Forums > Technical Discussion > Fuel and body traces
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Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
So last night I tried body tracing for the first time but it didnt work out too well. I just couldnt get a flame to stay on my body. I was using lamp oil as fuel which is what I blame the failure on. What is the best fuel to use for body tracing?
The only thing I did get was a nice little 3rd degree burn on my wrist when the wick melted to my skin >< Note to self: never use other people's home made wicks.
So last night I tried body tracing for the first time but it didnt work out too well. I just couldnt get a flame to stay on my body. I was using lamp oil as fuel which is what I blame the failure on. What is the best fuel to use for body tracing?
The only thing I did get was a nice little 3rd degree burn on my wrist when the wick melted to my skin >< Note to self: never use other people's home made wicks.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
SILVER Member
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Posted:
I'd suggest white gass or alcohol. If that burn really is third degree go see a doctor. Been there done that and if you want to keep your hand see a doctor.
I'd suggest white gass or alcohol. If that burn really is third degree go see a doctor. Been there done that and if you want to keep your hand see a doctor.
Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada
Flaming Lesbian
181 posts
Location: Portland, Oregon
181 posts
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posted:
cody took the words out of my mouth...
(and please see a doctor, some things can't be fixed with neosporin)
cody took the words out of my mouth...
(and please see a doctor, some things can't be fixed with neosporin)
Lights dancing off my skin as chains wrap round it.
Pain is in a little box and I'm so glad I found it.
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Dont think its quite 3rd degree. It blistered a lil but its still rather small (~penny size). I think my hand will pull through
Thanks for the suggestion though.
Dont think its quite 3rd degree. It blistered a lil but its still rather small (~penny size). I think my hand will pull through
Thanks for the suggestion though.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
SILVER Member
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Posted:
Sounds like a good second degree burn. Keep the blister on it as long as you can, that keeps it clean.
Third degree burns are generally pretty big surrounded by second degree and first degree on the outer edge. Third degree burns don't usually blister, just look like discolored skin that doesn't hurt.
I'm not a Dr and it's hard to diagnose on a post, I'm just speaking from personal experience.
Do you know what your frend's wicks were make out of? If it stuck to you there's something synthetic in there and those wicks shouldn't be used.
Sounds like a good second degree burn. Keep the blister on it as long as you can, that keeps it clean.
Third degree burns are generally pretty big surrounded by second degree and first degree on the outer edge. Third degree burns don't usually blister, just look like discolored skin that doesn't hurt. I'm not a Dr and it's hard to diagnose on a post, I'm just speaking from personal experience.
Do you know what your frend's wicks were make out of? If it stuck to you there's something synthetic in there and those wicks shouldn't be used.
Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Malcolm will eventually be posting an article I wrote on first aid for burns.
A 2nd degree burn is where the skin is intact, but blistered. You should immediately run the area under cold water for a minimum of 5 minutes once you've removed the heat source. Don't apply anything to it and avoid popping the blisters.
If you absolutely HAVE to pop the blisters, then take a sewing needle and hold it in a candle for 10 seconds, wait another 10 for it to cool, and then poke a small hole at the edge of the blister to drain the fluid. Then use a pair of nail scissors to trim the dead skin around the edge of the blister. That should be covered with bacitracin (which I recommend over neomycin/polymixin, which is "Neosporin").
A third-degree burn is charred and the skin is broken. That needs immediate medical attention as it can be colonized by the bacterium Pseudomonas aeruginosa, which is not sensitive to any topical antibiotic and, for that matter, is hard to treat with any antibiotics, period. Infection with Pseudomonas can be fatal because it can spread in the blood. I have seen people get infected with it. It is not pretty. Fortunately, I haven't seen anyone die of it.
As far as fuel goes, I use Coleman Camp fuel. Works fine because it has such a low evaporation point. Just make sure to shave any areas of dense body hair before rubbing it with burning fuel.
Malcolm will eventually be posting an article I wrote on first aid for burns.
A 2nd degree burn is where the skin is intact, but blistered. You should immediately run the area under cold water for a minimum of 5 minutes once you've removed the heat source. Don't apply anything to it and avoid popping the blisters.
