Forums > Social Chat > Things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us: (Dirty Laundry)
Login/Join to ParticipateNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
*** Please note that I've changed the topic from "The definitive DIRTY LAUNDRY thread" to what it is now to more adequately reflect it's contents and intent***
[Yeah, I'm gonna do it.]
I'll start off by saying that this is in reference to some of the bad blood that has been flowing though HoP with the Sexy Fire Spinners thread, the Censored thread, and the Have we lost the point thread. The large majority of HoPers that this doesn't pertain to can move on and not bother with this nonsense.
I'm gonna try really hard NOT to make this a redundant post NOR am I going to blame anybody.
I would very much like to see us to discuss some SPECIFIC things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us.
IF you are not interested in participating in this conversation PLEASE DON'T POST "I think everything is fine" or "Just shut up" or "Why are you still talking about this" or "Grow some balls" type posts. Clearly there are enough of us that are still affected. I, like some, would benefit from an open discussion. Please allow us this one thread to discuss this.
AFTER we have all aired our dirty laudry about what bothers us, and only AFTER. We can see if there is a common ground that we can meet upon.
Again:
This is only for people who want to discuss this further.
*For example: (And I'm deliberately picking a stupid one that I don't agree with) If it really bothered someone that people flirt too much on HoP they could say so, then 57 people would disagree with them and perhaps they'd learn to deal with it. OR 75 people could come out of the woodwork and say it bothered them too and I, as NYC, would then AT LEAST KNOW that the next time I flirted, I'd be bothering people.
For the third time, if this is not for you, it would help the thread if you just clicked "back"
Unfortunately, I think it would also help if we kept all threads completely free of sarcasm.
And my final attempt to play civilian moderator, I won't even start with what I think. Perhaps someone else can start...
Specific things that we, as individials, would like not to see on HoP or that offend us:
(I think it would be beneficial to distinguish between "This offends me but I can deal with it" and "I really think that this has no place on HoP".)
[Standing idealistically with eyes wide open hoping for positive but preparing for negative...]
[ 04 October 2002, 13:43: Message edited by: NYC ]
*** Please note that I've changed the topic from "The definitive DIRTY LAUNDRY thread" to what it is now to more adequately reflect it's contents and intent***
[Yeah, I'm gonna do it.]
I'll start off by saying that this is in reference to some of the bad blood that has been flowing though HoP with the Sexy Fire Spinners thread, the Censored thread, and the Have we lost the point thread. The large majority of HoPers that this doesn't pertain to can move on and not bother with this nonsense.
I'm gonna try really hard NOT to make this a redundant post NOR am I going to blame anybody.
I would very much like to see us to discuss some SPECIFIC things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us.
IF you are not interested in participating in this conversation PLEASE DON'T POST "I think everything is fine" or "Just shut up" or "Why are you still talking about this" or "Grow some balls" type posts. Clearly there are enough of us that are still affected. I, like some, would benefit from an open discussion. Please allow us this one thread to discuss this.
AFTER we have all aired our dirty laudry about what bothers us, and only AFTER. We can see if there is a common ground that we can meet upon.
Again:
This is only for people who want to discuss this further.
*For example: (And I'm deliberately picking a stupid one that I don't agree with) If it really bothered someone that people flirt too much on HoP they could say so, then 57 people would disagree with them and perhaps they'd learn to deal with it. OR 75 people could come out of the woodwork and say it bothered them too and I, as NYC, would then AT LEAST KNOW that the next time I flirted, I'd be bothering people.
For the third time, if this is not for you, it would help the thread if you just clicked "back"
Unfortunately, I think it would also help if we kept all threads completely free of sarcasm.
And my final attempt to play civilian moderator, I won't even start with what I think. Perhaps someone else can start...
Specific things that we, as individials, would like not to see on HoP or that offend us:
(I think it would be beneficial to distinguish between "This offends me but I can deal with it" and "I really think that this has no place on HoP".)
[Standing idealistically with eyes wide open hoping for positive but preparing for negative...]
[ 04 October 2002, 13:43: Message edited by: NYC ]
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
BRONZE Member
Sporadically Prodigal
2,758 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Sporadically Prodigal
2,758 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Wow NYC - good of you to do this. Thanks.
Like you, I desperately hope we can maintain a healthy & mature open discussion here...
Firstly, nothing on HOP offends me.
Secondly, I have found myself becoming increasingly irritated when watching decent and provocative threads being turned into brain mush. I mentioned this a while ago to someone we all know and love, asking how I should react to my building frustration as a moderator. He suggested that I leave it alone and that it would die its own death, and was of the opinion that if I voiced my frustration, some people would be even more inclined to continue do it (you know, that whole reverse psychology thing).
However, this has not occured, and I feel that littering threads with pages of Nonsense (not the capitalisation of the word) has become all too acceptable and the modus operandi for many of the members.
I also find it quite disrespectful that new people's Introductions are ambushed and overrun.
Like I said in the Have We Lost It thread, I used to be the on-topic nazi, and I guess this may have something to do with why this particular issue bothers me so much.
I personally would like to see a little more restraint and consideration from people; just take a step back and ask yourself if it's really necessary to type that quirky one-liner: does it merely satisfy your cravings, or does it actually positively contribute to the subject at hand?
I know I might be sounding like a kill-joy - but I'm not. I just ask that decent threads remain decent, and that nonsense be left to the nonsense threads.
Another thing for people to consider is Bandwidth. Have a thought for the administrator's monthly bill please!
Wow NYC - good of you to do this. Thanks.
Like you, I desperately hope we can maintain a healthy & mature open discussion here...
Firstly, nothing on HOP offends me.
Secondly, I have found myself becoming increasingly irritated when watching decent and provocative threads being turned into brain mush. I mentioned this a while ago to someone we all know and love, asking how I should react to my building frustration as a moderator. He suggested that I leave it alone and that it would die its own death, and was of the opinion that if I voiced my frustration, some people would be even more inclined to continue do it (you know, that whole reverse psychology thing).
However, this has not occured, and I feel that littering threads with pages of Nonsense (not the capitalisation of the word) has become all too acceptable and the modus operandi for many of the members.
I also find it quite disrespectful that new people's Introductions are ambushed and overrun.
Like I said in the Have We Lost It thread, I used to be the on-topic nazi, and I guess this may have something to do with why this particular issue bothers me so much.
