Forums > Social Chat > Handling homophobia in society
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Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Posted:
This isn’t another thread about the rights and wrongs of homophobia. Somehow I don’t think the mods would be too happy with me for that.
This is a thread about how to face society’s perception with regards to homosexuals.
I guess I’m looking for people advise on how to handle things, and to hear the experiences of others.
Last night just won’t leave me alone.
Spitfire and I went to ikea, to get stuff for our room. We were having fun, wandering through and deciding everything we wanted in our house when we get our own place. It really brought home the fact that Kim and I will eventually have our own place to live together. That reminded me how happy I am, and how lucky I am, and we were both walking along with big smiles on our faces.
We weren’t obviously being a couple- we weren’t holding hands, didn’t have our arms round each other, or anything like that. We don’t particularly do that in public- not in Texas anyway!
So we were walking along, and had a group of black women and kids behind us. We barely noticed them until we heard the comment
“You come here, and you run into all the goddam lesbians!”
Kim stopped.
I stopped, turned around, and glared straight at the woman behind me who had made the comment.
She stuck her head down, and they walked off.
I have a very fiery temper. I can control it quite well, but it was hard not to say some derogatory comment to this woman, especially as the abuse was coming from someone in another minority group.
Now, it’s quite easy to recognize the fact that Kim and I are lesbians. We do look like the stereotypes, and both have short spiky hair. So we understand that this isn’t going to be a one off incident.
So does anyone have any advice on how to handle situations like this?
I don’t want to just pretend I haven’t heard them, as this kind of gives off the image that it’s ok to give homosexual people this kind of abuse. But on the other hand, I don’t want to get into a full blown argument (or worse) over it.
I’m just confused as to what to do.
This isn’t another thread about the rights and wrongs of homophobia. Somehow I don’t think the mods would be too happy with me for that.
This is a thread about how to face society’s perception with regards to homosexuals.
I guess I’m looking for people advise on how to handle things, and to hear the experiences of others.
Last night just won’t leave me alone.
Spitfire and I went to ikea, to get stuff for our room. We were having fun, wandering through and deciding everything we wanted in our house when we get our own place. It really brought home the fact that Kim and I will eventually have our own place to live together. That reminded me how happy I am, and how lucky I am, and we were both walking along with big smiles on our faces.
We weren’t obviously being a couple- we weren’t holding hands, didn’t have our arms round each other, or anything like that. We don’t particularly do that in public- not in Texas anyway!
So we were walking along, and had a group of black women and kids behind us. We barely noticed them until we heard the comment
“You come here, and you run into all the goddam lesbians!”
Kim stopped.
I stopped, turned around, and glared straight at the woman behind me who had made the comment.
She stuck her head down, and they walked off.
I have a very fiery temper. I can control it quite well, but it was hard not to say some derogatory comment to this woman, especially as the abuse was coming from someone in another minority group.
Now, it’s quite easy to recognize the fact that Kim and I are lesbians. We do look like the stereotypes, and both have short spiky hair. So we understand that this isn’t going to be a one off incident.
So does anyone have any advice on how to handle situations like this?
I don’t want to just pretend I haven’t heard them, as this kind of gives off the image that it’s ok to give homosexual people this kind of abuse. But on the other hand, I don’t want to get into a full blown argument (or worse) over it.
I’m just confused as to what to do.
Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
I think you handled it exactly right. A wordless glare was exactly the correct response. She was obviously ashamed of herself, if only for being loud enough for you to hear.
Now, someone else might have met your gaze with a defiant stare right back. Just smile sweetly and say "Why, yes, this is one of our places. What are YOU doing here?"
IKEA has had gay male couples in their ads, so you're on good ground there; but it can be used generally. After all, there are no places from which gay people are specifically banned, so all places are "our places." And if it makes homophobes feel uncomfortable, good. They deserve to.
In general, I think being polite is usually the best course. If you meet prejudice with courtesy, you can generally induce shame, which doesn't go away as fast as anger after an argument, or the sting of a tongue-lashing. Shame may actually turn into remorse (leading to a change in behavior); this is another advantage.
All this is when your actual physical safety is pretty assured, of course. Judge accordingly.
I think you handled it exactly right. A wordless glare was exactly the correct response. She was obviously ashamed of herself, if only for being loud enough for you to hear.
