Forums > Social Discussion > my problem with Burningman....
Login/Join to ParticipateBRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
Don't get me wrong, I think the idea of an event that caters to fire performance is great. Let me get that out of the way right now. The problem I have with Burningman is the people who constantly ask me if I'm going. My response was initially "no, but I'd like to." This was before the four hundredth person in the course of a month. Now, I respond with,"no, because everyone else does it for me." The last thing I think I would like to do is go to a gathering of drugged-out ravers and stoned hippies, all of whom are vying for a Darwin award by playing with fire in their respective states. When other fire performers in portland ask me if I'm going, and I say no, they ask why not. They act like burningman is the only reason to get into what we do. Does anyone else feel this way?
Don't get me wrong, I think the idea of an event that caters to fire performance is great. Let me get that out of the way right now. The problem I have with Burningman is the people who constantly ask me if I'm going. My response was initially "no, but I'd like to." This was before the four hundredth person in the course of a month. Now, I respond with,"no, because everyone else does it for me." The last thing I think I would like to do is go to a gathering of drugged-out ravers and stoned hippies, all of whom are vying for a Darwin award by playing with fire in their respective states. When other fire performers in portland ask me if I'm going, and I say no, they ask why not. They act like burningman is the only reason to get into what we do. Does anyone else feel this way?
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
-Why-
126 posts
Location: uk, Newcastle / Chester
126 posts
Location: uk, Newcastle / Chester
Posted:
I think i have quite the oposite feeling, from the perspective of someone who hasn't been , i would love to go, and witness burningman.
I think it would be a truely mind altering experience.
I think i have quite the oposite feeling, from the perspective of someone who hasn't been , i would love to go, and witness burningman.
I think it would be a truely mind altering experience.
If money is the root of all evil, then why do people sell Bibles?
GOLD Member
ARRRR!
529 posts
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA
ARRRR!
529 posts
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA
Posted:
I would live there year round if I could.
True, BM has the largest gathering of fire performers in the U.S. but that is only a very small reason people go. It's about the art, the diverse community, free self expression and giving back to others to name a few.
I can't say I remember seeing one fire spinner intoxicated to the point of being unsafe and I must have seen a couple thousand. There may be a few drugged out ravers and stoned hippies and if that's not your thing then just ignore it.
BM is not the end all be all of fire performing but it is another great place to go for an incredible spin jam. I hope you make it out there one year and join us, BM needs more HoPers.
I would live there year round if I could.
True, BM has the largest gathering of fire performers in the U.S. but that is only a very small reason people go. It's about the art, the diverse community, free self expression and giving back to others to name a few.
I can't say I remember seeing one fire spinner intoxicated to the point of being unsafe and I must have seen a couple thousand. There may be a few drugged out ravers and stoned hippies and if that's not your thing then just ignore it.
BM is not the end all be all of fire performing but it is another great place to go for an incredible spin jam. I hope you make it out there one year and join us, BM needs more HoPers.
"My skin is singed but it heals my heart and with glowing pride I'll wear my scars." -Davey Havok
Internet Hate Machine
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
Posted:
So basically, you don't like any festival at all?
There's always gonna be some. Fact of life really.
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
The last thing I think I would like to do is go to a gathering of drugged-out ravers and stoned hippies
So basically, you don't like any festival at all?
There's always gonna be some. Fact of life really.
The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Suggestion:
Go to Black Rock City.
THEN I'll be happy to take you seriously when you describe the event.
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
\The last thing I think I would like to do is go to a gathering of drugged-out ravers and stoned hippies, all of whom are vying for a Darwin award by playing with fire in their respective states.
Suggestion:
Go to Black Rock City.
THEN I'll be happy to take you seriously when you describe the event.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Did you really just start at thread about "your problem with Burningman" and yet you've never been?
Wow.
Even I wouldn't be that bold.
Did you really just start at thread about "your problem with Burningman" and yet you've never been?
Wow.
Even I wouldn't be that bold.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
burning man - it doesn't suck as much as glastonbury does
cole. x
burning man - it doesn't suck as much as glastonbury does
cole. x
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
GOLD Member
king of the hedgehogs
125 posts
Location: Madtown, USA
king of the hedgehogs
125 posts
Location: Madtown, USA
Posted:
I haven't been to BM since 1999, and I fear that it may have been the last time for me. I didn't like how it was morphing as it grew, and I really don't groove on politics or cliquishness. Having said that, it is still a pretty amazing festival - there is no other really quite like it. It's worth going, if you've never been, but, IMHO, not the be-all-end-all of everything.
