Forums > Social Chat > This cant go on!!
Login/Join to ParticipateGod's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
well i just read that a British aid worker, Margaret Hassan, may have been killed. HOW MUCH LONGER!!!! HOW MANY MORE LIVES!!! this has to end soon one way or another, there have been to many deaths on BOTH sides. i have news flash for you all YOU ARE ALL WRONG!!! THERE IS NO RIGHT IN WAR!! THERE WILL BE NO WINNER!! THERE WILL ONLY BE DEATH!! im sorry out of the 5 friends that went to iraq for bush, only 1 has come home, one is dead, and the other 3 i dont know! and now another aide worker, and a WOMAN! have these so called woriors for islam read their holly book?? women are off limits to this kind of [censored]!!!.....................im sorry, but this just broke me, my heart goes out to the family and friends of that poor woman, and i HOPE it was not her (they have not confirmed it yet) but even if its not her it was SOMEONE! SOMEONE THAT HAD A FAMILY, THAT WAS LOVED!!!! im crying from rage at the big picture here.........and that big pisture is death, nothing else, just death..........pray people, please just pray to who or what ever you pray to, pray for this to end, someone has to be listening some were............F>F
well i just read that a British aid worker, Margaret Hassan, may have been killed. HOW MUCH LONGER!!!! HOW MANY MORE LIVES!!! this has to end soon one way or another, there have been to many deaths on BOTH sides. i have news flash for you all YOU ARE ALL WRONG!!! THERE IS NO RIGHT IN WAR!! THERE WILL BE NO WINNER!! THERE WILL ONLY BE DEATH!! im sorry out of the 5 friends that went to iraq for bush, only 1 has come home, one is dead, and the other 3 i dont know! and now another aide worker, and a WOMAN! have these so called woriors for islam read their holly book?? women are off limits to this kind of [censored]!!!.....................im sorry, but this just broke me, my heart goes out to the family and friends of that poor woman, and i HOPE it was not her (they have not confirmed it yet) but even if its not her it was SOMEONE! SOMEONE THAT HAD A FAMILY, THAT WAS LOVED!!!! im crying from rage at the big picture here.........and that big pisture is death, nothing else, just death..........pray people, please just pray to who or what ever you pray to, pray for this to end, someone has to be listening some were............F>F
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
not a stranger
558 posts
Location: wales
558 posts
Location: wales
Posted:
It's a mad, bad, sad world.
And hurting other people will never make it better.
It's a mad, bad, sad world.
And hurting other people will never make it better.
Eat when you're hungry
Sleep where it's dry
No one is ever what they seem
Gabriel King - The Wild Road
SILVER Member
slack rating - 9.5
2,216 posts
Location: Suburbiton, Yoo-Kay, United Kingdom
slack rating - 9.5
2,216 posts
Location: Suburbiton, Yoo-Kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
whoever was responsible for the death of margret hassan isn't doing anyone any favours... especially themselves and the iraqi people. it's the most mindnumbing stupid and cruel act i can think of. it makes me angry too, and exceptionally sad that such a wonderful person can be treated in such a manner. i hope those responsible get what's coming to them... 
whoever was responsible for the death of margret hassan isn't doing anyone any favours... especially themselves and the iraqi people. it's the most mindnumbing stupid and cruel act i can think of. it makes me angry too, and exceptionally sad that such a wonderful person can be treated in such a manner. i hope those responsible get what's coming to them... It is our fantasies that make us real. Without our fantasies we're just a blank monkey' - Terry Pratchett
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
at this point duballsatr, i no longer agree with you, while there is NO JUSTIFICATION for killing and innocent AIDE worker, if the ones that did this "get whats comeing to them" it will just go round and round, there is no end here, cant you see that? we murder an iraqi, they kill a non-iraqi, their mentality is eye for an eye...........IT HAS TO JUST STOP both sides are worng at this point, but our RED NECK ASS, PRIDE HAVEING, PRESIDENT wont just back out........
at this point duballsatr, i no longer agree with you, while there is NO JUSTIFICATION for killing and innocent AIDE worker, if the ones that did this "get whats comeing to them" it will just go round and round, there is no end here, cant you see that? we murder an iraqi, they kill a non-iraqi, their mentality is eye for an eye...........IT HAS TO JUST STOP both sides are worng at this point, but our RED NECK ASS, PRIDE HAVEING, PRESIDENT wont just back out........
