Forums > Social Chat > I give up... Just do the weave fast.

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
It's funny cause its true!!!but i think that purely because it "looks hard.. and really cooooool" *was told this buy a spectator....*its ok do all your stuff i like it!! ------------------A Faeries Heart Beats Fierce and Free!!!!!

Teach tolerance, not competition.
Send food, not bombs.

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
I was recently at a latenight where I was spinning and had the thrill of being center stage to the club. Everyone was watching..half of them prolly only saw the lights.. :P ...Try doing the alt. butterfly combo really really fast..that had them cheering..hehehCRD

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
I was beggining to think the same thing, i'm not that good at poi, i've only been doing it for about 7 months, i know a fair bit of stuff, but not many wraps. I find that there are probably 3 or 4 things that everyone will cheer for, and the rest is just to fill up space (or so i've been told). Fast weave does really impress people, especialy when they get in very close to the body, and a trick i learnt of shadowfire's video, where he spins them around his head. if ya get hit really hard in the nutz but keep going in the other direction, it gets a cheer, with the ahhh shit sound. but then there is kinda a favourite of mine and a friends, do weave really fast, and turn non stop, and do a 1080 on the spot, everyone's like WOW

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
To the average dude who has probably hardly seen fire twirling at all, most tricks are lost on them.In the signature moves thread, I wrote about how I do a thing I call the wheel, and it seems to impress purely because fire comes very close to my face. Big deal, smokers do that every time they light up.I've found the 5 point weave looks just like the 3 point weave to the average bystander, and I've had beginner poi people say they couldn't be bothered learning the weave because they could already do the figure 8.I've also found that different moves impress dif ppl. Any wrap that comes close to the groin area makes all the men wince, especially teenage boys. Girls generally comment on smooth flowing graceful moves as simple as chasing the sun & hi/lo turns. Kids love the fast weaving with turns because you look like a fire ninja dude! BUT OF COURSE... We only do this for ourselves,right?!------------------Your parents were wrongFire is good Play with fire

UYI OLDSKOOL

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
Too true, too true..I was watching some people twirl on the beach a couple of months ago. There were a lot of people doing the basic poi moves and some pretty good staffers. I was watching for about an hour and the applause was pretty much non-existant, until one girl got up and did the 3 beat really fast... and only the 3 beat. Nonetheless, the crowd exploded with applause and blokes were calling out that they wanted to marry her and have her babies...Most people just don't realise the effort that goes into learning the trickier moves. To the crowd there's not even an amazing amount of difference between the 3-beat weave and the btb weave... I would say different!Personally, I don't like moving really fast. It doesn't take any more skill and just tires you out quickly, so you can only twirl in short bursts. Each to their own, though.Princess xxx

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
At the club last night, applause was basically non existant... people seemed to pretty much ignore us, or just try and walk straight through us. They were just sort of like, cool, fire, or like, cool, glowy stuff, rather than looking at the actual moves... breathing got the best reaction, as usual.the five beat is better for bystanders because you can do it faster than the weave, and it looks a bit cooler because of the wrist movement....women were ripping off their clothing?nah but i think the thing is, when spinning for a crowd dont be afraid to do the same thing over and over again, because they dont appreciate the transitions, but like the patterns; it's like with jazz improvisations, you need repetition otherwise you lose any sort of structure or coherence.If you're playing to an easy crowd, don't try and kill yourself doing hard moves, it's just not worth it... ESPECIALLY if you happen to screw up, because that really recks the image.

x X x ß £ Å Ĉ К ß î я Ð x X x

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
Ha,I was discussing this the other day with some fire peeps and u are absolutely right....all butterfly and variations get no reaction, I just keep it down to wrapping into the buterfly from the weave and doing a few overhead/alternate/low waves and then straight back into the weaves.Basically just turn around a lot and do forward/backward weaves. Fountain still a good crowd pleaser and five beats look good when turning around etc. Also corkscrews and chasing sun when u go into them from the fountain...Funny that the only really musical moves are the weaves as well!seems a bit pointless learning all the other moves really?------------------check my pics etc at www.poishop.f2s.com------------------errrm "I intend to live forever, or at least die trying." Voltaire

------------------
errrm I intend to live forever, or at least die trying.
Voltaire

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
yeah ... I know what you mean ...I felt it sometimes. for example the 5 beat weave does not make anyone's heart beat but the twirlers themselves I am affraid. I am a bit souple so I bend backward when doing a simple weave. People love it allthough it is just so simple.Maybe if you act as if what you were doing was very very dangerous people would buy it more ? shine onCassandra

"I want brown bread... no, that is diesel oil..."
"So I was raised in Europe, where History comes from ..."
"NON !!! La Plume de mon oncle n est pas Bingibangibungi !!!"

