Forums > Beginner Staff Moves > Doublestaff 5 Beat Quartertime Weave
Login/Join to Participateenthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
Lets bring some Poi terms over here
Anybody played with these? The 5 beat one can achieve by using a fingerspin and the same hand motion like in a 5 beat Poi weave. Turning offers even more beats (Spider concept).
My first post in the Staff Section so please be gentle with me
andy
Lets bring some Poi terms over here
Anybody played with these? The 5 beat one can achieve by using a fingerspin and the same hand motion like in a 5 beat Poi weave. Turning offers even more beats (Spider concept).
My first post in the Staff Section so please be gentle with me
andyTo learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
GOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posted:
welcome to the dark side whats the spider concept?
welcome to the dark side
whats the spider concept? Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
GOLD Member
old hand
834 posts
Location: Wellington somerset, UK
old hand
834 posts
Location: Wellington somerset, UK
Posted:
if you turn, its like having more legs?
if you turn, its like having more legs?
Drawings by chalk minds, strech between the stars
Kyle Mclean-
Contact without dance is like sex without wiggling.
A) it does feel as good
B) it does not look as good on film
GOLD Member
Pirate Ninja
3,882 posts
Location: Galway/Ireland
Pirate Ninja
3,882 posts
Location: Galway/Ireland
Posted:
Welcome 
As i understood it (meaning i read it here somewhere and it vaugely made sense) its not possible to do a proper 3beat weave with sticks.... i cant tesity to this though. It simply means i cant do it
Its nice to see your staying true to form and confusing the hell out of me though. Welcome to darkside indeed.
yowsa
how can you do a five beat? (well you just explained that didnt you )
sounds sweet, any clips?...
and
what is the spider concept (i think i saw a clip of rev doing something nuts like this)
EDITED_BY: ado-p (1105355246)
Welcome As i understood it (meaning i read it here somewhere and it vaugely made sense) its not possible to do a proper 3beat weave with sticks.... i cant tesity to this though. It simply means i cant do it
Its nice to see your staying true to form and confusing the hell out of me though. Welcome to darkside indeed.
yowsa
how can you do a five beat? (well you just explained that didnt you
)sounds sweet, any clips?...
and
what is the spider concept (i think i saw a clip of rev doing something nuts like this)
EDITED_BY: ado-p (1105355246)
Love is the law.
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
Arashi !! ARAAAAAAASHIIIIIII !!!!!!! We need you over here !!!!!
Americans . . . they are never around when you need them. But if we all hold hands and shout his name very very loud, I think he will come over to us to the staff section. What do you think kids? Shall we all call Arashi now? OK, all together now
ARAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII !!!!!!!!!!
Actually Benjamen, you could do a search - In the Poi section
And Dark side ??
! Poi rulz !
Written by:
whats the spider concept?
Arashi !! ARAAAAAAASHIIIIIII !!!!!!! We need you over here !!!!!
Americans . . . they are never around when you need them. But if we all hold hands and shout his name very very loud, I think he will come over to us to the staff section. What do you think kids? Shall we all call Arashi now? OK, all together now
ARAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII !!!!!!!!!!
Actually Benjamen, you could do a search - In the Poi section
And Dark side ??
! Poi rulz ! To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
I completely forgot:
I completely forgot:
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
GOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posted:
urg fine ill go into that deep dark place where scary things with string reside
urg fine ill go into that deep dark place where scary things with string reside
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
I thought it was the case that you could do a three beat weave as long as a) the sticks are short, or b) you're holding the sticks significantly offcentre.
It's easy to do a butterfly weave with sticks. As is a normal no throws, contact, or hand manipulation ttn weave. (You can tell there are a lot of variations of TTN with sticks)
To do a five beat normal weave? Would be interesting to see. And something I feel mo-seph and simian would like. I would, however, turn my nose up at it, till summer time when I get bored and decide to learn it for a laugh when it's sunny sometime.
I thought it was the case that you could do a three beat weave as long as a) the sticks are short, or b) you're holding the sticks significantly offcentre.