If you absolutely HAVE to pop the blisters, then take a sewing needle and hold it in a candle for 10 seconds, wait another 10 for it to cool, and then poke a small hole at the edge of the blister to drain the fluid. Then use a pair of nail scissors to trim the dead skin around the edge of the blister. That should be covered with bacitracin (which I recommend over neomycin/polymixin, which is "Neosporin").
A third-degree burn is charred and the skin is broken. That needs immediate medical attention as it can be colonized by the bacterium Pseudomonas aeruginosa, which is not sensitive to any topical antibiotic and, for that matter, is hard to treat with any antibiotics, period. Infection with Pseudomonas can be fatal because it can spread in the blood. I have seen people get infected with it. It is not pretty. Fortunately, I haven't seen anyone die of it.
As far as fuel goes, I use Coleman Camp fuel. Works fine because it has such a low evaporation point. Just make sure to shave any areas of dense body hair before rubbing it with burning fuel.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,110 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Thanks Lightning, good post.
Bit late now though. Last night the blister got popped accidentally. Been putting Bactine on it and covering it with a bandage since. Looks like its beginning to heal so I think all is well.
I had a can of coleman fuel in my car, too bad I didnt use that. Im not sure exactly what happened. The wicks were made of gauze and white school glue on coat hangers. I put it on my skin and smeared it fast but where I first touched my skin on my wrist was black stuff that burned me. Not sure if it was the glue or what but I thought glue was supposed to harden in fire. The wick was like sizzling when I looked close at it. I dunno how she managed to eat fire with them.
Thanks Lightning, good post.
Bit late now though. Last night the blister got popped accidentally. Been putting Bactine on it and covering it with a bandage since. Looks like its beginning to heal so I think all is well.
I had a can of coleman fuel in my car, too bad I didnt use that. Im not sure exactly what happened. The wicks were made of gauze and white school glue on coat hangers. I put it on my skin and smeared it fast but where I first touched my skin on my wrist was black stuff that burned me. Not sure if it was the glue or what but I thought glue was supposed to harden in fire. The wick was like sizzling when I looked close at it. I dunno how she managed to eat fire with them.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
When it comes to torches, I recommend professionally made torches as opposed to home-made. This is because professionally made torches are likely to be safer. HOP makes good ones, as does Bearclaw. Bearclaw's are especially nice because they have the swinging ball on the butt-end. HOP's are nice because they are very lightweight, but they don't have the swinging ball.
I did try to make home-made torches once by wrapping kevlar rope around the end of a shish-kebab skewer after I had bent the tip over to try to grip the rope. The tip wound up sticking out of the wick, making them unusable for eating or contact.
When it comes to torches, I recommend professionally made torches as opposed to home-made. This is because professionally made torches are likely to be safer. HOP makes good ones, as does Bearclaw. Bearclaw's are especially nice because they have the swinging ball on the butt-end. HOP's are nice because they are very lightweight, but they don't have the swinging ball.
I did try to make home-made torches once by wrapping kevlar rope around the end of a shish-kebab skewer after I had bent the tip over to try to grip the rope. The tip wound up sticking out of the wick, making them unusable for eating or contact.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
SILVER Member
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Posted:
Not neccessairally, depends on how It happoned. My third degree burn or deep full thickness burn as they liked to call it. No charring and no broken skin. The fire never toutched it though, it was a convected heat burn, still had hair even. The reason I'm pointing this out is to encourage someone who has a burn and is desciding weather or not to go to the dr. "no charring?hmmmmm no dr"
I had no signs of infection, ever, but when I asked them to culture it, I had 3+ Pesudomonas. It lived through silvadine and monster doses of antibiotics. Which killed every other normal flora in my system but not the Pseudomonas.
If you don't want to go to a dr, just wait about 2 weeks like I did, then the pain will dictate what you do
Great Idea, I am not of the sasquatch/wookie variety, but enough burning hair can melt to your skin I suppose
Quote:
A third-degree burn is charred and the skin is broken.
