Forums > Beginner Poi Moves > chains vs the wire poi bizz?
Login/Join to ParticipateBRONZE Member
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
Posted:
i haf had the practice poi (the tail stylz) for last few months and wanna invest in some of the real fire poi bizzo....but bein quite the n00b i was just wonderin wot the benefits of chains are over the normal wire poi?...
like wot would be best for the beginner type ? - are chains just for the more experienced peeps
chheeers
i haf had the practice poi (the tail stylz) for last few months and wanna invest in some of the real fire poi bizzo....but bein quite the n00b i was just wonderin wot the benefits of chains are over the normal wire poi?...
like wot would be best for the beginner type ? - are chains just for the more experienced peeps
chheeers
GOLD Member
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Pooh-Bah
2,109 posts
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Posted:
Theres really not a big difference. The only pros/cons I know of are that cord can get kinks in it and chain can hurt while doing wraps. I use and recommend chain but its not a huge deal.
Theres really not a big difference. The only pros/cons I know of are that cord can get kinks in it and chain can hurt while doing wraps. I use and recommend chain but its not a huge deal.
Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
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SILVER Member
Pooh-Bah
2,014 posts
Location: Galveston, TX, USA
Pooh-Bah
2,014 posts
Location: Galveston, TX, USA
Posted:
Actually, there is a huge difference between ball chain and the wire stuff. The wire stuff can get tangled really easily. The ball chain is made to untangle itself - when it gets tangled you can usually just pull the two poi apart and the balls will roll off each other and untangle. Not so with the wire stuff.
I would highly recommend ball chain to everyone, including the newest of the novices. It really makes learning much less frustrating as you are not having to stop to untangle your poi nearly as often.
I say get the ball chain and you definitely won't regret it, and I know there are many others who share my opinions.
Actually, there is a huge difference between ball chain and the wire stuff. The wire stuff can get tangled really easily. The ball chain is made to untangle itself - when it gets tangled you can usually just pull the two poi apart and the balls will roll off each other and untangle. Not so with the wire stuff.
I would highly recommend ball chain to everyone, including the newest of the novices. It really makes learning much less frustrating as you are not having to stop to untangle your poi nearly as often.
I say get the ball chain and you definitely won't regret it, and I know there are many others who share my opinions.
BRONZE Member
freelance bum
286 posts
Location: Upstairs, Australia
freelance bum
286 posts
Location: Upstairs, Australia
Posted:
I fully agree with the ball chain comments, except for one limitation they have. If you do any moves where you wrap some chain around your hand to shorten the length (like the buzzsaw for instance) and you hold the ball chain itslef to twirl, you can seriously weaken it at one link, which is no good. This is the only circumstance that I've seen ball chain fail under. The answer to get the best of both worlds would be to have longer handles and shorter chains to prevent the need to hold the chain itself.
This is only an issue if you do those moves or if you have longish chains. Short chain twirling is fun, fast and furious which can really test the integrity of your equipment and the flammability of your forearm hair.
I fully agree with the ball chain comments, except for one limitation they have. If you do any moves where you wrap some chain around your hand to shorten the length (like the buzzsaw for instance) and you hold the ball chain itslef to twirl, you can seriously weaken it at one link, which is no good. This is the only circumstance that I've seen ball chain fail under. The answer to get the best of both worlds would be to have longer handles and shorter chains to prevent the need to hold the chain itself.
This is only an issue if you do those moves or if you have longish chains. Short chain twirling is fun, fast and furious which can really test the integrity of your equipment and the flammability of your forearm hair.
UYI 
OLDSKOOL
SILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,899 posts
Location: Austin, Texas, USA
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,899 posts
Location: Austin, Texas, USA
Posted:
I do a lot of wraps and have never had ball chain break anywhere except at the link closest to the fire, and have never had ball chain break on my practice poi.
That said, the warning that Audax gave is important and I am sure it is true. Ball chain is definitely the best thing to spin with, but you do have to be sure that you are using a big enough gauge (15 gauge or more for fire) and be sure to inspect it for fatigue on a regular basis. You'll have to replace 15 gauge after about 50 burns or so (no big deal, since it is cheap). Ball chain has so many advantages that I won't bother to list them, and they more than make up for the fact that you have to replace it every so often.
I do a lot of wraps and have never had ball chain break anywhere except at the link closest to the fire, and have never had ball chain break on my practice poi.
That said, the warning that Audax gave is important and I am sure it is true. Ball chain is definitely the best thing to spin with, but you do have to be sure that you are using a big enough gauge (15 gauge or more for fire) and be sure to inspect it for fatigue on a regular basis. You'll have to replace 15 gauge after about 50 burns or so (no big deal, since it is cheap). Ball chain has so many advantages that I won't bother to list them, and they more than make up for the fact that you have to replace it every so often.