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
SILVER Member
slack rating - 9.5
2,216 posts
Location: Suburbiton, Yoo-Kay, United Kingdom
slack rating - 9.5
2,216 posts
Location: Suburbiton, Yoo-Kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
sorry dude, when i say get what's coming to them i don't mean american missiles. i mean i hope that in the great big cycle of karma something extremley nasty happens to them at some point wether in this life or the next which makes them regret their complete disregard for humanity. i should have realised that sounded wrong....
sorry dude, when i say get what's coming to them i don't mean american missiles. i mean i hope that in the great big cycle of karma something extremley nasty happens to them at some point wether in this life or the next which makes them regret their complete disregard for humanity. i should have realised that sounded wrong....
It is our fantasies that make us real. Without our fantasies we're just a blank monkey' - Terry Pratchett
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
id like to post two quotes right now, one from a movie and one from one of the most peaceful ppl in history:
"Has anything youve done made your life any better?" -American History X
"An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind." - Ghandi
i agree with all of this.. if both mentalities is an eye for an eye, then this will just keep going in a vicious cycle.. and its spreading too.. hatred breeds hatred.. i dont know if you guys heard about this, but in holland a filmmaker was killed by a islam fanatic a few weeks back.. since then there have been threats coming from muslim fundamentalists that several politicians are on the list for next victims, but also from the other side, mosques have been burned to the ground by dutch nationalists.. and my guess is that this will only get worse, not only in holland but all over the world.. pls correct me if im wrong, but dont most religions, including islam, teach tolerance? i dont see any tolerance of other ppls beliefs or opinions
id like to post two quotes right now, one from a movie and one from one of the most peaceful ppl in history:
"Has anything youve done made your life any better?" -American History X
"An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind." - Ghandi
i agree with all of this.. if both mentalities is an eye for an eye, then this will just keep going in a vicious cycle.. and its spreading too.. hatred breeds hatred.. i dont know if you guys heard about this, but in holland a filmmaker was killed by a islam fanatic a few weeks back.. since then there have been threats coming from muslim fundamentalists that several politicians are on the list for next victims, but also from the other side, mosques have been burned to the ground by dutch nationalists.. and my guess is that this will only get worse, not only in holland but all over the world.. pls correct me if im wrong, but dont most religions, including islam, teach tolerance? i dont see any tolerance of other ppls beliefs or opinions
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
You seem to be missing the grand picture that you're talking about. Just pulling out and leaving it will cause more problems than you can imagine. Right now there are many groups fighting for power within Iraq, until there is a semi stable system established pulling out is just going to open the door for much more bloodshed and corruption, and the possibility of a large scale war in the middle east.
You need to support the troops, support the PEOPLE who think they are doing the right thing for their country. They are the ones putting their lives on the line. The reason this isn't over is because the public doesn't support the troops enough to supply them and END the war that's already started.
People need to stop complaining about the fact that the war started, complaining isn't going to fix it. Maybe if our boys had the funding they need to be able to effectivly do the things they need to do to end things it will end. The war has started, yes it was probably the wrong thing to do but it's done, theres nothing anyone can do about it now. Refusing to support the troops that are over there simply because you don't believe we should be there is doing nothing but dooming them.
EDITED_BY: Lurch (1100657195)
You seem to be missing the grand picture that you're talking about. Just pulling out and leaving it will cause more problems than you can imagine. Right now there are many groups fighting for power within Iraq, until there is a semi stable system established pulling out is just going to open the door for much more bloodshed and corruption, and the possibility of a large scale war in the middle east.
You need to support the troops, support the PEOPLE who think they are doing the right thing for their country. They are the ones putting their lives on the line. The reason this isn't over is because the public doesn't support the troops enough to supply them and END the war that's already started.
People need to stop complaining about the fact that the war started, complaining isn't going to fix it. Maybe if our boys had the funding they need to be able to effectivly do the things they need to do to end things it will end. The war has started, yes it was probably the wrong thing to do but it's done, theres nothing anyone can do about it now. Refusing to support the troops that are over there simply because you don't believe we should be there is doing nothing but dooming them.
