Forums > Social Discussion > the word poi is not japanese!!!
Login/Join to Participateresident bagpiper
342 posts
Location: Vermont, USA
342 posts
Location: Vermont, USA
Posted:
i have had several people tell me that poi is japanese for ball, and that "japanese children have been plaing with these poi on strings for thousands of years"
i have a limited knowledge of japanese, so i used a dictionary and some translation software for help...
i tried poi, and the romaji poii and found nothing (i also tried the corresponding katakana and hiragana)
i thried ball in the english side and found no references to poi or poii
POI IS MAORI!!!!!!
where is this belief coming from??
i have had several people tell me that poi is japanese for ball, and that "japanese children have been plaing with these poi on strings for thousands of years"
i have a limited knowledge of japanese, so i used a dictionary and some translation software for help...
i tried poi, and the romaji poii and found nothing (i also tried the corresponding katakana and hiragana)
i thried ball in the english side and found no references to poi or poii
POI IS MAORI!!!!!!
where is this belief coming from??
Q:What's the difference between the Great Highland Bagpipes and the Northumbrian Pipes?
A:The Great Highland Pipes burn longer.
BRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
Not here...
It says on the first page here that Poi is Maori.
Not here...
It says on the first page here that Poi is Maori.
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
BRONZE Member
Former Raver Invader... Not sure what i am now...
284 posts
Location: Southern California, USA
Former Raver Invader... Not sure what i am now...
284 posts
Location: Southern California, USA
Posted:
maybe you shuold carry around a bucn of pieces of paper that has the history of poi from some website and has all the sources written on them and put some kind of adherent on en so you can slap people that try to tell you it's japenese with it and it'll stick to their face
maybe you shuold carry around a bucn of pieces of paper that has the history of poi from some website and has all the sources written on them and put some kind of adherent on en so you can slap people that try to tell you it's japenese with it and it'll stick to their face
Clean for 6 months and counting... ah yeah, that's nice.
SILVER Member
Tantamount to fatuity
15,967 posts
Location: Down the road, United Kingdom
Tantamount to fatuity
15,967 posts
Location: Down the road, United Kingdom
Posted:
Neither is the word rabbit.
glad we cleared that up.
Written by: singed grumpy
the word poi is not japanese
Neither is the word rabbit.
glad we cleared that up.
Meh
Hop's Kitten Jester.
1,803 posts
Location: Wonderland igloo, Vic, Australia
1,803 posts
Location: Wonderland igloo, Vic, Australia
Posted:
No i dont think poi is japanese, if it were, it would pronounced po-i. its defiantely a maori word. I did japanese for 7 years and i never came across the word "poi"
No i dont think poi is japanese, if it were, it would pronounced po-i. its defiantely a maori word. I did japanese for 7 years and i never came across the word "poi"
.:Pink Exocutioner:.
I am Jack's Raging Bile Duct...
Loving you from the deepest part of my loins.
BRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Posted:
The word poi is not Japanese. Poi were known as Temari and were a childrens plaything - introduced by Chinese. There are websites showing you how to make Temari poi. Temari moved from being a childrens plaything to an arts craft, with intricate designs created and silks used in their creation. Temari goes back about a thousand years and there is a theory of thought from people who have studied the designs of poi in New Zealand and the temari of China / Japan that there was some influence / connection. In fact the timing suggests strongly that the Maori could indeed have taken the idea Temari and adapted into poi swinging.
However poi is not a Japanese word - poi to Japanese would probably be the Hawaiian potato thingy thats also poi - if anything I would say the Chinese had more influence over poi as it is known today as the most commonly held theory is that Maori originated in Mainland Asia (probably China).
The word poi is not Japanese. Poi were known as Temari and were a childrens plaything - introduced by Chinese. There are websites showing you how to make Temari poi. Temari moved from being a childrens plaything to an arts craft, with intricate designs created and silks used in their creation. Temari goes back about a thousand years and there is a theory of thought from people who have studied the designs of poi in New Zealand and the temari of China / Japan that there was some influence / connection. In fact the timing suggests strongly that the Maori could indeed have taken the idea Temari and adapted into poi swinging.