I suppose I may go again, now that they've restricted entry for "just for the burn" - we'll see.
BTW - If you think it's tough to be a spinner in Portland who doesn't go to BM, it pales in comparison to San Francisco in August - the phrase "See you on the playa!" was beginning to chafe a tad.
I haven't been to BM since 1999, and I fear that it may have been the last time for me. I didn't like how it was morphing as it grew, and I really don't groove on politics or cliquishness. Having said that, it is still a pretty amazing festival - there is no other really quite like it. It's worth going, if you've never been, but, IMHO, not the be-all-end-all of everything.
I suppose I may go again, now that they've restricted entry for "just for the burn" - we'll see.
BTW - If you think it's tough to be a spinner in Portland who doesn't go to BM, it pales in comparison to San Francisco in August - the phrase "See you on the playa!" was beginning to chafe a tad.
Yellow and blue make green.
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,617 posts
Location: Berlin, Ireland
Posted:
I wonder what we'll be saying about burning man in 10 years...
I wonder what we'll be saying about burning man in 10 years...
I live in a world of infinite possibilities.
BRONZE Member
Super Gidg!!!!
8,506 posts
Location: Portland Oregon USA
Super Gidg!!!!
8,506 posts
Location: Portland Oregon USA
Posted:
Fred, I have the same question asked of me every year. Can you see this red-haired, pale-skin, 3rd degree burn from the Oregon summer sun, actually make it out to the Playa? I have to be careful enough here at home ...
... High summer ... high desert ... the math just doesn't work.
All let other people go to MB and tell me all about it. What would be nice is a weekend thing close to home.
Fred, I have the same question asked of me every year. Can you see this red-haired, pale-skin, 3rd degree burn from the Oregon summer sun, actually make it out to the Playa? I have to be careful enough here at home ...
... High summer ... high desert ... the math just doesn't work.All let other people go to MB and tell me all about it. What would be nice is a weekend thing close to home.
Growing old is mandatory; growing up is NOT.
Proud member of the HoP DPS.
Sanity is a highly overrated state of mind.
I'm normal ... it's everyone else that's crazy.
Gidg
BRONZE Member
old hand
1,031 posts
Location: Bath, England
old hand
1,031 posts
Location: Bath, England
Posted:
Ok I wouild love to visit burning man an dI think in your heart you would too.
At any performance at festivals etc there are going to be a lot of people who have taken various illicit substances or are completely drunk or both.
I know when I can or cant play with fire, in a festival situation one of the main considerations is who is around and @fuc**d@ who might cause a problem, and also how much you have drunk etc.
This is something that you will only be able to judge after having been in that situation a few times.
If you have the chance to go to burning man then I would leap on it!! I am in the uk so it is a lot bigger consideration for me (esp monetary wise) but if I ha dthe chance I would go and experience it, you could go along and just observe if you are not happy with doing fire there, this is an art and many people will practice it in different ways, I think you could probably learn a lot if you went, even if you didnt do any fire yourself.
Take care, happy spinning,
Mark P
Ok I wouild love to visit burning man an dI think in your heart you would too.
At any performance at festivals etc there are going to be a lot of people who have taken various illicit substances or are completely drunk or both.
I know when I can or cant play with fire, in a festival situation one of the main considerations is who is around and @fuc**d@ who might cause a problem, and also how much you have drunk etc.
This is something that you will only be able to judge after having been in that situation a few times.
If you have the chance to go to burning man then I would leap on it!! I am in the uk so it is a lot bigger consideration for me (esp monetary wise) but if I ha dthe chance I would go and experience it, you could go along and just observe if you are not happy with doing fire there, this is an art and many people will practice it in different ways, I think you could probably learn a lot if you went, even if you didnt do any fire yourself.
Take care, happy spinning,
Mark P
GOLD Member
enthusiast, but not enthusiastic
367 posts
Location: Los Angeles, California, USA
enthusiast, but not enthusiastic
367 posts
Location: Los Angeles, California, USA
Posted:
I've been three times ('98, '99, and '02), but not as a fire performer. Wish like hell I had started spinning years ago when I first went and was mesmerized.....but I just assumed I wasn't cool enough.....or something like that......
