Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

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Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:Now I know there's a thread here talking about what covers people like and everything, but that's not really what I want to discuss.

why are there so many covers?
Do you think that doing a cover loses a person's credibility as an artist?
If a cover works, why do you think it works?

Yes, I've been spending a lot of time at my parents' house and that includes my mum bitching about covers ubblol

Now sometimes I have to admit I like covers, but it's a rare sometimes. There are some definitely some good ones out there. But why do them? And while I know covers aren't a new thing at all (some of my favourite covers were done in the 60s and 70s - John Farnham's cover of the Beatles' "Help" is beautiful) but there seem to be a lot more around these days. Shall I be cynical like my mother and ask "can't they write their own music?" or are they "trying to bring the old and gold music back into our era?"

As for bringing the old music into the modern era, I think that people like Michael Buble do this, because they retain the original feel of the music. But many "re-hashed" songs are changed a lot from their original form and many lose their meaning.

Take for example the Counting Crows cover of Joni Mitchell's "Big Yellow Taxi".
In the original she says "and a big yellow taxi took away my ol' man" which is a part of the original meaning on the song being a protest song as when she wrote it, divorce rates were rising. However the Counting Crow's version says "took my girl away" which I believe distracts from the true meaning on the song.

I do also have to admit that I like songs being covered in a different style. There is some guy who does rock songs in a swing style and I like this because he is still using creativity and potentially opening up a new market and making people more aware of the swing market. But I do not see people covering song by adding an electric guitar rather than an accoustic one as creativity and more laziness. I mean, what the hell was with Madonna covering "American Pie" or Jessica Simpson with "These Boots are made for Walking"???

Is it because I was brought up on my parents' music and therefore know the originals?

I know this is a bit of a rant, but I'm interested as to what others thing about why this industry is there.


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:Well - my 2 Baht fifty - art is always depending on the context. Something can be incredible beautiful in the proper context and very stupid, if inappropriate.

Goethe once made a statement, which I believe holds some truth: There hardly is an artist who can claim to exclusively acquire from his very own creativity. We are all influenced by what we see and hear in our environment (even our dreams) and how our minds process this information. Thus I am saying in regards of "creativity". We are much like an interconnected mass of braincells, than as individual as we sometimes claim to be.

Further I would say that many singers/ bands do not necessarily write their own songs - therefore it's not the band that gets covered. As a songwriter/ text writer/ compositor I would love to see what different interpreters (!) make from my pieces. After all it's about the imprint, left by the piece...

Last but not least, I guess that there are commercial interests behind it. Like with successful movies, successful songs... well, have been successful. "Tainted Love" is a song that was very successful at it's time and so far there has hardly been any cover version I came across and didn't like. Therefore the sale is almost certain. I also liked "American Pie" and "These boots...", even though I don't subscribe too much to Madonna or Jessica.

ubblol How about "you're just too good to be true"? by Frankie Valli, errm Any Williams, errm Lauryn Hill?

How about "Yesterday"? shrug IMO a cover is a tribute to the original artists and writers, even a remake is... Wiki on cover/ remakes... it delivers a (beautiful) piece of music in a different context and therefore makes it accessible to a different group or generation. Take "This is not a lovesong" by Nouvelle Vague... I think it's one of THE sexiest versions available.

And to cover that topic from my side completely: How about us? We do copy/ cover our teachers? Is a move just a guitar chord? Or a combination of moves much like a sequence? When does "creativity" start and "copying" end?

I like this thread - hope I haven't said too much, I haven't said enough, I thought that I heard you laughing, I thought that I heard you sing, I think I saw you try.... wink


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

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Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted: Written by: FireTom


Goethe once made a statement, which I believe holds some truth: There hardly is an artist who can claim to exclusively acquire from his very own creativity.




But where do you draw the line at acquiring creativity and simply stealing it? Someone could repaint the Mona Lisa and claim they just acquired it. Which is simply what a hell of a lot of covers do!


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:umm how can someone claim to have acquired a cover?

It exactly is about this fine red line: where does creativity start and copying end? wink


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

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Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:that's what i'm saying! that they can't! ubblol

i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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jarle
GOLD Member since Mar 2007

jarle

Lv15 Ranger
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 1489
Posted:I'm with FireTom on this - pretty much everything we do is copied or influenced from something else. My music taste for example - in my childhood I spent a lot of time over at my cousins, and hence I like most of the music they like.

However, I don't like most covers cranked out by mainstream artists - ESPECIALLY "If I were a rich girl' by someone. redface I forget who. One I do like however is 'Take On Me' by Reel Big Fish.

Long story short, it's safer to do a well-known and well-loved song a second time, but original songs are better. I think you draw the line at taking their entire song and re-doing it!


Kupo!

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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:... without adding anything or leaving something away rolleyes but hey, aint this usually the band that still plays in backyards and on the local garden shows? umm wink

My mum listened to loads of classical music when she was pregnant and when I have been a child (note that I can't use was anymore rolleyes redface ) - I blame it on her that I neither listen to speed/ black metal screamers, nor to free-jazz... shrug am I missing out on something?