However poi is not a Japanese word - poi to Japanese would probably be the Hawaiian potato thingy thats also poi - if anything I would say the Chinese had more influence over poi as it is known today as the most commonly held theory is that Maori originated in Mainland Asia (probably China).
Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.
- W B Yeats
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
It has been annoying me as well. But then I remember that there are these kinds of cultural and language misunderstandings all over the place. Still bugs me though.
It has been annoying me as well. But then I remember that there are these kinds of cultural and language misunderstandings all over the place. Still bugs me though.
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
member
53 posts
Location: OZ
53 posts
Location: OZ
Posted:
hmmm i dunno bout the word all i kno is that they are fun to use!
hmmm i dunno bout the word all i kno is that they are fun to use!
~*~peace and trust takes years to build, yet takes only seconds to shatter~*~
starring Skippy the green llama
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted:
say it with me..MAY - OR - EEE
easy enough
say it with me..MAY - OR - EEE
easy enough
First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica
" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."
GOLD Member
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
Posted:
Maaori actually.
Non-Https Image Link
my brothers are the whales, and my mother the earth, the sky is my father and the wind's, my uncle's.
EDITED_BY: Dragon7 (1098953018)
Maaori actually.
Non-Https Image Link
my brothers are the whales, and my mother the earth, the sky is my father and the wind's, my uncle's.
EDITED_BY: Dragon7 (1098953018)
GOLD Member
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
Posted:
I would like to see these Temari to jude for myself though. Got any links?
I would like to see these Temari to jude for myself though. Got any links?
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
judge away sir.
judge away sir.
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
GOLD Member
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
addict
625 posts
Location: Aotearoa (NZ), New Zealand
Posted:
U know me too well Mr Clom
Not to say, i dont believe my ancestors wearnt connected to asia, they could have been, but they were just as likley to have been from south america.. It would be nice to see ur sources on that, because statements like that are why people think poi is a japanese word.
I have studied alot of traditional maori art and even then, 1 art is not enough proof, to compare it to an art from another country and say they were related. Just because maori call sweet potato "kumara" and south americans call it "kuma" dosn't instantly imply we were from there.
Vague comparisons between these art's are:
Temari
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
Simila designs on Maori taniko poi (sry no taniko poi on the net):
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
American Indian:
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
U know me too well Mr Clom
Written by:Personally i dont believe everything i read. I studied ANTH at uni and it was the biggest load of horse [censored] i ever had to endure.
In fact the timing suggests strongly that the Maori could indeed have taken the idea Temari and adapted into poi swinging.
Not to say, i dont believe my ancestors wearnt connected to asia, they could have been, but they were just as likley to have been from south america.. It would be nice to see ur sources on that, because statements like that are why people think poi is a japanese word.
I have studied alot of traditional maori art and even then, 1 art is not enough proof, to compare it to an art from another country and say they were related. Just because maori call sweet potato "kumara" and south americans call it "kuma" dosn't instantly imply we were from there.
Vague comparisons between these art's are:
Temari
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
Simila designs on Maori taniko poi (sry no taniko poi on the net):
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
American Indian:
Non-Https Image Link
Non-Https Image Link
BRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Posted:
Temari date back a couple of thou years or so around time the Maori are thought to have started their journey which would eventually bring them to NZ. I'd quite like to see my sources on that too- find the info on the net / books - there was a scientific report a year or two ago based on alcohol genes & DNA testing that Maori came from different places, predominately Asia - in particular Taiwan and China. I stated that there is a strong suggestion that Maori could have brought idea of Temari with them on their travels and used the idea of decorative balls and used them for poi swinging. A suggestion is not a definite, its a possibility! It is a strong possibility that Temari being used in original homeland could have been brought on their journeys, as its unlikely that all the knowledge / culture would have been left behind also. Then again Temari were thought to have been a noblemans plaything. Were Maori poor explorers, decendants of noblemen off to conquer new lands..?
True I don't know that much about Maori culture / history except what I've been told by Maori friends themselves. Neverthless I don't believe your having studied in Uni gives you a right to snitty replies - your tone offends me!
