... for me that's just too cheap of a [censored]-line. The same applies to white water rafting, bungee jumping or fire dancing - you need to come out of your "comfort zone", your body sends a fireworks of warning signals and your higher self sits back enjoying the show.

Sidenote: If I would have to choose from all existing religious/ philosophical concepts - which would be the one for me, I would relate to Sanyassin and Buddhism (in that order). Why? because Buddhism directs 'the source' where I feel it is: within and Sanyas (Osho) tackles this 'source' in a much more playful manner, with a lot more compassion, tolerance and less dogma. Both have advantages and weaknesses tho.

Meditation itself is a very powerful tool, hence 'self-absorption' and 'quietness' can be attained in many activities just alike: fire-spinning, juggling, riding ones motorcycle, sex, walking in the desert, diving, playing chess, carving, painting... name them yourself. Some of them require 'man-made items', others don't, again others create 'man-made items'. I'm not quite sure whether Buddha acknowledged that there are myriad ways to reach the state of 'quietness within' - apart from meditation (sitting and watching your navel).

And for me I can't see a reason why it would require a guru (other than my own), why I'm required to read and follow others' doctrines and concepts... ? My main point of criticism towards most Buddhist institutions is that they are not dedicated to develop ones own 'inner guru' - which (IMHO) is the 'only true path', the 'only true teacher/ leader', ones very own connection to ... well, call it as you want, but maybe the most precise term would be: 'god' - these "schools" are again procrastinating your 'arrival' (for their own benefit).

You really 'need' a "guide" to sit and be quiet, observe your own thoughts and feelings? You really 'need' an interpreter for those thoughts and feelings, need 'ready-made conceptions of existence'? Then IMHO you're maybe one reason why we still can't move on (re. Mahayana), because you're scared of something out there, you still look for a parent, a boss, a president, a priest, so you do not have to feel 'lost'. And you have 'lost': trust in life and the universe that is. You fell out of 'paradise' twice: first getting born = out of the womb and then for a second time out of the 'paradise' your parents, family and friends created and now you long to get back, to pro-long the symbiotic feeling you had when you were a embryo, a baby, a child, a teen. Loved, protected, nurtured, guided. Maybe you only discovered that these feelings you have (had) are "betrayal", inflicted by your self onto your self for the reason of sustenance. Maybe you felt the sweetness of (romantic) 'love' for someone else and the devastation of it crumbling... ?

Maybe your 'ego' feels the urge to put it all into a new context, redefine "reality" so everything neatly fits together again and now you're becoming 'prey' to those energy suckers out there who 'lure' you into their realm, make you go their way, feed their 'ego'.

But I get carried away with preachertell.

Point being that Buddhism is not a "new idea". The "new idea" (sorry to say, Stone) IMO is what you call "ego induced loonacy" or "spiritual hedonism": 'self directed paths of spirituality', 'pick and mix religions'

I find only relatively few '-ists' open for these new renegades. This usually is where tolerance (for others spirituality) ends and inquisition is sustained.

Western philosophy has received a very strong blow: Roman Catholic Christianity, no wonder we are fascinated by Eastern/ Asian spirituality, as there is little left in the West.

But I'm getting carried away.


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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