Forums > Social Discussion > Anti War

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
lol...rofl....roflmmfao....*falls out of chair laughing*p.l.u.r.r.Xtrem

Peace Luv Uni-t Respect Responsa-what?!?! Xtrem

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
Raymund thats a hard way that you look at the world if you can say the Killing is an unfortunate part of life. If you look at it in a differnt light and someone told you that your Aunt's death in the WTC was an unfortunate part of life. I'm sure you would not see it the same way.As Dom said the bible can not be taken literally it has been rewritten many many times over the years in fact some of the bibles weren't written till 60 years after the death of Jesus (if you believe in Jesus)60 years is a long time for stories to change and mutate. However the common thread through all the bibles and gospels is a theme of peace and love for all!Btw Happy Easter every body.

Smile and the whole world smiles with you

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
Wow I made it go onto a new pagehow exciting

Smile and the whole world smiles with you

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
And the prize goes to Splerph for our 11th page!!!! R.

It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
Hey Raymond.I did kinda wonder when I first started reading this post whether you were for real, or just trying to provoke. Your pain seemed very real, however, and as you calmed down & talked more rationally, I began to believe that you were attempting to make some sense of the world, and were prepared to listen a little, as well as teach. Now I seem to be wondering again whether you are in fact sincere in what you are posting.I know and deal with quite a few people who play games with provocation. The wise ones know when to lay that role aside for a time.I also know and deal with quite a few people who believe that to be strong and passionate is to shout. These people often have no respect for others naturally quieter than themselves, believing that they either have nothing to say, or that they cannot be that passionate about their beliefs. They have respect only for those that they view as more forceful than themselves.At the same time we are talking in circles here, and each of us plays a role in doing it. Someone gets Raymond annoyed, he responds, they get annoyed, others try & calm it down. Then Raymond annoys someone, they respond, and others try & calm it down. Not much gets done. So lets move it to another stage. Each of you, what are you going to do, or are you currently doing, to address any of the issues you talked about in this thread? It can be tiny, like talking about it with your friends. Or it could be something big.I am at a cross-roads point in my life right now, anyhow. So when I think about this, I am also thinking about how I am going to go about re-shaping my life. One of the things I am looking into is voluntary work with organisations who support refuges. I am looking at other things as well.What about you? Will this discussion make you go out & do anything (no matter what)? Or are you already doing something about those things you feel passionate about?R.

It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

Posted: 2nd Apr 2002
She's already won the C@ntus Prize for most interesting name. How many more will she win i wonder......

Meh

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
why is her name interesting?------------------ ~*~ Katinca ~*~

Love and Light

~*~ Katinca ~*~

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
Woohoo two prizes. Now I'd like to thank.... just kidding.Thanks Cantus!

Smile and the whole world smiles with you

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
Ahhh Katinca & Splerph, now you are just filling space, so that you can win the prize for the 12th page!!! R.[This message has been edited by Rozi (edited 03 April 2002).]

It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
Nah, he's just clocking up to his 2000th post!

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
Actually I view my Aunts death as murder, but people dieing in car wrecks, OD's, cancer I few deaths to things like that as an unfortuante part of life. Like I said I was being blunt, but somehow I knew that someone was going to say somthing anyway.Now Rozi, I need to know what about me you are unsure of so that I might correct you or whatever. Do you doubt that I am a Marine, well do a check on me then. I am Lance Corpral Berry, Scott P. HQ Mag 11 Armory MCAS Miramar. I do not know where you would look but I wouldnt doubt if I and everyone I worked with was somewhere on the net.Are you doubting my aunts death? Then should I post her obituary and pictures of her kids and husband?You are correct however I anoy someone or someone pisses me off. Like I said before I enjoy my temper. I guess its the adreniline rush I get from it. You are also right in saying that Raymund Phule is a role. I am not as umm how to say... flared up in real life. It actualy takes a bit more than somebody to say something stupid to get me all rild up. Raymund Phule is a pig headed egotisticle loudmouth shnook, I on the other hand am actualy rather quiet, I would wrather listen to what my friends have to say than speek. Dont get me wrong though I love to hear my own voice. As you can tell from my long winded shpeals about myslef. [This message has been edited by Raymund Phule (edited 04 April 2002).]