Not neccessairally, depends on how It happoned. My third degree burn or deep full thickness burn as they liked to call it. No charring and no broken skin. The fire never toutched it though, it was a convected heat burn, still had hair even. The reason I'm pointing this out is to encourage someone who has a burn and is desciding weather or not to go to the dr. "no charring?hmmmmm no dr"
Quote:
That needs immediate medical attention as it can be colonized by the bacterium Pseudomonas aeruginosa, which is not sensitive to any topical antibiotic and, for that matter, is hard to treat with any antibiotics, period.
I had no signs of infection, ever, but when I asked them to culture it, I had 3+ Pesudomonas. It lived through silvadine and monster doses of antibiotics. Which killed every other normal flora in my system but not the Pseudomonas.
If you don't want to go to a dr, just wait about 2 weeks like I did, then the pain will dictate what you do
Quote:
Just make sure to shave any areas of dense body hair before rubbing it with burning fuel.
Great Idea, I am not of the sasquatch/wookie variety, but enough burning hair can melt to your skin I suppose
Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada
GOLD Member
.
420 posts
Location: United Kingdom
.
420 posts
Location: United Kingdom
Posted:
back on to the origional question (i think)
yeah lamp oil was why you didn't get any traces...
colemans is good for traces etc... (or shellite for aussies, or lighter fluid if yo ucan't get either of these)
nice one
dave
back on to the origional question (i think)
yeah lamp oil was why you didn't get any traces...
colemans is good for traces etc... (or shellite for aussies, or lighter fluid if yo ucan't get either of these)
nice one
dave
SILVER Member
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Posted:
I was talking with a lady I met at work who was doing some street perfoming. (I work at a renaissance festival, she was on a 2 week contract for fire performing and acrobatics).
She was using a high proof alcohol for all of her traces and eating, if that helps any I just got in 2 bottles of 95% Alcohol I was going to use for experimenting with different chemicals for colored burns (Not going to use the colored fire for traces, I'm not dumb :P)
I was talking with a lady I met at work who was doing some street perfoming. (I work at a renaissance festival, she was on a 2 week contract for fire performing and acrobatics).
She was using a high proof alcohol for all of her traces and eating, if that helps any
I just got in 2 bottles of 95% Alcohol I was going to use for experimenting with different chemicals for colored burns (Not going to use the colored fire for traces, I'm not dumb :P) Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> STAY SAFE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug.gif" alt="" />
BRONZE Member
Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
3,989 posts
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
3,989 posts
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posted:
Charles the Energizer Safety Bunny bounces into the thread...
"And don't forget that fuels suitable for tracing require A LOT more care in handling than standard kero/3440 special/lamp oil.
They have a lower flashpoint, meaning they are more likely to ignite from a flame with the flame being in direct contact with the fuel. This means someone wandering past with a cigarette or even a strong static spark (from some wearing nylon trousers for example) can set it on fire. "
Bounces out of the thread again...
Charles the Energizer Safety Bunny bounces into the thread...
"And don't forget that fuels suitable for tracing require A LOT more care in handling than standard kero/3440 special/lamp oil.
They have a lower flashpoint, meaning they are more likely to ignite from a flame with the flame being in direct contact with the fuel. This means someone wandering past with a cigarette or even a strong static spark (from some wearing nylon trousers for example) can set it on fire. "
Bounces out of the thread again...
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SILVER Member
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Scientist!
578 posts
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Posted:
Ok, after another week at my ren fest, I talked with another performer (goes by the stage name Truly Odd, if you care) about his body traces (he didn't even know that's what they were called, he just screwed around with fuel and found out it didn't burn him, so he put it in his act).
He used colemans for his traces, and kero for his fire breathing.
Ok, after another week at my ren fest, I talked with another performer (goes by the stage name Truly Odd, if you care) about his body traces (he didn't even know that's what they were called, he just screwed around with fuel and found out it didn't burn him, so he put it in his act).
He used colemans for his traces, and kero for his fire breathing.
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> STAY SAFE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug.gif" alt="" />
PLATINUM Member
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
Posted:
Yes, colemans for traces is no problem, but alcohol is really not a good idea... experiment; take a cup of colemans and take a cup of high grade alcohol... light both cups... What do you see?