Poi swinging is not a Japanese 'gei' - and I don't see why saying that the theory Maori travelled from China to New Zealand would have any relevance to why people think poi is Japanese? My post was specifically to state why poi are not Japanese but that the fact that temari are used in Japan could have created the misconception that poi are Japanese.
Now that I've said my piece - who fancies a pint
Temari date back a couple of thou years or so around time the Maori are thought to have started their journey which would eventually bring them to NZ. I'd quite like to see my sources on that too
- find the info on the net / books - there was a scientific report a year or two ago based on alcohol genes & DNA testing that Maori came from different places, predominately Asia - in particular Taiwan and China. I stated that there is a strong suggestion that Maori could have brought idea of Temari with them on their travels and used the idea of decorative balls and used them for poi swinging. A suggestion is not a definite, its a possibility! It is a strong possibility that Temari being used in original homeland could have been brought on their journeys, as its unlikely that all the knowledge / culture would have been left behind also. Then again Temari were thought to have been a noblemans plaything. Were Maori poor explorers, decendants of noblemen off to conquer new lands..? True I don't know that much about Maori culture / history except what I've been told by Maori friends themselves. Neverthless I don't believe your having studied in Uni gives you a right to snitty replies - your tone offends me!
Poi swinging is not a Japanese 'gei' - and I don't see why saying that the theory Maori travelled from China to New Zealand would have any relevance to why people think poi is Japanese? My post was specifically to state why poi are not Japanese but that the fact that temari are used in Japan could have created the misconception that poi are Japanese.
Now that I've said my piece - who fancies a pint
Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.
- W B Yeats
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
i'm still reading shogun.
god its good.
recently i found out:
what gei-sha means and why they are different from 'courtesans'.
that japenese people liked hot baths almost as much as i do.
where dildos come from.
that incense sticks were carefully rolled so they could be used to measure time by the hour.
i'm still reading shogun.
god its good.
recently i found out:
what gei-sha means and why they are different from 'courtesans'.
that japenese people liked hot baths almost as much as i do.
where dildos come from.
that incense sticks were carefully rolled so they could be used to measure time by the hour.
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
starring Skippy the green llama
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
1,148 posts
Location: Seattle, WA
Posted:
Shogun is an awesome book..Keep reading the series, it only gets better.
From looking online tho, I don't see what the art of stitched sacks has to do with the art of spinning. Thats like saying the inventor of kevlar has influenced hyperloops. Tool vs technique, I don't see the correlation.
Shogun is an awesome book..Keep reading the series, it only gets better.
From looking online tho, I don't see what the art of stitched sacks has to do with the art of spinning. Thats like saying the inventor of kevlar has influenced hyperloops. Tool vs technique, I don't see the correlation.
First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica
" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
its all about the balls dude.
its all about the balls dude.
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
BRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Pooh-Bah
2,211 posts
Location: London, Wales (UK)
Posted:
Glad your enjoying the book Cole! Off to Nihon myself soon, will be back just in time for next Synergy though! Hope to see you then
Glad your enjoying the book Cole! Off to Nihon myself soon, will be back just in time for next Synergy though! Hope to see you then
Come faeries, take me out of this dull world, for I would ride with you upon the wind and dance upon the mountains like a flame.
- W B Yeats
SILVER Member
sleeping with angels
508 posts
Location: anaheim CA usa
sleeping with angels
508 posts
Location: anaheim CA usa
Posted:
i know its not japanese... my step dad is japanese and he taught me to speak a lil bit of it and oi isnt even a word in japanese
i know its not japanese... my step dad is japanese and he taught me to speak a lil bit of it and oi isnt even a word in japanese
SLEEP WITH ANGELS muckieha
GOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia
Posted:
*considers getting shogun...*
*considers getting shogun...*
"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA
"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie
SILVER Member
veteran
1,389 posts
Location: Guelph, ON, Canada
veteran
1,389 posts
Location: Guelph, ON, Canada
Posted:
Ooh, got halfway through Sho-Gun in the summer, but left it at home
Decided to take Mists of Avalon instead...
If you want to read a gooood book about the Geisha's, read Memoirs of a Geisha. It's really really good, although with more of a feminine feel... But still a great read.