EDITED_BY: Lurch (1100657195)
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
the problem is that both sides think they are doing the right thing.. in my opinion NOBODY has the right to tell others how to live, but i agree, whats done is done and complaining wont help..
however, i dont think its funding that the troops need.. there are billions of dollars being spent on that particular war weekly.. its just that nobody will give up, everybody is fighting for what they believe..EVERYBODY HAS THE RIGHT TO THEIR OWN OPINION, BUT DONT FORCE THAT OPINION ON OTHERS!!
Written by: Lurch
You need to support the troops, support the PEOPLE who think they are doing the right thing. They are the ones putting their lives on the line.
People need to stop complaining about the fact that the war started, complaining isn't going to fix it. Maybe if our boys had the funding they need to be able to effectivly do the things they need to do to end things it will end.
the problem is that both sides think they are doing the right thing.. in my opinion NOBODY has the right to tell others how to live, but i agree, whats done is done and complaining wont help..
however, i dont think its funding that the troops need.. there are billions of dollars being spent on that particular war weekly.. its just that nobody will give up, everybody is fighting for what they believe..EVERYBODY HAS THE RIGHT TO THEIR OWN OPINION, BUT DONT FORCE THAT OPINION ON OTHERS!!
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
Funding is what they need. From the start of the war they were warned that we don't have enough ground troops to effectivly police the nation for a peaceful rebuilding.
There aren't enough troops, and not enough equipment for our boys to do their job to the best of their ability. There is a reason theres so many 'support our troops' groups out there collecting money to buy and send essential things like body armor and boots overseas to our soldiers. The government isn't supplying it as well as they should be.
I agree that everyone has the right to their opinion. But remember we aren't fighting a war for the joy of it. The US is damned if we do damned if we don't. If we pull out now we'll be blamed for the bloodshed and chaos that will follow. The best solution in my eyes is to put everything we have into doing what needs to be done, not pussyfooting around the problem, or trying to do things cheaply to save money and supplies... I want this war over as much as you do but if we stop now all is for nothing.
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. - George Orwell
Funding is what they need. From the start of the war they were warned that we don't have enough ground troops to effectivly police the nation for a peaceful rebuilding.
There aren't enough troops, and not enough equipment for our boys to do their job to the best of their ability. There is a reason theres so many 'support our troops' groups out there collecting money to buy and send essential things like body armor and boots overseas to our soldiers. The government isn't supplying it as well as they should be.
I agree that everyone has the right to their opinion. But remember we aren't fighting a war for the joy of it. The US is damned if we do damned if we don't. If we pull out now we'll be blamed for the bloodshed and chaos that will follow. The best solution in my eyes is to put everything we have into doing what needs to be done, not pussyfooting around the problem, or trying to do things cheaply to save money and supplies... I want this war over as much as you do but if we stop now all is for nothing.
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. - George Orwell
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
ok, i see what youre saying.. i dont know enough about the funding and supply of essentials to go into a hot debate about it
and yes i agree with you that they have to stay until the end of it, for better or worse.. theres only one thing that bothers me and that is that i see this conflict turning into a mix between vietnam and the arab-israeli conflict: guerilla warfare from the 'enemy' so very difficult if not impossible to sift out and defeat, and a clash of beliefs and ethics that (so it seems) cannot be compromised upon..
ok, i see what youre saying.. i dont know enough about the funding and supply of essentials to go into a hot debate about it
and yes i agree with you that they have to stay until the end of it, for better or worse.. theres only one thing that bothers me and that is that i see this conflict turning into a mix between vietnam and the arab-israeli conflict: guerilla warfare from the 'enemy' so very difficult if not impossible to sift out and defeat, and a clash of beliefs and ethics that (so it seems) cannot be compromised upon.. God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
ok lurch, have youy lost ANY ONE in this war? I HAVE!!! so forgive me if im against it at this point.......and remember all the reasons we went in to iraq WERE WRONG! WMD ring a bell? its the wrong war in the wrong place PERIOD!
stickman, yes i read that story as well, and your right hate spreads like wild fire.......
ok lurch, have youy lost ANY ONE in this war? I HAVE!!! so forgive me if im against it at this point.......and remember all the reasons we went in to iraq WERE WRONG! WMD ring a bell? its the wrong war in the wrong place PERIOD!
stickman, yes i read that story as well, and your right hate spreads like wild fire.......
