Forums > Videos > "Poi Documentary" Straight Talk

Posted: 4th May 2008
I'd say Nick or Yuta would be the wrong path to take, theres probably enough material out there, especially on Nick, he's a reasonably productive man.

Rob for his versatility or Drew would be good choices...

Ronin theres basically nothing about, except for brief forays into the internet poi culture we've seen of him scattered about. So that'd probably be a valuable decision also.

I've deliberately avoided the whole "Who is the most important poi spinner" question and attempted to give some sort of valuable feedback anyway.

By the way, Carry me caravan take me away!

Posted: 5th May 2008
Hi son,

thank you very much for your response.

I really start to think about whether the question about the "most important poi spinner" is adequate to what I actually want from you - a little of information like the one m_n_s just gave me. Thus I better change the question for I know that some people will eventually feel offended by it and once more I apologize for any inconvenience - never meant to annoy anyone on this board.

Have a nice day!
Max

Posted: 5th May 2008
Hey max;



well, first of all, thank you for thinking of me , but i won't comment on my own suitability cause that would be silly.



what i will do is give you lots of my own opinions and publicly, cause it'll make people think about who and what... there're also some 'who made you first pick up poi' threads that you'd probably find interesting....



so:



what are you trying to acheive? to make poi more well known? to make people understand where it comes from? to big up the beest/mostinfluential spinners? to archive what has been happening in poi?



for me, the last one is the biggie. every other 'alternative sport' has its documentary makers. you can easily find tv/feature length early skate documentaries, and parkour has it, and snowboarding, and.... where are ours? its not like poi is not popular enough



so, if



relaying what has been happening in the past ten years in poi, who has been involved and where is it going



is your focus, then these are some of the folks i would track down and talk to, in no particular order; (i'm just putting a tiny bit of info next to each, but i could talk about them all for hours ) (people, please don't be offended if you're not here.....)



Malcolm;

who created world wide poi . well, not created, but certainly facilitated a HUGE crosspollination of it, through this site. without whom, i would be a muso



Nick;

yes there are lots of other bits of stuff about him, but thats no reason to not include the most famous poi spinner there is. and thats before all the teaching and inspiration...



Thai Tom;

seriously old skool, and still doing incredible things. he pushed fire spinning to unbeleivable lengths in austria, germany and thailand; where many of todays best spinners learned their trade



wibbling matt;

host of spherculism, and the first person to REALLY do something interesting with his poi, not just spin them...



a.n.other maori

for getting us all started



a.n. other glowstringer

i wish i could name names... but i don't know the scene well enough. but there's a whole bunch of them out there that are supergood and superinfluential who don't mix with us



Yuta

again, one of the most famous spinners, and a permanent inspiration to all who meet him and watch the vids..



ronan;

for a long, long time has been everybodies favourite spinner who has no internet presence. absolutely at the cutting edge of poi, and starting to gain the reputation he deserves on a wider basis.



and any of



old skool

PK(PIP, videos), Drew(guru), anya(early COL, incredible shows, Feuerkunst), Dunc (PLAY founder), Dom (seriously inspiring back in the day, still amazing, AND hop admin), Danae (the first eurogirl ) Arashi (i could have put him in any of the lists for a myriad of reasons, including the list above....), Sage (COL, Art of Poi, still going...), mikhal (for the book, and the courses in london), Vincent bruel (aMAZING multitalented performer, still the owner of the 'robs favourite ever poi act' award, but sadly dead, so an interview could be tricky), Guy/Axis, who was doing hardcore glowshows before i even thought about poi, Jo derry (for obvious reasons ), NYC (one of the first yanks to get over to the euroscene, inspirer of many, teacher to millions), and a whole load of oldskoolers who made videos - shibaki, Le skunk, etcetc edit coleman and dragon, and dev kev...



mid skool

Andy house (COL inspiration, philosopher, fabulous teacher), Olivier alphalight (for travelling and spreading poi like there was no tomorrow), FNF + Oli (videos that regularly feature on everyones top 5, and making orbitals a way of life), Olive (though i think he may be futureskool), Icon (possibly nu-skool, but i haven't seen much recently ), rev (similar - incredible spinning, not heard much, even on spherc), lozjam (contact poi, techygirly, eurotraveller)



nu/future skool

noelski, rovo, zan and alienjon (strange americans doing strange stuff... and running spinagogue, and making dvds, and travelling the world for their art...), cyrille , G (just incredible), thomas (like the yanks, but swedish), Durbs (i'd love to praise durbs, but my built in toast heckling precludes it), Yoshiki and vicered and a whole other bunch of parisians , Mark Douglass (the best juggler to EVER take up poi and for some reason the only aussie on my list )



i know i have missed out loads of people, and that my list is euro-centric..... but i'm only working from my own brain, and am therefore limited but i'll try to update as and when...



