Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Noah was channel surfing today and stopped on a show about celebrities and thier religions....and how much money they spend on being "balanced" and pious.

umm Woah!

Did you know there is Kabbalah water? It is supposedly spring water from Canada (not Israel!) that is blessed by Kabbalic Rabbi's and therefore it brings health to the drinker! Supposedly it costs some stupid amount like $500 a case or something absurd like that.

Then of course there is Image Balancing. You send this company a headshot and for the bargain price of $10,000 they will shoot energy beams at your picture for months in order to bring your energies into balance. My guess is that the photo ends up in the circular file and they laugh their way to the bank.

And I was appauled at all the supposedly Buddhist and Kabbalic celebrities who literally shut down these poorer countries while visiting them on pilgramages, and who spend the nights in $2000 a night rooms and such. If these religions really do teach these people to be humble and not value earthly possessions as much as their spiritual souls, why are they not helping those less fortunate more?
My favorite of this is Madonna, who in her conversion took the very humble Kabbalic name Esther which is of a queen who essentially saved the Hebrew people and is heralded as a saint. Now...someone needs to tell me how one can claim to be in search of ridding themselves of their ego (one of the major goals of the Kabbalah) and then take on such pretentions and then get a GINORMOUS diamond encrusted "E" to flaunt it?

And those are just a couple examples I heard.

I think obscene amounts of money make many of these celebrity peoples brains into those of a leming or sheep.

What do you think? And do you think it would happen to you?


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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FlameChild
FlameChild

Pyromantic
Location: Norway (Way way up North, on t...
Member Since: 23rd Jun 2002
Total posts: 136
Posted:Hmm...
I don't think I'll ever know the answer to that question..
If I won a million dollars (7 million norwegian kroner) to morrow, I believe I would freak out a bit.
Buy my self a new car, new clothes and stuff..
But I don't think I would on totally useless stuff..

On the other hand, these things might mean a lot to the celebrities..
And why shall we judge what are meaningful to these people?
It's their money, wether they spend it wise or not, is not our task to judge..
But I agree with you..

But please don't make Madonna a saint..
On the Live8-concert she demanded a case of kabbalah-water backstage..
She's not better than the rest..


-= I am the god of Hell-fire =-
-= And I bring you......fire =-

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FlameChild
FlameChild

Pyromantic
Location: Norway (Way way up North, on t...
Member Since: 23rd Jun 2002
Total posts: 136
Posted:Ops.. sorry.. misunderstood the writing..
you did not make Madonna a saint..
Sorry sorry sorry..
*kisses Pele's feet*
My most humble apologies..


-= I am the god of Hell-fire =-
-= And I bring you......fire =-

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fNi
fNi

master of disaster
Location: New York
Member Since: 8th Mar 2004
Total posts: 3354
Posted:things like this just piss me off;

one of my favorite memories of live8 was when madonna was being interviewed and was asked if she had ever been to africa offtopic

but anyways,
These celebrities that seek spiritual guidance, good for them. But I think that the scholars would be schvitzing themselves if they saw, for instance, how commericial and cheapened the Kabbalahh (not even Judaism, but Jewish Mysticism) has become.


kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more

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oli
not with cactus
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devo...
Member Since: 24th Jul 2003
Total posts: 2052
Posted:i think all religion is in some way about trying to buy yourself into a better life in one way or another... so money of some sort is gonna be involved.

Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no

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Kyrian
Dreamer
Location: York, England
Member Since: 15th Mar 2002
Total posts: 4308
Posted:Madonna doesn't scare me as much as Gwen Stefani or Mariah Carey, but yes, being a celebrity seems to put people out of touch with the world in very noticeable ways. I wa actually talking with someone about this the other day.. they just don't seem to *
understand* anymore. I think celebrityness is worse than just money, altho it could just be more visible. But I think if I just had a lot of money, and not also the celebrity thing, I would remain pretty balanced. I know food alcohol and housing would get a bit up there if i truly has millions at my disposal... but... i just can't even imagine the type of things they do....! I think some of it might be low self esteem, even, the amount of ostentatiousness just dosn't make sense otherwise.


Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Flamechild, that was too funny. No apology needed! wink

Kyrian, I think you bring up an important point about celebrity not necessarily being about the money and they still do stupid stuff. I think that the money just makes it easier for them too! lol

fNi, I agree the scholars would flip. I think though that Jesus would too, if he could see the levels of distortion attached to his teachings now, you know?

It makes me wonder about the leaders/gurus/priests/rabbi's you know? How much do they get paid for blessing that water anyway? wink


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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fNi
fNi

master of disaster
Location: New York
Member Since: 8th Mar 2004
Total posts: 3354
Posted:simple answer....its a crock of censored

kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more

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Mr_Chutney
Mr_Chutney

Tosser
Location: Herefordshire
Member Since: 18th Apr 2003
Total posts: 1711
Posted:Written by: oli

i think all religion is in some way about trying to buy yourself into a better life in one way or another... so money of some sort is gonna be involved.