I personally would like to see a little more restraint and consideration from people; just take a step back and ask yourself if it's really necessary to type that quirky one-liner: does it merely satisfy your cravings, or does it actually positively contribute to the subject at hand?
I know I might be sounding like a kill-joy - but I'm not. I just ask that decent threads remain decent, and that nonsense be left to the nonsense threads.
Another thing for people to consider is Bandwidth. Have a thought for the administrator's monthly bill please!
HoP Posting Guidelines
Is it the Truth?
Is it Fair to all concerned?
Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?
If you can answer YES to these 4 questions then you may post a reply.
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
It is difficult, there are some threads where post hijacking is acceptable, intro threads, those auctions threads, etc etc. But hijacking a bigger discussion is not on, although I have sorta been guilty of it myself at times.
Do people feel embarassed to pull things back on topic? If you see that someone else has taken a thread on a detour, and you want to post something with the original topic, how do you feel about posting that comment? Would you do it?
It is difficult, there are some threads where post hijacking is acceptable, intro threads, those auctions threads, etc etc. But hijacking a bigger discussion is not on, although I have sorta been guilty of it myself at times.
Do people feel embarassed to pull things back on topic? If you see that someone else has taken a thread on a detour, and you want to post something with the original topic, how do you feel about posting that comment? Would you do it?
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
Enter a "Title" here:
2,905 posts
Location: San Diego California
2,905 posts
Location: San Diego California
Posted:
I am super guildty of highjacking so me thinks I will be carefull from now on.
I am super guildty of highjacking so me thinks I will be carefull from now on.
Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"
SILVER Member
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Posted:
Im tired of the lack of welcome for newcomers on HoP. Yes, everynow and then someones intro thread gets hijacked, but usually in a way that relates to something they have said in their intro. I still think thats a damn sight better than having barely any response at all....
oh, and it'd be nice when there are intro's, if it werent just the same nine or ten people posting hello's to newcomers. Im sure there are plenty of people out there, who could spare ten minutes to say hi to a few new people, and check up on them every few days to see if they've replied, or have questions, or difficulting navagating the board....
[ 03 October 2002, 18:24: Message edited by: Flynt ]
Im tired of the lack of welcome for newcomers on HoP. Yes, everynow and then someones intro thread gets hijacked, but usually in a way that relates to something they have said in their intro. I still think thats a damn sight better than having barely any response at all....
oh, and it'd be nice when there are intro's, if it werent just the same nine or ten people posting hello's to newcomers. Im sure there are plenty of people out there, who could spare ten minutes to say hi to a few new people, and check up on them every few days to see if they've replied, or have questions, or difficulting navagating the board....
[ 03 October 2002, 18:24: Message edited by: Flynt ]
Currently on the right side up of the world.
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,009 posts
Location: Bristol, UK
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,009 posts
Location: Bristol, UK
Posted:
I'm just dittoing Flash Fire. Too much nonsense.
I'm just dittoing Flash Fire. Too much nonsense.
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Okay, so so far we have got the following big issues:
1. Welcoming newcomers. We wish more people would say hello to newbies in the intro threads, and gently help them out in other areas.
2. High-jacking threads. We wish people would not get so far off topic in serious threads.
My personal idea with this last one, is that we need to learn again how to take back to the topic. Cass does it in a brilliant way. She just thinks of something that she would like to say on the topic, preferably a question that will open things up, and she says "to return to the topic... etc, etc". It is a very quiet and effective way to subtly take things back. Now I recognise that some people may find this hard to do. Can you think of any other reasons why it might not work? If so, lets address those things.
Okay, so so far we have got the following big issues:
1. Welcoming newcomers. We wish more people would say hello to newbies in the intro threads, and gently help them out in other areas.
2. High-jacking threads. We wish people would not get so far off topic in serious threads.
My personal idea with this last one, is that we need to learn again how to take back to the topic. Cass does it in a brilliant way. She just thinks of something that she would like to say on the topic, preferably a question that will open things up, and she says "to return to the topic... etc, etc". It is a very quiet and effective way to subtly take things back. Now I recognise that some people may find this hard to do. Can you think of any other reasons why it might not work? If so, lets address those things.
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
Laguna dude
1,438 posts
Location: Laguna, California, US
1,438 posts
Location: Laguna, California, US
Posted:
not solutions but considerations towards them for us, if i may.
(1) welcoming new members
as one of those who frequently welcomes newcomers wherever i am, i've often kicked over laissez-faire leaving people to welcome whom they find & whom they will vs. strong (beyond their habits) encouragement of people to actively post welcomes (and some are shy themselves, seeing this as a sel-introduction!) vs. a standing welcome committee (formalized or not) vs. (if only this existed!) a system which alerts those whose interests are in common with those expressed by the new member (while open to everyone's welcome)
(2) asking people to stay on topic/ not hijack/ not be flippant in serious threads
i can tell you from my experience now at HoP, it's often hard to get, even if you actively seek & invite, people into many worthy topics, & how can you keep out less focused posts? besides intentional flippancy, don't also forget: while we might ask for self-restraint, many people, psychologically, when troubled by a topic, by the opinions of others in the thread, or its level of conversation if advanced, react in their posts out of their discomfort. and some less-focused posts are the best/ most the poster has to offer! that's ALL they got. then where's our compassion, acceptance, & appreciation for that?
so we have a quality vs. common citizenship vs. judging people's ability vs. judging what you & what others & what posters believe is relevant vs. taste chain-mesh.
furthermore, there's a popularity question, including to whose judgment about value & use of time & resources, if any, shall we hearken? some here want to kill a lot of time with light humor or cantankerousness, which only bothers me when it hurts. . . not just bothers, but hurts. . . others. yet even looking at bandwidth & the business end, high-bandwidth threads mean more popularity for the site, more visitation, more members, and more community & business, even if the bigger quantity of members includes less often fire-focused members. then we have the question of how much we're encouraging deeper fire practice, education, skill, interest, or fellowship with those in whom it is new, or not yet deep, as well as those in whom it may never be deep.
i've worked on:
(A) fostering a serious thread from the beginning (English language symposium). . . which came to a pause, if not a natural end yet, with some humor, then those who responded to the humorous turn. . ."hijacked" it, though with willing participation of several original topic members, into the incubator of the auctions. since of course i still value the original topic, i invite in those interested & add to it what pops up on topic at HoP. the English language symposium itself is not only a valuable life topic, it affects how we each behave at HoP very directly.