It's easy to do a butterfly weave with sticks. As is a normal no throws, contact, or hand manipulation ttn weave. (You can tell there are a lot of variations of TTN with sticks)
To do a five beat normal weave? Would be interesting to see. And something I feel mo-seph and simian would like. I would, however, turn my nose up at it, till summer time when I get bored and decide to learn it for a laugh when it's sunny sometime.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
GOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posted:
"spider - follow time, spin in follow time anywhere, you can think of it as one move (arashi classification) or as a family (ww cross follow etc traditional club swinging classification) and as a way of spinning. It becomes a game to extend your spider, add btb, add wall plane, add long arm etc etc. )then go do a split time spider then butterfly, then parallel etc)"
i still dont get it
edited for appropriate placing of "'s
EDITED_BY: ben-ja-men (1105367424)
"spider - follow time, spin in follow time anywhere, you can think of it as one move (arashi classification) or as a family (ww cross follow etc traditional club swinging classification) and as a way of spinning. It becomes a game to extend your spider, add btb, add wall plane, add long arm etc etc. )then go do a split time spider then butterfly, then parallel etc)"
i still dont get it
edited for appropriate placing of "'s
EDITED_BY: ben-ja-men (1105367424)
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
DIAMOND Member
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
The Ministry of Manipulation
2,523 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Posted:
Ben You could use more of these things " "
3 beat with 2 staffs its probably the only doulbe staff move I ever learnt/ worked out, one time when Lisa went to the toilet but then lisa came back from the toilet so I stopped doing it. and I hold the sticks in the middle
5 beat with 2 hula hoops yes I worked on that and its possible, but very reachy, so I guess its the same with 2 staffs too. But its too contorted for my taste
I'm sure mr poibox could make it look good though
Ben You could use more of these things " "
3 beat with 2 staffs its probably the only doulbe staff move I ever learnt/ worked out, one time when Lisa went to the toilet but then lisa came back from the toilet so I stopped doing it. and I hold the sticks in the middle
5 beat with 2 hula hoops yes I worked on that and its possible, but very reachy, so I guess its the same with 2 staffs too. But its too contorted for my taste
I'm sure mr poibox could make it look good though
GOLD Member
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
just lost .... evil init
2,474 posts
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posted:
mmmm i see
i still dont get this whole spider thing, lisa can u go to the toilet so i can work this stuff out
poibox any chance of a video?
mmmm i see
i still dont get this whole spider thing, lisa can u go to the toilet so i can work this stuff out poibox any chance of a video?
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
The general problem with staff weaving is that when you swap hand positions, the back end of the staffs want to go through your opposite forearm. I know of four ways out:
- hold the sticks near one end, so that the back end is very short
- split your hands apart, so the back ends can come between them (and using short sticks makes this less noticeable)
- let the staff lock against the back of your wrist (which gives you an asymmetric pattern with a 3 beat). This is kinda contorted, as you spend half the time with locked arms.
- develop detachable wrists. This is proving difficult.
I'll have to try the five beat fingerspins though, they sound cool, and might get rid of some of the contortions I'm having by trying to do it all with snakes.
Butterfly weaves are definitely where it's at with stick weaving though
The general problem with staff weaving is that when you swap hand positions, the back end of the staffs want to go through your opposite forearm. I know of four ways out:
- hold the sticks near one end, so that the back end is very short
- split your hands apart, so the back ends can come between them (and using short sticks makes this less noticeable)
- let the staff lock against the back of your wrist (which gives you an asymmetric pattern with a 3 beat). This is kinda contorted, as you spend half the time with locked arms.
- develop detachable wrists. This is proving difficult.
I'll have to try the five beat fingerspins though, they sound cool, and might get rid of some of the contortions I'm having by trying to do it all with snakes.
Butterfly weaves are definitely where it's at with stick weaving though
monkeys ate my brain
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
I think the quartertime bit might be really helpful (but it's late and I can't spin in my room), because it might mean that something doesn't have to be on the other side of something else because it's already there. Or something.
