Forums > Social Discussion > PoiGeek.com - Thoughts, opinions etc
Login/Join to ParticipateBRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
www.poigeek.com
Quite surprised this hasn't been mentioned on here before - it's a fairly significant development in the world of poi spinning...
Quick summary, it's a pay-per-view instructional video website which aims to teach poi spinning on a move-by-move basis.
Currently only has a couple of moves up, but the basic premise is obvious.
I think it's a good idea in theory, I even had a similar idea at one stage. The key thing obviously is ensuring the content is substantially better than the huge amounts of free lessons scattered around the interweb to give value for money.
Would anyone here consider using it?
Is anyone massively against the idea?
My only mild gripe with the whole site is the naming of moves, which aren't anywhere near "HoP standard", nor "general spinning community standard". Which is fine on it's own - but can (and will) lead to confusion when a PoiGeek'er meets a regular spinner, but also could hinder progress e.g. "Archer Weave" is just a long-arm/short-arm weave, yet without this qualifier, there's no obvious indicator that LA/SA can be applied to 90% of all poi moves...
This is probably hypocritical, but names for moves should be logical
www.poigeek.com
Quite surprised this hasn't been mentioned on here before - it's a fairly significant development in the world of poi spinning...
Quick summary, it's a pay-per-view instructional video website which aims to teach poi spinning on a move-by-move basis.
Currently only has a couple of moves up, but the basic premise is obvious.
I think it's a good idea in theory, I even had a similar idea at one stage. The key thing obviously is ensuring the content is substantially better than the huge amounts of free lessons scattered around the interweb to give value for money.
Would anyone here consider using it?
Is anyone massively against the idea?
My only mild gripe with the whole site is the naming of moves, which aren't anywhere near "HoP standard", nor "general spinning community standard". Which is fine on it's own - but can (and will) lead to confusion when a PoiGeek'er meets a regular spinner, but also could hinder progress e.g. "Archer Weave" is just a long-arm/short-arm weave, yet without this qualifier, there's no obvious indicator that LA/SA can be applied to 90% of all poi moves...
This is probably hypocritical, but names for moves should be logical
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
BRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
But I'd argue, there doesn't need to be any justification...
Regardless of content, people have put alot of time and effort into making the videos. It's up to the individual whether they make their videos free or not.
You could argue the ethics of taking what you've learnt for free and then passing it on at cost - but maybe GG has locked herself away and come with it all herself so feels justified charging for it.
But then it's not charging for the moves, it's charging for the time that went into making the videos, and if they're well made, edited etc. then I don't think it's unfair to charge people.
But I'd argue, there doesn't need to be any justification...
Regardless of content, people have put alot of time and effort into making the videos. It's up to the individual whether they make their videos free or not.
You could argue the ethics of taking what you've learnt for free and then passing it on at cost - but maybe GG has locked herself away and come with it all herself so feels justified charging for it.
But then it's not charging for the moves, it's charging for the time that went into making the videos, and if they're well made, edited etc. then I don't think it's unfair to charge people.
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
BRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
So... if Nick charged for his YouTube videos, would people feel happy about it? And would you pay?
Is it the fact it's a relatively unknown spinner, of dubious skill/fame that knarks people, or is it the ethics behind it?
So... if Nick charged for his YouTube videos, would people feel happy about it? And would you pay?
Is it the fact it's a relatively unknown spinner, of dubious skill/fame that knarks people, or is it the ethics behind it?
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
BRONZE Member
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
Posted:
im not sure, sometimes i think you do need to justify charging a price for something.
but you can also argue that if people are going to pay for something they could get for free with a bit of effort then thats their lookout.
i think people wouldnt be happy if nick started charging for videos now, even though it would be fair enough.
i think it is a combination of a relatively unknown spinner to HOP, dubious skill level ( i think someone mentioned temple of arse somewhere along the line
) and slightly the ethics behind it. although if the videos were much better i dont think there would be as much fuss.
oh and the fact that the website says they are free
im not sure, sometimes i think you do need to justify charging a price for something.
but you can also argue that if people are going to pay for something they could get for free with a bit of effort then thats their lookout.
i think people wouldnt be happy if nick started charging for videos now, even though it would be fair enough.
i think it is a combination of a relatively unknown spinner to HOP, dubious skill level ( i think someone mentioned temple of arse somewhere along the line
) and slightly the ethics behind it. although if the videos were much better i dont think there would be as much fuss.oh and the fact that the website says they are free
"the geeks have got you" - Gayle
BRONZE Member
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
Posted:
But then you could always claim you were doing a simple one-handed butterfly instead of the glittertastic double-twirl-opposites-show-off, no?