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
While I partly agree with the gist of this thread--that civilians can't appreciate the moves we take most pride in--I partly disagree. They do appreciate it when we mix it up, move around, stay on the beat of the music, that sort of thing. If you just stood there doing the weave for 5 minutes, no matter how fast, everyone would get bored.Sometimes I get an enthusiastic response from spinning really slow. But clearly I need to work on my speed, as I have yet to provoke any women into ripping their clothing (or cloting) off.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
And that, is the number 1 reason I dislike professional performance. You have to 'dumb' down your moves to get a reaction! JoshPS - ripping off their clotting? eeeeeewwwwwwwwww!!!Adam thats Gross![This message has been edited by [Josh] (edited 22 October 2001).]

Posted: 21st Oct 2001
its all in the rythm... anyone seen gladiator? something like "kill and they will applaude you, entertain and they will love you"NYC i know what you mean, for some reason the crowds love when you do a butterfly and drop to your knees and then lean all the way onto your back. not that tricky (if your back doesnt give out) but still gets an amazing reaction...

anyone got a light?

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
I don't want to hear this stuff.as a relatively beginner twirler i want to hear stuff like "People go ohhhhhhhh and ahhhhhhh at the basic stuff but really love you when you can do extraordinarilly hard moves" That way i have some drive to learn the harder moves.Not that its gonna stop me.... Cheers APB

Good on usGood on us all

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
This is a thread I can offer something too!I'm a non-spinner. I help Pele with knowing if things look interesting. To me, most of it is "Fire in circles." 3 beat, 5 beat it's still fire in circles. It's when it's changed up that it looks intersting to me.Weave, btb anything, windmill, buzzsaw, those each look different. That I notice.Pele's commented that she likes to learn the difficult moves to keep her interest in the poi arts. It also makes the easy ones a little easier and when performing for civies that's good as mistakes are lessened.A note on audience responses. We've found that they forget to cheer or applaud because they're in awe of what's going on. You're twirling FIRE around your body! Do you have any idea how nuts that seems to normal people!? You may want to have a hidden assistant in the audience start to clap every so often. The reason the fast move works is because it breaks their concentration and it looks like you're doing something to get a reaction instead of presentation.------------------"Except for that Mrs. Lincoln, How did you like the play?"Pyromorph - Let the fire change you

FYI: I am not Pele. If you wish to reply to me and use a short version of my name, use: PWB.

English? Who needs that? I'm never going to England. - Homer Jay Simpson

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
A month or so back a couple of us went csmping and were spinning fire all night on the beach of a quory the only time we got a response is when we would light up. After that.......silence. No one was sitting around us, everyone was around the lake, watching the fire reflect off the water. They would get into the twirling and wouldn't respond. I don't think you can tell the difference between a crowd that isn't amused and a crowd that is dumb founded. So once again, spin for you, because you enjoy it, if they cheer bonous!

Nothing good ever comes from hanging out with normal people.

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
No Doubt. I certainly spin for myself. In fact most of my spinning takes place when I'm alone. I like the solitude of it and the fact that I can do moves that feel good rather than look good. Sometimes I just grove with a move or two (which would look pretty boring.)I also agree that making it look harder than it is helps as well. Grimacing while trailing always helps. Dropping to knees while eating a cupcake would probably get a round of applause. In a sense I DO like the fact that you need to be "in the know" to really appreciate good spinning. It's just silly that I can hook up 4 glowsticks to each string, drop to my knees and do a weave and people will go nuts whereas most of the technical skills go unnoticed.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
in my experience, the best way to get cheers is to change it up often. almost any combo looks impressive if very little time is given to each individual move, just enough to differentiate it from the last one. The tough part is memorizing a complex order, or fast improvising if you are that much of a boss (which i am not! (yet)).also, if you spin to music that fluctuates between calm and crazy, you can spin slow or fast accordingly, and time moves to the song. One music choice which is my favorite and has received much approval is anything by TOOL, due to its intensity.however, i must admit that the most important factor to most people is how fast, not how hard. it sucks, but i feel better about myself for being in the know.