For example, the cross (quartertime) btb waistwrap (can I call it a waistwrap, meg? I forget...) thing that looks so lovely in knox's video gets an extra beat than the parallel version because it's quarter time. I think.
There must also be two different quarter time versions of things - one where the right hand leads by 90 degrees, and one where it follows by 90 degrees. Or does it happen that only one version will work for any particular move? Or does the lead change on each side? Is there a hard version and an easy version? What do you poi kids do?
I think the quartertime bit might be really helpful (but it's late and I can't spin in my room), because it might mean that something doesn't have to be on the other side of something else because it's already there. Or something.
For example, the cross (quartertime) btb waistwrap (can I call it a waistwrap, meg? I forget...) thing that looks so lovely in knox's video gets an extra beat than the parallel version because it's quarter time. I think.
There must also be two different quarter time versions of things - one where the right hand leads by 90 degrees, and one where it follows by 90 degrees. Or does it happen that only one version will work for any particular move? Or does the lead change on each side? Is there a hard version and an easy version? What do you poi kids do?
monkeys ate my brain
SILVER Member
Tantamount to fatuity
15,967 posts
Location: Down the road, United Kingdom
Tantamount to fatuity
15,967 posts
Location: Down the road, United Kingdom
Posted:
brilliant!
Lisa (i'm assuming it's the same one) inspired me to do snakes/cradles/shotgun/whatever the frigging things are called doubles entirely composed of fingerspins.
It's quite tricky but i've mostly nailed it now.
Haven't tackled the 3 beat issue for doubles for a long time. It all got a bit tricky when some bright spark banned fingerspins from the equation. 5 beat, i suspect, would be impossible without fingerspinnage though methinks.
But then i don't do poi so what would i know?
Written by: Glåss
one time when Lisa went to the toilet but then lisa came back from the toilet so I stopped doing it.
brilliant!
Lisa (i'm assuming it's the same one) inspired me to do snakes/cradles/shotgun/whatever the frigging things are called doubles entirely composed of fingerspins.
It's quite tricky but i've mostly nailed it now.
Haven't tackled the 3 beat issue for doubles for a long time. It all got a bit tricky when some bright spark banned fingerspins from the equation. 5 beat, i suspect, would be impossible without fingerspinnage though methinks.
But then i don't do poi so what would i know?
Meh
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
5 beat is doable but mightily contorted. 6 is easier, cos symmetric contortions turn into body movement
5 beat is doable but mightily contorted. 6 is easier, cos symmetric contortions turn into body movement
monkeys ate my brain
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
Somehow funny because the "has a weave even beats or not" discussion was a "Poi Thing" some time ago. Weaves have uneven beats due to the fact that one has a change of the leading Poi ermmm Staff - this way creating symmetry! But I could be wrong
What makes it interesting with staffs is the fact that changing the Crossover Points can add extra beats to your system which is not the case with Poi ([Old link] wouldnt add extra beats in a Poi weave but in a Double-Staff weave
)
Is there a Staff Graemlin ?!?
andy
Written by:
6 is easier, cos symmetric
Somehow funny because the "has a weave even beats or not" discussion was a "Poi Thing" some time ago. Weaves have uneven beats due to the fact that one has a change of the leading Poi ermmm Staff - this way creating symmetry! But I could be wrong
What makes it interesting with staffs is the fact that changing the Crossover Points can add extra beats to your system which is not the case with Poi ([Old link] wouldnt add extra beats in a Poi weave but in a Double-Staff weave
)Is there a Staff Graemlin ?!?
andy
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
The three-beat weave (as in poi and clubs) is asymmetrical.
Nothings impossible, but a 5-beat weave with staffs is out there.
Good Luck with that one.
Cheers
The three-beat weave (as in poi and clubs) is asymmetrical.
Nothings impossible, but a 5-beat weave with staffs is out there.
Good Luck with that one.