But anyway, I have a few points to make:
1) if you're interested, GO. The sheer size and scope of the festival is amazing, and if you go early enough to see the metamorphosis of the empty playa into a city, it's a mind and heart-boggling experience. Ignore the so-called politics and cliqueishness. Unless you want to be an organzier, who cares about that crap??? I've never been made to feel like an outsider (except once with a person I went with, go figure), despite the fact that I am a lawyer, look sort of conservative - compared to the shall-we-say typical attendee, etc. And I've heard that lawyers and engineers are the most common professions at BM, so guess what you artsy-fartsy types, if we ever get organized, you folks are TOAST! (just kidding, I actually think there's a lot of cross-over; I am always thrilled to find out that people I have preconceived notions about - which I try to do as little as possible - are actually cool)
2) Gidg, I am as fair as fair gets and have never been badly sunburned at BM. Take care of yourself, etc. Skin issues are not a reason not to go if you really want to.
3) OT - I've been seriously considering moving to Portland, noticed someone mentioned that here. I'm in LA currently and my sister lives in Portland. I gather there's a good fire community up there, yes?? How is it re cliqueishness, etc.?
I've been three times ('98, '99, and '02), but not as a fire performer. Wish like hell I had started spinning years ago when I first went and was mesmerized.....but I just assumed I wasn't cool enough.....or something like that......
But anyway, I have a few points to make:
1) if you're interested, GO. The sheer size and scope of the festival is amazing, and if you go early enough to see the metamorphosis of the empty playa into a city, it's a mind and heart-boggling experience. Ignore the so-called politics and cliqueishness. Unless you want to be an organzier, who cares about that crap??? I've never been made to feel like an outsider (except once with a person I went with, go figure), despite the fact that I am a lawyer, look sort of conservative - compared to the shall-we-say typical attendee, etc. And I've heard that lawyers and engineers are the most common professions at BM, so guess what you artsy-fartsy types, if we ever get organized, you folks are TOAST! (just kidding, I actually think there's a lot of cross-over; I am always thrilled to find out that people I have preconceived notions about - which I try to do as little as possible - are actually cool)
2) Gidg, I am as fair as fair gets and have never been badly sunburned at BM. Take care of yourself, etc. Skin issues are not a reason not to go if you really want to.
3) OT - I've been seriously considering moving to Portland, noticed someone mentioned that here. I'm in LA currently and my sister lives in Portland. I gather there's a good fire community up there, yes?? How is it re cliqueishness, etc.?
You can't fall off the floor, but sometimes you need a chair to reach the cookie jar.
BRONZE Member
Super Gidg!!!!
8,506 posts
Location: Portland Oregon USA
Super Gidg!!!!
8,506 posts
Location: Portland Oregon USA
Posted:
Munkpunks - Unfortunetly for me it isn't just because of the sunburn that I could possibly avoid if I worked really hard at it. My problem would be during those times of tremendious heat. If I'm out in it during triple digits or if it's in the high 90's for several days in a row, I will get physically sick. No matter how much water I drink my stomach rebels, I get head aches and my muscles tense up.
Both Fred and I live in Portland. We have organized fire spins twice a month that are great. You don't find cliqueishness there, at least not that I've noticed. There are others the live and breath the fire community but I don't have all that much time to get into it. It doesn't help that most everything goes on late at night and I work 5 days a week starting at 7:00am. It doesn't allow a lot during the week and by the time the weekend rolls around I'm usually dog tired.
If you ever in this neck of the woods on the first or third wednesday, drop me a line and we can get you to a fire jam. After all it does go year around.
Munkpunks - Unfortunetly for me it isn't just because of the sunburn that I could possibly avoid if I worked really hard at it. My problem would be during those times of tremendious heat. If I'm out in it during triple digits or if it's in the high 90's for several days in a row, I will get physically sick. No matter how much water I drink my stomach rebels, I get head aches and my muscles tense up.
Both Fred and I live in Portland. We have organized fire spins twice a month that are great. You don't find cliqueishness there, at least not that I've noticed. There are others the live and breath the fire community but I don't have all that much time to get into it. It doesn't help that most everything goes on late at night and I work 5 days a week starting at 7:00am. It doesn't allow a lot during the week and by the time the weekend rolls around I'm usually dog tired.
If you ever in this neck of the woods on the first or third wednesday, drop me a line and we can get you to a fire jam. After all it does go year around.
Growing old is mandatory; growing up is NOT.
Proud member of the HoP DPS.
Sanity is a highly overrated state of mind.
I'm normal ... it's everyone else that's crazy.