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
Tool!I'm going to see tool in a few days!and as for this thread, I'm not a poiier, I'm a staffer. all my tough wrist wracking moves get no applause. same with behind the back, through the fingers.I do the figure 8 really fast, and they cheer! tosses get some applause too, but they still scare me so I don't do them too often, specially if it's really dark.but you know what? I don't care if they applaud, I do it for ME. When I whale on the figure eight and hurt my arms, they cheer, and I get embarrased. when I pull of my behind-the-back-through-each-finger-on each-hand-frontwards-and-backwards-in- perfect-time-to-the-beat move, that makes me smile.------------------~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

Posted: 22nd Oct 2001
Yep, performing with a staff on Saturday night for about 75 people, the move that gave the best reaction from the people watching was doing a single (I think the HoP name is a forwards or figure 8) very quickly while skipping around the circle of people watching - a very basic move.It was only other twirlers who seemed to be impressed with harder moves or combos - but that was cool feedback in itself.

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
that is kinda true but have you tried the BTB weave Turn 360 degress after that wrap to my arm and get a BTB butterfly then a weave a 360 degress turn ... i get reaction from ppl when i do it.. they like it a lot... also ppl like ummm when im doing weave and then turn like a 270 degrees and BTB weaveits not just the weeave move try the BTB moves crowd like it... at least here....

Dance like if noone were watching you

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Well, I enjoy spinning for myself however I enjoy sharing my art with others. And nothing gets me pumped up more than a crowd who's really into the spinning(whether it be a dumbfounded look, or cheers). (: Man I love to spin. *would never give his poi up*------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
One move I find hard that the crowd does appreciate is the one hand overhead butterfly with fire. I think it's the scary imminent flaming death thing that they like.

UYI OLDSKOOL

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Ahhhh the fire in circles debate rages on. Somewhere in the archive there is a couple more threads on this which are very interesting.Since Whipping Boy has pretty much explained from the audience side what we figured out here's a few other things to add.Body movement to a crowd is everything. Yup the fire, stix, bola's, staff..whatever you are spinning looks cool but move your body and it looks more dangerous and is harder (need that timing down). I perform most during the day, where light tends to suck up the colours of my fire. What makes up for it is body movement (which is why I encourage you to not wear black and use some lights).Rhythm is key...if your music is going one way and you the other is it a little weird for an audience. Not only will people be dumbfounded but they will fear for you. I am constantly asked if I need a drink or help or whatever, people yell it in the middle of my show. Part of the silence is awe, part is fear...and this is good, play off of it but not too much. Make them laugh about it, not hide their eyes.NYC, along these lines, watch out for playing things up as being too difficult. You will lose some of your audience for fear effect (speaking from experience, I once had some children really freaked because they thought I was going to be burned alive.) And someday you will have someone in your audience who **will** know what you are doing and who won't be afraid to call you an ass for playing it up. I see it all the time, and have been guilty of doing that myself. People know what we do is dangerous, they just sometimes forget they shouldn't run out and try it. Make it known that it is hard, that you can get burned but make sure that is it. People trail all the time with candles and such...melodrama is one thing I would really watch out for.As for the 3 beat weave...may I remind you all that at some point most of you found it difficult? Hell most found the butterfly difficult at some point. Just because you have gotten to the point where it is basic for you does not mean that it is not difficult. Josh...you can't dumb down something for people who don't know. I found this comment insulting for the audiences I hold so dear. Think of it as educating them starting with what we view as the basics, like where we started.The thing is for a good show as a professional, audience awareness is everything. What moves look best from what angle? How can I move my body to get from one angle and into the other and still be interesting? Where should I change speeds, and sizes of my movements so that it is noticable from 40 feet away? (remember many movement changes are small nuances we know because we are close...try to make them larger for the people in the back row.) What can I do to enhance my presentation? Costumes, lighting, music, movement, introduction...? When you are performing you aren't there for you, you are there because someone paid you to be there for an audience and you need to show them that. Make eye contact, talk to them a little, appreciate them and they will remember it when they are done being awed.When you spin for you, go off in another world, no one cares then, but when it is to impress people, the challenge is keeping it to their level, smoothe and exciting.If you can bring distinction in your own mind between the two, you really will enjoy performing so much more.I love performing, with or without spinning. My audience is everything to me and because of that I create my shows with them solely in mind. What can I do to make them laugh? What can I do to bring them into my world? The fire part takes care of itself, as others have said, it is fire, it is impressive when it is in a camp ring...what makes us think we can have dominion over that? What we do with ourselves in relation to the fire is the important part.Style, technique and presentation are key. Extreme technicality can be saved for those private moments in the back yard.Welcome to show business! ------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...https://www.pyromorph.com