But then you could always claim you were doing a simple one-handed butterfly instead of the glittertastic double-twirl-opposites-show-off, no?
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
SILVER Member
Rum-Swilling Combustioneer
227 posts
Location: Macungie, PA, USA
Rum-Swilling Combustioneer
227 posts
Location: Macungie, PA, USA
Posted:
Odds are it isn't anything that shady. Somebody has something, and other people want it enough to pay for it - voila, a business! If nobody on the Internet is willing to pay for it, they will simply stop offering it.
I used to see martial arts sites like this all the time. Some were really exceptional quality, stuff you could really learn from, and others were average, on par with some of the better homemade Youtube videos, but it was all the same format, give or take a sparkling customer testimonial or two. What usually happened was that the armchair fencers got bored and stopped looking at that site and the serious students either passed it by right off the bat or decided to go find a real instructor anyway for any number of reasons. There's nothing wrong with selling what you have to offer, and that's more true on the Internet than anywhere at any time in history, because it's very low-maintenance and easy to do.
I wouldn't buy lessons from poigeek, but I would gladly donate to Nick. The difference is that he does it for the love of poi and since he's been a big inspiration to me as I've learned to spin, I'd like to give something back. Sites like Poi Geek aren't very inspirational, so at the end of the day it just feels like a business transaction.
I'm not personally familiar with Glitter Girl's history with HOP, or lack thereof, so I can't comment on that. But with stuff like this the market quickly sorts it out by itself.
Odds are it isn't anything that shady. Somebody has something, and other people want it enough to pay for it - voila, a business! If nobody on the Internet is willing to pay for it, they will simply stop offering it.
I used to see martial arts sites like this all the time. Some were really exceptional quality, stuff you could really learn from, and others were average, on par with some of the better homemade Youtube videos, but it was all the same format, give or take a sparkling customer testimonial or two. What usually happened was that the armchair fencers got bored and stopped looking at that site and the serious students either passed it by right off the bat or decided to go find a real instructor anyway for any number of reasons. There's nothing wrong with selling what you have to offer, and that's more true on the Internet than anywhere at any time in history, because it's very low-maintenance and easy to do.
I wouldn't buy lessons from poigeek, but I would gladly donate to Nick. The difference is that he does it for the love of poi and since he's been a big inspiration to me as I've learned to spin, I'd like to give something back. Sites like Poi Geek aren't very inspirational, so at the end of the day it just feels like a business transaction.
I'm not personally familiar with Glitter Girl's history with HOP, or lack thereof, so I can't comment on that. But with stuff like this the market quickly sorts it out by itself.
Bouncing Baby Pipe!
SILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
Posted:
Funny this has come up cos I just went on a little explore of old threads last night (the *do anything rather than uni assignment* type explore) after seeing Durbs ref to Temple of etc in another current thread. I was a bit surprised at the venom to GG that was expressed then.. and not surprised that Malcolm had locked the somewhat vitriolic threads those years ago. SO I totally support the not slagging off GG or anyone else here now approach. But it is a bit odd that someone would quote being 'endorsed' by HoP threads when most of the comments on them were so ... unenthusiastic.
As for me personally pay by move? No, of course I wouldn't when I can learn off so many people I know. And there is so much free stuff out there. But I don't have a problem in principle with people charging for the time it takes to make vids/host them etc. I know people like Meenik have been struggling for years to find a way to make a living from their skill and insight, and I myself have happily paid good money for DVDs like encyclopoida and Sphercular Vision. I've even produced one myself (from footage of the last UberOz) that people could learn heaps from... and sold it for a commercial price to cover costs and give the editors a few meals.
The naming thing could be a bit confusing but playing is more important than talking so I'm not so fussed, not worth a war. Aubergine/eggplant. Doona/duvet. Mobile/cell phone. Big deal, we can still make a meal...and communicate.. and keep warm.
Funny this has come up cos I just went on a little explore of old threads last night (the *do anything rather than uni assignment* type explore) after seeing Durbs ref to Temple of etc in another current thread. I was a bit surprised at the venom to GG that was expressed then.. and not surprised that Malcolm had locked the somewhat vitriolic threads those years ago. SO I totally support the not slagging off GG or anyone else here now approach. But it is a bit odd that someone would quote being 'endorsed' by HoP threads when most of the comments on them were so ... unenthusiastic.