(B) bringing some effective form & vitality to a lark thread, not trying to keep out inventive & irregular posts, but getting posters to be in a game together. that's hard, too.
i first joined the Male Auction thread as a jump-in volunteer. then the Female Auction founder has 3 times, now finally, designated me to "manage" it, and retired. must admit i don't get to the fun myself as easily under the sheer work implied, it's getting like what i do here in SoCal through OrangeFire, drawing together & organizing pyros & events. . . what work? providing a structure so the players in the game have a game worth playing. well, as with any satisfying game, i am also bringing the action in them to a conclusion, so it gets somewhere. then people can continue it if they like it well enough to "play again" or not.
(C) helping to turn an initially "weak" thread into a better discussion. as in the Redneck thread, which is another satellite of this complex of discussions on HoP mores & manners. with the goodwill of others, this succeeded for a substantial stretch, then it too has mutated. . .into a beer thread a bit, and now mainly into a thread on rednecks per se, whereas the original emphasis simply used rednecks as a term of shame (yes, before nice pro-rednecks spoke up) in a condemnation of attitudes & practices here. the new redneck emphasis is not very particularly HoP, and quite diffuse. just as someone (NYC?) noticed the Have we lost the point thread has now become "diluted," after many used it valuably, with "intense" posts.
other approaches too, but these 3 plus 1 more, for your consideration now.
and the contra-neat-and-tidy question: how much does it matter whether 3 topics or 10 form one long thread, instead of being neatly in 10 threads? here we have living, evolving, biological-metaphor conversation community vs. boolean search of mainly past history (& some current material) vs. some people's preference for boundaries or for purity or for clear drawers in their organizational cabinet vs. others' prefernce for creative, unfettered, undisciplined, unpredictible fertility vs. chances to cross-link ideas & conversations in an omnidirectional map, though it is harder to know where the other related nodes are in this mode vs. . . what other macro, big-view grasps of what we do?
(D) done a good bit of cross-linking of active conversations (just as some of you do a lot of links to past threads), especially in Technical, such as the Swords, Clubs, Fire Extinguishers/ fuel safety & other threads. yow, that's a lot of just plain work, offering links back & forth & sharing your awareness of related threads where relevant posts have already been posted!
no doubt many before my time have done all this. well, here's some of the actual "stuff" about which we're proposing to discuss persuasion, shaping our society, suggesting policy, or mechanisms.
without more artificial intelligence, besides the possibility of posting rules (& if so, posting member "rights" would be a good balance, and you'd do as well to post community "ideals," since that's what rules imply, explicitly or not, and whether all are unanimous or not), & aware of Pele's expressing the overwhelming of moderators with minor (some would say "petty") requests, many strictly interpersonal/ inter-personality, & being virtual sure HoP is unlikely (fortunately) to enact much pratical censorship (by mods or any one else), though i understand it is, on rare occasion, performed, what is it we propose who does how?
[ 03 October 2002, 22:16: Message edited by: FireMike ]
not solutions but considerations towards them for us, if i may.
(1) welcoming new members
as one of those who frequently welcomes newcomers wherever i am, i've often kicked over laissez-faire leaving people to welcome whom they find & whom they will vs. strong (beyond their habits) encouragement of people to actively post welcomes (and some are shy themselves, seeing this as a sel-introduction!) vs. a standing welcome committee (formalized or not) vs. (if only this existed!) a system which alerts those whose interests are in common with those expressed by the new member (while open to everyone's welcome)
(2) asking people to stay on topic/ not hijack/ not be flippant in serious threads
i can tell you from my experience now at HoP, it's often hard to get, even if you actively seek & invite, people into many worthy topics, & how can you keep out less focused posts? besides intentional flippancy, don't also forget: while we might ask for self-restraint, many people, psychologically, when troubled by a topic, by the opinions of others in the thread, or its level of conversation if advanced, react in their posts out of their discomfort. and some less-focused posts are the best/ most the poster has to offer! that's ALL they got. then where's our compassion, acceptance, & appreciation for that?
so we have a quality vs. common citizenship vs. judging people's ability vs. judging what you & what others & what posters believe is relevant vs. taste chain-mesh.
furthermore, there's a popularity question, including to whose judgment about value & use of time & resources, if any, shall we hearken? some here want to kill a lot of time with light humor or cantankerousness, which only bothers me when it hurts. . . not just bothers, but hurts. . . others. yet even looking at bandwidth & the business end, high-bandwidth threads mean more popularity for the site, more visitation, more members, and more community & business, even if the bigger quantity of members includes less often fire-focused members. then we have the question of how much we're encouraging deeper fire practice, education, skill, interest, or fellowship with those in whom it is new, or not yet deep, as well as those in whom it may never be deep.
i've worked on:
(A) fostering a serious thread from the beginning (English language symposium). . . which came to a pause, if not a natural end yet, with some humor, then those who responded to the humorous turn. . ."hijacked" it, though with willing participation of several original topic members, into the incubator of the auctions. since of course i still value the original topic, i invite in those interested & add to it what pops up on topic at HoP. the English language symposium itself is not only a valuable life topic, it affects how we each behave at HoP very directly.
(B) bringing some effective form & vitality to a lark thread, not trying to keep out inventive & irregular posts, but getting posters to be in a game together. that's hard, too.
i first joined the Male Auction thread as a jump-in volunteer. then the Female Auction founder has 3 times, now finally, designated me to "manage" it, and retired. must admit i don't get to the fun myself as easily under the sheer work implied, it's getting like what i do here in SoCal through OrangeFire, drawing together & organizing pyros & events. . . what work? providing a structure so the players in the game have a game worth playing. well, as with any satisfying game, i am also bringing the action in them to a conclusion, so it gets somewhere. then people can continue it if they like it well enough to "play again" or not.
(C) helping to turn an initially "weak" thread into a better discussion. as in the Redneck thread, which is another satellite of this complex of discussions on HoP mores & manners. with the goodwill of others, this succeeded for a substantial stretch, then it too has mutated. . .into a beer thread a bit, and now mainly into a thread on rednecks per se, whereas the original emphasis simply used rednecks as a term of shame (yes, before nice pro-rednecks spoke up) in a condemnation of attitudes & practices here. the new redneck emphasis is not very particularly HoP, and quite diffuse. just as someone (NYC?) noticed the Have we lost the point thread has now become "diluted," after many used it valuably, with "intense" posts.
other approaches too, but these 3 plus 1 more, for your consideration now.
and the contra-neat-and-tidy question: how much does it matter whether 3 topics or 10 form one long thread, instead of being neatly in 10 threads? here we have living, evolving, biological-metaphor conversation community vs. boolean search of mainly past history (& some current material) vs. some people's preference for boundaries or for purity or for clear drawers in their organizational cabinet vs. others' prefernce for creative, unfettered, undisciplined, unpredictible fertility vs. chances to cross-link ideas & conversations in an omnidirectional map, though it is harder to know where the other related nodes are in this mode vs. . . what other macro, big-view grasps of what we do?