-v-
Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!
BRONZE Member
member
67 posts
Location: strongsville, ohio, usa
member
67 posts
Location: strongsville, ohio, usa
Posted:
Ball chain is great for wraps, for tangles, and durability wise it is up there high on my list. Ive only had the 120 test chain break on me once. You ussually just have to check the connectors and make sure the chain will not slip out. Ive had the chain slip out on me before, no biggee though. Chain is good for airwraps and hyperloops, but if you can master these then get some cables. You can do execellent hyperloops and airwraps but with cables you have to go into them just right. Cables are very fast. kinda hurty when doing regular wraps though but the amount of recoil you get off them is great. Since your just starting out i would recomend chains, make sure its the 120lb test though. Length wise, in my opinion the shorter the better, my chains are only a foot long from link on the grip to the link on the wick, i have four inch wicks as well though which increase the length a bit. my whole set up from top of the grip to the end of the wick is only 19inches long. Lots of fun, there are some things you can do with shorter chains that you cannot do with really long ones. It works the opposite way though, they are not good for moves which require alot of inertia.
Ball chain is great for wraps, for tangles, and durability wise it is up there high on my list. Ive only had the 120 test chain break on me once. You ussually just have to check the connectors and make sure the chain will not slip out. Ive had the chain slip out on me before, no biggee though. Chain is good for airwraps and hyperloops, but if you can master these then get some cables. You can do execellent hyperloops and airwraps but with cables you have to go into them just right. Cables are very fast. kinda hurty when doing regular wraps though but the amount of recoil you get off them is great. Since your just starting out i would recomend chains, make sure its the 120lb test though. Length wise, in my opinion the shorter the better, my chains are only a foot long from link on the grip to the link on the wick, i have four inch wicks as well though which increase the length a bit. my whole set up from top of the grip to the end of the wick is only 19inches long. Lots of fun, there are some things you can do with shorter chains that you cannot do with really long ones. It works the opposite way though, they are not good for moves which require alot of inertia.
Power percieved is power achieved.
SILVER Member
.:*distracted by shiny things*:.
3,777 posts
Location: brizvegas, Australia
.:*distracted by shiny things*:.
3,777 posts
Location: brizvegas, Australia
Posted:
hi
just thought i'd add my two cents here. i have cable (wire) poi, and a firend of mine has chain. i like mine better - mainly because they're so much lighter! i've used my friends chains, and i've found that chains and cable tangle as much as each other.
i guess it all depends on personal preference.
you should try both kinds at the shop! that way you'll get a feel for the different types.
anyways...caio!
hi
just thought i'd add my two cents here. i have cable (wire) poi, and a firend of mine has chain. i like mine better - mainly because they're so much lighter! i've used my friends chains, and i've found that chains and cable tangle as much as each other.
i guess it all depends on personal preference.
you should try both kinds at the shop! that way you'll get a feel for the different types.
anyways...caio!
do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good to eat!
if at first you do succeed, try not to look too astonished!
smile! :grin: it confuses people!
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
well to add my $.25... ball chain is better then wire... bonuses all listed above...
that being said I think you should look into a coated cable (like the kind used on bicycle locks)... because the ball chain, despite all its bonuses, sucks ass.. it doesn't spin well, especially hyperloops and stuff, and it hurts when doing wraps because of the way the ball chain connects to the outer ring..
I'm currently looking into alternatives, and I think the covered cable is the best.. I tried to light up with them yet though.. so you may have to remove the coveringfrom the side near the fire..
but cable is -way- cleaner and smoother then chain..
*shrugs*
EDITED_BY: Rev (1069436181)
well to add my $.25... ball chain is better then wire... bonuses all listed above...
that being said I think you should look into a coated cable (like the kind used on bicycle locks)... because the ball chain, despite all its bonuses, sucks ass.. it doesn't spin well, especially hyperloops and stuff, and it hurts when doing wraps because of the way the ball chain connects to the outer ring..
I'm currently looking into alternatives, and I think the covered cable is the best.. I tried to light up with them yet though.. so you may have to remove the coveringfrom the side near the fire..
but cable is -way- cleaner and smoother then chain..
*shrugs*
EDITED_BY: Rev (1069436181)
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
BRONZE Member
Magical Sock Dancer
255 posts
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Magical Sock Dancer
255 posts
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Posted:
No idea what Rev is talking about. I love the way ball chain spins, and I don't see how you could get anything better for hyperloops.
No idea what Rev is talking about. I love the way ball chain spins, and I don't see how you could get anything better for hyperloops.