As for me personally pay by move? No, of course I wouldn't when I can learn off so many people I know. And there is so much free stuff out there. But I don't have a problem in principle with people charging for the time it takes to make vids/host them etc. I know people like Meenik have been struggling for years to find a way to make a living from their skill and insight, and I myself have happily paid good money for DVDs like encyclopoida and Sphercular Vision. I've even produced one myself (from footage of the last UberOz) that people could learn heaps from... and sold it for a commercial price to cover costs and give the editors a few meals.
The naming thing could be a bit confusing but playing is more important than talking so I'm not so fussed, not worth a war. Aubergine/eggplant. Doona/duvet. Mobile/cell phone. Big deal, we can still make a meal...and communicate.. and keep warm.
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
SILVER Member
Momma Bear
4,525 posts
Location: Telford, Shrops, United Kingdom
Momma Bear
4,525 posts
Location: Telford, Shrops, United Kingdom
Posted:
Wicked post Gabe, totally agree with you, tomayta tomato!
Wicked post Gabe, totally agree with you, tomayta tomato!
Hoppers are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly.
SILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
Posted:
I just went to have a little looksee at the site and some of the free trailers and it looks fair enough to me. Not sure how good the actual breakdown lessons are.. but from the freebie it's pretty clear to see what is being offered and to make a choice about if you want to pay to, as it says, have it 'broken down so you can pick it up'. A lot of us would be able to get the idea, pick it up and teach ourselves just from what is there for free... . Good luck to her I reckon. And hey, she's not a skinny boy with long arms so she gets my vote just for that
I just went to have a little looksee at the site and some of the free trailers and it looks fair enough to me. Not sure how good the actual breakdown lessons are.. but from the freebie it's pretty clear to see what is being offered and to make a choice about if you want to pay to, as it says, have it 'broken down so you can pick it up'. A lot of us would be able to get the idea, pick it up and teach ourselves just from what is there for free... . Good luck to her I reckon. And hey, she's not a skinny boy with long arms so she gets my vote just for that
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
SILVER Member
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Posted:
I'm not sure the naming issue is quite as clear as you make it Gabe; most of us are brought up with Duvet's or cell phones etc.
The point with poi naming conventions is that the patterns we use in poi are almost completely alien to someone when they start spinning, so the name they are taught is their only reference. The reason there is no problem with cell/mobile phones, Duvet's or doona's, is that both names are recognised, despite a local preference to a particular name.
If poi is taught with one name, then someone hears another, it is unlikely that a fresh spinner will have any inkling that the two are synonymous. I suggest that this creates at best a hindrance and at worst a barrier.
Names take a long time to come into common use on a wide scale, once those names are established it can appear belidgerent to ignore such conventions or rename without good reason.
I'm not sure the naming issue is quite as clear as you make it Gabe; most of us are brought up with Duvet's or cell phones etc.
The point with poi naming conventions is that the patterns we use in poi are almost completely alien to someone when they start spinning, so the name they are taught is their only reference. The reason there is no problem with cell/mobile phones, Duvet's or doona's, is that both names are recognised, despite a local preference to a particular name.
If poi is taught with one name, then someone hears another, it is unlikely that a fresh spinner will have any inkling that the two are synonymous. I suggest that this creates at best a hindrance and at worst a barrier.
Names take a long time to come into common use on a wide scale, once those names are established it can appear belidgerent to ignore such conventions or rename without good reason.
BRONZE Member
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
Posted:
there are problems with that approach to naming of things. i think we would all love to have a unified poi language. a set of unit terms that can be built up to describe things.
therefore describing a 1 long arm/1 short arm weave is more descriptive to someone who doesnt know the move than the "archer weave" is, even though the archer bit of it does describe it to an extent.
there are problems with that approach to naming of things. i think we would all love to have a unified poi language. a set of unit terms that can be built up to describe things.
therefore describing a 1 long arm/1 short arm weave is more descriptive to someone who doesnt know the move than the "archer weave" is, even though the archer bit of it does describe it to an extent.
"the geeks have got you" - Gayle
SILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
Posted:
For that particular move, I think Archer is a great name. Let's all use it!
For that particular move, I think Archer is a great name. Let's all use it!