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Margaret Hassan was an Irish/Iraqi aid worker who had converted to Islam and had been working for the Iraqi people for 30 years.
The outrage over her murder has been felt on all sides - from family, friends and politicians in the west, to the people on the streets of Iraq. The general feeling is that this murder happened when US troops arrived in Fallujah, the hostage-takers panicked and shot her because they didn't know what else to do.
This is what I heard on the news, hopefully she was spared the beheading.
This war should never have happened. However, the invasion could have been a success if it had been handled correctly - with the full participation of the Iraqi people.
But it has been made worse (and continues to be made worse) by the heavy-handed actions of US soldiers, their policies of internment and human rights abuses - these things that inspires the insurgents. Young men see their innocent friends killed by US troops and that inspires them to fight back. It is understandable.
In the months since the invasion, law and order has broken down, making the country safe for terrorists (not Iraqi insurgents - there is a difference) to set up base.
I agree that US troops cannot pull out now. They are needed to clear up the mess they have made. However, tactics need to be changed. It must become a peace-keeping rather than invasive mission. Instead of bulldozing over cities and towns, killing everything in their path, US soldiers MUST try to negotiate.
The Iraqi people do not want them there. But they need law and order. If the US is so insistent on giving Iraq its freedom - then actions speak louder than words. Ask the Iraqi people what they want instead of telling them.
My hopes are that the death of this aid worker will make political leaders think of a peaceful way forward - and that the other aid workers in Iraq do not pull out.
x
Margaret Hassan was an Irish/Iraqi aid worker who had converted to Islam and had been working for the Iraqi people for 30 years.
The outrage over her murder has been felt on all sides - from family, friends and politicians in the west, to the people on the streets of Iraq. The general feeling is that this murder happened when US troops arrived in Fallujah, the hostage-takers panicked and shot her because they didn't know what else to do.
This is what I heard on the news, hopefully she was spared the beheading.
This war should never have happened. However, the invasion could have been a success if it had been handled correctly - with the full participation of the Iraqi people.
But it has been made worse (and continues to be made worse) by the heavy-handed actions of US soldiers, their policies of internment and human rights abuses - these things that inspires the insurgents. Young men see their innocent friends killed by US troops and that inspires them to fight back. It is understandable.
In the months since the invasion, law and order has broken down, making the country safe for terrorists (not Iraqi insurgents - there is a difference) to set up base.
I agree that US troops cannot pull out now. They are needed to clear up the mess they have made. However, tactics need to be changed. It must become a peace-keeping rather than invasive mission. Instead of bulldozing over cities and towns, killing everything in their path, US soldiers MUST try to negotiate.
The Iraqi people do not want them there. But they need law and order. If the US is so insistent on giving Iraq its freedom - then actions speak louder than words. Ask the Iraqi people what they want instead of telling them.
My hopes are that the death of this aid worker will make political leaders think of a peaceful way forward - and that the other aid workers in Iraq do not pull out.
x
Getting to the other side 
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
that was verry well put poise........
that was verry well put poise........
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
i always find this funny (not haha funny of course, just interesting to compare)
according to the online websters dictionary the definition of terrorist is: the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion
the definition of terror then is: violence (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands..
my history teacher in high school asked us this too. the gave the definition of a terrorist to be "someone who uses violence for political or ideological reasons"
is this not a little hypocritical of GWB to be calling those ppl terrorists.. did he not also use violence to intimidate, even remove, a government and eventually want them to live the way they do? did he not also use violence for ideological reasons? his view of future iraq (or so he tells the world) is for it to have a democracy like the US because he thinks that is the correct way to live..
i think the term terrorist should not be used so lightly and quickly, not by bush and not by us.. insurgents would be a better word however poise already made clear that there is a difference.. insurgents tend to fight back only because their way of life is threatened or their country occupied..
anyone see fahrenheit 9/11? one of the things that shocked me the most was that bush said he would be angry too if his country was occupied.. hmmmmm.. makes you think and wonder if he is seeing the bigger picture.. whether or not he can imagine this war from the iraqi ppls point of view.