Now, someone else might have met your gaze with a defiant stare right back. Just smile sweetly and say "Why, yes, this is one of our places. What are YOU doing here?"
IKEA has had gay male couples in their ads, so you're on good ground there; but it can be used generally. After all, there are no places from which gay people are specifically banned, so all places are "our places." And if it makes homophobes feel uncomfortable, good. They deserve to.
In general, I think being polite is usually the best course. If you meet prejudice with courtesy, you can generally induce shame, which doesn't go away as fast as anger after an argument, or the sting of a tongue-lashing. Shame may actually turn into remorse (leading to a change in behavior); this is another advantage.
All this is when your actual physical safety is pretty assured, of course. Judge accordingly.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
Hmmm.....great advice, Xopher. I'm not sure what got me worse...the statement itself, or the fact that statement came from somone of color who, I'm sure, has had to endure racist jokes or comments.
The thought is still bouncing in my head: Civil Rights are for everyone, lady, don't feel so privileged.
I didn't say it...kind of wish I had...but...I think courtesy might be a better response, in the end.
Hmmm.....great advice, Xopher. I'm not sure what got me worse...the statement itself, or the fact that statement came from somone of color who, I'm sure, has had to endure racist jokes or comments.
The thought is still bouncing in my head: Civil Rights are for everyone, lady, don't feel so privileged.
I didn't say it...kind of wish I had...but...I think courtesy might be a better response, in the end.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
"Why yes, we have civil rights now. Isn't it wonderful?" With the same bright happy I'm-pretending-you-just-weren't-unspeakably-rude-to-me smile.
Perfectly polite. Drives the point home. Miss Manners has pointed out that sometimes courtesy can be used to make people feel rotten, but only when they deserve to.
Once the screen of courtesy is up, you can decide from behind it how vicious you feel!
"Why yes, we have civil rights now. Isn't it wonderful?" With the same bright happy I'm-pretending-you-just-weren't-unspeakably-rude-to-me smile.
Perfectly polite. Drives the point home. Miss Manners has pointed out that sometimes courtesy can be used to make people feel rotten, but only when they deserve to.
Once the screen of courtesy is up, you can decide from behind it how vicious you feel!
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
BRONZE Member
Satisfying HOPs Lust For Fire
308 posts
Location: Salem, Oregon, USA
Satisfying HOPs Lust For Fire
308 posts
Location: Salem, Oregon, USA
Posted:
It might not be the "right" way to deal with a situation like that, but if it had been me I would have very sarcasticly said, "Lesbians! Where?" & started wildly looking around. But then again, I'm one of those people that can't keep my mouth shut about things.
It might not be the "right" way to deal with a situation like that, but if it had been me I would have very sarcasticly said, "Lesbians! Where?" & started wildly looking around. But then again, I'm one of those people that can't keep my mouth shut about things.
Never settle for normal.
Average thinking brings average results.
SILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
4,172 posts
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
4,172 posts
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom
Posted:
Whilst on holiday I met this instructer called M. He was very obviously gay and I accepted him for that.
In the evenings there was a disco which everybody went too. As soon as any of the 'routine' dances were played he would jump up there and start dancing his ass off. I thought it was brilliant, and was up there as much as he was. Just to watch him dance was just amazing. I've never seen anybody put as much energy into the YMCA as he did!
Halfway through one song a small child came up in front of him whilst he was dancing and made sort of a gay gesture, very hard to describe. like he put his hands underneath his chin and cocked his leg (if you can understand that) taking the piss outta him. I would have given the kid a right mouthful, but he, he just beamed at him and started dancing with even more energy then before! Another example of how you can rise above these things.
You'll always gonna get these people, i would just ignore them, there beneath you to be honest.
Aimz xx
Whilst on holiday I met this instructer called M. He was very obviously gay and I accepted him for that.
In the evenings there was a disco which everybody went too. As soon as any of the 'routine' dances were played he would jump up there and start dancing his ass off. I thought it was brilliant, and was up there as much as he was. Just to watch him dance was just amazing. I've never seen anybody put as much energy into the YMCA as he did!
Halfway through one song a small child came up in front of him whilst he was dancing and made sort of a gay gesture, very hard to describe. like he put his hands underneath his chin and cocked his leg (if you can understand that) taking the piss outta him. I would have given the kid a right mouthful, but he, he just beamed at him and started dancing with even more energy then before! Another example of how you can rise above these things.