BRONZE Member
member
69 posts
Location: Tucson, USA
member
69 posts
Location: Tucson, USA
Posted:
Inertia,
Wire poi (firewire?) are very easily made. I suggest buying/making ballchain poi, and making your own wires. With quicklinks, you can just switch back and forth, trying them both out.
You can probably find 1/16" steel wire cable at a local do-it-yourself store, and you need roughly 2 feet of it per poi. At the same store, get four wire-crimps, also called swages. Just make loops big enough for your quicklinks, and use some pliers to crimp the swages.
MJ
Flamma Aeterna
EDITED_BY: Flamma Aeterna (1069447865)
Inertia,
Wire poi (firewire?) are very easily made. I suggest buying/making ballchain poi, and making your own wires. With quicklinks, you can just switch back and forth, trying them both out.
You can probably find 1/16" steel wire cable at a local do-it-yourself store, and you need roughly 2 feet of it per poi. At the same store, get four wire-crimps, also called swages. Just make loops big enough for your quicklinks, and use some pliers to crimp the swages.
MJ
Flamma Aeterna
EDITED_BY: Flamma Aeterna (1069447865)
That which does not kill me, only makes me stranger.
BRONZE Member
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
Posted:
WOW....thanks heaps for all ur input guys...much appreciated
....by the sounds i is gonna haf to look into sortin myself wit sum of that chain bizz
i be gettin excited bout it already.... yayay
WOW....thanks heaps for all ur input guys...much appreciated
....by the sounds i is gonna haf to look into sortin myself wit sum of that chain bizz
i be gettin excited bout it already.... yayay
SILVER Member
Mumma Hen
6,391 posts
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Mumma Hen
6,391 posts
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted:
Ball chain is the bomb... makes buzzsaws and isolations a piece of cake... beauiful smooth feel..it converted a cable girl such as I, over to the world of fire with chains
Ball chain is the bomb... makes buzzsaws and isolations a piece of cake... beauiful smooth feel..it converted a cable girl such as I, over to the world of fire with chains
TAJ "boat mummy." VALURA "yes sweetie you went on a boat, was daddy there with you?" TAJ "no, but monkey on boat" VALURA "well then sweetie, Daddy WAS there with you"
BRONZE Member
member
54 posts
Location: South East London, United Kingdom
member
54 posts
Location: South East London, United Kingdom
Posted:
The real thing is that wire poi are the easiest to untangle as you can pull them apart with no real effort due to their resiliance to gettiing tangalled(how ever it's spelt!). Eventually these do kink, i'm on my second set of wires within a year and will be moving to ball chains soon. Wires do actually start to hurt when doing wraps but are really light which makes things nice. Ball chains are much more comfortable when initiating wraps as they bend around your skin as opposed to a metal wire. Plus hyperloops are extremely hard with wires due to their rigidity. I would definatly say buy ball chain as they are a much more worthy investment.
The real thing is that wire poi are the easiest to untangle as you can pull them apart with no real effort due to their resiliance to gettiing tangalled(how ever it's spelt!). Eventually these do kink, i'm on my second set of wires within a year and will be moving to ball chains soon. Wires do actually start to hurt when doing wraps but are really light which makes things nice. Ball chains are much more comfortable when initiating wraps as they bend around your skin as opposed to a metal wire. Plus hyperloops are extremely hard with wires due to their rigidity. I would definatly say buy ball chain as they are a much more worthy investment.
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
I dunno, I spin monkey fists on some of the 120 test ball chain and my hyperloops just aren't clean.. they happen.. and they occur easily... but they are very sloppy control-wise... I like my tangles to happen smooth and cleanly, and ball chain just doesn't work well for that... and the connectors make wraps a pain sometimes too...
not saying other people don't know what they are talking about.. I'm just saying that I don know what other people are talking about... I went through all this and in the end chose ball chain... but my preferences would be:
nothing> wire> ball chain> other chain> covered cable
chain like wallet-chain style chains work well if you have the right kind of connector.. but again, this is all matter of preference.. and you won't know 'til you try them all...
Quote:
No idea what Rev is talking about. I love the way ball chain spins, and I don't see how you could get anything better for hyperloops.
I dunno, I spin monkey fists on some of the 120 test ball chain and my hyperloops just aren't clean.. they happen.. and they occur easily... but they are very sloppy control-wise... I like my tangles to happen smooth and cleanly, and ball chain just doesn't work well for that... and the connectors make wraps a pain sometimes too...
not saying other people don't know what they are talking about.. I'm just saying that I don know what other people are talking about... I went through all this and in the end chose ball chain... but my preferences would be:
nothing> wire> ball chain> other chain> covered cable
chain like wallet-chain style chains work well if you have the right kind of connector.. but again, this is all matter of preference.. and you won't know 'til you try them all...