i always find this funny (not haha funny of course, just interesting to compare)
according to the online websters dictionary the definition of terrorist is: the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion
the definition of terror then is: violence (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands..
my history teacher in high school asked us this too. the gave the definition of a terrorist to be "someone who uses violence for political or ideological reasons"
is this not a little hypocritical of GWB to be calling those ppl terrorists.. did he not also use violence to intimidate, even remove, a government and eventually want them to live the way they do? did he not also use violence for ideological reasons? his view of future iraq (or so he tells the world) is for it to have a democracy like the US because he thinks that is the correct way to live..
i think the term terrorist should not be used so lightly and quickly, not by bush and not by us.. insurgents would be a better word however poise already made clear that there is a difference.. insurgents tend to fight back only because their way of life is threatened or their country occupied..
anyone see fahrenheit 9/11? one of the things that shocked me the most was that bush said he would be angry too if his country was occupied.. hmmmmm.. makes you think and wonder if he is seeing the bigger picture.. whether or not he can imagine this war from the iraqi ppls point of view.
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
The numbers of 'insurgents' that we're killing is troubling too. Were there really THOUSANDS of 'terrorists' in Iraq before we got there?
And what will the sons and daughters of these thousands think of the US?
At least the next time someone flies a plane into one of our buildings, Americans won't be dumb enough to ask "Why us?"
Bah... they probably will. After all, we're HELPING them by killing them, right?
The numbers of 'insurgents' that we're killing is troubling too. Were there really THOUSANDS of 'terrorists' in Iraq before we got there?
And what will the sons and daughters of these thousands think of the US?
At least the next time someone flies a plane into one of our buildings, Americans won't be dumb enough to ask "Why us?"
Bah... they probably will. After all, we're HELPING them by killing them, right?
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Stickman,
Here are some definitions that I use that I find helpful.
TERRORISM: When a non-military group uses force against non-military targets.
WAR CRIMES: When a military uses force against non-military targets.
GUERILLA WARFARE: When a non-military group uses force against military targets.
Bush is not a terrorist. However, I believe that he may be a war criminal.
Stickman,
Here are some definitions that I use that I find helpful.
TERRORISM: When a non-military group uses force against non-military targets.
WAR CRIMES: When a military uses force against non-military targets.
GUERILLA WARFARE: When a non-military group uses force against military targets.
Bush is not a terrorist. However, I believe that he may be a war criminal.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Hrm.... I'm not so sure about the third one.
You can certainly have military group using guerilla warfare. I wouldn't call the North Vietnamese "Non-military group" during the US-Vietnam war.
Hrm.... I'm not so sure about the third one.
You can certainly have military group using guerilla warfare. I wouldn't call the North Vietnamese "Non-military group" during the US-Vietnam war.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
Lightning : guerilla warfare = unconventional war tactics
the us revolution was guerilla, this was the insurgants are useing gurilla tactics
Lightning : guerilla warfare = unconventional war tactics
the us revolution was guerilla, this was the insurgants are useing gurilla tactics
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
Yes, I have lost friends in this war. They were fighting for their (our) country they deserve our respect not people saying well they shouldn't be there anyways when they die. Everyone over there is there by choice, we have a volunteer army right now. Noone was drafted.
I'm not saying that the war was 'right' or wrong, thats an entirely different debate. But regardless of how wrong the war is it is still started. Complaining about it and protesting it isn't going to do one bit of good. This may very well turn into the next Vietnam with that attitude. There was anger taken out on the vets by our own people when they came home. Soldiers go to war, put their lives on the line thinking they're fighting for their country and doing the right thing only to come back to the homeland and get urine thrown in their face and be called baby killers.
Like I said before I want this war over as much as anyone. Our people are putting their lives on the line for a country that looks like they don't want our help. However the media is biased, all media is biased, so I have to take my word from friends that are over there. The horrors of war are just publicized for the masses now, this war isn't very different from any other.
Yes, I have lost friends in this war. They were fighting for their (our) country they deserve our respect not people saying well they shouldn't be there anyways when they die. Everyone over there is there by choice, we have a volunteer army right now. Noone was drafted.