(D) done a good bit of cross-linking of active conversations (just as some of you do a lot of links to past threads), especially in Technical, such as the Swords, Clubs, Fire Extinguishers/ fuel safety & other threads. yow, that's a lot of just plain work, offering links back & forth & sharing your awareness of related threads where relevant posts have already been posted!
no doubt many before my time have done all this. well, here's some of the actual "stuff" about which we're proposing to discuss persuasion, shaping our society, suggesting policy, or mechanisms.
without more artificial intelligence, besides the possibility of posting rules (& if so, posting member "rights" would be a good balance, and you'd do as well to post community "ideals," since that's what rules imply, explicitly or not, and whether all are unanimous or not), & aware of Pele's expressing the overwhelming of moderators with minor (some would say "petty") requests, many strictly interpersonal/ inter-personality, & being virtual sure HoP is unlikely (fortunately) to enact much pratical censorship (by mods or any one else), though i understand it is, on rare occasion, performed, what is it we propose who does how?
[ 03 October 2002, 22:16: Message edited by: FireMike ]
molten cheers,
~ FireMike
FireMikeZ@yahoo.com (personal messages welcome, no promo spam, please!)
Laguna, California, US
Laguna dude
1,438 posts
Location: Laguna, California, US
1,438 posts
Location: Laguna, California, US
Posted:
possible solutions
(1) welcoming new members
a welcome package would be a nice idea, including (simple, of course!) introduction to our resources & nice conventions. "Please go to the Introductions Forum and . . ." "How to ask a moderator. . ." (with a PM, an area some new members don't find right away) "Welcome to Home of Poi, would you like to post some pictures of yourself spinning fire?" "If you are just learning and have not spun fire yet. . ."
have to check the only place i know so far HoP expresses a corporate welcome, in the e-mail confirmation of membership. but perhaps a New Member Orientation area online which all can go through, including some posting etiquette, if you insist, or for those with my perspective, some indoctrination into the general ways HoP culture communicates.
(2) on-topic posts
just a note: surely with our volume of posts, neither mods nor thread starters nor volunteers would like to routinely censor or delete posts or ask posters to delete or modify them to be more "on topic," especially as hasty, inaccurate, often ungrammatical, sometimes uninformed or mean or unfair posts are often the best people can give us.
but might we gain something from a higher-level grouping/ linking in the opposite direction?
(3) related posts
instead of conscientious volunteers posting links in a thread, wherever their posts may arrive in the sequence, to other relevant threads (or articles, even off-site references), might there be an area at the top of the page to enter relevant thread links, appearing conveniently on all pages of a thread? can anything (probably not) be automated in searching for relevant threads, especially among currently active ones, not archives?
this would be a topic-grouping level, below the level of individual forums.
[ 03 October 2002, 22:30: Message edited by: FireMike ]
possible solutions
(1) welcoming new members
a welcome package would be a nice idea, including (simple, of course!) introduction to our resources & nice conventions. "Please go to the Introductions Forum and . . ." "How to ask a moderator. . ." (with a PM, an area some new members don't find right away) "Welcome to Home of Poi, would you like to post some pictures of yourself spinning fire?" "If you are just learning and have not spun fire yet. . ."
have to check the only place i know so far HoP expresses a corporate welcome, in the e-mail confirmation of membership. but perhaps a New Member Orientation area online which all can go through, including some posting etiquette, if you insist, or for those with my perspective, some indoctrination into the general ways HoP culture communicates.
(2) on-topic posts
just a note: surely with our volume of posts, neither mods nor thread starters nor volunteers would like to routinely censor or delete posts or ask posters to delete or modify them to be more "on topic," especially as hasty, inaccurate, often ungrammatical, sometimes uninformed or mean or unfair posts are often the best people can give us.
but might we gain something from a higher-level grouping/ linking in the opposite direction?
(3) related posts
instead of conscientious volunteers posting links in a thread, wherever their posts may arrive in the sequence, to other relevant threads (or articles, even off-site references), might there be an area at the top of the page to enter relevant thread links, appearing conveniently on all pages of a thread? can anything (probably not) be automated in searching for relevant threads, especially among currently active ones, not archives?
this would be a topic-grouping level, below the level of individual forums.
[ 03 October 2002, 22:30: Message edited by: FireMike ]
molten cheers,
~ FireMike
FireMikeZ@yahoo.com (personal messages welcome, no promo spam, please!)
Laguna, California, US
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
This is becoming a refreshingly coherent and intelligent post. I'm glad to see that my initial pessimism was unfounded. Even to step back and see the tone within this post is refreshing. I find it interesting how holding back sarcasm and quick jokes leads to such a more pleasant conversation. There are certainly some commonalities in the prior posts which we can draw upon. I'm looking forward to checking back later and see how this has gone.
Encouraging others to follow suit,
NYC
This is becoming a refreshingly coherent and intelligent post. I'm glad to see that my initial pessimism was unfounded. Even to step back and see the tone within this post is refreshing. I find it interesting how holding back sarcasm and quick jokes leads to such a more pleasant conversation. There are certainly some commonalities in the prior posts which we can draw upon. I'm looking forward to checking back later and see how this has gone.
Encouraging others to follow suit,
NYC
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
DIAMOND Member
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Posted:
quick one.
Much more subtel in the references to recreational drug taking.
And much less of them.
This is meant to be a site for all ages and is read by all ages.
quick one.
Much more subtel in the references to recreational drug taking.
And much less of them.
This is meant to be a site for all ages and is read by all ages.
back from the dead...sort of
884 posts
Location: 43°41'N 79°38'W
884 posts
Location: 43°41'N 79°38'W
Posted:
I thought this was actually a thread about dirty laundry. I was going to come in here and start bitching about having to wear a bathing suit for the past three days because I ran out of underwear and I don't have time to do my frickin' laundry these days.
I thought this was actually a thread about dirty laundry. I was going to come in here and start bitching about having to wear a bathing suit for the past three days because I ran out of underwear and I don't have time to do my frickin' laundry these days.