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
geek, level 1
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
Posted:
i think mine runs:
other chain>ball chain>wire
wire seems so unadaptable.
and i've not yet found any move/transition thats easier with ball chain over forged chain with a swivel...
(just have to not tangle)
R
i think mine runs:
other chain>ball chain>wire
wire seems so unadaptable.
and i've not yet found any move/transition thats easier with ball chain over forged chain with a swivel...
(just have to not tangle
)R
Holistic Spinner (I hope)
member
1,591 posts
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
1,591 posts
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
Posted:
You prefer nothing holding your poi heads to your handles? That's certainly wacky.
The greater then symbol is like a hungry fish that always eats the greater item, and the listing order goes from greatest to smallest
So your list should go like this
Covered cable>Other chain>Ball chain>wire>nothing
Quote:
nothing> wire> ball chain> other chain> covered cable
You prefer nothing holding your poi heads to your handles? That's certainly wacky.
The greater then symbol is like a hungry fish that always eats the greater item, and the listing order goes from greatest to smallest
So your list should go like this
Covered cable>Other chain>Ball chain>wire>nothing
BRONZE Member
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
member
28 posts
Location: Dunedin, NZ, Netherlands
Posted:
ok so jus wehn i thought i was gettin my head round the whole wire vs chain thing another variable gets thrown in the works..
wot is forged chain? is that teh plastic covered shizz the post earlier was referriin to?
thanks again fo all teh helpin out teh n00b bizz....it be much appreciated
ok so jus wehn i thought i was gettin my head round the whole wire vs chain thing another variable gets thrown in the works..
wot is forged chain? is that teh plastic covered shizz the post earlier was referriin to?
thanks again fo all teh helpin out teh n00b bizz....it be much appreciated
geek, level 1
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
Posted:
no.. just noormal link chain, but if you look at cheap chain it often has a gap in the link, so can com apart more easily under pressure. forged chain has the entire link solid, no gaps.(go to mitre 10 and have a look at a few different types and you'll see what i mean)
R
no.. just noormal link chain, but if you look at cheap chain it often has a gap in the link, so can com apart more easily under pressure. forged chain has the entire link solid, no gaps.(go to mitre 10 and have a look at a few different types and you'll see what i mean)
R
Holistic Spinner (I hope)
member
1,591 posts
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
1,591 posts
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
Posted:
weirdly I cannot find forged chain anywheres around here that's of a appropriate weight for spinning poi. It's all shotty pressed together stuff with cheap spot welds.
weirdly I cannot find forged chain anywheres around here that's of a appropriate weight for spinning poi. It's all shotty pressed together stuff with cheap spot welds.
geek, level 1
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
5,300 posts
Location: everywhere
Posted:
talking of approriate weights....
the first set of poi i used had crappy chain with only 5lb breaking strain...and it lasted me 6 months fast spinning and serious punishment... i ten changed(after no problems, just felt like it was time) to chain with breaking strain of 75 lbs.. and it broke second time out...
so just goes to show you never can tell.
R
talking of approriate weights....
the first set of poi i used had crappy chain with only 5lb breaking strain...and it lasted me 6 months fast spinning and serious punishment... i ten changed(after no problems, just felt like it was time) to chain with breaking strain of 75 lbs.. and it broke second time out...
so just goes to show you never can tell.
R Holistic Spinner (I hope)
BRONZE Member
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Bastard Newbie Messiah
1,269 posts
Location: Apparently lost in my ego, USA
Posted:
I'm sorry I guess I should have stated that it was in order from least to greatest... obviously I'd prefer spinning with anything over nothing..
I'm sorry I guess I should have stated that it was in order from least to greatest... obviously I'd prefer spinning with anything over nothing..
More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"Buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
SILVER Member
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Posted:
My first set of fire poi was made with cable and I really liked them, until I dropped one and it kinked really badly. Even so, I still used them for a while, until one of the kinks started fraying and it took a slice out of my leg.
My current set of chains is ballchain, which I prefer so much over the cable or normal linked chain, it just feels that much smoother to spin with. I've never had any problems with it pinching exposed flesh when it wraps and it's no problem to loop around my hands a couple of times to shorten them for some buzzsaw type stuff.
My first set of fire poi was made with cable and I really liked them, until I dropped one and it kinked really badly. Even so, I still used them for a while, until one of the kinks started fraying and it took a slice out of my leg.
My current set of chains is ballchain, which I prefer so much over the cable or normal linked chain, it just feels that much smoother to spin with. I've never had any problems with it pinching exposed flesh when it wraps and it's no problem to loop around my hands a couple of times to shorten them for some buzzsaw type stuff.
But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.
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