Forums > Beginner Poi Moves > hyperloop - the basic 4-beat

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colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
at nyc's request this is my attempt at explaining how to do the most basic of the hyperloops. if anyone can do better (and i'm *sure* you can) please do - the more descriptions, the better.

okay, we start with the trusty old three beat weave.
we are going to put in a hyperloop when the poi are on your right hand side (rhs) and bring it across to the left hand side (lhs) to untangle.
as your left hand comes onto your rhs and you right hand follows, slightly split the planes of your poi so that the right hand poi comes *outside* of the left (ie. further out to the right so that the left would swing under the right armpit if we kept spinning).
keep your arms moving in the motion of the weave but at the same time, separate your hands so that they are about half your string-length away from each other.

here come da tricky bit:

you need to stop moving your hands when your right hand is at 12 o'clock and your left hand at 6 (ie. the top and bottom of a circle) the right poi should be at this point travelling down and pointing away from you (the direction you are facing) and the left poi travelling upwards and behind and away from you (having just passed your right thigh).
now, as the poi pass each other, you need to move your left hand out to the right and your right hand in towards you (to the left), tangling the strings in the process.
ideally you should aim to get the strings to cross at least halfway between the poi head and the handle.
the poi will now be spinning around a new centre where the strings have tangled.
allow each poi to complete one beat 'outside' your arms on the rhs then whip your hands over to the lhs of your body (same sort of pace as if you were doing a fast five-beat weave) making sure to keep the hands' relative distances and positions (ie. @ 12 and 6 and keeping the string taught).
the poi should spin through and end up on the 'outside' of your lhs.
if you get uneven beats on either side or a beat going between your arms you will get a knot from the depths of hell.

if everything has gone to plan, after another beat on this side the strings should separate and leave you free to slip back into a weave or into another hyperloop back the other way.

so that's my best attempt at an explanation i'm afraid.

a few extra tips i think are worth mentioning are firstly, that i tend to give a little 'push' or 'flick' to both poi (ie. speed them up very slightly), just before i tangle the strings. this seems to help carry them through the spin of the smaller circle.
secondly, i have found that to keep the string taught throughout the move, you only need pull with the hand on top (the right hand in the above example). it kinda feels like you're holding up the whole pattern as you pass it to the other side of your body.
in reverse it feels like the bottom hand that keeps the whole thing tight.

as for not having a poi 'die' (stop spinning and succumb to gravity) on the way out, this seemed to just cure itself after a little while - i think pulling the strings against each other slightly on the way out helps, as does swinging your hands quickly back into the weave motion after untangling.

[edit: speeding up *just* the poi that keeps it all stable helps the most i think - just before tangling, accelerate just the top hand for forward hyps or the bottom hand for reverse hyps.]

best of luck to those who are trying to learn off of this complete jumble of words.

coleman out.

[edit: quick note about the counting of this. the above description adds up to two beats. bringing the poi back to the rhs after the hyperloop has untangled will add another two beats, hence the whole move (a weave with a hyperloop on one side) will add up to 4bts. some people will only count the tangled beats, others will count from when strings touch to when they separate - these people are just mad ]

[ 17. July 2003, 00:11: Message edited by: coleman ]

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
No, actually that was pretty clear... well, pretty clear for one of those moves that's bloody impossible to explain

"Moo," said the happy cow.


MoohaahaaBRONZE Member
enthusiast
382 posts
Location: In Ger Land, India


Posted:
Now explain inside hyperloops. Then outside inside outside ones. Please. Then rabbit moves. Just for a laugh

I like ART

[ 08. January 2003, 12:49: Message edited by: Moohaahaa ]

Some things you have to see to believe, but
Some things you have to believe in to see.


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
A quick "thanks"... I don't have time to play right now but will surely try later this week.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
spiralx - thank-you
nyc - good luck
moohaahaa -

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
(still at work and unable to play... BUT)

How important are poi designs in doing hyperloops? I'm thinking that some of the "Sock" style poi might be a heck of a lot easier since they won't "catch" as easily. Where as my cathedrals on ball chain have a tendancy to catch...

Will poi design/chain material matter in learning?