DIAMOND Member
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Posted:
Paddy, bit of a social blunder there, (not a problem, just bad timing)
have you not read anything thats happened in the last week?
to quote NYC:
eh
Glass
[ 04 October 2002, 12:50: Message edited by: glass ]
Paddy, bit of a social blunder there, (not a problem, just bad timing)
have you not read anything thats happened in the last week?
to quote NYC:
quote:Now I think whats going on here is a new precident is being establised which might allow some threads may remain serious discussion.
. I find it interesting how holding back sarcasm and quick jokes leads to such a more pleasant conversation
eh
Glass
[ 04 October 2002, 12:50: Message edited by: glass ]
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
You know what folks?
It's not perfect here. I know that. We have problems. We have fights, people hijacking threads, idiots posting instructions for home-made napalm, etc.
And for all the posts we start on it, I'm not sure how much better we're going to make it. In fact, all this talk is sort of depressing me. I'm not saying that you guys should stop talking about it if it's making you feel better, but I guess I just don't see the problem.
Even though I registered well over a year ago (although I only became active less than a year ago) I still feel like a newbie sometimes. I wonder how much people appreciate my posts, I wonder if I'm being appropriate, and I wonder if some people would just as soon see me disappear.
But then I get on these boards and I laugh a LOT with you guys. And I just ignore the contentious posts when I get sick of it.
I love it here. No, it's not perfect, and it won't ever be, but it's GREAT! So I guess what I'm saying is learn to see the good parts.
Hugs to all of you.
You know what folks?
It's not perfect here. I know that. We have problems. We have fights, people hijacking threads, idiots posting instructions for home-made napalm, etc.
And for all the posts we start on it, I'm not sure how much better we're going to make it. In fact, all this talk is sort of depressing me. I'm not saying that you guys should stop talking about it if it's making you feel better, but I guess I just don't see the problem.
Even though I registered well over a year ago (although I only became active less than a year ago) I still feel like a newbie sometimes. I wonder how much people appreciate my posts, I wonder if I'm being appropriate, and I wonder if some people would just as soon see me disappear.
But then I get on these boards and I laugh a LOT with you guys. And I just ignore the contentious posts when I get sick of it.
I love it here. No, it's not perfect, and it won't ever be, but it's GREAT! So I guess what I'm saying is learn to see the good parts.
Hugs to all of you.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Paddy, just to reinforce what Drew said. You do realize that you interrupted a conversation where people were discussing how rude it is to randomly burst into a serious conversation... to tell us that you needed to wash your underwear.
I'm not making any judgement on that. I just want to bring it to your attention that that's what you did.
Staying within my civilian moderator mode... Mike, I tried very hard to suggest that it would be more helpful if only those that saw a problem posted. I'd just like to see THIS thread STAY with my initial topic of:
Steering the topic back to ... the topic, I think it would be great if others posted as well. We've got some good, intelligent issues on the table.
And please. If you AGREE with someone or something, PLEASE say so. Even if it's just so we can get a head count of who thinks what. I'm finding it frustrating getting PMs and Emails to the extent of "Wow, I really agreed with you back there but thought it would be more fun if I just let you stand alone like an idiot."
SPECIFIC things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us:
...
Paddy, just to reinforce what Drew said. You do realize that you interrupted a conversation where people were discussing how rude it is to randomly burst into a serious conversation... to tell us that you needed to wash your underwear.
I'm not making any judgement on that. I just want to bring it to your attention that that's what you did.
Staying within my civilian moderator mode... Mike, I tried very hard to suggest that it would be more helpful if only those that saw a problem posted. I'd just like to see THIS thread STAY with my initial topic of:
quote:"Learn to see the good parts" is certainly an appropriate response, I guess. I'd just like to be able to hear other peoples opinions about the topic at hand.
SPECIFIC things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us.
Steering the topic back to ... the topic, I think it would be great if others posted as well. We've got some good, intelligent issues on the table.
And please. If you AGREE with someone or something, PLEASE say so. Even if it's just so we can get a head count of who thinks what. I'm finding it frustrating getting PMs and Emails to the extent of "Wow, I really agreed with you back there but thought it would be more fun if I just let you stand alone like an idiot."
SPECIFIC things that we would like NOT to see on HoP or things that offend us:
...
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
addict
642 posts
Location: UK, London
642 posts
Location: UK, London
Posted:
A lot of what you talk about are rules on other bulletin boards.
One particular website (forums.tdzk.com) runs really well with this one rule. I will use this as reference.
NO SPAM
This does not just include advertising and the like but mostly involves keeping the number of posts you put onto the board to a sensible minimum. i.e. no random silliness but only on topic posts, no double posting i.e. do not follow a post you have just made with another one, edit the last one you did instead. There is no normal social discussion on there site unless it is in character.
I do not suggest we go as strict as TDZK but the system does work!
This rule is particularly important as many people including on HOP make some posts primarily to increase their post count. So double posting is seen to be quite a bad thing and is frowned upon severely.
For example I do not want to see anymore posts which announce how many posts a person has submitted. This is a waste of time as we can see this already at the bottom of each post they make.
Ok one suggestion that I think would be really good if it was implemented. As the top thread in each place i.e social, technical, intros etc... There should be a set of ettiquette (sp?) rules and helpful posting hints (like what kind of topic is usually found there) for newbies. This thread can only be replied to by Mods. Other forums allow one thread to be stuck at the top for this reason and I think HOP should have the same.
If that cannot be done then perhaps making a similar screen as the one for introductions which has some suggestions at the forum opening.
Anyway I think I am making very little sense as I can see what I mean in my head but cannot explain it very well!!!
Anyway my addition to this thread with only one piece of dirty laundry.
Reminder: PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT ANNOUNCE YOU HAVE REACHED xxx AMOUNT OF POSTS. It really annoys me look you have even got me shouting!!!!
[ 04 October 2002, 09:52: Message edited by: Jez ]
A lot of what you talk about are rules on other bulletin boards.
One particular website (forums.tdzk.com) runs really well with this one rule. I will use this as reference.
NO SPAM
This does not just include advertising and the like but mostly involves keeping the number of posts you put onto the board to a sensible minimum. i.e. no random silliness but only on topic posts, no double posting i.e. do not follow a post you have just made with another one, edit the last one you did instead. There is no normal social discussion on there site unless it is in character.
