Forums > Social Chat > poi as viewed by other object manipulators.

this comes from the glow vs fire thread, but i thought as a side topic it deserved a separate discussion:

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Don't know about In other countries but in the UK Poi has had a real hard time getting the respect that it deserves from other forms of object manipulation. Mainly because it's got quite a low entry level and people seemed to make the leap that if it starts easy it must all be easy. This of course is a big pile of poo, it's not about about how high or low the entry level is it's about where you can take it to.

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this is only partly true.
as a fanatic juggler i hear the reasons behind this one a lot. and stick up for poi in a juggling-centric world.

the reason other manipulators don't like poi is this: someone starting to juggle takes up this much space: themselves. about 3ft in front of them. and they don't move.

someone starting to poi can learn the three beat weave and dance all over the place, taking up as much space as there is available, and sometimes more than that.

jugglers tend to be a bit more singleminded on trick-learning, which in general is a static activity, and spinners are more dancey( ) and focussed on being beautiful . if you are trying to learn 9444455555 and some guy keeps meandering through your pattern you are going to get pissed off. whereas most spinners i know if they are hit by another spinner will shrug it off (after an apology ) as an occupational hazard.

so this is what i mean by tim being part right.
altho low entry level is part of the problem(the fact that practically anyone can learn enough to dance in a day), most jugglers i know now accept that poi can be tricky, and wierd and wacky, and downright difficult. that doesn't stop them getting angry with what they view as a space infringement.


any opinions on this one?


incidentally it has been one of my major aims to get spinning more recognised by jugglers as a valid circus art, and i felt my mission was in some way fulfilled when luke burrage(juggler extraordinaire, hater of poi ) came up to me after a practise session at the bristol convention and said 'hey. nice poi stuff. is all that [censored] new?', and wanted to know how to get into contact staffcause he liked that too(may have just been polite, i've seen no evidence he's gone anywhere near a stick although knowing him he'll come to renegade in a year or so and spin 9 staffs at once )



happy cogitating and spacially-aware spinning
R

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

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well i have to say my eyebrows are raised. almost like this but not quite popping out. plus my mouth isn't a little square.

way back in my yooot i used to teach people at renfairs how to juggle three balls and i rarely met anybody that with a few minutes time couldn't do the basic juggle a few times, and most could keep it going for quite a bit. dropping was of course a natural part of it but then so is tangling your chains. and keep in mind i RRRREALLY don't "do" juggling. [thinly veiled understatement of the year ] mayhaps you guys need to work on your teaching methodology!

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"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Lastly, I have to disagree with a point that has been made a couple of times i.e. that poi dancing requires better physical conditioning than juggling.

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I've made a point of developing a relaxed, and generally slow, style, with the emphasis on stretching and no muscular tension.

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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

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Faking It - Channel 4

This week Faking It takes a Student Poi Spinner and turns her into a Five-Ball Juggler in just Four Weeks!

Will the 3 experienced juggler judges pick her out from a group of four amateur performers at the BJC?

Tune in to find out!

[This has no relevance to the thread, and indeed perhaps it should be the other way around, but I love Faking It!]

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Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

Love and Light

~*~ Katinca ~*~

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that’s funny, because last night I was thinking the only way to settle this discussion would be to have a duel b/t a intermediate non-juggling poister and a intermediate non- poister juggler, to c who adapted the best.

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Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

A kiss blown is a kiss wasted, the only kind of kiss is a kiss tasted.

I'm a woman. We don't say what we want, but we reserve the right to be pissed off if we don't get it. That's what makes us so fascinating and not just a LITTLE bit scary.

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In particuclar I'd be interested in what method you used to break people of the common habit of using a 'shower' (i.e. using a short pass from one hand rather than throwing both balls to the same height) rather than 'cascade' pattern when on the two ball stage.

In my experience around 50% of beginners do this, and the process of overcoming that habit seems to take considerably more than five minutes.

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"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

Step (el-nombrie)

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how would you know who had adapted the best?

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Where jugglers are concerned, the main transition they seem to have difficulties with is spinning poi, probably because good spinning requires more 'dance' than technique, whereas jugglers can tend to approach it with the same static and technique based approach that is common in juggling.

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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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However, I can't deny what I see, and what I've experienced, as the facts, which are that, for all that spinning is far from technically easy, it is considerably more so than the stuff I was doing in juggling.

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If I want to push my technique with something that requires awesome focus just to maintain, then it's time for a five ball reverse cascade or some double devil sticks, or a hellishly complicated three ball combination.

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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

A cute girl after I finished spinning fire at this party :
"OMG ur soo hot!"

I love being a fire spinner

"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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hmm



there was way too much spinning at the juggling workshop i was at last night, no doubt about it...



It was crowded, and well over two thirds of the space at a juggling workshop was all poi and sticks swinging around.



There was definite annoyance, completely understandably, although it wasn't directly communicated by any of the jugglers to the spinners, who would have then probably calmed down a bit, and taken turns spinning or similar.



It really drove home to me the unfairness of a workshop dedicated to a particular skill 'invaded' by people who take all the space they need practicing something entirely different.



You can twirl stuff pretty much anywhere, but juggling really needs a windless, high ceilinged, well-lit location. Those can be really hard to find, and once you've found it you don't want something that doesn't take advantage of these attributes 'wasting' the space.



i repeat, hmm...

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"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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The reason why I look down in general on people doing poi is because of the ease at which it can be learnt

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new members who try to learn how to juggle, fail, and then move on to poi without trying their best

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But from my experiences, people who give up on juggling to do poi don't progress to more technical poi tricks.

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But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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I personally have never experienced any problems with poi taking up too much space.

The reason why I look down in general on people doing poi is because of the ease at which it can be learnt. Every year at our juggling club we get new members who try to learn how to juggle, fail, and then move on to poi without trying their best. To me its just highlights a personal weakness. I understand that poi can be difficult - I've no problem with people who do it at a high technical level. But from my experiences, people who give up on juggling to do poi don't progress to more technical poi tricks.

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You're definitely not going to like my next reason! - It looks extremely gay when guys do simple poi tricks.

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"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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The reason why I look down in general on people doing poi is because of the ease at which it can be learnt.

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I understand that poi can be difficult - I've no problem with people who do it at a high technical level. But from my experiences, people who give up on juggling to do poi don't progress to more technical poi tricks.

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You're definitely not going to like my next reason! - It looks extremely gay when guys do simple poi tricks.

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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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(and he ISN'T a multiple hoppsonality, just in case you was thinkin)

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Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no