Cheers
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
First up, I should have said "sympathetic" contortions, or something - if your left arm is doing something that pulls your torso to your left, and so is your right arm, then you can use body movement to make them both easy, which is what happens in a 6 beat.
Really? I thought it was symmetrical
First up, I should have said "sympathetic" contortions, or something - if your left arm is doing something that pulls your torso to your left, and so is your right arm, then you can use body movement to make them both easy, which is what happens in a 6 beat.
Written by: Stone
The three-beat weave (as in poi and clubs) is asymmetrical.
Really? I thought it was symmetrical
monkeys ate my brain
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
each hand does a different thing on each side but the entire pattern is symmetric.... ain't it? If you had a mirror in front of you the left side would look like the right...
each hand does a different thing on each side but the entire pattern is symmetric.... ain't it? If you had a mirror in front of you the left side would look like the right...
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
3,149 posts
Location: London
3,149 posts
Location: London
Posted:
You can't do a continuous uneven beat pattern with a stick unless you're using fingerspins or handrolls. That just gradually adds twists to your arm and quickly enters the realm of physical impossibility.
i reckon i do 3b split time, without fingerspins, holding 4ft staffs in centre, with wrists together (although seperating the hands makes it much prettier)
It has even beats and it's symmetrical (both sticks do 1.5 rotations either side of the body, and cross the body plane at the same time)
moseph - just got 5bt without fingerspins, cheers It is indeed doable but mightily contorted. Now whats this about 6bt?
Played with quartertiming my 3b and 5b just now... it's very confusing. Things seem suddenly easier for a bit, and then i'm a big tangle of arm and stick. Any answers to moseph's questions about quartertiming would be appreciated
Written by: Poibox II
Somehow funny because the "has a weave even beats or not" discussion was a "Poi Thing" some time ago. Weaves have uneven beats due to the fact that one has a change of the leading Poi ermmm Staff - this way creating symmetry! But I could be wrong
You can't do a continuous uneven beat pattern with a stick unless you're using fingerspins or handrolls. That just gradually adds twists to your arm and quickly enters the realm of physical impossibility.
i reckon i do 3b split time, without fingerspins, holding 4ft staffs in centre, with wrists together (although seperating the hands makes it much prettier)
It has even beats and it's symmetrical (both sticks do 1.5 rotations either side of the body, and cross the body plane at the same time)
moseph - just got 5bt without fingerspins, cheers
It is indeed doable but mightily contorted. Now whats this about 6bt?Played with quartertiming my 3b and 5b just now... it's very confusing. Things seem suddenly easier for a bit, and then i'm a big tangle of arm and stick. Any answers to moseph's questions about quartertiming would be appreciated
Written by: mo-seph
There must also be two different quarter time versions of things - one where the right hand leads by 90 degrees, and one where it follows by 90 degrees. Or does it happen that only one version will work for any particular move? Or does the lead change on each side? Is there a hard version and an easy version?
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
There are 2 different kinds but who dont relate to the leading end problem.
a.) Right Staff - Right Hand. Left Staff - Left Hand.
b.) Right Staff - Left Hand. Left Staff - Right Hand.
The leading end/ Beat count is another issue. Are there half beats? What about different changes within Quartertime, Quarter beats
I think NYC would love this topic
I think the half beat issue adds up to a 6 beat weave (0.5 beats on each side), so 7 should be possible . . . hmmmm . . . .
Written by:
There must also be two different quarter time versions of things - one where the right hand leads by 90 degrees, and one where it follows by 90 degrees. Or does it happen that only one version will work for any particular move? Or does the lead change on each side? Is there a hard version and an easy version? What do you poi kids do?
There are 2 different kinds but who dont relate to the leading end problem.
a.) Right Staff - Right Hand. Left Staff - Left Hand.
b.) Right Staff - Left Hand. Left Staff - Right Hand.
The leading end/ Beat count is another issue. Are there half beats? What about different changes within Quartertime, Quarter beats
I think NYC would love this topic
I think the half beat issue adds up to a 6 beat weave (0.5 beats on each side
), so 7 should be possible . . . hmmmm . . . . To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
I don't quite get what you mean...