I do not suggest we go as strict as TDZK but the system does work!
This rule is particularly important as many people including on HOP make some posts primarily to increase their post count. So double posting is seen to be quite a bad thing and is frowned upon severely.
For example I do not want to see anymore posts which announce how many posts a person has submitted. This is a waste of time as we can see this already at the bottom of each post they make.
Ok one suggestion that I think would be really good if it was implemented. As the top thread in each place i.e social, technical, intros etc... There should be a set of ettiquette (sp?) rules and helpful posting hints (like what kind of topic is usually found there) for newbies. This thread can only be replied to by Mods. Other forums allow one thread to be stuck at the top for this reason and I think HOP should have the same.
If that cannot be done then perhaps making a similar screen as the one for introductions which has some suggestions at the forum opening.
Anyway I think I am making very little sense as I can see what I mean in my head but cannot explain it very well!!!
Anyway my addition to this thread with only one piece of dirty laundry.
Reminder: PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT ANNOUNCE YOU HAVE REACHED xxx AMOUNT OF POSTS. It really annoys me look you have even got me shouting!!!!
[ 04 October 2002, 09:52: Message edited by: Jez ]
'Happiness is liking peeing on yourself. Everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth.'
'If *I* had a hammer, there'd be no more folk singers.'
DIAMOND Member
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Posted:
I really don't want to see a list of rules at the top of the discussion board. Its too official.
I like the laid back no rules, and mostly self moderating style.
If we want a code of conduct then I would prefer it if we as a group drafted our own code of conduct, use this and similer thread to work it out, then start a new thread with that as the first post and edit that first as it changes, so all following posts in that thread will become redundent, but a valid place to discuss that code.
and to explain it.
it should be short and simple.
But I get the feeling that that is what NYC is woking towards here.
Then if we think other HOPers are stepping out of line just gently point them there. maybe.
To disagree with Jez:
I'm quite happy for there to be silly threads that act as stupid chat, as long as the title is obvious. so that it makes them easy to ignore.
And most threads are not this dry or serious so the occasion for a little spot of humour is often welcome.
Thread Titles
Ok any thread title in capitals is just bad manners.
And thread titles which aren't entirely clear as to what they're about are just irritating.
oh and any introduction thread titled Hello I never read.
Be cool
Drew
__________________
balance
I nicked that sig off dom, I like it
[ 04 October 2002, 12:45: Message edited by: glass ]
I really don't want to see a list of rules at the top of the discussion board. Its too official.
I like the laid back no rules, and mostly self moderating style.
If we want a code of conduct then I would prefer it if we as a group drafted our own code of conduct, use this and similer thread to work it out, then start a new thread with that as the first post and edit that first as it changes, so all following posts in that thread will become redundent, but a valid place to discuss that code.
and to explain it.
it should be short and simple.
But I get the feeling that that is what NYC is woking towards here.
Then if we think other HOPers are stepping out of line just gently point them there. maybe.
To disagree with Jez:
I'm quite happy for there to be silly threads that act as stupid chat, as long as the title is obvious. so that it makes them easy to ignore.
And most threads are not this dry or serious so the occasion for a little spot of humour is often welcome.
Thread Titles
Ok any thread title in capitals is just bad manners.
And thread titles which aren't entirely clear as to what they're about are just irritating.
oh and any introduction thread titled Hello I never read.
Be cool
Drew
__________________
balance
I nicked that sig off dom, I like it
[ 04 October 2002, 12:45: Message edited by: glass ]
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
[Sorry I've got to step out of civilian moderator mode for a second but I'll do so inside these parenthesis so it seems like I'm whispering and not disrupting the conversation... As silly as it sounds, could everyone please refer to me as NYC online. I've been keeping my real name hush hush because my students sign on. Due to the politics at my school it would be fine if they guessed it was me, but uncool if they knew for sure. It sounds crazy but that's office politics when you work with minors... It hadn't been a problem AT ALL for the last year but this past week it's been an epidemic... Sorry, thanks, peace!]
[Sorry I've got to step out of civilian moderator mode for a second but I'll do so inside these parenthesis so it seems like I'm whispering and not disrupting the conversation... As silly as it sounds, could everyone please refer to me as NYC online. I've been keeping my real name hush hush because my students sign on. Due to the politics at my school it would be fine if they guessed it was me, but uncool if they knew for sure. It sounds crazy but that's office politics when you work with minors... It hadn't been a problem AT ALL for the last year but this past week it's been an epidemic... Sorry, thanks, peace!]
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Fair call on the title lines. But not to be mean, you are going to have to admit that this title is a little misleading. It uses a colloquialism, and puts things lightly in what might be a jokey manner. You almost have to know NYC and how he feels at the moment to know how serious he is being.
There is a lot of history and experience of each other that we are taking for granted in this thread. We know how serious this is, because we have been around for a bit.
People who are newer to the site may not know this. They haven't had the conversations we have had previously, they don't even know what the board felt like. They need to be treated gently if they commit a faux pas. As such I am going to say that I am quite disappointed with the way that thing with Paddy was handled earlier in the thread. It could have been handled a lot more kindly.
I know I keep coming back to this, but there are ways of dealing with threads that go off-topic that do not result in anyone feeling hurt or offended. Most people are just in a bubbly mood, and don't realise what they are doing. It is enough to say "returning to the topic", they will get the message cos they ain't dumb.
Fair call on the title lines. But not to be mean, you are going to have to admit that this title is a little misleading. It uses a colloquialism, and puts things lightly in what might be a jokey manner. You almost have to know NYC and how he feels at the moment to know how serious he is being.
There is a lot of history and experience of each other that we are taking for granted in this thread. We know how serious this is, because we have been around for a bit.
People who are newer to the site may not know this. They haven't had the conversations we have had previously, they don't even know what the board felt like. They need to be treated gently if they commit a faux pas. As such I am going to say that I am quite disappointed with the way that thing with Paddy was handled earlier in the thread. It could have been handled a lot more kindly.
I know I keep coming back to this, but there are ways of dealing with threads that go off-topic that do not result in anyone feeling hurt or offended. Most people are just in a bubbly mood, and don't realise what they are doing. It is enough to say "returning to the topic", they will get the message cos they ain't dumb.
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
SILVER Member
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Posted:
Id like to second glass, on the issue of drug reference.
I realise its a lifestyle choice, and good for you if that is the way you want to live your life. But less blatant references in posts that have nothing todo with drug issues, would be preferable.