Gidg
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Gidg,
The sun and heat really are NOT a problem... At least in my experience. First of all, theres so many places to hide from the sun that its pretty easy to get away from it if you want. I was in that desert for 10 days this year and barely got tanned. Second, while the temp does get to tripple digits, you cant really tell because the air is so dry. You arent all sweaty because it just evaporates immediately. Then theres the various ways to cool down if you are feeling a bit hot. There are camps with misters, there are trucks riding by spraying water out the back, there are people walking around spraying anyone who wants it, etc... To be honest, I was surprised at how little trouble I had adjusting to the heat. I was expecting much worse. The dust, however, is a different story Gotta love waking up every morning and cleaning your nose of mud.
Gidg,
The sun and heat really are NOT a problem... At least in my experience. First of all, theres so many places to hide from the sun that its pretty easy to get away from it if you want. I was in that desert for 10 days this year and barely got tanned. Second, while the temp does get to tripple digits, you cant really tell because the air is so dry. You arent all sweaty because it just evaporates immediately. Then theres the various ways to cool down if you are feeling a bit hot. There are camps with misters, there are trucks riding by spraying water out the back, there are people walking around spraying anyone who wants it, etc... To be honest, I was surprised at how little trouble I had adjusting to the heat. I was expecting much worse. The dust, however, is a different story
Gotta love waking up every morning and cleaning your nose of mud. Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
GOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand
Posted:
Frederick the Reckless
Burningman is a very special event, i've been 3 times, everyone should go once in their lifetime. Not for the firespinning, that really is a tiny part of it. There's lot of 'firenazis' at burningman, and to be honest i never saw any really amazing spinners their. I mean i'm sure there are but most i saw weren't great.
The art is among the best in the world, you are fortunate to live in the states for 1 reason only, it doesn't cost you a grand to get to the playa.
Next year you should go. Then in 2007 you may have a good reason not ot go, but as it stands, you don't have a leg to stand on i'm afraid.
There are many good things and many bad things about burningman, but whatever happens it's certainly a very rewarding experience.
Personally i can't see myself getting out there again. I don't really wanna have my identity stolen by the bush administration, but i'll be out in new zealand this year and i'm hoping ot get to the regional burn.
Just go out to black rock city next year, damn, i know a hella cute girl from portland.....
Frederick the Reckless
Burningman is a very special event, i've been 3 times, everyone should go once in their lifetime. Not for the firespinning, that really is a tiny part of it. There's lot of 'firenazis' at burningman, and to be honest i never saw any really amazing spinners their. I mean i'm sure there are but most i saw weren't great.
The art is among the best in the world, you are fortunate to live in the states for 1 reason only, it doesn't cost you a grand to get to the playa.
Next year you should go. Then in 2007 you may have a good reason not ot go, but as it stands, you don't have a leg to stand on i'm afraid.
There are many good things and many bad things about burningman, but whatever happens it's certainly a very rewarding experience.
Personally i can't see myself getting out there again. I don't really wanna have my identity stolen by the bush administration, but i'll be out in new zealand this year and i'm hoping ot get to the regional burn.
Just go out to black rock city next year, damn, i know a hella cute girl from portland.....
Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.
member
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posted:
I have to say I really don't dig Burning Man much. It started as a good idea, but I feel it has become a decadent event for letting you freak out. I am a RIANBOW GATHERING kid. Maybe cuz I was born the year Rainbow started. Maybe cuz it is free. Maybe cuz there is a pourpose beyond the parties there. Rainbow has plenty of fire performances. There they are more about the spirit of fire and the spirituality of fire dancing. Sure you get the drugged out Hippies and Raves there, but not as badly. Rainbow is over 30 running. You should check it out if you haven't. Next years is in Colarado and promises to be a great one. It was thed fastest council in memory. No other venue was porposed. That is the other thing I like about Rainbow It is completely anarchistic. No person in charge every decision is consinsous. I think Burning Man is just too comercial and too played out. But that is my opinion.
I have to say I really don't dig Burning Man much. It started as a good idea, but I feel it has become a decadent event for letting you freak out. I am a RIANBOW GATHERING kid. Maybe cuz I was born the year Rainbow started. Maybe cuz it is free. Maybe cuz there is a pourpose beyond the parties there. Rainbow has plenty of fire performances. There they are more about the spirit of fire and the spirituality of fire dancing. Sure you get the drugged out Hippies and Raves there, but not as badly. Rainbow is over 30 running. You should check it out if you haven't. Next years is in Colarado and promises to be a great one. It was thed fastest council in memory. No other venue was porposed. That is the other thing I like about Rainbow It is completely anarchistic. No person in charge every decision is consinsous. I think Burning Man is just too comercial and too played out. But that is my opinion.
I thought I waz just dreammin'?!!??!!??!! Dis place can't really be real.
