Forums > Beginner Staff Moves > Contact rolls: need new ideas!

Posted: 24th Mar 2003
again apologies for the slowness in the nooest vid coming online, but it will be there soon i promise and its got loads of staff stuff so peruse.

and even more apologies for not having time to sit down and wrte some stuff for ys... but have a look back thru for contact threads if you haven't already..... see ys
R

Holistic Spinner (I hope)

Posted: 24th Mar 2003
yo,

sounds like you got a lot of handle onna horisontal, but try go for vertical next, hava look at the contact threads, most of which are submerged now though underuse. when you got a double jeasus come back to us.

oh, and you have the armrolls up yes? try armrolls (horisontal) down the arn and round the front of the neck. much harder but it alows the 'full steve'.

keep on truckin....


N?

This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

Posted: 24th Mar 2003
Vertical? How would one get the horrizontal momentum to push the staff down the length of the arms while its spinning vertical? Or do you move your body around the staff in this move? Or does it go from a front/back plain down, not side/side vertical plain?

I'll have to go searching for this one. Sounds cool, and just me trying to figure out what you mean has already spurned some new ideas.

Posted: 26th Mar 2003
yup, move the body underneath, do your searches, I cant explain again.... (well, maybe)


N?

This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

Posted: 27th Mar 2003
You can also do vertical contact by pushing your arm against the staff as it is rolling...

An easy way to get into it is to start off with a horizontal roll (say from right arm across shoulder and onto left arm).

Then allow the rolling staff to drop 'behind' your arm until it is almost vertical and then push your arm backwards quickly (turning the body in the sam direction helps too).

That will give the staff enough pressure to stay on the arm and keep rolling down.

who knows, maybe you could get it to do a barrell roll like a airplane???

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Posted: 28th Mar 2003
Ohhh, ok, I see what you mean by vertical now. Like the one Glass's video shows about 45 seconds in where he takes his hand backwards under his armpit and rolls the staff over shoulders and neck? I got that one down, but your right my vertical rolls aren't all that numerous yet.

Charles, you mean like around the neck, and then pushing the shoulder up to change the direction of the staff? I also find it helps to step back I think on this one, but I don't remember my exact method for it. I do a move where I do a figure 8 using the back of my hand, bringing the staff into an armpit stall when coming up from behind the back, and then use my whole arm to start it rotating around the opposite side of the neck and as it comes back around to the side I started on again, I push my shoulder up to get into a vertical plane again, or tuck my head to the other side to let it rotate around my shoulder and catch under my armpit.

What is this Jesus thingy I've heard about from Nix (?? If I got your nick wrong +) I'm sorry, just been reading past posts)? Sounds interesting.

Also, through past searches I have found something called a fishtail? Is this what Glass starts doing about 35 seconds in? I've been working on getting that down (Using only back of hand)... though I currently have a tendancy to hit myself in the head somehow... I did discover my armpit stall/round the neck transfer this way though!

Oh, BTW I swing with a 5'5" staff, so I hope you don't need a shorter staff for any of these.

Posted: 28th Mar 2003
When they are ready, The moves will come from inside you. But its not about getting more moves.

maybe, You could stop trying to get the water and spend a few months polising cars and painting fences.

where you from? Why so secretive?

Posted: 28th Mar 2003
Haha, a little town called Medina in the (so Im told) great state of Ohio. Not secretive, just lazy.

Haha and thanks for the tip Obi Wan. Or should I call you Master Roshi? (Dragonball reference). Besides, without stealing moves off of you guys I couldn't have gotten as far as I have! Plus somehow any move that I happen to fall upon seems to have already been discovered by everyone here, and maybe you can keep me from smashing myself in the head/knee/foot/arm and everything else I tend to hit the first few times I try a move.

Oh, and I think I found a video where a girl does a fishtail with a baton... she keeps her hand level with the ground (back of hand up) and then makes the fishy move described I think... Off to learn another few transitions for this neat little trick.

Posted: 29th Mar 2003
Ok, I finally finished reading that whole post (wow). Haha it's funny to see all the Buddhist and Taoist philosophy that pops up in people here... Kinda nice to see Im not the only one who enjoys fire so much.

Actually I had been spinning a broomhandle around for about a month (learning the basics on my own, figure 8, tosses, etc.) before a friend suggested I try it on fire. We attached rags to the end and lit it on fire and ever since then I've been addicted. I read a lot of books on spirituality (Haha amateur theologian), and have been following a lot of meditative paths in the last year as well. I often find that I kinda go into a moving meditative state when I spin (I can't focus on anything else, forces my brain to cut out all extraneous everyday crap and it feels like I channel Reiki subconciously while I do it too...).

Anyway, I learned about how the staff moves on my own by experimentation and already had my own style down before I found this site. For instance, I sometimes find I start incorporating Kung Fu stances when I play as well. I just kinda got addicted to full contact work after your video... quite frankly I had sworn off contact work before this because I didn't think it could add a lot to my spinning. Thank you for showing me I was wrong, as now I find contact work to be an integral part of my spinning.