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
BRONZE Member
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
Posted:
yeah but the problem with that is if someone has never heard of it, they would be hard pressed to work out what it is from the name, but if you call it longarm-shortarm-weave, a lot easier to work out.
yeah but the problem with that is if someone has never heard of it, they would be hard pressed to work out what it is from the name, but if you call it longarm-shortarm-weave, a lot easier to work out.
"the geeks have got you" - Gayle
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,895 posts
Location: Cambridge UK
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,895 posts
Location: Cambridge UK
Posted:
wow.. got me posting something moderately sensible in discussion for once...
when you're a beginner, I really don't think the name of the move matters that much: 'Archer', 'longarm/shortarm', 'reaching inside the cow'....
so long as you can see what the move is and figure out how to do it, it's still teaching you basic elements of coordination in a way that's understandable.
I'd agree though, that when you reach the intermediate-advanced level, it helps to start breaking things down, as people get into the idea of 'there are no moves, simply endless variations', at which point, terms like longarm, shortarm, antispin, isolation etc all start to become rather useful.
I've made the mistake in the past of trying to explain the 'no move' theory to people who've been newbies and often received blank stares. I think it can actually be disheartening for some people when they realise what a mountain there is to climb.
Whereas if you say, 'learn this move, its called the archer' its nice and simple, no further explanation required
on a side note, I think its nice to see how GG's spinning has improved since CoL5, although I totally don't agree with the reference to HoP on her website.
wow.. got me posting something moderately sensible in discussion for once...
when you're a beginner, I really don't think the name of the move matters that much: 'Archer', 'longarm/shortarm', 'reaching inside the cow'....
so long as you can see what the move is and figure out how to do it, it's still teaching you basic elements of coordination in a way that's understandable.
I'd agree though, that when you reach the intermediate-advanced level, it helps to start breaking things down, as people get into the idea of 'there are no moves, simply endless variations', at which point, terms like longarm, shortarm, antispin, isolation etc all start to become rather useful.
I've made the mistake in the past of trying to explain the 'no move' theory to people who've been newbies and often received blank stares. I think it can actually be disheartening for some people when they realise what a mountain there is to climb.
Whereas if you say, 'learn this move, its called the archer' its nice and simple, no further explanation required
on a side note, I think its nice to see how GG's spinning has improved since CoL5, although I totally don't agree with the reference to HoP on her website.
Because ActiveAngel sounds like a feminine deodorant
Like sex, I'm much more interesting in real life than online.
'Be the change you want to see in the world around you' - Ghandi
BRONZE Member
nut.
756 posts
Location: Bouncing off the walls., England (UK)
nut.
756 posts
Location: Bouncing off the walls., England (UK)
Posted:
Just on the names thing.. I know it makes life awkward to work out what people are talking about when everyone has different names for stuff, but it *does* make it sound more interesting..
(anyone else a Pratchett fan.. Leonard of Quirm anyone..?)
I suspect they won't do very well on that site, so it probably won't matter what we think of it.. You do really of need a better reputation to sell stuff 'blind' for long.. That's not really inspiring.
Just on the names thing.. I know it makes life awkward to work out what people are talking about when everyone has different names for stuff, but it *does* make it sound more interesting..
(anyone else a Pratchett fan.. Leonard of Quirm anyone..?)
I suspect they won't do very well on that site, so it probably won't matter what we think of it.. You do really of need a better reputation to sell stuff 'blind' for long.. That's not really inspiring.
THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH!
If that's okay with you?
SILVER Member
Hunting robot foxes
1,046 posts
Location: Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, England (UK)
Hunting robot foxes
1,046 posts
Location: Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, England (UK)
Posted:
I think everyone should have their own name for every move, poi is too easy to understand, we need to add something interesting or we'll all be bored of it next week.
Excuse me, I'm off to go practice "Poking the bear in the eye"
I think everyone should have their own name for every move, poi is too easy to understand, we need to add something interesting or we'll all be bored of it next week.
Excuse me, I'm off to go practice "Poking the bear in the eye"
Working hard to be a wandering hippie layabout. Ten years down, five to go!
BRONZE Member
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
Posted:
Written by :Mr_Chutney
to teach under a completely different naming structure is counter-intuitive
"the geeks have got you" - Gayle
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,895 posts
Location: Cambridge UK
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,895 posts
Location: Cambridge UK
Posted:
dunno, never did me much harm: I learnt 'the mexican wave', not 'alternating butterfly shoulder reels' and it didn't do me much harm
dunno, never did me much harm: I learnt 'the mexican wave', not 'alternating butterfly shoulder reels' and it didn't do me much harm
Because ActiveAngel sounds like a feminine deodorant
Like sex, I'm much more interesting in real life than online.