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
well, your responses are more thought out than i'd have expected... no offense intended. merely making it clear tha i have read each of the replies to this thread. there's a tribe site i posted this same thing on, and it turned trashy with a quickness. the thing is that when you get asked on a bi monthly basis by at least five people in the same evening, you get tired of hearing about it. no, in my heart i once wanted to go, but no longer. after having an idea shoved down your throat (metaphorically speaking), you have two reactions available: you either accept it and cave in, or you reject utterly and completely. i went for the latter of the two choices. the fact that the same people that ask me are people i know can't keep from mixing drugs and fire doesn't help reinforce the idea that maybe i might wish to go someday.
on commercialism of the concept: i agree with Murfdasmurf. it started as this little idea, and while a good idea, it snowballed. in no time flat, the idea became an institution. and now it's the biggest fire gathering in the world, and this is a two-edged sword. you get the ones that describe it as a quaint little get together, which it no longer is...(40,000 people is not quaint.) and you get the ones that act like if you don't go, you're nothing. which is also untrue, but try telling them that. then you get the ones who tell it like it is, which makes up the majority of the responses in this thread so far... the ones that say, "it's okay, fun, etc. but it's not the end all be all." the people in the tribe.net thread would do well to know you all. they may slip up and learn something from you that improves their character.
well, your responses are more thought out than i'd have expected... no offense intended. merely making it clear tha i have read each of the replies to this thread. there's a tribe site i posted this same thing on, and it turned trashy with a quickness. the thing is that when you get asked on a bi monthly basis by at least five people in the same evening, you get tired of hearing about it. no, in my heart i once wanted to go, but no longer. after having an idea shoved down your throat (metaphorically speaking), you have two reactions available: you either accept it and cave in, or you reject utterly and completely. i went for the latter of the two choices. the fact that the same people that ask me are people i know can't keep from mixing drugs and fire doesn't help reinforce the idea that maybe i might wish to go someday.
on commercialism of the concept: i agree with Murfdasmurf. it started as this little idea, and while a good idea, it snowballed. in no time flat, the idea became an institution. and now it's the biggest fire gathering in the world, and this is a two-edged sword. you get the ones that describe it as a quaint little get together, which it no longer is...(40,000 people is not quaint.) and you get the ones that act like if you don't go, you're nothing. which is also untrue, but try telling them that. then you get the ones who tell it like it is, which makes up the majority of the responses in this thread so far... the ones that say, "it's okay, fun, etc. but it's not the end all be all." the people in the tribe.net thread would do well to know you all. they may slip up and learn something from you that improves their character.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
oh, wait... that's 3 edges, isn't it....?
oh, wait... that's 3 edges, isn't it....?
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Spiritual fire... I get it now... Youre one of those. Now THATS your problem with burning man...
Spiritual fire... I get it now... Youre one of those. Now THATS your problem with burning man...
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
SILVER Member
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Posted:
Well fred we tribers are here too.
Maybee I took offence too quickly when you categorized everyone. here is my responce on tribe to the exact same post for everyone here to see.
I apologise for being harsh, but I don't like stereotypes.
Have you found the answer to your question here?
HOP is a world forum and tribe is mostly west coast USA. Different arena.
Burningman is a large part of my life. I meet my girlfrend there, the next year I proposed to her at burningman as the man went up, and this year we were married there. I don't do drugs, and most of the people I know don't spin fire with anything onboard.
As tired as you are about people asking if your going, I'm tired of people who have never been to burningman attacking it. And I'll defend it.
Well fred we tribers are here too.
Maybee I took offence too quickly when you categorized everyone. here is my responce on tribe to the exact same post for everyone here to see.
Written by:
Fred said
"The last thing I think I would like to do is go to a gathering of drugged-out ravers and stoned hippies, all of whom are vying for a Darwin award by playing with fire in their respective states"
Comeon what the heck kind of responce to this do you expect?
Fact is that burningman is the largest gathering of fire performers in the world. This is coincidental to the fact that Burningman is a unique city of 40,000 people. Like in a real city you get the good with the bad.
now if you want to adopt a media driven perspective of the drugged out raver steriotype and apply it to a majority of your peers, that's your perogative. Why don't you actually "try" going once first before you make a final opinion.
I apologise for being harsh, but I don't like stereotypes.
Have you found the answer to your question here?
HOP is a world forum and tribe is mostly west coast USA. Different arena.
Burningman is a large part of my life. I meet my girlfrend there, the next year I proposed to her at burningman as the man went up, and this year we were married there. I don't do drugs, and most of the people I know don't spin fire with anything onboard.