and then there are the proper old skool places that nurtured poi - for me its edinburgh and the beltane fire festival which has been running since 1989 (and from which came tepooka) and had fire spinning even back then... i could put you in touch with some originals from that. I'm sure there are other groups/places that have the same effect for others.



does that help, or make it harder?



smiles

Rob
EDITED_BY: bluecat (1210063558)

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

Posted: 5th May 2008
Oh sure...change the question after I've spent the whole day trying to come up with an answer.

Originally I was going to post that i couldn't come up with an answer seeing as how most of my poi education came from the internet and I collected my "moves' from whatever sources appealed to me.

I hold a special regard for Coleman and his role as the Rosetta Stone of poi threads. Without his input, I never would have figured out half of those conversations.

Posted: 5th May 2008
@bluecat: Rob, thank you very much for this giant post that holds so much worthy information in it! I have a couple of questions regarding some of the names you mentioned and I would very much like to get in touch with you - expect an email coming this week



some basic stuff about my documentary: Rob just cut one of the most basic questions for every filmmaker: what are you trying to achieve? what is your goal? well let's just say it isn't to hype people who are already well known in the community. still those people are a very important part of the whole "poi puzzle" so I can't ignore them either.

If I was to decide for any of Rob's propositions I would pick the last one. But still this is only a part of the big picture so what I'd like you to do is to trust me for I'll tell you a lot more about the whole idea as soon as I got some specific and very important concerncs handled I need to take care of first.



@stout: sorry for confusing you but considering what you would have answered I don't really regret my decision to have changed the question kidding hehe

Let me just say that I am very interested in people like you - people who learned a lot or maybe even their entire poi knowledge from the internet.



@all: please don't be intimidated to share your opinion. I appreciate every minute you invest in reading this thread so it would be kinda sad to not read anything from you, wouldn't it? I am sure that each and every person on this board has an interesting story to tell

Posted: 6th May 2008
Good answer Mr Cat sir!
Duvan - if you are making a documentary and want to get Malcolm's/HoP HQ input, let me know and we'll try and help. I wonder if it's because it's spring over your way but over the last week or so I'd have to say I've fielded a number of different enquiries about interviewing "us" for various media spots about poi. There's a couple of wee projects in the wings... but a real documentary would be a great thing to have out there.

So, PM or e-mail me if you have some specific ideas or want to see if you can tap into the other people's efforts rather than having to come all the way down here to little ol NZ....

Written by: Doc Lightning talking about Marmite in Kichi's Intro thread

I have several large jars of the stuff. I actually like it... a little. And don't tell anyone I admitted to it.

Posted: 6th May 2008
@georgemc: Glad to hear that HOP finally get's the attention it deserves! I am currently analyzing the expenses for my project and I've been thinking about travelling to NZ (maybe at the time of your 10 years anniversary) but this still takes some time for I have to figure out how many sponsors I can get for the project.
I'll contact you within the next few weeks

Posted: 8th May 2008
so, as noone else seems like they want to respond

there was a set that i forgot about, and a few other folks

groups that have been doing shows and inspiring people that way, groups that set up juggling/spinning meets:

again i only really know a few
Flame Oz
te POOKa
Tryptych (the first performing spinners i ever met, 13 years ago toby gomme, sarah harman, daniel crute - you should ALL check them out cause they are still performing and being amazing), though as separate people now...)
Just Jugglers
Holly Wademan from Flame Fire shows in NZ
and loads of more recent groups - tirasaru, fenfire, Swissfire, BCC, Vulcan, etcetcetc

and some individuals i missed (and i am sure there will be a million more)
Coleman (how could i forget! ohmygod! if you don't include him i will complain)
Tony Touch (never met him, but the number of uberspinners who say 'tony touch taught me everything' is phenominal)
Brett (at the forefront of nu-wave aussies )
selena (oldskool londonite)
karine (snap - inspiration to millions)
Rob Bloor (firenix)

blahblhabaabjhlabhlblhbalbhlhabl (someone else put in some opinions please?)