I've never seen it that way- I'm pretty closed to any one religion due to the unique and contrdictory existence of religion in general but I don't see that money is necessarily involved?


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Prometheus
Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Member Since: 30th Jun 2002
Total posts: 459
Posted:When I was very young, were were required to give our offerings in person every Sunday, y'know, to build character. One day, I decided to give mine to a poor kid in school who didn't always have lunch money. That Sunday, when the priest asked where his 2 dollars* was, I said I already gave it to the poor. Boy did I get snubbed that week. I couldn't see the difference between me giving money directly to those who needed it, and using a middle man.

*(I want my two dollars!!!)


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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ben-ja-men
ben-ja-men

just lost .... evil init
Location: Adelaide
Member Since: 12th Jun 2003
Total posts: 2474
Posted:Written by: Pele

My favorite of this is Madonna, who in her conversion took the very humble Kabbalic name Esther which is of a queen who essentially saved the Hebrew people and is heralded as a saint. Now...someone needs to tell me how one can claim to be in search of ridding themselves of their ego (one of the major goals of the Kabbalah) and then take on such pretentions and then get a GINORMOUS diamond encrusted "E" to flaunt it?




i guess it depends on
- how much time u have available to u to spend learning
- what your goal is (real discovery of truth or satisfying that part of you that needs to believe)
- who your teacher is and what their motivations are

different people read the same thing and take different meaning from it, ive met christians who believe that the bible is the unquestionable word of god and arnt intersting in considering the possiblity of anything else. other christians accept that it was written by men and retranslated by men and at some point heavily edited by king james, but that the letter of the bible isnt important its the spirit of the lessons that count.

maybe madonna does feel that her music does save the masses by giving them inspiration, hope etc. realistictly even if she gave away everything she owned (approximately 315 million) to the worlds underprivilidges lets very conservatively say 10% of the worlds population 6,446,131,400 everyone would get a massive 50 cents!!!!

then again maybe its just the latest hollywood trend *shrugs*. i dont think its any more "stupid" than "good christians" who dont treat others, especially their families with the principles they so strongly believe in, once life gets tough all those high faluting ideals go straight out the door, yep the rich definately dont have a monopoly on stupidity


Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?

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flid
flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire
Member Since: 27th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3136
Posted:what are these strange fangled religions you talk of that arn't corrupt and more about spirituality than poltics and making money? All the ones i know of are, even the dalai lama sells tourist tack that has nothing to do with 'buddhist teaching' but traditional stuff from his country, like astrological charts etc. It's really a matter for me when it's being sold as part of the religion, not just by people from the religion. Ie the difference between monks selling wine and monks selling wine that will make you a better christian.

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Kyrian
Dreamer
Location: York, England
Member Since: 15th Mar 2002
Total posts: 4308
Posted:Every religion has bad apples.... and prolly every religion has good ones... but some seem to generate more of one type than another I think! (perhaps its just how they distribute themselves)

Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:Pele, I think it proves a quote I once heard.

"Idiot: n. A member of a large, powerful, and ubiquitous tribe whose influence on human affairs is far-reaching and profound."

Idiots come rich and poor, in every shape, size, color, nationality, sexual orientation, gender, etc. Idiocy is truly equal-opportunity.

And if you're a clever person and it occurs to you to make a market of rich fools, then kudos to you! But if you think that money causes idiocy, then you may be the next member of the tribe...
wink


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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Kyrian
Dreamer
Location: York, England
Member Since: 15th Mar 2002
Total posts: 4308
Posted:Hehe... but I'm not convinced that fame doesn't cause forms of it, at least.....

Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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Aryth
Aryth

in a beautiful daze....
Location: Liverpool, England
Member Since: 25th May 2005
Total posts: 134
Posted:In my opinion money corrupts at all levels, those who have less are more generous than those who have more And see less worth in possessions and more in enjoyment and self satisfaction.
For example my girlfriend is a door to door charity collector and when her and her team are out collecting they know that the chances are they are much more likely to have someone willing to support the charity (regardless of which one) if they live in a small house/council house. People who are obviously well off i.e. detached house executive car or two on the drive, are 99% of the time remarkably rude and one of their favourite phrases is huh were the ones needing charity.

Dont know if its just me who can see it but by having money people immediately have the urge to get more and more money, followed by more and more needless possessions i.e. a second car or weekend car. Which then leads to them totally loosing sight of the real world and becoming pretentious censored

Yes we can look at celebrities and say look how stupid your being buying water for $500 or whatever but its the corruption around them and that because they have money they want to flaunt how much better they are than us.


Whatever happened to my green and pleasant land?

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Lemonkey
Lemonkey

Stalking amidst the desert, carrying an oversized scalpel...
Location: Huddersfield + Hull Uni... UK.
Member Since: 1st Aug 2005
Total posts: 1019
Posted:Written by: fNi

simple answer....its a crock of censored



How true.