As tired as you are about people asking if your going, I'm tired of people who have never been to burningman attacking it. And I'll defend it.
Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada
member
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posted:
ICon yeah you know I am one of those and you must be one of the others. Spiritual sure fire is the seperation of man from all other animals. We are the only one that uses and manipulates fire. So yes is has a spirituality. Also according to the definintion of life fire is alive. So you can take it a step further if you want.
Back to Burning Man though I feel in any festaval or major event you get what you give. By that I mean if you have a sour attitude you will have a sour time. Now if your happy go lucky your probably gonna have a great time. So put out what you want back. Of course this isn't 100% you can be happy and have bad stuff happen.
EDITED_BY: MurfdaSmurf (1127173263)
ICon yeah you know I am one of those and you must be one of the others. Spiritual sure fire is the seperation of man from all other animals. We are the only one that uses and manipulates fire. So yes is has a spirituality. Also according to the definintion of life fire is alive. So you can take it a step further if you want.
Back to Burning Man though I feel in any festaval or major event you get what you give. By that I mean if you have a sour attitude you will have a sour time. Now if your happy go lucky your probably gonna have a great time. So put out what you want back. Of course this isn't 100% you can be happy and have bad stuff happen.
EDITED_BY: MurfdaSmurf (1127173263)
I thought I waz just dreammin'?!!??!!??!! Dis place can't really be real.
member
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
59 posts
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posted:
I think I could say it isn't the idea I don't like about BM but the people. I have meet tons of Burners and most of the ones I meet are annoying. I lived in Arizonia at a community and had lots of Burner going though on their way to BM or then back again to go to Toast in Flagstaff. The majority of them were heavy alcholic. They thought they knew it all. Had abrasive personalities. Oh and of course insist that you have to go to BM. Now if like Rainbow Gatherings it was free, I might go check it out. But hell if I am paying that ticket price to find out if I like something. I can just go to Rainbow in Colorado next year for free. I will find lots of cool fire performers and people who are cool but have nothing to do with the fire community. Cuz there is more to life than just fire. Sorry to have to say it. I will go to the Oregon country fair and the Tenasket barter fair. But unless you folks want to pay for me to go to BM then I wont see ya there.
I think I could say it isn't the idea I don't like about BM but the people. I have meet tons of Burners and most of the ones I meet are annoying. I lived in Arizonia at a community and had lots of Burner going though on their way to BM or then back again to go to Toast in Flagstaff. The majority of them were heavy alcholic. They thought they knew it all. Had abrasive personalities. Oh and of course insist that you have to go to BM. Now if like Rainbow Gatherings it was free, I might go check it out. But hell if I am paying that ticket price to find out if I like something. I can just go to Rainbow in Colorado next year for free. I will find lots of cool fire performers and people who are cool but have nothing to do with the fire community. Cuz there is more to life than just fire. Sorry to have to say it. I will go to the Oregon country fair and the Tenasket barter fair. But unless you folks want to pay for me to go to BM then I wont see ya there.
I thought I waz just dreammin'?!!??!!??!! Dis place can't really be real.
SILVER Member
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
That guy from Reno
556 posts
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Posted:
So Fred, I have an idea. Your the group leader right? Teach your troup that there is more to poi/fire performance than burningman, I have, and I run the darn Fire conclave camp. I know how caught up people can get about burningman and fire performance. Chances are that's the first place they saw it and don't know any better.
Burningman is a big powerful life impacting thing. The people who are asking you have been positively effected and want to share I would assume.
Maybee get out of portland and meet some other groups, see what's different.
There is alot more to poi/fire performance than burningman.
Sphereculist, what's a firenazi?
So Fred, I have an idea. Your the group leader right? Teach your troup that there is more to poi/fire performance than burningman, I have, and I run the darn Fire conclave camp. I know how caught up people can get about burningman and fire performance. Chances are that's the first place they saw it and don't know any better.
Burningman is a big powerful life impacting thing. The people who are asking you have been positively effected and want to share I would assume.
Maybee get out of portland and meet some other groups, see what's different.
There is alot more to poi/fire performance than burningman.
Sphereculist, what's a firenazi?
Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
waitaminnit... now where did i say anything about it being a spiritual thing...? i have a lot of fun performing with fire, yes... but it's not like i established a church devoted to it.