What I mean, is if you hold your sticks in a cross, with one vertiacal, and one horizontal in wheel plane, then there are two different ways you could be holding the verical staff - thumb up, and thumb down. Moving between them is equivalent to half a rotation, so it makes the difference whether the vertical staff is 1/4 rotation in front of the horizontal one, or 1/4 rotation behind it. This must be a distinction in poi too?
I think if you're using snakes/lockups, you could have 3/4 offsets as well.
Back to the weaving things, here's how I think about it (which might help for this topic in general)
This is all wheel plane, so warm up your wheel plane snakes... To start a weave, put both sticks on one side, horizontal in wheel plane. There is a base position, which is where each staff is exactly as if you were doing wheel plane fig8s with each staff, and they are at a point where they're both on the same side.
That's a bit confusing, so lets say both staffs are on the left. The left arm is forearm going up, wrist inwards. The right hand is above the left hand, knuckles upwards. It's about where your hands would be if they were holding a baseball bat horizontally over your shoulder ready to hit a very short person on the head.
If you weave from this position, you can get a 2 beat weave. No worries.
To get a 3 beat weave, you neet to offset your sticks by half a rotation. The easy way to do this is to move the lower hand (the left hand in the description above) into a wrist lockup, so that the forearm is horizontal, wrist up, and the staff rests on the inside forearm and goes outside the upper arm.
From here you do half a beat of unwrapping (bring your arms apart to let the ends through if you need to), carry across to the other side (1/2 beat) and then half a beat of wrapping up on the other side will get you to the same position on the other side.
Making sense?
Now to do higher beat weaves, you need to introduce more offsets. For a four beat weave, get into the three beat weave starting position, then take the top stick and rotate it 180 degrees in the same direction that you rotated the bottom staff. This puts you with your right arm across your body, with the inside of the wrist facing outwards and the knuckles down. Now you do a whole rotation of unwrapping, carry across and a whole rotation of wrapping up on the other side.
For five beats, you need a 1 1/2 rotation offset, so get into four beat position, and rotate your bottom arm from the shoulder until your elbow is pointing forwards, then do 1 1/2 rotations unwrapping, carry and wrap up again.
For six, I'm afraid I can't explain the body positions, but it's the logical extension, i.e. getting an extra half lock on the top arm. I have a suspicion that I might have been then doing some of the unwrapping behind me, which would be cheating, so I'll have to go have a play.
This is, of course only one way of doing it.
For a 3 beat, you need 1/2 rotation offset. We got that from the bottom staff in the above example. You can also do it with the top staff instead, which means you use the other flavour of snakes (sorry, don't have good terminology). This is a nice alternative, as it's much easier to isolate, and isolated staff weaves are lovely.
For a 4 beat, you need 1 rotation. We got that by putting half a rotation on each staff, but you could put a whole rotation on 1 staff, which would get you quite an interesting weave. (I can do it with biros sitting at my desk, but I'm not sure if it'll translate to 1.5m sticks... should do, though)
So here's the relevant bit. Those were all half rotation offsets. It would surely be possible to put in extra quarter rotations, and get families of quarter time weaves.
By which I mean I'm going to get off my ass and have a play
I don't quite get what you mean...
What I mean, is if you hold your sticks in a cross, with one vertiacal, and one horizontal in wheel plane, then there are two different ways you could be holding the verical staff - thumb up, and thumb down. Moving between them is equivalent to half a rotation, so it makes the difference whether the vertical staff is 1/4 rotation in front of the horizontal one, or 1/4 rotation behind it. This must be a distinction in poi too?
I think if you're using snakes/lockups, you could have 3/4 offsets as well.
Back to the weaving things, here's how I think about it (which might help for this topic in general)
This is all wheel plane, so warm up your wheel plane snakes... To start a weave, put both sticks on one side, horizontal in wheel plane. There is a base position, which is where each staff is exactly as if you were doing wheel plane fig8s with each staff, and they are at a point where they're both on the same side.