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

Posted: 8th May 2008
Just poi? Not staff?
eg FlameOz are not really a 'poi' act.. staff and other gear eg clubs/ropes are also strong in there. They should be included anyway for how they've pushed the choreo synchro theatrical approach forward.

and will someone tell me... is Thai Tom the same person as Fire Tom?

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....

Posted: 8th May 2008
@bluecat: thank you man you really contribute a lot to this thread!! email coming tomorrow
maybe your huge post intimidated the rest of the HOPer

@newgabe: just poi. as I just said in another forum I've been thinking about doing a documentary about poi, staff & clubs but I came to the conclusion that I could not do justice to all of these toys. So if I succeed with this poiQmentary I may think about doing a documentary about staff in 2 or 3 years.

to all: so far I've gathered a lot of information on "popular" or however you wanna call 'em poi spinners. If you are not interested in giving names, as I just said - no problem.

Maybe you wanna share an idea or two about what you'd like to see in the documentary anyway?

Just give me one or two lines about any idea you have. So many people in this forum, guys, as I said before, I am sure u got some stuff to tell!!

Want to point out as well that this documentary won't be about "populars" only but will also feature a few poi-noobs that just got started!

things are getting really interesting right now, every day that passes brings me closer to a final version of the script and I started researching on how I can get money for the project

Max

Posted: 8th May 2008
i included FO for exactly that reason - they haven't got a huge amount of poi in their shows, but they have been pushing fire performance massively.

and no, TT and FT are different. Thai tom was at Ubereurope and you for sure spoke to him there....

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

Posted: 8th May 2008
Hi duvan

I'd thought about answering with some kind of list but when it comes right down to it I find it difficult to "rank" people in order of importance. I picked up tricks from wherever i could, be it from a "big name" spinner or someone you've never really heard of.

I started spinning in 2003, back when bandwidth and hosting videos was an "issue" so the quantity of material out there was fairly limited compared to today's scene. Heck, just for fun, I took all the promo video clips Sage made for HoP, spliced them together, and added my own soundtrack.

Also there were big namers who I got absolutely nothing from.

Posted: 8th May 2008
Erm, assuming the question is now:

"Who have been the most inspiring and impressive poi spinners for you personally in the last few years? "



I'm going to shy away from naming people and broaden it into sweeping, probably innaccurate stereotypes



London, specifically Spitalfields crowd:

Hardcore, techy, feet-stuck-to-the-floor poi spinning. Gave me massive inspiration everytime I went up there, and IMO were at the forefront of tech poi for many years.



France (Various groups):

Inspired me in the ways they move. Perfectly demonstrate the "Movement over tricks" mentality of poi. It seems even a "I can do a weave and a buzzsaw" french spinner can be a joy to watch, even to the most grizzled, cynical spinner



Australians (Several groups):

Shining examples of the poi community as a whole. Every meet I went to was full of kind, friendly, welcoming people. From demi-gods to uber-newbies, their openess is a perfect example of inspiring people to take up poi in the first place.



The above isn't all strictly true of course - you get Londoners who move well, French people who are friendly and very tech' Aussies.



/Edit: This isn't meant to discredit any Americans, Germans, New Zealanders etc etc - I've just had very little actual contact with these scenes so they've never really "inspired" me

Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude

Posted: 8th May 2008
@stout: yeah I must say that it might be a little hard to do some sort of ranking on these sort of things. Personally I wouldn't be able to rank anybody either. Just gimme a few names, that'll be enough Yet that Sage thing u just told made me laugh for she was also the first spinner to w00t me - and these are those little stories I really do like.

@durbs: thanks, quite interesting to read your post. I am definitely thinking about pointing out some differences between the several spinning styles in different countries so I was also glad to have found Rob's thread about that topic (although he saying I look like a robot when doing poi made me cry all night long )

and don't worry - if I ever do a staff documentary it will feature Rob Heart only so u don't have to worry about threads like this one anymore

Posted: 8th May 2008

 Written by :bluecat



and no, TT and FT are different. Thai tom was at Ubereurope and you for sure spoke to him there....