Written by: ICoN
Spiritual fire... I get it now... Youre one of those. Now THATS your problem with burning man...
waitaminnit... now where did i say anything about it being a spiritual thing...? i have a lot of fun performing with fire, yes... but it's not like i established a church devoted to it.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
to summarize since i responded to cody's post in tribe also, my troupe is mixed on the idea of going. some want to, some don't care, and some are like me: they're tired of hearing it. it's not all there is, and i know too many people here in portland who think it is.
to summarize since i responded to cody's post in tribe also, my troupe is mixed on the idea of going. some want to, some don't care, and some are like me: they're tired of hearing it. it's not all there is, and i know too many people here in portland who think it is.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
If they want to attack it, fine.
I'm tired of people who have never been there telling me what it's like there.
I've burned for four of the last six years. *I* don't pretend to know what Burning Man is. Anyone who does clearly has no idea what it is.
Written by: Cody
As tired as you are about people asking if your going, I'm tired of people who have never been to burningman attacking it. And I'll defend it.
If they want to attack it, fine.
I'm tired of people who have never been there telling me what it's like there.
I've burned for four of the last six years. *I* don't pretend to know what Burning Man is. Anyone who does clearly has no idea what it is.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
SILVER Member
old hand
768 posts
Location: San Francisco, California, USA
old hand
768 posts
Location: San Francisco, California, USA
Posted:
ummm...i wouldn't exactly call twenty years "no time flat."
The event under discussion is very important to me -- it completely changed my life in a way that the Rainbow gatherings did not. I've been to three of the latter, but not in a long time, the last one I went to was 1990
I think that something about the epic scale of BM and the extremes of environment (both natural and social) make room for transformative experiences in a way that other festivals don't. I mean, when you get down to it, at most other festivals you're well aware you're camping in the woods or a meadow somewhere. Black Rock City feels like you're on another planet interfacing with an alien culture and alien lifeforms. And that's when you're sober.
On the other hand, I don't get offended by critiques of Burning Man by people who've gone. People who have never been and critique it...you have to remember that bottom line is they have no idea what they're talking about, so to those opinions all you can really say is "whatever." And sometimes, "that's too bad."
I'm not one of those burners that thinks everyone should go. I mean let's be real: it really is not an event for everyone (even if they do play with fire), and if a person's attitude is so negative and their prejudgments are as entrenched as the anti-BM sentiment in this thread seems to be, it's probably better for everyone if they don't go. Openness and a willingness to surrender are key to having a rewarding experience. Anyone who displays the opposite of these qualities aren't people to whom I'd ever say "oh you should go to Burning Man." Not only would they not have a good experience, but there's a big potential that they'll negatively impact the experience of those around them.
On the other hand, for anyone who's even a little bit curious, it's so worth it to put your fears aside and just go. Fear is what held me back from going for a long time, and I think it's what keeps a lot of people (who are not annoyed by everyone telling them to go) from going. And once you put the fear away and decide to go, that's the first step of the transformation and the hardest one to make.
This year I felt like those people in Close Encounters of the Third Kind who got visited by the aliens and then got all obsessed with the shape that turned out to be Devil's Tower, only the shape we were all obsessed with was the man. The man calls us home...
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
in no time flat, the idea became an institution.
ummm...i wouldn't exactly call twenty years "no time flat."
The event under discussion is very important to me -- it completely changed my life in a way that the Rainbow gatherings did not. I've been to three of the latter, but not in a long time, the last one I went to was 1990
I think that something about the epic scale of BM and the extremes of environment (both natural and social) make room for transformative experiences in a way that other festivals don't. I mean, when you get down to it, at most other festivals you're well aware you're camping in the woods or a meadow somewhere. Black Rock City feels like you're on another planet interfacing with an alien culture and alien lifeforms. And that's when you're sober.On the other hand, I don't get offended by critiques of Burning Man by people who've gone. People who have never been and critique it...you have to remember that bottom line is they have no idea what they're talking about, so to those opinions all you can really say is "whatever." And sometimes, "that's too bad."
I'm not one of those burners that thinks everyone should go. I mean let's be real: it really is not an event for everyone (even if they do play with fire), and if a person's attitude is so negative and their prejudgments are as entrenched as the anti-BM sentiment in this thread seems to be, it's probably better for everyone if they don't go. Openness and a willingness to surrender are key to having a rewarding experience. Anyone who displays the opposite of these qualities aren't people to whom I'd ever say "oh you should go to Burning Man." Not only would they not have a good experience, but there's a big potential that they'll negatively impact the experience of those around them.