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
naaahhh ray, your not as bad as you think you are...you just know how to get a rise out of peeps on this board, ithink its actually funny thatyo get a kick out of it too...lol...getting me all worked up is no chore, asyou probably can tell...its all good ol buddy, all in fun, peace!!p.l.u.r.r.Xtrem

Peace Luv Uni-t Respect Responsa-what?!?! Xtrem

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
That does clear up a few things for me. It helps me in knowing why you are doing this. For the record, I think I would get along well with you/Scott. I find you/Raymond very frustrating to deal with & that is because our aims at the moment are opposed.

You may have guessed that I am involved in politics in my real-ish life. Right now I am finding it frustrating because the sole focus is upon competing against one another, rather than working together for a solution. My focus tends to be finding a resolution. What I try & do here on this thread is explore why people think & feel the way they do, & see if their is common ground. (I know, fairly arrogant, so feel free to point out fallacies in my arguments etc). I find it difficult when people are generating conflict, for the sake of it. That's part of the reason why I am talking fairly softly here, and not shouting my head off.

Can you set up another alias, where you/Scott gets to talk sometimes? Only joking. But I would honestly like to know what you do in the rest of your life, about these things you obviously feel passionate about. (the reply can be as simple as "I joined the military" ) I would like to know that there are people active in the world, not just involved in circular arguments.

Hope that helps you a little with where I am coming from too.

R.

It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
yes lovely name indeed.. although it looks slightly familiar I can't put my finger on why...

I too thought Raymond was some sort of troll... however the arguments he may/may not have provoked are some of the most valid and rational I've seen on this subject anywhere on this web..

The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.- B.B.King

Posted: 3rd Apr 2002
Raymund Phule = Troller

Do you purposely go out of your way to express views so aggressively and rudely that you intimidate people? Are you purposely trying to piss people off, by tearing apart some of their views with non-referenced data? Do you get your kicks out of doing this? People like you are so bad in this society if this is the case. You have to understand that they have just as much right to their own opinion as you do sir. I think you should keep that in mind.

Anyway you annoy me too much, that I choose not to participate let alone read this Topic. Which is a little depressing because there are some good points that other people who aren’t so DOMINATING make, but they are over seen and hidden because of your aggressively and over bearing monstrous approach to arguments. I don’t know if you ever got taught that arguments can be a great source to collaborate peoples information and come up with a solution or to present clearer evidence in light of a particular point. There is no right or wrong. It is merle a discussion of facts to assess views, reasons, and points and the relevant data to which that particular party has used to get their opinion on that topic. You seem to think arguing is just pure intimidation and domination. If I yell at them enough, I will beat them into submission. I am surprised people as still taking your bait and yelling back at you. Well I for one choose not too. Maybe if we were discussing something else, but not here on this topic or other topics where you demonstrate these traits as I believe they hinder progress, and upset people more then they provide a positive input.

So thank you for Bullying people out of topics. Where would the world be without Bullies (note sarcastic tone please)

Cheers,
Kate

Love and Light

~*~ Katinca ~*~

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
katinca what's this about non-referenced data, are you trying to get people laughing or what. and why do you have to narrow down what an arguement or disscussion has to be. surely its what the people involved make it, not just some idealised concept some educated types have, oh i forgot where all here to solve the worlds problems, we're people and we have other needs lets not forget that.

Posted: 4th Apr 2002


to you Mr. itsgottab-y

Just trolling myself. Figured...when in Rome?



*long boring day at work, needed some action...*

Love and Light

~*~ Katinca ~*~

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
Ive been following this thread throughout and it seems to me that all the subjects that have come and up, and even they way they have been discussed sometimes, all have something in common - POWER STRUGGLES. - war, religion, rape, anger, retaliation......