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
It might be true that people love the weave... and it is lol but they do understand what consitutes trickier and therefore more screaming and yelling. For example not many people think the 5bt-weave is all that cool but rapidly switching between forward and btb 3-beat weaves every 2 seconds will be jaw-dropping. People usually understand that faster means harder, and faster while behind your back is harder then that. So usually they appreciate it. Another thing - people need style and flair - like a signature move, entrance, finish, and you also have to move around. Standing in one place doesn't look all that great. Wind the strings around your hands until you can grab the stix in your hands, bust into some liquid or pop, and then unwind, and go back into string form.laterz,taiguy

The reason communism doesn't work is because people like to own stuff

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Well my story hehe... I was at a party and they were playing reggae.... there were around 3 or so spinner.. standing in their corners doing weave/windmills and some wraps... soo I instead of going there and spin with them, I went to the empty space... where there wasn't anyone... (and behind the backs of the audience, where no one was watching( i think)... suddenly I began to spin, taking like 25 meters of space... and doing slights jumps &doing the weave, && weave & turn & windmill... for a few seconds, and suddenly everyone was cheering me... oOOHh!!! =)and I continued to move around a lot and doing the infinite butterfly 4 wraps and it pleases the audience more... and then the dj began to play trance and then they turned off the lights and suddenly the others 3 or so spinners where nearby me, trying to impress the girls!!!! but i think they wanted me hehe, the guy with the blue lightsWell... the story is the same as Pele, it's all about body movements, if you stay still like a moron, nobody will Look you =P

Posted: 8th Dec 2001
Ug... It happened again.I was out last night, really nice night spinning fire with a wonderful crowd of friends and people that I just met. We're all having a grand old time at our usual fire hangout and there's a great band playing, great vibes, lots of comfy "beds" and couches to hang on with very cool people... etc, etc, etc.Now keep in mind, my posse is, for the most part, much better than I am, IMHO. We had guys throwing lit poi up and catching them, 5 beats BtB o'plenty, crazy hand wraps, behind the head wraps, NONE of which I've ever even tried. It was a good night and we had all of my poi inspirations out there in a very positive smiley happy community vibe. A fire circle starts and a crowd gathers and I was EXHAUSTED from my workweek but of course, "force" myself to light up. I'm not really in the mood for anything complicated but the music had just sped up so I figured I'd just weave it up, break a sweat, and head back to my corner. I did a fast set and, since my chains are on the short side, I was the only one "on" the beat rather than on every other beat making me look much faster. Weave, fountains, a few simple wraps, butterfly stuff, yawn, back over to my comfy couch with my friends.Well, the security guard with whom I'd become freindly with comes over to my friends later in the evening and proceeds to tell them all how I had "schooled them"... oh yes... it gets worse. We're all standing around waiting to all get into my car and he won't shush about how "I was 'on' tonight and I showed them all up." I was trying to distract him and de-escalate his excitement but he kept insisting to my friends how "my boy blew you all away" and "schooled them bigtime"... When in fact:A) I DIDN'T!B) There wasn't even a competitive vibe anywhere in the evening.Ug... luckily I'm friendly enough not to be too embarassed by his insistance that I had shamed the rest of the (clearly superior) fire performers...Moral of the story:There are times when you DON'T want to just do the weave fast.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Posted: 8th Dec 2001
I guess what mostly bugged me was the fact that they guys and girls who were actually WORKING out there got overlooked by "no effort" me looks bad for the art in general.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Posted: 8th Dec 2001
Yeah, you're making everyone else look bad stop it.And while we're on the subject, stand up straight - you're making the place look untidy.Comb your hair, straighten yourself up. How are you ever going to find a nice girl looking like that?

Meh

Posted: 8th Dec 2001
Perspective NYC.... (and quit yer damn whining! )Remember to those who don't know it is just fire in circles. You gave the people what they (the onlookers) wanted to see, everyone else gave the people what they (the twirlers) wanted to do. Big difference. In the laymans eyes, spinning fast and furious is on the level of behind the back anything with you work wise, and sometimes it is veiwed as harder. Layman don't know a butterfly from side spins from 1-20 beat anything. You performed, the othes just spun. Get used to the concept that technical moves only impress those who are in the know.------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...https://www.pyromorph.com

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

Posted: 8th Dec 2001
But tidy yourself up a bit anyway - you never know....

Meh

Posted: 9th Dec 2001
Yeah, yeah... good way of thinking about it Pele.And Cantus... you lookin' to unload a shipment of "nice girls" or something? Hook a brotha up, son!

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]