Did make me think about my poi practice though... Darn left hand still has trouble controlling plains for some reason and now I think I have to return to the basics to fix that.

Posted: 29th Mar 2003
cool
meditative
kung fu stances

why did you waste your time stealing what was already given freely.
That video was there because i'd spent too long typing moves.

If you want more challenge, learn the, slower and cleaner plans.
then with a shorter staff.

But the best stuff come from experimenting with the joy of simple things.

Posted: 29th Mar 2003
Indeed. Actually I don't care for shorter stalves, though I have two baton size ones for doubles if I ever get around to learning them well. I've tried long doubles but I just don't feel it yet with those, need more practice. Just looks all funky when I try to do it right now...

Though I did start trying staff in one hand, one poi in the other (three balls of fire)... just playin with it but its kinda cool. The down the arm and up the other thing took me two weeks to nail. I found it was a lot easier if I started rolling it down not on the center, but about 2/3 up the staff. It gives it more fluidity and momentum for when I roll it down my leg. I have a feeling I'll have to clean that up more though if I want to start getting it to spin on my shoulderblades and such... right now if I try it usually ends up rolling down my back, which is fine because I came up with some transfers that look like I *meant to do that*, but thats the kind of precision only practice will bring me now. Just that it get's boring trying the same thing over and over and over and sometimes I need something new to try. I always seem to learn the move I can't get when I stop trying.

One thing that has been bothering me is the elbow rolls... I'm just now starting to feel them and I've been trying them off and on for two weeks. I've been kinda stuck on learning to use the back of my hand more as this has opened up several cool transfers, etc. in my style. Now if I could only get that fishtail down too...

Havn't gotten to a point where I can do it all without my hands, yet. Back of hand catches are also next on my list... last time I tried one I spranged my thumb (Which is why I find myself suddenly interested in moves that don't use fingers ).

Posted: 3rd Apr 2003
Oh I just figured out some crazy vertical roll (At least it feels like vertical... maybe a little diagonal at times...). Spinning reverse in my right hand I let it roll over my wrist and up my forearm. Once it is about center I roll my forearm around the now vertical staff by pushing my body toward it and bending at the elbow in to my chest (With arm horizontal). It then rolls over my bicep and then comes the tricky part (for me anyway). While still walking toward the right, I let my right foot pivot on the toe so my toes are pointing inward, and turn my body 180 degrees by bringing my left foot around and planting it with toes pointing to what was my right, turning myself around. Seems to need a lot of speed here since you are trying to outrun the staff from nailing you in the back of the head.

From here I either let it roll over my bicep and into a new forward spin, or another one I'm playing with, but havn't figured out that well, as I can't really explain HOW I get it to do this... but somehow when I turn my body if I position my arms right I can get it to roll over my right arm and transfer it to my left arm, and then mirror what I did on the right arm (Moving my body out to what was my left, now my new right), extending it out and rolling it over my forearm and into my other hand for whatever's next...

Is anyone familiar with this? I can't figure out how I do it because I have to go so fast to keep myself from suffering massive head trauma from this new baulky staff, so its like a guessing game every time i try...

Well Im off to work. Chaio.

Posted: 4th Apr 2003
yo,

yeah, i understand, this is the elbow roll to elbow roll with a turn on the back to get it across. straingt turns across the back are either all about timing (if your turning 180, take the time of the body turn from the speed of the staff turn) or plane, where the move starts off behind you in the wall plane and rolls over without turning the body.

try: staff goes backwards over right shoulder, turn 180 to the left, staff comes forward over left shoulder. this should give you the idea, then start working on the same move across the front of your chest.

keep on truckin....


N?

This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

Posted: 10th Apr 2003
Thank you nix, with that advice I nailed this move today. I dont feel comfortable doing in front of the neck yet because I have a tendancy to hit my adams apple and cause myself much pain. One day though. Would this move be anything like the double jesus? I couldn't find a whole lot through the searches for this one...

Now here's a new one I'm playing with (read I'm trying to build strength and flexability for). I roll it down my left arm from a helicopter, around the back of my neck, and then up my right arm to the bicep level, just enough to clear my head as the front end comes around. As the front comes around I push my right arm up so it rolls under my armpit and around my body, at which point I turn about 90 degrees and let it roll down to my foot where I kick it up. Now here's the new part I'm trying to get... if one were able to raise the left leg up REAL high, catching the staff just below the waist on the foot and then pushing the leg upward with the momentum of the staff it would roll around the leg to the knee, changing plains from horizontal to vertical, and then turning back right quickly would make it roll around the knee and you could catch it with the left hand or perhaps even roll it somewhere else like up the back of the hand into an elbow roll...

Two problems so far though: a) momentum seems to wane after the toss so its hard to get it to roll without raising the leg REALLY REALLY high like almost vertical... I am not that flexible unfortunatly. Which leads me to b) I keep falling over backwards when I try this.