That's a bit confusing, so lets say both staffs are on the left. The left arm is forearm going up, wrist inwards. The right hand is above the left hand, knuckles upwards. It's about where your hands would be if they were holding a baseball bat horizontally over your shoulder ready to hit a very short person on the head.
If you weave from this position, you can get a 2 beat weave. No worries.
To get a 3 beat weave, you neet to offset your sticks by half a rotation. The easy way to do this is to move the lower hand (the left hand in the description above) into a wrist lockup, so that the forearm is horizontal, wrist up, and the staff rests on the inside forearm and goes outside the upper arm.
From here you do half a beat of unwrapping (bring your arms apart to let the ends through if you need to), carry across to the other side (1/2 beat) and then half a beat of wrapping up on the other side will get you to the same position on the other side.
Making sense?
Now to do higher beat weaves, you need to introduce more offsets. For a four beat weave, get into the three beat weave starting position, then take the top stick and rotate it 180 degrees in the same direction that you rotated the bottom staff. This puts you with your right arm across your body, with the inside of the wrist facing outwards and the knuckles down. Now you do a whole rotation of unwrapping, carry across and a whole rotation of wrapping up on the other side.
For five beats, you need a 1 1/2 rotation offset, so get into four beat position, and rotate your bottom arm from the shoulder until your elbow is pointing forwards, then do 1 1/2 rotations unwrapping, carry and wrap up again.
For six, I'm afraid I can't explain the body positions, but it's the logical extension, i.e. getting an extra half lock on the top arm. I have a suspicion that I might have been then doing some of the unwrapping behind me, which would be cheating, so I'll have to go have a play.
This is, of course only one way of doing it.
For a 3 beat, you need 1/2 rotation offset. We got that from the bottom staff in the above example. You can also do it with the top staff instead, which means you use the other flavour of snakes (sorry, don't have good terminology). This is a nice alternative, as it's much easier to isolate, and isolated staff weaves are lovely.
For a 4 beat, you need 1 rotation. We got that by putting half a rotation on each staff, but you could put a whole rotation on 1 staff, which would get you quite an interesting weave. (I can do it with biros sitting at my desk, but I'm not sure if it'll translate to 1.5m sticks... should do, though)
So here's the relevant bit
. Those were all half rotation offsets. It would surely be possible to put in extra quarter rotations, and get families of quarter time weaves.By which I mean I'm going to get off my ass and have a play
monkeys ate my brain
GOLD Member
Pirate Ninja
3,882 posts
Location: Galway/Ireland
Pirate Ninja
3,882 posts
Location: Galway/Ireland
Posted:
mo-seph
thanks man, i finally understand what this is all about. even to the point whre i realised that i am already able to so a simple version of it. thanks again to the cork circus.
thats probably the clearest explanation of something that is stupidly complicated to explain i have every read.
*bows*
mo-seph
thanks man, i finally understand what this is all about. even to the point whre i realised that i am already able to so a simple version of it. thanks again to the cork circus.
thats probably the clearest explanation of something that is stupidly complicated to explain i have every read.
*bows*
Love is the law.
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
mo-seph - I really like your thread - What you describe is exactly Poi style with 100% different semantics as in the Poi Forum!
And this is where we are different
I totally agree with the two different ways of holding the staff - Same dirrection hands, different direction hands - For parallel Staffs
But with Cross staff its much more complicated. If you dont do fingerspin.
If you use fingerspin (and this is why I love it) the direction of the hands does not matter anymore.
So what now matters in quartertime: Which hand is holding which staff. In a cross position one staff is left and one is right, and they cannot change sides. So you can either hold the left with the left hand (and right with the right hand) or left with the right hand right with the left hand....
Makes sense?!?
mo-seph - I really like your thread - What you describe is exactly Poi style with 100% different semantics as in the Poi Forum!