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
i've managed to pull them off with normal oval link chains, sock poi (variety of materials), string and shoelaces. i've never tried ball chain or wire.

if by 'catch' you mean the chains won't slide along each other's length then this is a good thing. the tangle point on the strings stays the same all the way through the move until they untangle so chains that catch on each other may well be a bonus rather than a hinderance.

my neatest hyperloops i get using aerotech balls in nets on shoestrings. they're heavy and so carry through the move well and the laces are thin and have very little friction.

the only design i've had problems with are comets because of the tails - although hyperloops are still possible it just looks messier with tails i think.

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
I'll have to see. Well, first I'll have to learn it but I'll have to see if ballchain has any affect. It sounds like I should be able to do it with any poi. Emphaisis on the SHOULD.

Oh, and I was more concerned about the wicks catching on the other wicks and losing momentum but I guess if I do it right that shouldn't be a problem.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


DJ DantanaBRONZE Member
veteran
1,495 posts
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA


Posted:
yea, heavier poi heads are definitly easier to use with hyperloops, you can go slower, and friction from the chains touching and twisting up has less effect.

I have done hyperloops with my comet poi, and they work great, because the strings offer almost no resistance, and there is no hindrance from string twisting up (unlike normal chains) Just don't get them tangled, cause you WILL need to stop spinning to untangle them. those tails are viciouse, so dont try to learn hyperloops with comets untill you can do them with other toys.

other than that I guess the most important parts are, getting the poi chains to hit symetricaly and getting the timing, of when you bring the hyperloop over, correct.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
Hrmmm... well, I was definitely getting NOwhere with my lighter tennis ball poi, then shifted to my heaviest wicks on ball chains and a least got the chains to tangle in a manigable fashion. A few quick questions... keep in mind, I may have to give up until I've actually seen someone do the trick.

1) When bringing the poi together, how are both poi going to the ouside? When I'm crossing chains, one seems to want to come inside?

2) I'm having trouble counting beats as I can no longer keep track of which poi is which! As my right poi comes down (my rt hand is at 12 o'clock and poi is at 6...) the strings should now be touching. The right poi is passing by the outside my left hand and my left poi is passing by inside my right hand, right? After they touch, does this poi do one complete rotation, then switch? Or half a rotation? Or what?

3) The place where the chains touch should be closer to the poi than the handle right?

Again... I'm a bit sceptial at my ability to learn this move never having seen it.. (Yeah, I know I asked! )

Still trying!

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
OK, new problem. I've dropped one poi and was just trying to get it to work with one. Wait, hear me out, I know you need two to do it. But when I'm doing just my right hand and stick out say, a left finger to create a new axis, the poi immidiately die/lose all momentum/flail about. Which is exactly what happens when I touch chains. My poi are immidiately losing all momentum and falling to the ground. I'm sceptical about the ballchain too.. at least for a beginner like me.

I know I won't expect to learn it quickly... but I don't quite see the move at all yet. Or at least how to keep the new momentum...

How far is Oklahoma?

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by NYC:
How far is Oklahoma?
a hell of a lot closer than london

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


DJ DantanaBRONZE Member
veteran
1,495 posts
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA


Posted:
Ok, nyc, I know your problem now. the poi chains should CROSS CLOSER TO THE HANDLES than the poi heads. It is easier to start out crossing the chains very close to the handles, then slowly (as you get better) start to cross them closer and closer to the poi heads (about halfway is max for the normal hyperloop)

With that being said, I can do a wierd one were the chains cross just a few inches from the poi heads, and the hyperloop "magicaly" undoes itself without bringing the poi to the other side of you body. It is easiest to do this from a windmill, and hyperloop in front of you. the poi will pop apart very quickly after the hyperloop. I think they are sort of coming inside (so you see a small circle in front of you) right after they hyperloop. but it happens so fast you can't unwrap them on purpose, you just have to set it up right and they will come apart on their own. (does this description make sence?) there is a certain point along the chains where this works. I think it is about 7 inches from the poi head.

But for normal hyperloops, start out crossing chains very close to the handles, then work your way out.

You are having trouble because it all happens to fast when you cross closer to the poi heads, it is almost imposible to control the hyperloop (after it is started) when you wrap close to the poi heads. therefor, you must set up a hyperloop so it will come undone on it's own (when you wrap close to the poi heads.

got it now?

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!