I wonder what the Motrhead version of "you're just to good to be true" would sound like... arrgh, slipping into chitty - pardon me Rogue footinmouth


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:I've noticed you seem to be in a chatty mood! Are you hungover?

oh dear look! Now I'm being chatty!

spank s self


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:*ignores the bait* List of most covered songs *and breaks head over what song "Eleanor Rigby" is* confused

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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DarkFyre
BRONZE Member since Nov 2005

DarkFyre

HoP mage and keeper of the fireballs
Location: Palmerston North, New Zealand

Total posts: 1965
Posted:Doing a cover of a song is nothing new and has been going on as long as music has been around.

In some form it is ment a flattery to the original artist and in another it is a way of passing on the music that the current artist loves. Sometimes it is lazzyness but at the same time imitation is a great way to learn.
Just for an example
How many guitarists know how to play "Stairway to Heaven"? (most of them)
And at the time that they learnt it did they have the musical knowhow to write an original piece? (probably not)
Thus covers are an important way to learn.

Somtimes covers are an adaptation, so that a powerfull song can be brought before an audience with a wider variety of musical tastes.

Some covers are a mockery of the original song (anything by Weird Al Yankovich) and some are a vast improvement on the original.

Most covers are somewhere between flatery and lazyness and the artists that are responsible for them should know better, as a result many of them suck but hey thats life.


May my balls of fire set your balls on fire devil

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FireTom


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Total posts: 6650
Posted:^^^ ubbidea ^^^ btw: you have any pictures of your invented firetoys? *hides from incoming spell*

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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_Aime_
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

_Aime_

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom

Total posts: 4172
Posted:Y'know..I've got lots of stuff to say about this in my head, but at the momant all my fingers can come up with is 'Meh'...

I'll come back later...


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alien_oddity


alien_oddity

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Posted:i was just flicking through the telly channels and flicked onto er..................em...........i cant remember hewr name thats how good she is ubblol

she was on stage at glastonbury festival doing a cover of blondie's "heart of glass"

i agree with aimz...........................*yawns* Meh............ubblol


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UCOF
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

UCOF

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Total posts: 15414
Posted:I saw Arctic Monkies' cover of Shirley Bassey's "Diamonds are forever".

I thought it was a bit rubbish.

 Written by: Jarle

One I do like however is 'Take On Me' by Reel Big Fish.



bounce Its a good tune is that bounce2

Another favourite cover version, and one of my all time favourite songs, is this:


(One of the only Youtube videos where there is no rudeness or posts only in capital letters biggrin )

I also went though a phase of listening to lots of different ska punk covers biggrin
smile


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alien_oddity


alien_oddity

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Posted:ubbidea LILLY ALLEN ubblol it's been bugging me for ages

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_Aime_
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

_Aime_

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom

Total posts: 4172
Posted:I like the cover genre.
Some ones I like and others I dont, just like any other songs to reach my ears.

I love to hear differant artists slants on songs that I like, and hearing covers of them is sometimes a refreshing change.

Rouge, would you be quite so botherd if an orchestra performed a 'cover' of a classical track, or if perhaps a DJ used a sample from another track that wasnt his, in making his new tune - or do you just not like covers of songs that you hold affection for?

Whilst I may not like all covers, I admire the passion that went into them, because to cover a song and sing/perform it in front of others who will be more likely to critasize you because you're singing a cover (why is that?) you've gotta have some balls..


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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

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Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:No, it's not just covers of songs I have affection for. I didn't think I'd made that implication. And like I said - it's not that I hate all covers; there are some I do like.

I'm not bothered by orchestras, because isn't that the idea of the classical genre? That pieces are composed to be performed by orchestras in general? I didn't know they were specified to one orchestra only. I don't know, I have no idea how that market works.

And I have less of an idea about the DJ world. But I see DJs taking an old song and just remixing it as covers as well.


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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Eera
BRONZE Member since May 2003

old hand
Location: In a test pit, Mackay, Austral...

Total posts: 1107
Posted:I think it's kind of a grownup's version of singing their favourite song in the shower; they just want to do it. If the song has merit in the way the new performer sings it then why not? I hate carbon-copy performers - why do people pretend to be the new Beatles when there already *is* (or was) the Beatles.

Personally, I prefer Crow's version of Big Yellow Taxi (the one that's the hidden track, not the single release as whatsherface going "bah bah be bah..." in the background really annoys me), Gunner's Knocking on Heaven's Door is way better than the original as Axl can actually sing, ditto for Jeff Buckley's Alleluia.

However.

The Corrs turned Everybody Hurts into lift music with their simpering wetness, and ANYONE who covers the Bangles is committing a capital crime.

Of course a singer is going to have more credibility if they have originality, regardless of who actually wrote the song, but making a career of covers just seems a little lazy to me.


There is a slight possibility that I am not actually right all of the time.

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