the best smiles are the ones you lead to
Written by: Doc LightningWritten by: sagetree
doc, do you have a response to this? killing civilians is NOT the only way to fight terrorism. it's actually a way to join the ranks of a terrorist and to continue the cycle that leads to more terrorism in the future.
My response is how does one go in there and kill terrorists without breaking anything else when the terrorists use civilians as shields?
You keep saying "do it without killing civilians." But HOW?
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
Written by: Professor Alan Dershowitz
The laws of war and the rules of morality must adapt to these realities. An analogy to domestic criminal law is instructive: A bank robber who takes a teller hostage and fires at police from behind his human shield is guilty of murder if the police, in an effort to stop the robber from shooting, accidentally kill the hostage. The same should be true of terrorists who use civilians as shields from behind whom they fire their rockets. The terrorists must be held legally and morally responsible for the deaths of the civilians, even if the direct physical cause was an Israeli rocket aimed at those targeting Israeli citizens.
Written by: Human Rights Watch
(Beirut, July 24, 2006) – Israel has used artillery-fired cluster munitions in populated areas of Lebanon, Human Rights Watch said today. Researchers on the ground in Lebanon confirmed that a cluster munitions attack on the village of Blida on July 19 killed one and wounded at least 12 civilians, including seven children. Human Rights Watch researchers also photographed cluster munitions in the arsenal of Israeli artillery teams on the Israel-Lebanon border.
"Cluster munitions are unacceptably inaccurate and unreliable weapons when used around civilians," said Kenneth Roth, executive director of Human Rights Watch. "They should never be used in populated areas."
According to eyewitnesses and survivors of the attack interviewed by Human Rights Watch, Israel fired several artillery-fired cluster munitions at Blida around 3 p.m. on July 19. The witnesses described how the artillery shells dropped hundreds of cluster submunitions on the village. They clearly described the submunitions as smaller projectiles that emerged from their larger shells.
Written by: diary of Lebanese American Reem Mobassaleh (who was in lebanon last week)
Do not think for a second that anything about these attacks is simply aimed at weakening Hizballah. It is weakening the whole country, trying to break us all. Today, the Israeli army gave the people of the Southern Lebanese town of Marwahin two hours to leave their village. Out of fear, they packed up and started to leave. Shortly after they left their village, Israeli helicopters targeted their cars, killing 23 people, 9 of whom were children. These were not long-range missiles that accidentally landed on the fleeing civilians. These were targeted missiles fired from helicopters just above them. The majority of the more than 150 people that Israel has killed in the last few days are children. They are demolishing the country, having bombed both Muslim and Christian areas. All forms of civilian infrastructure have been hit. And Israel has precluded us from any form of escape. By air is impossible since they've decimated our airport. By sea is impossible since Israeli battleships line our shore and have bombed our ports. By land is impossible since Israel has bombed all the roads between Lebanon and Syria and demolished all connecting roads and bridges in the southern half of the country.
Written by:
Birgit, given the background of the middle-east, the abduction of two soldiers was little more than an excuse Israel gave to start this war, and to pull out of peace negotiations with Hamas.
He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.
Nietzsche
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
Written by: sagetreeWritten by: Professor Alan Dershowitz
The laws of war and the rules of morality must adapt to these realities. An analogy to domestic criminal law is instructive: A bank robber who takes a teller hostage and fires at police from behind his human shield is guilty of murder if the police, in an effort to stop the robber from shooting, accidentally kill the hostage. The same should be true of terrorists who use civilians as shields from behind whom they fire their rockets. The terrorists must be held legally and morally responsible for the deaths of the civilians, even if the direct physical cause was an Israeli rocket aimed at those targeting Israeli citizens.
good point and i agree
but what about:Written by: Human Rights Watch
(Beirut, July 24, 2006) – Israel has used artillery-fired cluster munitions in populated areas of Lebanon, Human Rights Watch said today. Researchers on the ground in Lebanon confirmed that a cluster munitions attack on the village of Blida on July 19 killed one and wounded at least 12 civilians, including seven children. Human Rights Watch researchers also photographed cluster munitions in the arsenal of Israeli artillery teams on the Israel-Lebanon border.
"Cluster munitions are unacceptably inaccurate and unreliable weapons when used around civilians," said Kenneth Roth, executive director of Human Rights Watch. "They should never be used in populated areas."
According to eyewitnesses and survivors of the attack interviewed by Human Rights Watch, Israel fired several artillery-fired cluster munitions at Blida around 3 p.m. on July 19. The witnesses described how the artillery shells dropped hundreds of cluster submunitions on the village. They clearly described the submunitions as smaller projectiles that emerged from their larger shells.
and:Written by: diary of Lebanese American Reem Mobassaleh (who was in lebanon last week)
Today, the Israeli army gave the people of the Southern Lebanese town of Marwahin two hours to leave their village. Out of fear, they packed up and started to leave. Shortly after they left their village, Israeli helicopters targeted their cars, killing 23 people, 9 of whom were children. These were not long-range missiles that accidentally landed on the fleeing civilians. These were targeted missiles fired from helicopters just above them. The majority of the more than 150 people that Israel has killed in the last few days are children.