You'll always gonna get these people, i would just ignore them, there beneath you to be honest.
Aimz xx
SILVER Member
All the neurotic makings of America's lesser known sweetheart
9,831 posts
Location: body in Las Vegas, heart all around the world, USA
All the neurotic makings of America's lesser known sweetheart
9,831 posts
Location: body in Las Vegas, heart all around the world, USA
Posted:
that's golden. if i had thought it, i definately would have taken that approach myself.
Written by: SpitFire
The thought is still bouncing in my head: Civil Rights are for everyone, lady, don't feel so privileged.
that's golden. if i had thought it, i definately would have taken that approach myself.
I was always scared with my mother's obsession with the good scissors. It made me wonder if there were evil scissors lurking in the house somewhere.
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.
**giggles**
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
OK...so I cleaned it up a bit for HoP...the original phrase had a bit more choice language in it...though...simplicity in the statement as posted here seems to make it...stronger somehow.
Written by: pounceWritten by: SpitFire
The thought is still bouncing in my head: Civil Rights are for everyone, lady, don't feel so privileged.
that's golden. if i had thought it, i definately would have taken that approach myself.
OK...so I cleaned it up a bit for HoP...the original phrase had a bit more choice language in it...though...simplicity in the statement as posted here seems to make it...stronger somehow.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
SILVER Member
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Posted:
Being polite and courteous probably would be a wise approach, I agree.
A tough one to do though, give my temper.
If I turn round and abuse people back, does that make me any better than them?
Not likely- instead it drops me to their level.
I always feel at the time as though just looking at someone isn't enough. That I need words- especially cutting words- to drive the point home.
It's only when I try to put myself in the position of the other person that I realise I would be quite ashamed if the person on the receiving end had just turned round, looked at me, risen above it, and walked off.
But then I would've been ashamed at making the comment in the first place.
I would like to be able to say something if I needed to.
Not something harsh or abusive, but... something.
Problem is, I get angry, and my mind goes blank of anything to say past "shut the
up, you b**ch"
And to be honest, that's really not a very sensible option!
Being polite and courteous probably would be a wise approach, I agree.
A tough one to do though, give my temper.
If I turn round and abuse people back, does that make me any better than them?
Not likely- instead it drops me to their level.
I always feel at the time as though just looking at someone isn't enough. That I need words- especially cutting words- to drive the point home.
It's only when I try to put myself in the position of the other person that I realise I would be quite ashamed if the person on the receiving end had just turned round, looked at me, risen above it, and walked off.
But then I would've been ashamed at making the comment in the first place.
I would like to be able to say something if I needed to.
Not something harsh or abusive, but... something.
Problem is, I get angry, and my mind goes blank of anything to say past "shut the
up, you b**ch"And to be honest, that's really not a very sensible option!
Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.
BRONZE Member
member
25 posts
Location: Vancouver BC, Canada
member
25 posts
Location: Vancouver BC, Canada
Posted:
damn homophob's
damn homophob's
Miss Whippy
1,262 posts
Location: Cornwall & Oxford
1,262 posts
Location: Cornwall & Oxford
Posted:
Its awful when that happens and you were lucky nothing more came from it.
One time when i was with my (now ex) girlfriend we were at the beach just talking and cuddling etc. and a group of about 5 guys walked past. They were unspeakably rude, it was as if because we were together, we threatened their masculinity and of course this meant that they had to emphasise it, saying we were missing out (in a much ruder way) and that we should let them 'turn us back'.
Thankfully, eventually, after much swearing on both parts, our friends arrived (half an hour late!) and the idiots ran away.
Theres no good way to deal with homophobia because you'll always think, i couldve said or done something more/different that wouldve been more appropriate.
I agree with Xopher, i think you handled the situation in the best way.
Its awful when that happens and you were lucky nothing more came from it.
One time when i was with my (now ex) girlfriend we were at the beach just talking and cuddling etc. and a group of about 5 guys walked past. They were unspeakably rude, it was as if because we were together, we threatened their masculinity and of course this meant that they had to emphasise it, saying we were missing out (in a much ruder way) and that we should let them 'turn us back'.