Far out, and here I have been visualising ThaiTom every time I read a FireTom post on HoP! *revises brain waves*



Ah well, my 2p worth then on the poinspiration

Kevdev was an original inspiration to me when I very first started doing poi and met him years ago in Oz. He was so good, and yet was so generous and friendly and encouraging to little old sloppy newb me. That attitude I love: Durbs named it as a characteristic of the Aussie scene but for me it was first modelled by an uberBrit. I actually hadn't met many local spinners then, apart from me own family...



Then it has to be Nick Woolsey. I remember just gawping at Dervishly Yers when I saw it...again and again... and then to find that a little email would actually bring him to my own backyard.. good lord, how generous are these amazing people!!!! Yuta and Ronan and others now of course are wonderful, so inspiring... but Nick.. aaaaaaah.



And yes, Matt Terry. Right up and out there on the techlove vibration.

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....

Posted: 8th May 2008
Names ?? OK.

First, there was Nick's Dervishly Yers...
Then there was Cassandra's Spinning in Paris videos ( sure, there was lots of others in those videos, and I swiped some of their stuff, but I was and always will be a serious Cassandra fan )
The guys from Oklahoma played a major influential role but for the life of me, I can't remember any names...oh wait, Jedi White ?
Kael was my main influence when I adopted a glowstringer style ( wraps, gilligans )
THE BEST IRL poi teacher I ever ran into has to be Andy House. Not only would he answer questions, but he'd provide several alternative views on a particular move or technique. Plus, his Koh Tao video was simply stunning.
One Wheel Dave...for actually making tutorials and writing posts that were understandable

That's about all I can recall now, I wasn't picky about who i ripped off as i wasn't trying to emulate anyone so there's lots of "unknowns" out there who've had their patterns "borrowed" and adapted by me

Posted: 10th May 2008
I don't mean to offend but for some reason I feel like saying 'do a woman'. I hear of less inspirational women twirlers then men, and I find them much more inspiring, generally. Jebus... talk about pigeon holing... sorry... think its probably because I relate more to their movement. Personal thing.

or maybe...
why do people idolize certain people... what sort of people become 'poi hero's'. Is it because they are athletic... determined... double jointed?

the different sub groups... I like that one... ozzie and french (pistache! ) and british and NZ... or glowstringers or tech/dance/acro...

Maybe, if you want to do an individual, choose someone who has touched many of these groups to show the scope of poi?

Don't know.... freewheeling thoughts today.

Good luck!

There is a world made of air, one of earth and one of water.
And there is one made of fire, and all of them fight for supremacy. They are fighting now, in my head.

Posted: 11th May 2008
Hi looper,

well your post contains elements that I've actually planned to embed in the film. there will be at least two women "featured" in the film.

The idolize question is a good one for I have to confess that I idolized some spinners as well back then. I think that this question will eventually get it into it as well in one form or another.

And finally the glowstringers. I am currently talking to the only girl I could find in Germany doing glowstringing and we'll see what we can make outta it for she didn't do spinning for quite some time now but maybe she can help me find other guys in Europe who really are into that stuff.

Have a nice day
Max

Posted: 12th May 2008
My 2 cents worth - my inspirations:
Its and obvious one, but Sage inspired me in Mexico 2000, without me knowing who she was. She showed me what was possible.
Rob Bluey showed me what wasnt possible (I think I stopped training Poi when i started seeing his impossibilities!!)
Malcolm and HOP vids showed me how to do it.
SpinCycle/FlameOz showed me how to show it.
Te Pooka showed me how to be it.
Something that hasnt been spoken about - InFire Festivals
I think they were the 1st to bring some or most of all those mentioned (in Europe at least) together and their philosophy of collaberation, inspired a real sense of Poi community in Austria (Festivals - FireDance, Hoche a Fuere), more generally in Europe (FireKunst, PLAY) and more MORE generally the world (Woodford, EJC etc..)
and I cant leave this post without mentioning Gabe. I think her influence and HOP hostel has brought many Poi travellers together.
Other names I feel I must mention are Drew, DevKev, Oli, Olive, the Jeromes, Arashi, Nick, Matt, Ronan, all of whom ive been lucky enough to meet and be blown away by.
One other thing - BurningMan - ive never been (oh the constant shame!!) but surely there must be people from there that have inspired and furthered the evolution of Poi in the US and around the world?
Oh and.....Awesome Project - Respect Duvan - hope it comes to fruition