However, once this has been identified this gives us a basis for reform, an insight into how to put an end to war, and end to pain.

Once we have overcome the need for power, once we forget the ego and approach all things in life with love - only then we can begin to change the world.

It is an individual responsibility, to change the world we must begin with ourselves.

This may seem a simplistic and impossible approach, as a single person it would be like spitting in the sea but more and more of us are beginning to realise the way through. We will grow and multiply in numbers, and the results will bring forth a new generation. A time of peace and love. (man!

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
yeah kacanita, you'll only talk with people on your terms, good for you. thats why you end up talking to yourself and never changing, well done goodie to shoes.

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
Raymund Phule is a toll of sorts, but there is ryme and reason to his existance. I have a frustrating job, point blank. Any job in the military can be frustrating. Hell my MOS sends more people to the brig for stupid mistakes than any other MOS in the USMC. There is alot of pressure and responsibility. I created the fasade of Raymund to allow a way to get rid of all my frustrations and anger. Sometimes all that crap overflows onto other people.

In keeping in the true form of Ray... I enjoy peoples responses more than my posts. I get a little kick of adreniline when sombody reall just bashes me and I get all riled up. It's fun, it really is. I dont not always provoke but I would say its a good 50/50 that I provoke or are provoked. (Ok that didnt make to much sence just suck it up.

XTREMRAVR, I am still rathe pissed at you and your comments. Thats all I need to say about that.

Rozi, you're funny you really are. I understand you alittle bit more as well. Isn't finding out whats on the publics mind a big part of polotics. I mean your just doing your job.

Kate, even Ray feels alittle bullied by your post but like you said when in Rome. Maybe your need to make Raylinda or something like that.

Danile, its ok to talk to yourself but when you start asking yourself "What?" that there is a problem.

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
Ray, with your argumentative nature you're a fine example of a point Rozi and FireFairy raise - most people see life as a series of power struggles, a battle to prove who's right. Only when we begin working together, and realise that often both sides are right in different ways, can we all work together for peace.

itsgottab, I fail to see your problem with Kate, unless you're being sarcastic. She made a valid and true point about people getting enjoyment from baiting each other and hence getting nowhere, then you pointlessly bait her. Hmmmm...

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
I dont need to prove whos right, I know I am!

I do not see life as a series of power struggles, life is what you make it not what someone else makes it. If you do not want to get into a power struggle, adapt and overcome, if you can do nothing but fight fire with fire... feel free.

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
OK..OK.. i justhad to post bc the # of posts on this topic is weell was "420" thought that was kinda cool...speaking of 420...hmmmmwell gotta run i just had an idea...lol...

Peace Luv Uni-t Respect Responsa-what?!?! Xtrem

Posted: 4th Apr 2002
Rozi, that was a great post of yours up above.

wanting to know what people are doing, besides spouting off their minds about this on message boards..

well, there are peace ralleys to go to..

here is something much better than smoking pot to be doing on 420 for you XTRMRAVR..

https://www.a20stopthewar.org/

and guess what, you can smoke pot there if you want to. now, you are from texas, so i guess washington is a ways away from you.. but i'm sure you can find something if you search a little.

as for me.. i learn all i can, talk to my friends..

i have also made a website dedicated to peace, and i meet with a group once a week to plan peaceful alternatives.

https://www27.brinkster.com/antiwar

you can read some of mine and my friends opinions there, contribute your own, find useful links, some good quotes, join a contact list of people.

Rozi, and Dom, and others i've forgotten your names, i'd love to have you as contributors to the site.

we are currently helping to organize a march in our town on april 20th.

cmon people everyone needs to do their part, and we can make the world see that this war on terrorism is just as silly as the war on drugs.

~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
I am sure that the family members of those who died in the WTC dont see this war as silly. I think it would be wise to show those families some respect. Or else...

"Squish like grape.", Mr. Miyagi

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
Er, Ray, haven't you heard all those who lost family members or partners who spoke out against the war in Afghanistan before and during the action? Because they'd lost somebody they knew what it felt like, and instead of spreading the pain they said 'Nobody should have to suffer like us.' Very brave people.