DJ DantanaBRONZE Member
veteran
1,495 posts
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA


Posted:
oh, by the way, NYC, oklahoma is a short two hour flight away from NYC. And they have flights twice a day to OKC, which is one hour away from me. If you want to come for a visit I would love to teach you what I know. I have a couch you can sleep on too.

I love to meet other twirlers too. Nasu came down a while back and I was giddy as a school girl all night long

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!


MrConfusedBRONZE Member
addict
529 posts
Location: I wish I knew, United Kingdom


Posted:
From what I remember from when I began to get these, a few weeks back before the weather and then a complete bastard of a cold stopped me practicing:

quote:
When bringing the poi together, how are both poi going to the ouside? When I'm crossing chains, one seems to want to come inside?

I think that's what is meant to happen. The only way I've got this to work (with ball chain, btw) is after the tangle (on the right hand side), the right head goes underneath the tangle point, comes up on the outside (furthest away from the body), crosses the tangle point as if to rotate on the inside of the tangle point, at which point it is brought over to the left side of the body.
I have absolutely no idea what's going on with the left head, it's been too long since I've had a go at it.

Santanatwo, you're scaring me with the number of variations of this move you seem to know! You might be able to help, though. Completely by accident, I did a hyperloop that included rotations in between the arms, buzzsaw style. Any idea how? I'm stumped, just seem to hit myself and/or end up with a very nasty knot (so much worse than a normal tangle) when I actually try to do this.

J

If you're not confused, you're not thinking about things hard enough.


.Morph.SILVER Member
addict
669 posts
Location: Lancashire, UK


Posted:
Thanks for the description, I can now do a very sketchy version of a hyperloop. Guess I'll just have to practice some more, damn

colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by santanatwo:
the poi chains should CROSS CLOSER TO THE HANDLES than the poi heads.
thats bang on. you can imagine hyperloops like normal airwraps. ie. wrapping the chain round your wrist to add an extra beat on each side just with the wrap moved along the strings

moohaahaa (he's a handy lad to have around ) pointed out to me today that if you start off spinning a four beat weave (by doing the five beat style 'wrist curling over each other' thing to add the extra beat just on one side - a 4 beat weave) and stop curling your wrists you get a four beat weave using an airwrap on one side.
now if you do this and pull your hands apart on the airwrap bit, hey presto, hyperloop

so if you do a hyperloop on the right to a hyperloop on the left, you are doing what is essentially a five beat weave.

getting to the point, this should help you to visualise which poi crosses over first nyc - in the original post's example, the left hand poi leads (ie crosses to the left and right hand sides first with the right following) all the way through the move - because its an even beat move, the same poi always leads.

[ 10. January 2003, 22:53: Message edited by: coleman ]

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


GlåssDIAMOND Member
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom


Posted:
Originally posted by mohahaha.
"Now explain ....rabbit moves."

OK, a personal favorite:
3 clubs: place club knob handle right up in your crotch, so the club sticks out the back as a bunny tail.
Holding 2 clubs pull groovy rabbit face put the clubs (handle end) up to your head to make bunny ears, bunny bouch round in a little circle, with the tail bobbing up and down.



err. check me if I'm wrong but
hyperloops got 2 or 3 beats in the tangle
airwraps got 2 beats in tangle
add in a tangle buzzsaw and you get extra beats

cole still not clear maybe see you in the fairy palace in the sky tomorrow.

[ 11. January 2003, 00:58: Message edited by: glass ]

Lightwistermember
20 posts
Location: wabash/Indianapolis


Posted:
Good description....but i dont quite follow. What does this move look like?

colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by coleman:
you can imagine hyperloops like normal airwraps. ie. wrapping the chain round your wrist to add an extra beat on each side just with the wrap moved along the strings

moohaahaa (he's a handy lad to have around ) pointed out to me today that if you start off spinning a four beat weave (by doing the five beat style 'wrist curling over each other' thing to add the extra beat just on one side - a 4 beat weave) and stop curling your wrists you get a four beat weave using an airwrap on one side.
now if you do this and pull your hands apart on the airwrap bit, hey presto, hyperloop

so if you do a hyperloop on the right to a hyperloop on the left, you are doing what is essentially a five beat weave.

that was all very confused wasn't it. it should have read:


you can imagine hyperloops like 4bt weaves with the string wrapping your wrist.