Lets face it, If it has nothing to do with the topic, and you dont need to say it, then why are you? There are a LOT of young kids (11 up) on this board, and i dont particularaly think its a good idea to go on about how smashed you were last wednesday and you were totally tripping on "whatever" and it was so funny cos a friend of yours was doing poi and nearly set themselves alight.....
we have all seen it, or heard it before. Lets not bother with the same old stories anymore!
Id like to second glass, on the issue of drug reference.
I realise its a lifestyle choice, and good for you if that is the way you want to live your life. But less blatant references in posts that have nothing todo with drug issues, would be preferable.
Lets face it, If it has nothing to do with the topic, and you dont need to say it, then why are you? There are a LOT of young kids (11 up) on this board, and i dont particularaly think its a good idea to go on about how smashed you were last wednesday and you were totally tripping on "whatever" and it was so funny cos a friend of yours was doing poi and nearly set themselves alight.....
we have all seen it, or heard it before. Lets not bother with the same old stories anymore!
Currently on the right side up of the world.
SILVER Member
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Posted:
Amen to the less drug references, there are plenty of boards where people can read up on the effects of drugs and whatnot, we don't need this one to become another.
Especially since there isn't really that much info to inform people properly here.
Amen to the less drug references, there are plenty of boards where people can read up on the effects of drugs and whatnot, we don't need this one to become another.
Especially since there isn't really that much info to inform people properly here.
But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.
member
61 posts
Location: New Zealand
61 posts
Location: New Zealand
Posted:
I think people can say what ever the hell they like- its only a board- not life changing or anything. I think life is for living and what you do is a totally personal choice- free from self doubt.Just live I think- we all know whats right 'deep inside'..yay for incubus.
I think people can say what ever the hell they like- its only a board- not life changing or anything. I think life is for living and what you do is a totally personal choice- free from self doubt.Just live I think- we all know whats right 'deep inside'..yay for incubus.
Loving your life...loving your planet...loving yourself.
HoP Mechanical Engineer
729 posts
Location: OK, USA
729 posts
Location: OK, USA
Posted:
Also in favor of minimizing the drug references.
One thing that kinda frightens me as a newbie (this sort of relates to the Newbie Welcoming issue) is that most of the unfocused chatter tends to bounce between people who know each other, have been friends since before a ton of ppl joined this board, etc. Sometimes I feel like I haven't really established a personality here yet, because everyone's already friends with someone else, and I don't have any, um, shall we say psychotic qualities that make me stand out in the crowd on a message board.
I'd like to see a way for people to try and initiate a conversation that can lead to familiarizing themself with another HoP-er, rather than trying to post something and getting the all-too-common (and somewhat humiliating) "try the search function, that's already been talked about" from an oldie. That sort of thing just takes the fun right out of it and doesn't encourage ppl to open up or post. Then again, I do understand the issue some ppl have with seeing the same technical questions pop up over and over again (BTB weaves, sparkly poi construction, etc).
A very positive thing I'd like to see more of - you guys know how Pele did the instructions on Fire Breathing as a separate section on the site? If something technical gets repeated constantly, maybe it should get "official" and move to a different part of the site, like the tutorials. Everyone would benefit if there was like a "how to make Sparkly Poi" or a more specific "BTB Weave" tutorial on the main page - you don't see constant questions about Fire Breathing or MSDS Information popping up on the tech discussion very often, or am I wrong here?
Also in favor of minimizing the drug references.
One thing that kinda frightens me as a newbie (this sort of relates to the Newbie Welcoming issue) is that most of the unfocused chatter tends to bounce between people who know each other, have been friends since before a ton of ppl joined this board, etc. Sometimes I feel like I haven't really established a personality here yet, because everyone's already friends with someone else, and I don't have any, um, shall we say psychotic qualities that make me stand out in the crowd on a message board.
I'd like to see a way for people to try and initiate a conversation that can lead to familiarizing themself with another HoP-er, rather than trying to post something and getting the all-too-common (and somewhat humiliating) "try the search function, that's already been talked about" from an oldie. That sort of thing just takes the fun right out of it and doesn't encourage ppl to open up or post. Then again, I do understand the issue some ppl have with seeing the same technical questions pop up over and over again (BTB weaves, sparkly poi construction, etc).
A very positive thing I'd like to see more of - you guys know how Pele did the instructions on Fire Breathing as a separate section on the site? If something technical gets repeated constantly, maybe it should get "official" and move to a different part of the site, like the tutorials. Everyone would benefit if there was like a "how to make Sparkly Poi" or a more specific "BTB Weave" tutorial on the main page - you don't see constant questions about Fire Breathing or MSDS Information popping up on the tech discussion very often, or am I wrong here?
What hits the fan is not evenly distributed.
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
Love your smiley coordination, looking smooth.
Nah you aren't wrong. I know quite often I have come in with "do a search" or whatever, and that can seem quite harsh. Especially if I do it without clickable links to tell you where you can find things. For example I could tell you tight now where the BTB weave is. With a clickable link and an explanation that it is in the poi lessons section at the bottom of that page. I could also give you some tips if I wasn't so shocking at it myself
That way you would have some info immediately, as well as knowing where to find more.
{Please pop down to my intro thread for tea & pancakes, Brody. Breakfast and conversation provided}
Love your smiley coordination, looking smooth.
Nah you aren't wrong. I know quite often I have come in with "do a search" or whatever, and that can seem quite harsh. Especially if I do it without clickable links to tell you where you can find things. For example I could tell you tight now where the BTB weave is. With a clickable link and an explanation that it is in the poi lessons section at the bottom of that page. I could also give you some tips if I wasn't so shocking at it myself
That way you would have some info immediately, as well as knowing where to find more.
{Please pop down to my intro thread for tea & pancakes, Brody. Breakfast and conversation provided}
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
SILVER Member
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
100 characters max...
2,996 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posted:
To recap, we have talked about:
1. Welcoming newcomers
2. Hijacking threads
3. No spam
4. Thread titles being specific
And we have been circling around the topic of the appropriate tone to use in conversations
To recap, we have talked about:
1. Welcoming newcomers
2. Hijacking threads
3. No spam
4. Thread titles being specific
And we have been circling around the topic of the appropriate tone to use in conversations
It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.
What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Nice job Rozi. I'm still trying to withhold my actual opinions and focus on what others have said.
I think it would be most effective if we waited a bit longer to let others "Air dirty laundry"... [My apologies for the seemingly vague thread title, maybe it's not as common of a global expression as I thought.]