Anyway, yesterday was the 34th anniversary of the murder of Martin Luther King, one of the most celebrated men in US history and a peacenik.

Peace all.

[ 06 April 2002, 01:57: Message edited by: Dom ]

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
Dom you know what I ment, and I do understand that there are some that do not want others to feel as they do but you know what? I aint one of em. When will my blood lust end? I dunno, but as time goes on the wounds will heal.

Now I dont know if you were just stating facts about Dr. King or if you were hinting something so I will not jump to conclusions and just agree with you on that one.

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
I found something that rather pissed me off. I do not know what I will write but advert your eyes because you might not like it. I will keep the language down to abbreviations for the worst posible scenerios.

This information is comming from...
https://www.a20stopthewar.org/

These are some of the goals of this group,

Increased funding for non-military-based financial aid for education.

An end to racial profiling and military recruitment targeting youth of color and working class youth.

An end to the degrading and secret imprisonment of immigrants.

An increased funding for non-military based financial aid for education would more than likely mean that they would have to cut funding for people like myself who are DEPENDING on that military money so that we can afford to go to college. The government is the only group out there that gives military members money to go to college, while there are literaly thousands of scholerships that any joe with a C+ can get. So tell me do I no longer have the right to attend college because I am in the military? Or do I just not matter?

I have yet to see one comercial targeting any specific race or color or economical status. I have even worked with a recruiter for a while. He did not target anybody based on anything. Now I do not know about the other branches but in the Marines we dont want just anybody. We want the few the proud. Not any joe can do what we do.

An end to the degrading and secret imprisonment of immigrants.

I agree that nobody should be wrongfully imprisond but then again I do not see where they have proof of anyone imprisond, if you can enlighten me please do.

This group from what I can tell has goals to ruin my way of life. As if to say that I and my fellow military members should be treated like second rate trash. Get rid of our education and only allow the rich white guys in the military. Do alot of military members come from the mid to low class people group? Well yes they do but they arnt targeted. This group makes the military sound like an evil empire. Well I got news for you folks... IT AINT. It is a good life for those who can handle it. I admit that some cant but ya know some cant handle McDonalds!
They are a bunch of anti military hatemongers in my opinion.

[ 06 April 2002, 04:22: Message edited by: Raymund Phule ]

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
Ray, this is mean to say, but you seem to enjoy people treating you like shit so I'll say it anyway.

You need to grow up. Your responses are quite juvenile. You make false comments about hating war and being willing to open your arms to anyone on this board but at the same time you acknowledge your bloodlust and tell people that you hate them. You make comments that lead people to believe that you think you are better because you are in the military yet you also want people to pity you because you've had a rough life. Lots of people have rough lives, I'm sure many on this board (including myself) have had horrible things happen to us, we just don't use them as arguments in a discussion.

If the government gave college funding to, say, AmeriCorps members or other non-military service opportunities you wouldn't have to join the military to go through college. Yes, that's right: poor, skater-punks that have suffered from drug problems and other things would be able to go to college even if they didn't join the military. I got a 3.9 gpa in high school (ooh, look at me brag) and didn't receive scholarships for school from private sources, universities, or grants from the government. (That's me asking for your pity, if you didn't notice)

I would have been more than happy to enlist in AmeriCorps or something similar but I could not afford to take that much time off to do something I would have enjoyed greatly. Interesting, isn't it, how many of the same politicians demanding increased funding for the military resist funding AmeriCorps?

I'm somewhat embarassed that I wrote this, but figured Ray would get a kick out of it anyway.

-WrenAnd that, my friends, is condensed evil.

Posted: 5th Apr 2002
I still believe that war is terrible, but nessecary. What other options are there? You think terrorists are just going to say that theyre sorry for blowing up buildings? These people are beyond negotiations. Anyone who is against the war, what do you propose that we do? Maybe im missing something, but war is the only option. And i dont feel sorry for our country killing people. These people are people who want to kill us.Very few innocent people are killed.