~ Bobo
Ooh, got halfway through Sho-Gun in the summer, but left it at home
Decided to take Mists of Avalon instead...If you want to read a gooood book about the Geisha's, read Memoirs of a Geisha. It's really really good, although with more of a feminine feel... But still a great read.
~ Bobo
wie weit, wie weit noch?
fragst mich, wo wir gewesen sind...
du fehlst hier
GOLD Member
Fool
2,020 posts
Location: Cornwall, UK
Fool
2,020 posts
Location: Cornwall, UK
Posted:
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the idea of a ball on a string was an ancient japanese thing. I'll try to find out where i read it. In the mean time, here are some other poi-related useless facts. I especially like the "jewish expression of disgust" one.
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the idea of a ball on a string was an ancient japanese thing. I'll try to find out where i read it. In the mean time, here are some other poi-related useless facts. I especially like the "jewish expression of disgust" one.
"I believe the cost of life is Death and we will all pay that in full. Everything else should be a gift. We paid the cover charge of life, we were born."
Bill Hicks, February 1988
newbie
19 posts
Location: Somerset, England
19 posts
Location: Somerset, England
Posted:
I learned to swing poi when I was a kid in New Zeland many years ago; it's a Maori word. The Japanese word for a ball is mari (please correct my spelling, Japanese scholars, I am but a humble crafts person), hence the embroidered te-mari balls pictured above - I learned that craft from a Japanese friend. I wonder if someone somewhere has mis-heard the words and confused Maori/mari?
Maori poi were normally made from flax leaves, you make a ball of dried and scrunched up leaves and then use whole dried leaves to wrap around to make the ball. Temari were based on wadded up scraps of old cloth wrapped with silk threads and then embroidered in geometric patterns. As far as I can ascertain there is no connection.
I learned to swing poi when I was a kid in New Zeland many years ago; it's a Maori word. The Japanese word for a ball is mari (please correct my spelling, Japanese scholars, I am but a humble crafts person), hence the embroidered te-mari balls pictured above - I learned that craft from a Japanese friend. I wonder if someone somewhere has mis-heard the words and confused Maori/mari?
Maori poi were normally made from flax leaves, you make a ball of dried and scrunched up leaves and then use whole dried leaves to wrap around to make the ball. Temari were based on wadded up scraps of old cloth wrapped with silk threads and then embroidered in geometric patterns. As far as I can ascertain there is no connection.
Pat in Somerset, England
GOLD Member
Member
32 posts
Location: Wakayama-ken, USA
Member
32 posts
Location: Wakayama-ken, USA
Posted:
Though nobody needs help establishing the fact that "poi" is clearly Maori and not Japanese, and besides the existence of the Hawaiian potato of same name, there is one native Japanese use of the word "poi" (at least here in Kansai where I live). The word for tossing something up, or chucking something away is "poito," which gets colloquially shortened to "poi" as a sound effect whenever people toss things. (For example, if you wanted to borrow my pen and I tossed it to you from across the room, either over- or underhanded, I would say "poi" as I threw it.) I ran into this time after time when trying to tell people what I was doing slinging tennis balls around on strings and so I finally asked one of my friends with some English abilities and we worked it out. (I checked my dictionaties to make sure, too. ) Not sure how relevant this is to the conversation, but whatever.
Though nobody needs help establishing the fact that "poi" is clearly Maori and not Japanese, and besides the existence of the Hawaiian potato of same name, there is one native Japanese use of the word "poi" (at least here in Kansai where I live). The word for tossing something up, or chucking something away is "poito," which gets colloquially shortened to "poi" as a sound effect whenever people toss things. (For example, if you wanted to borrow my pen and I tossed it to you from across the room, either over- or underhanded, I would say "poi" as I threw it.) I ran into this time after time when trying to tell people what I was doing slinging tennis balls around on strings and so I finally asked one of my friends with some English abilities and we worked it out. (I checked my dictionaties to make sure, too.
) Not sure how relevant this is to the conversation, but whatever. "To my delight, I discovered that poi are amazing movement exploration tools. They are guides. They are teachers. They are like Yoda, only smaller and on strings." --Nick Woolsey, also known as Meenik
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