Thankfully, eventually, after much swearing on both parts, our friends arrived (half an hour late!) and the idiots ran away.
Theres no good way to deal with homophobia because you'll always think, i couldve said or done something more/different that wouldve been more appropriate.
I agree with Xopher, i think you handled the situation in the best way.
Aim high and you'll know your limits, aim low and you'll never know how high you could have climbed.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
I had a lesbian friend once who responded to "you just need one good f*ck from a real man to straigten you out" with "No, that's what YOU need."
The gentleman (using the term loosely) was NOT happy. But she was, and so was I when she told me.
I had a lesbian friend once who responded to "you just need one good f*ck from a real man to straigten you out" with "No, that's what YOU need."
The gentleman (using the term loosely) was NOT happy. But she was, and so was I when she told me.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
nice one, Xoph.
Beth, I would have been nervous in a situation like that.
I've been lucky in that most of what I've had to endure were rude comments.
I did have one nearly nasty incident inmy home town of New Orleans, when a very drunk straight woman got in my face and started saying things like "All you need is a good man," etc.
I was younger, and had the same hot temper I have now, but less control. I ignored her, amazingly enough, so she pushed me. My friends knew me well enough to just grab me and pull me away before I really reacted.
Compared to my friends who've gotten the crap beaten out of them...I'm lucky.
nice one, Xoph.
Beth, I would have been nervous in a situation like that.
I've been lucky in that most of what I've had to endure were rude comments.
I did have one nearly nasty incident inmy home town of New Orleans, when a very drunk straight woman got in my face and started saying things like "All you need is a good man," etc.
I was younger, and had the same hot temper I have now, but less control. I ignored her, amazingly enough, so she pushed me. My friends knew me well enough to just grab me and pull me away before I really reacted.
Compared to my friends who've gotten the crap beaten out of them...I'm lucky.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
Ahhh, you coulda taken 'er! Very drunk people usually have highly kickable asses.
Um, uh, gosh I'm glad your friends stopped you from doing anything foolish. Violence, always bad, yeah that's right.
I also know someone who got beaten in the Village by a group of teenage girls from New Jersey. They were using a walking stick on him, and gave him a bloody nose while yelling about how it was all the faggots' fault that AIDS was around, and suchlike.
He started throwing handfuls of his blood at them (aiming for eyes, mouths etc). They ran away.
Once THEY get physical, get out of the situation any way you can. If you can run, run. If you have to hurt them, hurt them. And there's no upper bound to how MUCH you hurt them, if you're in fear for your life or safety, and you think it's the only way to escape. Crotch-kicks with all your might very much inbounds. Kicks to break the knee likewise.
Ahhh, you coulda taken 'er! Very drunk people usually have highly kickable asses.
Um, uh, gosh I'm glad your friends stopped you from doing anything foolish. Violence, always bad, yeah that's right.
I also know someone who got beaten in the Village by a group of teenage girls from New Jersey. They were using a walking stick on him, and gave him a bloody nose while yelling about how it was all the faggots' fault that AIDS was around, and suchlike.
He started throwing handfuls of his blood at them (aiming for eyes, mouths etc). They ran away.
Once THEY get physical, get out of the situation any way you can. If you can run, run. If you have to hurt them, hurt them. And there's no upper bound to how MUCH you hurt them, if you're in fear for your life or safety, and you think it's the only way to escape. Crotch-kicks with all your might very much inbounds. Kicks to break the knee likewise.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
Indeed.
Apparently, I come across as really tough. People around me think if someone tried to mess with me I'd kick their @$$.
Mand knows better, I'm sure, as she's gotten to know me. I have a tough demeanor, but it's more bark than bite.
Of course, if forced to, I would give someone the meanest fight I could. I'm small...I HAVE to be scrappy. Let's just hope it never comes down to that.
Indeed.
Apparently, I come across as really tough. People around me think if someone tried to mess with me I'd kick their @$$.
Mand knows better, I'm sure, as she's gotten to know me. I have a tough demeanor, but it's more bark than bite.
Of course, if forced to, I would give someone the meanest fight I could. I'm small...I HAVE to be scrappy. Let's just hope it never comes down to that.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
Another way to put it...
I have a lion's roar, but a kitten's teeth.
Another way to put it...