My response: How much warning did Hezbollah give civilians before launching rockets into their home? NONE.
Who, exactly, was Hezbollah's first attack aimed at? CIVILIANS. No military target to be seen.
Hezbollah has also bragged that more women and children have been killed than armed men. I find this disgusting.
Israel fights under the Geneva Convention. They warn civilians to evacuate. They do hit civilian targets because it is impossible to be surgical.
Hezbollah hides behind civilians and targets civilians.
And this is why we need a wall. And a stern warning that the first rocket fired over the wall means that Israel will invade and take the country. And they can do it if they want to. Israel has, person-for-person, the best military in the world.-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
Written by: Birgit
right... that's just ridiculous. 1 rocket and Israel invades the country? Like, even if the majority of Lebanese or Syrians or Palestinians (if that counts as a country in that respect) decides to leave Israel alone, and 1 militant fires off a rocket, Israel's given the right to take the whole country? Sorry, that's just a REALLY bad idea. But it'd probably get the support from the USA
Well done for hitting that UN/Unifil post and killing 4 people who I suppose hid Hezboolah terrorists, too, by the way!
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
Written by: Birgit
Hmmm. I somehow doubt the UN attacked Israel. Unless I'm entirely misinformed.
Written by: andrealee
We just did a little of that here in Canada and managed to arrest 20 terrorists,and confiscate an enormous amount of bomb materials and weaponry, with absolutely no collateral damage.These people were prepared to bomb the parliment buildings, kill the PM, and other assorted acts of terrorism.
If the current intelligence and spy systems are inadequate to manage this on a large scale, such as might be requirred in that region, then they had better get busy developing them fast. This approach has a number of problems, of course, but at least is potentially less damaging than bombing civilians. Though the loss of privacy and personal rights may in the long term be a fairly significant societal concern for individuals and populations.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
Written by: andrealee
No Mike, I dont think it is the same thing. But finding terrorists in Canada is actually quite an accomplishment- we dont have all that many ya know. Do you have any ideas other than walls? If the problem is cultural, how do we go about changing a culture? Can we? They do change, but how can one predict, influence or control that change?
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
Written by: Doc Lightning
My response: How much warning did Hezbollah give civilians before launching rockets into their home? NONE.
Who, exactly, was Hezbollah's first attack aimed at? CIVILIANS. No military target to be seen.
Hezbollah has also bragged that more women and children have been killed than armed men. I find this disgusting.
Sagetree, I'm awaiting your answer as to how one kills terrorists and guerillas hiding among civilians without hurting the civilians.
Written by: Birgit
right... that's just ridiculous. 1 rocket and Israel invades the country?
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
Written by: Reuters
Israel has also been waging an offensive in Gaza since June 28 to recover a soldier seized by Palestinian militants. Israeli forces killed 10 Palestinians, including seven militants and a three-year-old child, on Wednesday, medics and witnesses said. Altogether 130 Palestinians have been killed in the offensive.
Written by: Reuters
Al Jazeera television said 13 Israeli soldiers had been killed during clashes with Hizbollah guerrillas in a south Lebanese village. Israeli medics reported heavy casualties.
Hizbollah sources said their fighters had foiled Israeli attempts to evacuate casualties from Bint Jbeil, four km (2.5 miles) inside Lebanon. "Our men can hear the screams of their wounded calling for help," one source said.
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
Written by: sagetree
i don't know of an effective way to attack terrorist hiding behind civilians without killing civilians but that doesn't mean i will support the killing of children and innocent people in any way.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
Written by: Patriarch917
Pull it up on google maps. I challenge you to find a better vacation spot. Look at the areas above and below the gaza strip to see what can be done with that area.
Written by: NYC
Mike, you might find it interesting to know that the news coverage out here (UK) is GROSSLY anti-israeli. One of the news casters even said something like "Hezbolla rockets keep raining down on Israel as Israeli artillary shoots back over the border. Both sides seem equally guilty of trying to kill as many civilians as possible."
kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more
Written by: Yell fire!Written by: Patriarch917
Pull it up on google maps. I challenge you to find a better vacation spot. Look at the areas above and below the gaza strip to see what can be done with that area.
Patriarch, you certainly managed to extract a lot of information just by looking at the area using Google maps! I'm very impressed. Or maybe some of your info about the paradise that the Palestinians were given by the big hearted Israelis came from your neigbourhood synagog?
I happen to have friends in the UK who've spent a lot of time volunteering in the occupied territories, including Gaza. What they have seen out there is a little different from what you describe, which makes me wonder who exactly has been feeding you this information.
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
Written by: NYCWritten by: Birgit
right... that's just ridiculous. 1 rocket and Israel invades the country?
ONE rocket?!? Wow, the BBC is worse than I thought!
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?
"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?