I'm not saying that the war was 'right' or wrong, thats an entirely different debate. But regardless of how wrong the war is it is still started. Complaining about it and protesting it isn't going to do one bit of good. This may very well turn into the next Vietnam with that attitude. There was anger taken out on the vets by our own people when they came home. Soldiers go to war, put their lives on the line thinking they're fighting for their country and doing the right thing only to come back to the homeland and get urine thrown in their face and be called baby killers.
Like I said before I want this war over as much as anyone. Our people are putting their lives on the line for a country that looks like they don't want our help. However the media is biased, all media is biased, so I have to take my word from friends that are over there. The horrors of war are just publicized for the masses now, this war isn't very different from any other.
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
you missunderstand me, i have nothing but respect to our soldiers, and i will never disrespect them, and at this point (so save us both from geting personal or more upset and aventualy REALLY pissed) we need to agree to disagree, and leave it at that..........
you missunderstand me, i have nothing but respect to our soldiers, and i will never disrespect them, and at this point (so save us both from geting personal or more upset and aventualy REALLY pissed) we need to agree to disagree, and leave it at that..........
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Ha. I'd never thought of George Washington as an insurgant.
Written by: Fryed Fish
Lightning : guerilla warfare = unconventional war tactics
the us revolution was guerilla, this was the insurgants are useing gurilla tactics
Ha. I'd never thought of George Washington as an insurgant.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
i ment this war, not this was...sorry
i ment this war, not this was...sorry You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
if that first one is correct then the ppl killing US and other soldiers are not terrorists either.. i think that word is used too often without thinking about what it actually means
Written by: ...Lightning...
Stickman,
Here are some definitions that I use that I find helpful.
TERRORISM: When a non-military group uses force against non-military targets.
WAR CRIMES: When a military uses force against non-military targets.
GUERILLA WARFARE: When a non-military group uses force against military targets.
Bush is not a terrorist. However, I believe that he may be a war criminal.
if that first one is correct then the ppl killing US and other soldiers are not terrorists either.. i think that word is used too often without thinking about what it actually means
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
hey but lurch, exactly because you have lost loved ones in this war i think your opinion then becomes more biases too.. you hear the stories from the one that came back and base your opinion on that.. dont get me wrong thats perfectly fine, but then dont complain that the media is biased.. with which i agree by the way
hey but lurch, exactly because you have lost loved ones in this war i think your opinion then becomes more biases too.. you hear the stories from the one that came back and base your opinion on that.. dont get me wrong thats perfectly fine, but then dont complain that the media is biased.. with which i agree by the way
not a stranger
558 posts
Location: wales
558 posts
Location: wales
Posted:
I saw something on TV last week.
There was fighting, in Falluja I suppose, and there was an Iraqi in an alley between two buildings, they said he was wounded and trapped, he also seemed to be firing a gun.
Another soldier, American I think, went between the buildings and shot him dead. Then he came back and said 'He's done'.The soldier who killed the man, and the others who were with him, showed no apparent fear and appeared to be in no danger even though the guy was firing
This isn't a criticism of America, or support for Iraq, cos I'm sure the same thing has been done and said by every side in every war since time began. But it just seemed so horrible, so cold. .
It was just the way he said it, 'he's done', it was like the toaster had just popped, or the kettle had clicked off.
It was so weird to think I had just 'seen' someone killed in such a matter of fact way.
I know I probably seem very naive, even foolish, but it was awful really.
War, it can't be right, can it?
I saw something on TV last week.
There was fighting, in Falluja I suppose, and there was an Iraqi in an alley between two buildings, they said he was wounded and trapped, he also seemed to be firing a gun.
Another soldier, American I think, went between the buildings and shot him dead. Then he came back and said 'He's done'.The soldier who killed the man, and the others who were with him, showed no apparent fear and appeared to be in no danger even though the guy was firing
This isn't a criticism of America, or support for Iraq, cos I'm sure the same thing has been done and said by every side in every war since time began. But it just seemed so horrible, so cold. .
It was just the way he said it, 'he's done', it was like the toaster had just popped, or the kettle had clicked off.
It was so weird to think I had just 'seen' someone killed in such a matter of fact way.
I know I probably seem very naive, even foolish, but it was awful really.
War, it can't be right, can it?