I have a lion's roar, but a kitten's teeth.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
Cute. And as for hoping it never comes to that: Amen, Ache, So Mote It Be.
Cute. And as for hoping it never comes to that: Amen, Ache, So Mote It Be.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
SILVER Member
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Posted:
Nice!
Hmmm... I hope it never comes down me having to fight, because of people's opinions of me. I hate fighting.
When I started karate, my Sensei said something to me which has stuck ever since...
"when you know that inevitably there's going to be a fight, you're lower body provides you with the most useful of weapons.
With lots of practice, you can land lethal kicks... but they'll still be more useful if they're used for running away".
That's a philosophy I tend to go by!
Written by: Xopher
I had a lesbian friend once who responded to "you just need one good f*ck from a real man to straigten you out" with "No, that's what YOU need."
Nice!
Hmmm... I hope it never comes down me having to fight, because of people's opinions of me. I hate fighting.
When I started karate, my Sensei said something to me which has stuck ever since...
"when you know that inevitably there's going to be a fight, you're lower body provides you with the most useful of weapons.
With lots of practice, you can land lethal kicks... but they'll still be more useful if they're used for running away".
That's a philosophy I tend to go by!
Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.
SILVER Member
....
344 posts
Location: Midlands - nr cov, United Kingdom
....
344 posts
Location: Midlands - nr cov, United Kingdom
Posted:
I get that. my gf and i were walking in town once. we may or may not have been holding hands, i forget. A group of teenage boys went past and shouted " lickers!" at us. Me, i have that temper, and shouted "you're just jealous"
usually, when people spit "lesbian!" at me, i tend to comment audibly "they say it like it's a bad thing", or "yes?" they don't tend to know where to go next
My favroute lesbian comedienne does part of a sketch where she talks about a guy harrasing her, and he says "hey suzanne [westenhoefer], i was thinking, my wife's not so interested in sex anymore; why don't you come on over, and spice things up a little?"
she replies "your wife's not so interested in sex anymore because i've already *been* to your house!"
I get that. my gf and i were walking in town once. we may or may not have been holding hands, i forget. A group of teenage boys went past and shouted "
lickers!" at us. Me, i have that temper, and shouted "you're just jealous" usually, when people spit "lesbian!" at me, i tend to comment audibly "they say it like it's a bad thing", or "yes?" they don't tend to know where to go next
My favroute lesbian comedienne does part of a sketch where she talks about a guy harrasing her, and he says "hey suzanne [westenhoefer], i was thinking, my wife's not so interested in sex anymore; why don't you come on over, and spice things up a little?"
she replies "your wife's not so interested in sex anymore because i've already *been* to your house!"
"But what would you do with a brain if you had one?"
Dorothy Gale
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
Suzanne Westenhoefer is fantastic. She has several lines that would stop many people in their tracks, and scratching their heads.
Fighting nastiness with courtesy will go a long way.
Well...D@mn....mom was right again...she always told me to meet hostility with a smile. Mind you, I never got very good at smiling when my blood was boiling.
Suzanne Westenhoefer is fantastic. She has several lines that would stop many people in their tracks, and scratching their heads.
Fighting nastiness with courtesy will go a long way.
Well...D@mn....mom was right again...she always told me to meet hostility with a smile. Mind you, I never got very good at smiling when my blood was boiling.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
GOLD Member
ZORT!
3,045 posts
Location: Brisbane, Australia
ZORT!
3,045 posts
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted:
this delves into a few different rants i have stored away... but ill keep this brief.
one of my core values is to be completely happy with who i am. if someone doesnt like something about me, i honestly couldnt care less. ive become the person i am through my experiences, both high and low - and no stranger is ever going to take happiness away from me.
in one case, i was happily at dinner with my then boyfriend, having a lovely night out, and after 2 bottles of wine between us, were doing the 'holding hands over the dinner table thing.'
just watching the reaction was fascinating! you could see one person at another table take two, then covertly tell the other persons at the table - who would all stare....
yet, when going out with my last girlfriend - we were invisible to the entire world...
its strange this double standard, despite being in the 'supposedly politically correct society'
my personal philisophy.... stuff them! i dont care!!! if someone has a problem with any aspect of me? well, thats their problem - im completely happy as i am, and im not going to let anyone else interefere with my own peace of mind.