I despise celebrities who waste money on that Kabbalah nonsense, designer clothing which looks exactly the same as stuff you buy down at any random cheap store. They need to share their money out to random charities instead of wasting it. If I ever came into money, I'd give generously to charity, and even do a bit of charity work (as opposed to monotonous jobs).

I wish I had a few million to play around with. frown


Willy - is bad for your health...

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Ben-ja-min and Flid, this isn't about the religions...not at all. There are other threads for that.

It is about "celebrities" being hypocrites within their *very* public religions and their money...and it seems the more money they have the more gullible they become.

Kyrian, I completely agree! lol

I also don't think they at all deserve the money they are getting...not in the least. I mean, $1mill to poorly act on a tv show..per episode? Ummmm no, especially when one of them turns around and was the one who paid $10 thou to get her head shot scan and "energized" (though I really wish I thought of that!!!! ubblol ).


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Kyrian
Dreamer
Location: York, England
Member Since: 15th Mar 2002
Total posts: 4308
Posted:Yeah, and they don't pay their nannies well either, even tho most of them don't actually want to raise their own children or do anything else like it..... And that particular trend does seem to have a focus in money, and not just in th ecelebrity world.

Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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LazyAngel
LazyAngel

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Cambridge UK
Member Since: 29th Jul 2004
Total posts: 2895
Posted:I think a reason people do stupid things like getting their photo 'energized' or whatever, is that maybe it's their equivalent of a chocolate bar: for instance, If I want a treat, I'll go and buy a really nice meal somewhere or a scrummy chocolate dessert or somesuch. If I really want to treat myself, I'll get myself some new poi or make a new fire toy or some such.

I guess when they have that much cash to spare they think, 'oh I'll get my aura fixed, that'll be a nice treat'

Where this does tie into the religion argument is that these are the people (bored/weak willed/gullible) who religions can make the most money out of, while giving the impression that they are doing something worthwhile.

I think to understand these people though you need to look at where they came from and their backgrounds. I don't know anything about celebrities, but I guess some people just lose it when a load of cash is dumped on their lap.


Because ActiveAngel sounds like a feminine deodorant

Like sex, I'm much more interesting in real life than online.

'Be the change you want to see in the world around you' - Ghandi

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jeff(fake)
jeff(fake)

Scientist of Fortune
Location: Edinburgh
Member Since: 15th Apr 2005
Total posts: 1189
Posted:Written by: Prometheus

When I was very young, were were required to give our offerings in person every Sunday, y'know, to build character. One day, I decided to give mine to a poor kid in school who didn't always have lunch money. That Sunday, when the priest asked where his 2 dollars* was, I said I already gave it to the poor. Boy did I get snubbed that week. I couldn't see the difference between me giving money directly to those who needed it, and using a middle man.

*(I want my two dollars!!!)



I think that this is a superb recollection. It shows the generosity of regular people and the greed of our so call 'saviours'. It just makes me more hopfull for the future that a kid would make the choice to give his own money.


According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...

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PyroWill
PyroWill

HoP's Barman. Trapped aged 6 months
Location: Staines
Member Since: 4th Aug 2004
Total posts: 4437
Posted:Im more worried about the influence these celebrities have on people, especially youngsters, i see all these rap videos (sorry im using that as an example since its first to mind and my least favourite musical preference) where a bunch of guys are shouting bollox at the camera, and encourgae basically driving around with their pimped up cars and geting their 'bitches' as they say, and if that was just in the world of media thats fine, but i look around town and i see kids who the moment they become 17 take their driviing test and buy the fastest or souped up car they can afford and drive around mimicing these people and before you know it they end up piling it into a lampost or a person, im not saying celebrities or rap music are responsible for these peoples actions, but i do feel that celebrities do have a certain responsibility to their fans that look up to them and mimic them and they should try and set a good example.



Sorry i know its a bit offtopic



Who knows maybe im just being like this cos i want rippling abs and 20 girls in bikinis dancing around me, cos thats what happens in real life right, the tv said so!


An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind

Give a man a fish and he'll eat 4 a day hit a man with a brick and you can have all his fish and his wife

"Will's to pretty for prison" - Simian

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=Flashpoint=
=Flashpoint=

Pasta of Muppets
Location: in the interwebs...
Member Since: 1st Sep 2004
Total posts: 2719
Posted:Ahh the magic box tells us things!

ohmygodlaserbeamspewpewpew!
ubbrollsmileubbrollsmileubbrollsmileubbrollsmile

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TinklePants
TinklePants

Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr
Member Since: 3rd Jul 2005
Total posts: 4217
Posted:I see religion in two ways:

A way of blaming life's failures on *an act of god*

or

Something for us to hope for and to aspire to - to better ourselves.

My actual belief system is kind of mixed though, but it makes sense. shan't go into it right now, i'll just bore you all to death.
that's my two cents.


Always use "so's your face" and "only on Tuesdays" in as many conversations possible

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