Eat when you're hungry
Sleep where it's dry
No one is ever what they seem
Gabriel King - The Wild Road
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
heres something i thought of this morning..
i wrote this on a diff thread too, but in holland there has been some social unrest due to the murder of a filmproducer by an islam fundamentalist resulting in hatred, threats and destruction of religious facilities on both sides..
i was wondering if ppl think that all this spreading of islamic fundamentalism within europe as well as other places in the world is the result of the US declaring war on Iraq..
i think it has something to do with it, but not everything.. i think that the 'hatred' and disagreement already existed but that i was only manifested after all the killings started in iraq..
opinions???
heres something i thought of this morning..
i wrote this on a diff thread too, but in holland there has been some social unrest due to the murder of a filmproducer by an islam fundamentalist resulting in hatred, threats and destruction of religious facilities on both sides..
i was wondering if ppl think that all this spreading of islamic fundamentalism within europe as well as other places in the world is the result of the US declaring war on Iraq..
i think it has something to do with it, but not everything.. i think that the 'hatred' and disagreement already existed but that i was only manifested after all the killings started in iraq..
opinions???
God's illgitament son
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
1,489 posts
Location: state of confusion
Posted:
i would agree with you stick, the hate has always been an underline issue, but has become more prominent in wake of the war
i would agree with you stick, the hate has always been an underline issue, but has become more prominent in wake of the war
You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
reaction to the work of theo van gogh vs reaction to the work of salman rushdie.
compare and contrast.
i truly hate the media propagating this 'worldwide network of islamic fundamentalist terrorists' illusion.
its bullsh*t as far as i'm concerned.
look at this from reuters: inflammatory rumour mill.
in 1993 rushdie's norwegian publisher william nygaard was wounded in an attack outside his house - i wonder if another muslim fundamentalist terrorist cell was really behind that attack too?
i suppose it couldn't have been since that illusion hadn't been created yet.
two almost identical acts 15 years apart - could it be that there are just individuals who feel strongly enogh about their religion to want to cause harm to people who attack it?
churches have recently been subjected to arson attacks in holland due to the reaction to this film - was that the work of a muslim fundamentalist terrorist cell too?!
if so then who the f*ck is responsible for all the mosques being burnt down...?
reaction to the work of theo van gogh vs reaction to the work of salman rushdie.
compare and contrast.
i truly hate the media propagating this 'worldwide network of islamic fundamentalist terrorists' illusion.
its bullsh*t as far as i'm concerned.
look at this from reuters: inflammatory rumour mill.
in 1993 rushdie's norwegian publisher william nygaard was wounded in an attack outside his house - i wonder if another muslim fundamentalist terrorist cell was really behind that attack too?
i suppose it couldn't have been since that illusion hadn't been created yet.
two almost identical acts 15 years apart - could it be that there are just individuals who feel strongly enogh about their religion to want to cause harm to people who attack it?
churches have recently been subjected to arson attacks in holland due to the reaction to this film - was that the work of a muslim fundamentalist terrorist cell too?!
if so then who the f*ck is responsible for all the mosques being burnt down...?
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
the ppl responsible for that are dutch nationalist pigs!!
hate breeds hate, and this is a perfect example of it.. im not saying that only the islamic fundamentalists are violent and cause unjustified acts of violence, but burning down mosques didnt start until the death of theo van gogh..
i think there is a big problem with respecting other ppls beliefs and just respecting religions in general in holland. and besides, NOBODY, not in holland nor in the states nor in andora or anywhere else should people be allowed to say what others should believe or how they should live..
the ppl responsible for that are dutch nationalist pigs!!
hate breeds hate, and this is a perfect example of it.. im not saying that only the islamic fundamentalists are violent and cause unjustified acts of violence, but burning down mosques didnt start until the death of theo van gogh..
i think there is a big problem with respecting other ppls beliefs and just respecting religions in general in holland. and besides, NOBODY, not in holland nor in the states nor in andora or anywhere else should people be allowed to say what others should believe or how they should live..
SILVER Member
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
Posted:
I always thought terrorism was defined as:
Using violence to achieve political ends.
maybe not...?
I always thought terrorism was defined as:
Using violence to achieve political ends.
maybe not...?
World Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||
Posted:
thats what i thought as well.. using violent means for political or ideological ends.. but some ppl seem to diagree
thats what i thought as well.. using violent means for political or ideological ends.. but some ppl seem to diagree
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