Feel the Flame
Phirenix

Posted: 12th May 2008
thank you nix, I hope as well that it comes to fruition rather than to frustration

thank you all guys
after having been a real nerd for about two weeks now I decided to take a week off and to finish the script on my vacation (and more important in the sun ayee )

I won't need any more input on particular spinners but if you have another idea go ahead an share it.

consider this poll to be over, I will need some time to think about a couple of things and I'll be back in a week; really need to get out now, weather is just fine and my head starts spinning around spinning even in my dreams now

Posted: 12th May 2008
well you could look at major evolutions spinning-wise

i remember someone on here describing a workshop drew gave years ago showing isolated buzzsaw's

you can talk about how these concepts can open up a world of ideas noone had thought of

first people playing with hyperloops? hybrids etc...

"the geeks have got you" - Gayle

Posted: 18th May 2008
Post deleted by duvan

Posted: 22nd May 2008
hi guys,

hate to push my thread sorry about that
if there are still some British beginners out there - let me know
(geez somewhat tells me there simply are no beginners in the uk
anymore - they all mutate into "pro's" instantly )

contact me by the 30th of May no more entries possible after that
have to set a schedule for shooting that's why I came up with this deadline

have a nice weekend!
max

Posted: 23rd May 2008
Hi Duvan,

There are always beginners around, but you'll probably struggle to find them on here particularly.

The only thing I could really suggest for finding beginners is to trawl through some threads in the events and meet others sections and pm some new people, and to also register on the meet others forum. The problem is, is that new people often visit this site once, register, then disappear, so really, meets are the best way to find them I guess.

As for inspiration, most people have been covered, but I would mirror, please include as many girls as possible, pref aiming for a 50/50 split, its the only way that girls can be promoted, rather than reinforcing existing steriotypes.

Its amazing how much new spinners have raised the game. I remember when the hardest/most technical moves were just within my reach, but now, I'm miles away from all that, especially after taking time out of poi to work on other things. Its great if not slightly intimidating!

From my own interests, I would like to know if there is still a definate old skool/new skool style divide, or whether the lines have blurred. I would also be intrested to know how many spinners out concentrate on the performance/dance/movement side of poi (which is what I concentrate more on nowadays), rather the technical side of poi, which features heavily with all the amazing tricks around, and whether those interests are gender-orientated.

Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.

“What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.”

Ralph Waldo Emerson

Posted: 10th Jun 2008
I'll start shooting in a couple of days - if you still got any great ideas let me know - - - - - - - any of you guys in Paris in September?

thx to prickly once more for that nice post!

Posted: 11th Jun 2008
What about a visit to Play? there are loads of spinners there and you could get footage of increased gatherings and organisation etc. would be an example of an event that came to be mostly from the occurance of 1 community.

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.

Posted: 11th Jun 2008
Hey Mynci,



I would absolutely love to visit Play festival but there are several issues holding me back. On the one hand I'd need a place to stay/sleep for I won't be able to travel with a tent - my camera equipment is really, really heavy (tripod itself weighs 8kg ).

On the other hand I'd need a room to lock my equipment and do the daily maintenance and material inspecting stuff (plus I'd get problems with insurance if I couldn't lock that stuff away)..

I'm currently talking to Rob about these issues for he offered me to come to PLAY to do some filming for the film + filming the shows and stuff.



But it really depends on whether these things can be assured or not. I hope they do, I really really do and I deliberately did not plan anything else on these days in July so that I'd be able to attend it

Posted: 12th Jun 2008
duvan::

wow...you started a work, i could not do in this moment..

how to select people..???where to start??- who was, is important..??

i wish you good luck for your work!!

and i love all comments that came..in all this post.

all this .names -that give me inner pictures, inspirations that came and still come!!..things i remember, people i came in touch with..vid-s i saw, festivals,conventions i went to...

and what i was missing...as well..

great thread and great idea...fascinating!!

what a wonderful spirit is "poi"



if you meet thai tom tomorrow..
give him a big hug from me!!

love
josh

Posted: 12th Jun 2008
josh, thank you for your kind and encouraging words

good news: Rob told me they'd be able to provide me with a place for my equipment. Now all I need is a place to sleep - I guess I'll check the PLAY thread for that

Posted: 24th Jun 2008
perhaps you could rent a campervan for those few days? GIves you a bed AND a lock up. Have fun!

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....