'Be the change you want to see in the world around you' - Ghandi
BRONZE Member
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
compfuzzled
1,182 posts
Location: hastings, England (UK)
Posted:
long term for the scene i think it is harmful though
long term for the scene i think it is harmful though
"the geeks have got you" - Gayle
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Good vids are hard to make - lot of time and effort as stated already. A website costs money... so "pay per move" is inevitable in this case and if the market is taking it... why not?
But they need to give the moves new names. Who would pay for the "btb butterfly tutorial", if it's free elsewhere?
Makes me ponder whether Nick gets freebies from those who learned from his YouTube vids (apart from recognition)?
Teachers are greatly underpaid and tuition is greatly undervalued... Life's a supermarket and nobody's sitting at the cash counter - except for ringing tones and other bullscrap... (but which are happily paid for?)
Good vids are hard to make - lot of time and effort as stated already. A website costs money... so "pay per move" is inevitable in this case and if the market is taking it... why not?
But they need to give the moves new names. Who would pay for the "btb butterfly tutorial", if it's free elsewhere?
Makes me ponder whether Nick gets freebies from those who learned from his YouTube vids (apart from recognition)?
Teachers are greatly underpaid and tuition is greatly undervalued... Life's a supermarket and nobody's sitting at the cash counter - except for ringing tones and other bullscrap... (but which are happily paid for?)
the best smiles are the ones you lead to 
SILVER Member
enthusiast
360 posts
Location: Oxford, United Kingdom
enthusiast
360 posts
Location: Oxford, United Kingdom
Posted:
I do agree with a unified language for poi, but nicknames for moves make things quicker, if there's no other name for a longarm/shortarm weave, why not call it an archer weave.
I do agree with a unified language for poi, but nicknames for moves make things quicker, if there's no other name for a longarm/shortarm weave, why not call it an archer weave.
SILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
Posted:
There's [Old link]
There's [Old link]
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Ok, so I am involved in this to some extent and can answer some of the questions and concerns you all have.
First off, Glitter Girl (and thus, PoiGeek) markets to a very different demographic than you will find here at HoP. Generally, the people she serves are people who have a lot of money and don't care for spending hours reading message boards, watching videos, or hanging out with real poi geeks. They also tend to like things spelled out for them in a very simple and easy to follow structured manner. In essence, she is catering to... wait for it... pop culture/main stream.
Poi Geek's lessons are very high quality and sterile. Each 'course' has 10 lessons which are slight variations of one move (ie - my lesson was on buzzsaw fountains, I did fw buzz, rv buzz, fountain clockwise, fountain counter, anti-spin clockwise, anti-spin counter, turning left in regular, turning right in regular, turning left in anti, and turning right in anti) The moves are broken down as far as possible, teaching each lesson with the footwork, body position, left hand, right hand, putting it all together, then some tips for trouble shooting. There is also 'inspirational' footage included which shows some other things you can do with the moves featured in the course.
As for the naming stuff and the seemingly misrepresented 'free' lessons, its all part of the marketing game. There are no lies as there are free lessons on the site. Each course will have one free lesson available. The names of the moves (in certain cases) are different but only because that is how GG teaches it. Her students can relate better to the way she names things than the more technical names which are more widely accepted among this community.
Ok, so I am involved in this to some extent and can answer some of the questions and concerns you all have.
First off, Glitter Girl (and thus, PoiGeek) markets to a very different demographic than you will find here at HoP. Generally, the people she serves are people who have a lot of money and don't care for spending hours reading message boards, watching videos, or hanging out with real poi geeks. They also tend to like things spelled out for them in a very simple and easy to follow structured manner. In essence, she is catering to... wait for it... pop culture/main stream.
Poi Geek's lessons are very high quality and sterile. Each 'course' has 10 lessons which are slight variations of one move (ie - my lesson was on buzzsaw fountains, I did fw buzz, rv buzz, fountain clockwise, fountain counter, anti-spin clockwise, anti-spin counter, turning left in regular, turning right in regular, turning left in anti, and turning right in anti) The moves are broken down as far as possible, teaching each lesson with the footwork, body position, left hand, right hand, putting it all together, then some tips for trouble shooting. There is also 'inspirational' footage included which shows some other things you can do with the moves featured in the course.