moohaahaa (he's a handy lad to have around ) pointed out to me today that if you start off spinning a four beat weave (by doing the five beat style 'wrist curling over each other' thing to add the extra beat just on one side - a standard 4bt weave) and stop curling your wrists you get a four beat weave using a wrist wrap on one side.
now if you do this and pull your hands apart on the wrist wrap bit, the strings tangle instead hey presto, hyperloop

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


BlackFireJackmember
167 posts
Location: Bergen , Norway


Posted:
just add something ....
i used to fill my tennisball poi with stuff so they would be heavier and easier for hyperloops..
then I started with fire...and my firepoi's are light as hell....had to learn it all over again..

I like Fire.. :)


DJ DantanaBRONZE Member
veteran
1,495 posts
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA


Posted:
weave hyperloops have even numbered beats when inside. otherwise you tie a nice little knot when you go back outside. Butterflys just have to be symetrical. Outside weave hyperloops can have any number of beats.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!


bluecatgeek, level 1
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere


Posted:
working on the 'hyperloop anywhere' principle. if you have the timing fairly good(as suddenly happened to me yesterday) on hyperloops, then you seriously can put them in anywhere, forwards and backwards. if anything backwards ibetter for transitions cause you get a fairly easy one up above the head....

off to practise.


R

Holistic Spinner (I hope)


NickCMonkey Wrangler
183 posts
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada


Posted:
Just for an FYI, I was playing last night with the butterfly hyperloop on practice poi and had it going for probably 10 beats on a steady basis. May try to get a video of some practice poi spinning indoors sometime with this included.

DJ DantanaBRONZE Member
veteran
1,495 posts
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA


Posted:
ten?!?!?
the most I have gotten (and sucsessfuly exited from) is about five beats on the outside of a butterfly hyperloop. most impressive

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!


JinXmushroom collector
208 posts
Location: JHB, South Africa


Posted:
Thanx!

this explains hyperloops really well thanx to the poi gods.

just one question though is a hyperloop when you do what you would for a forward forearm wrap exept you wrap the chains around each other and not your arm?

JinX : If it doesnt kill you it makes you stronger

The spin cycle on the washing machine does not make earth worms dizzy.
It will however make cats dizzy and cats throw up twice their bodyweight when dizzy.


colemanSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom


Posted:
thats exactly it.

timing is a bit different but its the same sort of thing

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


JinXmushroom collector
208 posts
Location: JHB, South Africa


Posted:
i get the hyperloop pretty good on my right side but mess it up coming back from the left any sugestions?

JinX : If it doesnt kill you it makes you stronger

The spin cycle on the washing machine does not make earth worms dizzy.
It will however make cats dizzy and cats throw up twice their bodyweight when dizzy.


BlackFireJackmember
167 posts
Location: Bergen , Norway


Posted:
quote:
Originally posted by santanatwo:
Ok, nyc, I know your problem now. the poi chains should CROSS CLOSER TO THE HANDLES than the poi heads.
Thats easier.....But not a rule.....Hyperloops can cross where ever thay want on both chains....
I do a hyperloop where one poi is standing still while the other one swings in a buzzsaw...One poi have to cross by the handle..thats all....

I like Fire.. :)


i8beefy2GOLD Member
addict
674 posts
Location: Ohio, USA


Posted:
Just thought I'd throw in that I figured out the hyperloop and hyperloop weave yesterday to the point that I can pull it off about 1/3 of the time! I'm taking a break for a few days though because I need to give my knuckles, shin, shoulder, eye, and cranium time to heal from figuring this out with a set of beaming poi. I really gotta make up some new fire heads for these poi.... Oh and it is possible with ball chain, just have to make sure your hands don't slip to different heights as you bring it over, cause when it unwraps one of the poi will smack your knuckles.

And doing it by the poi heads you can turn it into a kind of reversal from a windmill, ending up with both poi going the opposite direction of whatever way they started... should be able to make that into a cool looking single-plane figure eight of fire if you get the timing down right and can do it both directions... Just a thought.

BlackFireJackmember
167 posts
Location: Bergen , Norway


Posted:
Thats one of the beauties with hyperloops....just going smoothly between moves in any directions and planes....Makes it much easier to play around ....and it looks really good ....options are endless.........

I like Fire.. :)


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