Written by:
What I mean, is if you hold your sticks in a cross, with one vertiacal, and one horizontal in wheel plane, then there are two different ways you could be holding the verical staff - thumb up, and thumb down
And this is where we are different
I totally agree with the two different ways of holding the staff - Same dirrection hands, different direction hands - For parallel Staffs
But with Cross staff its much more complicated. If you dont do fingerspin.
If you use fingerspin (and this is why I love it) the direction of the hands does not matter anymore.
So what now matters in quartertime: Which hand is holding which staff. In a cross position one staff is left and one is right, and they cannot change sides. So you can either hold the left with the left hand (and right with the right hand) or left with the right hand right with the left hand....
Makes sense?!?
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
enthusiast
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
523 posts
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posted:
I think so. But let me check...
If the sticks stay at 90 degrees, and the centres stay next to each other, then the staffs cannot swap what side of each other they are, so the staff in the left hand will always be to the left of the staff in the right hand (if that's the way they start, but it could be opposite), and because of fingerspinning you can ignore any hand positions relative to the staffs.
So you have a version where the right hand holds the staff which is on the right of the other one, and one where the right hand holds the staff which is on the left of the other one.
If you agree with that, then I think I understand
How close are you keeping the centres?
Since I recently got 5 bt poi weaving, I should be able to have a go at this...
As for beat counting, I think I have to read more on what you poi people have been saying about it - I think it's a contentious issue (I got the impression that people would say there are 6 beats in a 3 beat weave, but I might be confuzzled). Personally, I know what 180 degrees is, and I know what 360 degrees is, and that makes sense to me, but I'll happily translate into whatever language people agree on
I still think that leading and following quartertime exist, but they might not be possible, and maybe with sticks they are the same... I don't know them with poi, and I can't quite visualise....
Hmmmm...
:thoughtfullbutslightlydrunkgraemlin:
I think so. But let me check...
If the sticks stay at 90 degrees, and the centres stay next to each other, then the staffs cannot swap what side of each other they are, so the staff in the left hand will always be to the left of the staff in the right hand (if that's the way they start, but it could be opposite), and because of fingerspinning you can ignore any hand positions relative to the staffs.
So you have a version where the right hand holds the staff which is on the right of the other one, and one where the right hand holds the staff which is on the left of the other one.
If you agree with that, then I think I understand
How close are you keeping the centres?
Since I recently got 5 bt poi weaving, I should be able to have a go at this...
As for beat counting, I think I have to read more on what you poi people have been saying about it - I think it's a contentious issue (I got the impression that people would say there are 6 beats in a 3 beat weave, but I might be confuzzled). Personally, I know what 180 degrees is, and I know what 360 degrees is, and that makes sense to me, but I'll happily translate into whatever language people agree on
I still think that leading and following quartertime exist, but they might not be possible, and maybe with sticks they are the same... I don't know them with poi, and I can't quite visualise....
Hmmmm...
:thoughtfullbutslightlydrunkgraemlin:
monkeys ate my brain
GOLD Member
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
mo-seph
Yes, I agree it’s confusing
This is what I meant:
Jillings Lesson 11. Follow time Three beat weave.
Cheers
mo-seph
Yes, I agree it’s confusing
This is what I meant:
Jillings Lesson 11. Follow time Three beat weave.
Cheers
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
enthusiast
384 posts
Location: West LA
384 posts
Location: West LA
Posted:
- Agree 100%
Doesnt matter?!? From close to loose - depends on my mood
They exists, and are possible, but its harder to describe it with Poi (This is what I tried to explain in the [Old link] )
The advantage with staffs - you have two tangible ends -> easier to explain
I like this thread
Written by:
if you agree with that, then I think I understand
- Agree 100%Written by:
How close are you keeping the centres?
Doesnt matter?!? From close to loose - depends on my mood
Written by:
still think that leading and following quartertime exist, but they might not be possible, and maybe with sticks they are the same... I don't know them with poi, and I can't quite visualise....
They exists, and are possible, but its harder to describe it with Poi (This is what I tried to explain in the [Old link] )
The advantage with staffs - you have two tangible ends -> easier to explain
I like this thread
To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .
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