i couldnt care less about what someone i dont even know thinks about me. not everyone in the world is always going to have the same morals as me.... thats fine. ill keep my friends to those who understand me - and ignore those who dont.
be confident in your own beliefs, an be free of the pessimism, cynicism, and conservativism that plagues the world.
but, there is one main positive that i see in your original post... that you are both together - and you two look so CUTE together in that photo.
this delves into a few different rants i have stored away... but ill keep this brief.
one of my core values is to be completely happy with who i am. if someone doesnt like something about me, i honestly couldnt care less. ive become the person i am through my experiences, both high and low - and no stranger is ever going to take happiness away from me.
in one case, i was happily at dinner with my then boyfriend, having a lovely night out, and after 2 bottles of wine between us, were doing the 'holding hands over the dinner table thing.'
just watching the reaction was fascinating! you could see one person at another table take two, then covertly tell the other persons at the table - who would all stare....
yet, when going out with my last girlfriend - we were invisible to the entire world...
its strange this double standard, despite being in the 'supposedly politically correct society'
my personal philisophy.... stuff them! i dont care!!! if someone has a problem with any aspect of me? well, thats their problem - im completely happy as i am, and im not going to let anyone else interefere with my own peace of mind.
i couldnt care less about what someone i dont even know thinks about me. not everyone in the world is always going to have the same morals as me.... thats fine. ill keep my friends to those who understand me - and ignore those who dont.
be confident in your own beliefs, an be free of the pessimism, cynicism, and conservativism that plagues the world.
but, there is one main positive that i see in your original post... that you are both together - and you two look so CUTE together in that photo.
"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.
SILVER Member
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada
Posted:
Awww, thanks Dentrassi.
I try not to care about what people think, and it's often ok (when people keep their thoughts to themselves). It's when people start making comments or pointing that gets to me.
Maybe I should just start wearing ear plugs- they would solve all my problems!
Awww, thanks Dentrassi.
I try not to care about what people think, and it's often ok (when people keep their thoughts to themselves). It's when people start making comments or pointing that gets to me.
Maybe I should just start wearing ear plugs- they would solve all my problems!
Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Ok, Mods. I had nothing to do with starting this thread, I swear!
Anyway, maybe it's time that we started a movement among us Queer folk to be Out in public. That means maybe it's time to start doing exactly what the Religious Right fears the most: shoving it in their faces.
Maybe it's time that we started holding hands and generally acting like couples in public, staring down...nay...ignoring the stares we get, and letting the homophobes know that we are here and we are not afraid!
Now, obviously, you do have to be a bit afraid. Wandering through Waco, TX or Howell, MI holding hands is probably not a great idea for our own personal safety. But walking through downtown Houston...what's gonna happen?
Ok, Mods. I had nothing to do with starting this thread, I swear!
Anyway, maybe it's time that we started a movement among us Queer folk to be Out in public. That means maybe it's time to start doing exactly what the Religious Right fears the most: shoving it in their faces.
Maybe it's time that we started holding hands and generally acting like couples in public, staring down...nay...ignoring the stares we get, and letting the homophobes know that we are here and we are not afraid!
Now, obviously, you do have to be a bit afraid. Wandering through Waco, TX or Howell, MI holding hands is probably not a great idea for our own personal safety. But walking through downtown Houston...what's gonna happen?
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
To be honest, lightning, I'm not sure how people in downtown houston would act. We have a lot of folks who are Bible thumpers, and a lot of folks with the "Frat boy" mentality....
There are places I'm totally comfortable being myself and holding hands with Mand...there are other places that I'm not so...and, unless there's police near by, and I know they'd come to my aid, I'd be reluctant.
Perhaps we need a "TAKE BACK THE NIGHT" movement for gay folk...do it in conjunction with nat'l coming out day or something.
I do like your idea, lightning...not being rude to them, but not conforming to their ideals either....
To be honest, lightning, I'm not sure how people in downtown houston would act. We have a lot of folks who are Bible thumpers, and a lot of folks with the "Frat boy" mentality....
There are places I'm totally comfortable being myself and holding hands with Mand...there are other places that I'm not so...and, unless there's police near by, and I know they'd come to my aid, I'd be reluctant.