As for the naming stuff and the seemingly misrepresented 'free' lessons, its all part of the marketing game. There are no lies as there are free lessons on the site. Each course will have one free lesson available. The names of the moves (in certain cases) are different but only because that is how GG teaches it. Her students can relate better to the way she names things than the more technical names which are more widely accepted among this community.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Also, yes, there was a lot of work that went into Poi Geek.
My course alone was pretty time consuming. Beyond the script being written, I spent about 20 hours filming on set and 20 more hours recording voice in a sound booth, and 5+ hours filming inspirational footage. The lesson still needs to be edited and published.
Also, yes, there was a lot of work that went into Poi Geek.
My course alone was pretty time consuming. Beyond the script being written, I spent about 20 hours filming on set and 20 more hours recording voice in a sound booth, and 5+ hours filming inspirational footage. The lesson still needs to be edited and published.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
SILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia
Posted:
Hey thanks for posting, Icon. And I hope your vids get due respect for the work you put into them. Why do you call the poi geek vids sterile though? Strange word!
You mean.. really clean? Or ... not likely to produce results?
Lots of poi moves vids here have visually descriptive names. Thread the Needle, Flowers, Chase the Sun etc is a lot easier to say and remember than where-the-arms-go etc descriptions.
Try describing the Windmill that way. No way! But say Windmill and we have a picture in our heads straight away.
Archer ftw
And what;s a fountain? I thought that was a juggling term?
Hey thanks for posting, Icon. And I hope your vids get due respect for the work you put into them. Why do you call the poi geek vids sterile though? Strange word!
You mean.. really clean? Or ... not likely to produce results?
Written by :simta
if someone has never heard of it, they would be hard pressed to work out what it is from the name, but if you call it longarm-shortarm-weave, a lot easier to work out.
Lots of poi moves vids here have visually descriptive names. Thread the Needle, Flowers, Chase the Sun etc is a lot easier to say and remember than where-the-arms-go etc descriptions.
Try describing the Windmill that way. No way! But say Windmill and we have a picture in our heads straight away.
Archer ftw
And what;s a fountain? I thought that was a juggling term?
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
By sterile I mean really clean. White backgrounds, black clothes, color coded poi to correspond to left and right, very clear voice recording, HD video, etc.
By sterile I mean really clean. White backgrounds, black clothes, color coded poi to correspond to left and right, very clear voice recording, HD video, etc.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
BRONZE Member
1 + 1 = 3
3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
1 + 1 = 3
3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
Posted:
So why not make everyone happy and put both the names on there?
So why not make everyone happy and put both the names on there?
Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Why can't everyone just be happy with what is there? If you don't plan to buy any lessons, why would you complain?
Instructors can make the lessons any way they want. If I wanted to, I could have called my buzzsaw lessong "the wheel of death" or whatever. I did go with the more technical name (buzzsaw fountain tutorial). Glitter Girl chose to name hers the Archer Weave because that is how she teaches it to her students. She sees no reason to put 2 names on stuff to make it more confusing. Hell, there are probably 10 different names people could use for "archer weave"... Could be long arm weave, could be lock out weave, could be extended weave, etc... She chose archer weave... Makes sense IMO. Why does this upset you so much?
Why can't everyone just be happy with what is there? If you don't plan to buy any lessons, why would you complain?
Instructors can make the lessons any way they want. If I wanted to, I could have called my buzzsaw lessong "the wheel of death" or whatever. I did go with the more technical name (buzzsaw fountain tutorial). Glitter Girl chose to name hers the Archer Weave because that is how she teaches it to her students. She sees no reason to put 2 names on stuff to make it more confusing. Hell, there are probably 10 different names people could use for "archer weave"... Could be long arm weave, could be lock out weave, could be extended weave, etc... She chose archer weave... Makes sense IMO. Why does this upset you so much?
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
I mean, it's not like she renamed every poi move. Just a few, and IMO, the ones she renamed make it much simpler for beginners to understand and relate. Simple as that.
I mean, it's not like she renamed every poi move. Just a few, and IMO, the ones she renamed make it much simpler for beginners to understand and relate. Simple as that.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.
-Me
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Posted:
Cos the people here are in the HOP community and, the lady in questions site is part of another community??
It's one of the sadder aspects of human nature and communities, that those in one community will tend to pick fault with those in another in a fairly 'knee-jerk' manner
Written by :ICoN
Why can't everyone just be happy with what is there? If you don't plan to buy any lessons, why would you complain?