There have been some REALLY good suggestions on how to improve BUT I think it might still be useful to keep this thread on the "Identify the problem" phase a bit longer. Then, let's look back for solutions. It is with this post that I'm going to try to rename this thread to specifically reflect the intent...
Nice job Rozi. I'm still trying to withhold my actual opinions and focus on what others have said.
I think it would be most effective if we waited a bit longer to let others "Air dirty laundry"... [My apologies for the seemingly vague thread title, maybe it's not as common of a global expression as I thought.]
There have been some REALLY good suggestions on how to improve BUT I think it might still be useful to keep this thread on the "Identify the problem" phase a bit longer. Then, let's look back for solutions. It is with this post that I'm going to try to rename this thread to specifically reflect the intent...
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
addict
416 posts
Location: Hartford, CT USA
416 posts
Location: Hartford, CT USA
Posted:
:clears throat:
just to lend my two cents, even though im not that active of a poster, im quite an avid reader of the boards, and though i havent been here as long as some, ive been here for a bit, and in my opinion, the quality of the social discussion forum has declined...
now dont get me wrong, im not one to scoff at frivolous conversation, but when you have to weed through 6 topics of it to find one decent one, its rather annoying, and because of this i find myself being less and less attracted to the social forum, usually my computer time is pressed, and i cant sit and read through 5 pages of some irrelevant and hard to understand babble...
i agree with the previous suggestions made, and my only thing to add would be to remember that the boards are for everyone, and perhaps most importantly, for those trying to further themselves in this wonderful art/sport, and when a new member comes on the boards, it would be nice if it was a tad simpler for them to understand...
but on a happier note, id just like to point out how the technical forums have kept their integrity fairly intact since ive been here. perhaps this is because they have more of a focused point, but still, cheers to them...
:clears throat:
just to lend my two cents, even though im not that active of a poster, im quite an avid reader of the boards, and though i havent been here as long as some, ive been here for a bit, and in my opinion, the quality of the social discussion forum has declined...
now dont get me wrong, im not one to scoff at frivolous conversation, but when you have to weed through 6 topics of it to find one decent one, its rather annoying, and because of this i find myself being less and less attracted to the social forum, usually my computer time is pressed, and i cant sit and read through 5 pages of some irrelevant and hard to understand babble...
i agree with the previous suggestions made, and my only thing to add would be to remember that the boards are for everyone, and perhaps most importantly, for those trying to further themselves in this wonderful art/sport, and when a new member comes on the boards, it would be nice if it was a tad simpler for them to understand...
but on a happier note, id just like to point out how the technical forums have kept their integrity fairly intact since ive been here. perhaps this is because they have more of a focused point, but still, cheers to them...
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
SILVER Member
old hand
899 posts
Location: New York City, USA
old hand
899 posts
Location: New York City, USA
Posted:
I haven't been on HoP very long, but wanted to jump in on this issue.
It seems that much of the recent problems on HoP, if I understand the change in tone lately, stem from the kliqs that are around.
From those kinds of factions its just a short step to the personal attacks "me and my stupid friends vs. you and your stupid friends."
Its not even what is said that becomes important, its who is saying it. If I lie and all my friends swear to it, that doesn't make what I have said any more valid.
Doing away with kliqs is next to impossible, so I'm not sure how to handle this aspect of the problem.
(As a quick aside, wasn't "Dirty Laundry" a Don Henly song?)
Raph
I haven't been on HoP very long, but wanted to jump in on this issue.
It seems that much of the recent problems on HoP, if I understand the change in tone lately, stem from the kliqs
From those kinds of factions its just a short step to the personal attacks "me and my stupid friends vs. you and your stupid friends."
Its not even what is said that becomes important, its who is saying it. If I lie and all my friends swear to it, that doesn't make what I have said any more valid.
Doing away with kliqs is next to impossible, so I'm not sure how to handle this aspect of the problem.
(As a quick aside, wasn't "Dirty Laundry" a Don Henly song?)
Raph
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Gosh, it seems to me like you guys want an awful lot of rules.
Someone want to try tabulating all these?
Gosh, it seems to me like you guys want an awful lot of rules.
Someone want to try tabulating all these?
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
SILVER Member
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Intrepid Penguin
5,635 posts
Location: Australia
Posted:
i dont think its so much about having rules, as to identifying what the issues are , and being personally accountable!
shouldnt be too much to ask , right?
i dont think its so much about having rules, as to identifying what the issues are , and being personally accountable!
shouldnt be too much to ask , right?
Currently on the right side up of the world.
back from the dead...sort of
884 posts
Location: 43°41'N 79°38'W
884 posts
Location: 43°41'N 79°38'W
Posted:
sorry to offend peeps.
I even thought about not posting that (I *did* see the irony)...but I also thought, it's two lines longs, it won't waste anyone's time, it won't take up much space (as I don't have a sig) and it might provide a light laugh in the middle of a **very** serious conversation...
On the other hand I see where you're coming from...while I don't think a single joke is necessarily ruining a conversation, it might be the one that starts the run of jokes that does ruin a thread. I realize now that that's how that kind of thing gets started, so my bad.
but need we be soooo serious? I like the way HoP self regulates and can joke every once is a while, especially when people make such a social blunder (which lightens the any tension created). could my comment not have been pointed out in a lighter manner, and let the convo get back on track?
Again, I didn't want to throw things off track, I just thought things were very serious and wanted to share a little misunderstanding that I thought was funny. not trying to be a wiseass.
once again, I AM sorry folks. I'll stay out of this now.
sorry to offend peeps.
I even thought about not posting that (I *did* see the irony)...but I also thought, it's two lines longs, it won't waste anyone's time, it won't take up much space (as I don't have a sig) and it might provide a light laugh in the middle of a **very** serious conversation...
On the other hand I see where you're coming from...while I don't think a single joke is necessarily ruining a conversation, it might be the one that starts the run of jokes that does ruin a thread. I realize now that that's how that kind of thing gets started, so my bad.
but need we be soooo serious? I like the way HoP self regulates and can joke every once is a while, especially when people make such a social blunder (which lightens the any tension created). could my comment not have been pointed out in a lighter manner, and let the convo get back on track?
Again, I didn't want to throw things off track, I just thought things were very serious and wanted to share a little misunderstanding that I thought was funny. not trying to be a wiseass.
once again, I AM sorry folks. I'll stay out of this now.
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