If it's during the day, you will see a flame from the colemans, and nothing from alcohol... When it's dark you will see that the alcohol Is burning, but with a barely visible blue flame... And the point with blue flames is (nice btw, but small and hard to see), that it burns HOT, what I remember from chemistry; 1500 degrees celcius, instead of 800 degrees celcius (almost twice as hot).
Conclusion, use alcohol for usefull things (Drinking
or colored flames), but tracing isn't worth the trouble
Yes, colemans for traces is no problem, but alcohol is really not a good idea... experiment; take a cup of colemans and take a cup of high grade alcohol... light both cups... What do you see?
If it's during the day, you will see a flame from the colemans, and nothing from alcohol... When it's dark you will see that the alcohol Is burning, but with a barely visible blue flame... And the point with blue flames is (nice btw, but small and hard to see), that it burns HOT, what I remember from chemistry; 1500 degrees celcius, instead of 800 degrees celcius (almost twice as hot).
Conclusion, use alcohol for usefull things (Drinking
or colored flames), but tracing isn't worth the trouble || "Is True Mastery of the Elements But a Dream?" ||
PLATINUM Member
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
Posted:
ps, for very good information and very much information on fuels, fire-eating, tracing etc, see the site from Mephisto:
https://www.fyretr.com/
Lots of tekst, yes, lots of warnings, but definately worth to read it all if you really want to understand what you are doing!
ps, for very good information and very much information on fuels, fire-eating, tracing etc, see the site from Mephisto:
https://www.fyretr.com/
Lots of tekst, yes, lots of warnings, but definately worth to read it all if you really want to understand what you are doing!
|| "Is True Mastery of the Elements But a Dream?" ||
PLATINUM Member
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
addict
513 posts
Location: Netherlands - Breda
Posted:
Damn, a pps....
Especially my fire eating torches I want to make myself; I want to be able to exactly determine the dimensions of the wick [how large is my mouth, how deep can I put it in, etc...]
I don't know what gauze is, but white school glue rocks; cheap and it works, surely doens't melt... I use aluminium rods, and I attach normal cotton to it [The number of t-shirts I have is shrinking :-)] with white school glue -> No metal exposed (always watch out for metal...) and safe, they never let me down... [if you want to make it with kevlar, be carefull that you don't have the kevlar that is reinforced with metal threads...]
Allright, I Think that was all, hope it was usefull...
Damn, a pps....
Especially my fire eating torches I want to make myself; I want to be able to exactly determine the dimensions of the wick [how large is my mouth, how deep can I put it in, etc...]
I don't know what gauze is, but white school glue rocks; cheap and it works, surely doens't melt... I use aluminium rods, and I attach normal cotton to it [The number of t-shirts I have is shrinking :-)] with white school glue -> No metal exposed (always watch out for metal...) and safe, they never let me down... [if you want to make it with kevlar, be carefull that you don't have the kevlar that is reinforced with metal threads...]
Allright, I Think that was all
, hope it was usefull... || "Is True Mastery of the Elements But a Dream?" ||
BRONZE Member
Member
4 posts
Location: United Kingdom
Member
4 posts
Location: United Kingdom
Posted:
where abouts in Mephisto's website www.fyretr.com is info on fire tracing? I been skim reading and cant find where!
where abouts in Mephisto's website www.fyretr.com is info on fire tracing? I been skim reading and cant find where!
PLATINUM Member
Woodford is Goodford..!
241 posts
Location: Sydney at heart., Australia
Woodford is Goodford..!
241 posts
Location: Sydney at heart., Australia
Posted:
guys any suggestions on cool exciting and interesting stuff we can do with tracing? atm im combining it with palmfires, eating, fire magic (as in transfers, flash paper) dancing around sexily not actually doing anything etc.. but it gets a bit boring after say... 15 seconds. ok like 2 minutes.
ps. am yet to master mouth transfers
ideas?
guys any suggestions on cool exciting and interesting stuff we can do with tracing? atm im combining it with palmfires, eating, fire magic (as in transfers, flash paper) dancing around sexily not actually doing anything etc.. but it gets a bit boring after say... 15 seconds. ok like 2 minutes.
ps. am yet to master mouth transfers
ideas?
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