Cos the people here are in the HOP community and, the lady in questions site is part of another community??
It's one of the sadder aspects of human nature and communities, that those in one community will tend to pick fault with those in another in a fairly 'knee-jerk' manner
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
SILVER Member
with added berries
1,365 posts
Location: Manchester, England (UK)
with added berries
1,365 posts
Location: Manchester, England (UK)
Posted:
Ignoring who has set up the site, because really, it is completly irrelavent. (Lets face it, whatever anybody thinks about one of the instructors in particular, both are certainly at a high enough level to teach beginners!) My first thought when reading this was, yep, appealing to people who have just picked up poi, want instant/easy learning, don't want to have to work at something. (Usually do poi for less than a couple of months before they get bored).
Exactly the sort of people who message me all the time to give them private lessons. (And who in fact, on occasion, I have taught privately and taken money from.) Is that really any different? People paying for something that they could get if they went to a meet?
I now teach hoop to fairly similar people, although most stick at it for quite a few months before they get bored.
I do feel a bit wierd teaching them something I essentially learnt from you-tube and other people for free, and that is easily and openly available.
However, there is a market for people like that. And you know what, its not that they're necessrily lazy really, its just that they may not think in the same way as the majority of the hardcore poi-spinners/hoopers/whatever, they struggle with breaking down moves, of exploring and discovering new varients, they maybe lack in confidence in this area. Some maybe don't want to find the time to devote to it and practise, it potentially does take a lot longer to learn from youtube, than it does from someone in person. (Or I guess a very broken down, targetted series of videos).
So they want easy learning, with as fast as possible results, so they have a party trick they can show their friends.
PoiGeek has seen a gap in the market and exploited it. Is it any different from buying an instructional dvd? Or infact, paying for lessons? Just because you're downloading it, rather than getting it in the post?
Perhaps it isn't the best to change established names, (hoopgirl does exactly the same, and it does kind of bug me, for instance, how on earth is "warrior" easier to understand than figure of eight?!), but few of the people who actually buy the videos are likely to fall into the juggling scene really. Thats why they buy them in the first place. And if they do, they'll just have to learn the established names. We take it forgranted now in poi, staff and juggling etc, that names are very established and fixed. In pole and hoop for instance, most names are still very fluid, and some non-existant.
And all credit to them, at least they go beyond a three-beat weave and butterfly, and look at variations.
Ignoring who has set up the site, because really, it is completly irrelavent. (Lets face it, whatever anybody thinks about one of the instructors in particular, both are certainly at a high enough level to teach beginners!) My first thought when reading this was, yep, appealing to people who have just picked up poi, want instant/easy learning, don't want to have to work at something. (Usually do poi for less than a couple of months before they get bored).
Exactly the sort of people who message me all the time to give them private lessons. (And who in fact, on occasion, I have taught privately and taken money from.) Is that really any different? People paying for something that they could get if they went to a meet?
I now teach hoop to fairly similar people, although most stick at it for quite a few months before they get bored.
I do feel a bit wierd teaching them something I essentially learnt from you-tube and other people for free, and that is easily and openly available.
However, there is a market for people like that. And you know what, its not that they're necessrily lazy really, its just that they may not think in the same way as the majority of the hardcore poi-spinners/hoopers/whatever, they struggle with breaking down moves, of exploring and discovering new varients, they maybe lack in confidence in this area. Some maybe don't want to find the time to devote to it and practise, it potentially does take a lot longer to learn from youtube, than it does from someone in person. (Or I guess a very broken down, targetted series of videos).
So they want easy learning, with as fast as possible results, so they have a party trick they can show their friends.
PoiGeek has seen a gap in the market and exploited it. Is it any different from buying an instructional dvd? Or infact, paying for lessons? Just because you're downloading it, rather than getting it in the post?
Perhaps it isn't the best to change established names, (hoopgirl does exactly the same, and it does kind of bug me, for instance, how on earth is "warrior" easier to understand than figure of eight?!), but few of the people who actually buy the videos are likely to fall into the juggling scene really. Thats why they buy them in the first place. And if they do, they'll just have to learn the established names. We take it forgranted now in poi, staff and juggling etc, that names are very established and fixed. In pole and hoop for instance, most names are still very fluid, and some non-existant.
And all credit to them, at least they go beyond a three-beat weave and butterfly, and look at variations.
Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.
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