Perhaps we need a "TAKE BACK THE NIGHT" movement for gay folk...do it in conjunction with nat'l coming out day or something.
I do like your idea, lightning...not being rude to them, but not conforming to their ideals either....
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
SILVER Member
....
344 posts
Location: Midlands - nr cov, United Kingdom
....
344 posts
Location: Midlands - nr cov, United Kingdom
Posted:
I agree with you Mike. I refuse not to hold hands incase some ignormant bigot might take offence.
Quite honestly, i think it's a lot more offensive watching two straight people in the street eating each other's faces (and clothes!) off, than it is to see two gay ppl holding hands.
"It should not matter who we love. That we love, is the miracle."
If people don't like seeing me hold hands with my gf, well, no one MADE them look
I agree with you Mike. I refuse not to hold hands incase some ignormant bigot might take offence.
Quite honestly, i think it's a lot more offensive watching two straight people in the street eating each other's faces (and clothes!) off, than it is to see two gay ppl holding hands.
"It should not matter who we love. That we love, is the miracle."
If people don't like seeing me hold hands with my gf, well, no one MADE them look
"But what would you do with a brain if you had one?"
Dorothy Gale
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
Texas is not exactly friendly turf, even in big cities. A judge there ruled recently that if the police feel like ignoring cries for help from a crime victim because s/he happens to be homosexual, they have that right.
Also, there's no open-container law, and lots of guns (the kind of people you'd expect to take drunken exception to gay handholding often have gunracks on their pickup trucks).
Correct me, Texans, if I err. I have this from my friends in Texas, but the information could be out of date.
Texas is not exactly friendly turf, even in big cities. A judge there ruled recently that if the police feel like ignoring cries for help from a crime victim because s/he happens to be homosexual, they have that right.
Also, there's no open-container law, and lots of guns (the kind of people you'd expect to take drunken exception to gay handholding often have gunracks on their pickup trucks).
Correct me, Texans, if I err. I have this from my friends in Texas, but the information could be out of date.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
WAIT WHAT? Xoph...do you have a reference to the judge's ruling?
If that' sthe case, then THAT is unconstitutional. We are US Citizens and should be guaranteed due process under the law.
I'm about to be really Friggin ANGRY.
There ARE open container laws, but there are also concealed weapons laws. You can't bring weapons into establishments providing alcohol, though.
I really want to know about the first bit you mentioned though.....
WAIT WHAT? Xoph...do you have a reference to the judge's ruling?
If that' sthe case, then THAT is unconstitutional. We are US Citizens and should be guaranteed due process under the law.
I'm about to be really Friggin ANGRY.
There ARE open container laws, but there are also concealed weapons laws. You can't bring weapons into establishments providing alcohol, though.
I really want to know about the first bit you mentioned though.....
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
enthusiast
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
456 posts
Location: Hoboken, New Jersey, USA
Posted:
I'll see if I can find it. I got the reference from a blog a few months back. Gonna take me a while.
I'll see if I can find it. I got the reference from a blog a few months back. Gonna take me a while.
"If you didn't like something the first time, the cud won't be any good either." --Elsie the Cow, Ruminations
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
I appreciate it.....I've not really been hanging in the community too much, so such things slip over my head.
I've got a wonderful circle of friends, but I am...was the token lesbian..now Mand and I are the token lesbian couple.
I appreciate it.....I've not really been hanging in the community too much, so such things slip over my head.
I've got a wonderful circle of friends, but I am...was the token lesbian..now Mand and I are the token lesbian couple.
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
That's what I mean. We need to make a national (or international) movement. Maybe we can call it "Out in Public."
That means that just like the Blacks during the Civil Rights movement, we make ourselves visible...all at once...en masse.
Written by: SpitFire
Perhaps we need a "TAKE BACK THE NIGHT" movement for gay folk...do it in conjunction with nat'l coming out day or something.
I do like your idea, lightning...not being rude to them, but not conforming to their ideals either....
That's what I mean. We need to make a national (or international) movement. Maybe we can call it "Out in Public."
That means that just like the Blacks during the Civil Rights movement, we make ourselves visible...all at once...en masse.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
GOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posted:
Hmm...I like the idea...though wouldn't some folks say that's what gay pride parades are all about?
Hmm...I like the idea...though wouldn't some folks say that's what gay pride parades are all about?
Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.
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