On the other hand, for anyone who's even a little bit curious, it's so worth it to put your fears aside and just go. Fear is what held me back from going for a long time, and I think it's what keeps a lot of people (who are not annoyed by everyone telling them to go
) from going. And once you put the fear away and decide to go, that's the first step of the transformation and the hardest one to make.This year I felt like those people in Close Encounters of the Third Kind who got visited by the aliens and then got all obsessed with the shape that turned out to be Devil's Tower, only the shape we were all obsessed with was the man. The man calls us home...
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
I agree with Blueboy. BM is not for everyone.
First and foremost: do you have to be clean, well-rested, and dust-free every day? Then BM isn't for you. It's probably among one of the harshest natural environments in which you can attempt to camp. Only arctic climates present a bigger challenge.
I agree with Blueboy. BM is not for everyone.
First and foremost: do you have to be clean, well-rested, and dust-free every day? Then BM isn't for you. It's probably among one of the harshest natural environments in which you can attempt to camp. Only arctic climates present a bigger challenge.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
funny thing, people... I have yet to attack Burningman as an event. it's the PEOPLE. scroll up. reread. figure it out. IT'S THE PEOPLE. IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T STOP ASKING ME TO GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ACT LIKE YOU'RE NOT A FIRE PERFORMER IF YOU DON'T GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ARE CONSTANTLY SPINNING ON DRUGS, WHO I WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO GET AWAY FROM IF I WENT. i am well known in portland in the firejam circle. which means if i went, i would be spotted. once that happened, i would be inundated by the very people i don't want to be around when they're spinning. think on this: one of them is a total idiot who takes ecstasy , gets stoned, and uses a flamethrower. would you want this walking bomb following you around? i don't. he goes. there are more, but i digress, as you still think i am attacking the event itself.
funny thing, people... I have yet to attack Burningman as an event. it's the PEOPLE. scroll up. reread. figure it out. IT'S THE PEOPLE. IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T STOP ASKING ME TO GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ACT LIKE YOU'RE NOT A FIRE PERFORMER IF YOU DON'T GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ARE CONSTANTLY SPINNING ON DRUGS, WHO I WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO GET AWAY FROM IF I WENT. i am well known in portland in the firejam circle. which means if i went, i would be spotted. once that happened, i would be inundated by the very people i don't want to be around when they're spinning. think on this: one of them is a total idiot who takes ecstasy , gets stoned, and uses a flamethrower. would you want this walking bomb following you around? i don't. he goes. there are more, but i digress, as you still think i am attacking the event itself.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
SILVER Member
addict
449 posts
Location: Australia
addict
449 posts
Location: Australia
Posted:
The best solution for you is to cull down on the number of people you know. That way noone would invite you places. Everyone wins.
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
funny thing, people... I have yet to attack Burningman as an event. it's the PEOPLE. scroll up. reread. figure it out. IT'S THE PEOPLE. IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T STOP ASKING ME TO GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ACT LIKE YOU'RE NOT A FIRE PERFORMER IF YOU DON'T GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ARE CONSTANTLY SPINNING ON DRUGS, WHO I WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO GET AWAY FROM IF I WENT. i am well known in portland in the firejam circle. which means if i went, i would be spotted. once that happened, i would be inundated by the very people i don't want to be around when they're spinning. think on this: one of them is a total idiot who takes ecstasy , gets stoned, and uses a flamethrower. would you want this walking bomb following you around? i don't. he goes. there are more, but i digress, as you still think i am attacking the event itself.
The best solution for you is to cull down on the number of people you know. That way noone would invite you places. Everyone wins.
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Posted:
I've been aware throughout the thread that it's the people (who ask you to go), not the event, that you have an issue with.
Obviously some people have not gone to the trouble of reading your starter post and got the wrong idea as a result.
As a bit of constructive feedback I'd point out that the title you chose for the thread could have been beter phrased, as 'my problem with Burningman....' does give the impression that your issue is with the event, rather than the people.
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
funny thing, people... I have yet to attack Burningman as an event. it's the PEOPLE. scroll up. reread. figure it out. IT'S THE PEOPLE. IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T STOP ASKING ME TO GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ACT LIKE YOU'RE NOT A FIRE PERFORMER IF YOU DON'T GO. THE PEOPLE WHO ARE CONSTANTLY SPINNING ON DRUGS, WHO I WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO GET AWAY FROM IF I WENT.
I've been aware throughout the thread that it's the people (who ask you to go), not the event, that you have an issue with.
Obviously some people have not gone to the trouble of reading your starter post and got the wrong idea as a result.
As a bit of constructive feedback I'd point out that the title you chose for the thread could have been beter phrased, as 'my problem with Burningman....' does give the impression that your issue is with the event, rather than the people.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
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