Forums > Social Chat > Live Chat - trial/test

Posted: 10th May 2001
Didn't work for me. I tried it using Navigator 4.76 and IE 5 (both for Mac). With Navigator, I got past the login screen, but when the actual chat screen loaded, if I clicked in the window, the program just terminated. IE couldn't even manage to finish loading the login screen.Also, I should point out, it isn't Javascript, it's Java. Big difference.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

Posted: 10th May 2001
i wanna play!pere

Posted: 10th May 2001
Adamrice - I've just upgraded to netscape 4.77 and had no worries getting in.

Posted: 10th May 2001
yup, well it doesnt work with IE for Mac OsX, omniweb, or IE and Netscape for OS9.i was thinkin maybe its my freaked out computer, but maybe its a mac issue...Pere

Posted: 9th May 2001
Malcolm, I definitely like the chat room, and maybe this question is redundant (i.e. the smiley face incident ), but there are different chat times. How long does each session last?------------------~I dont care if they eat me alive, Ive got better things to do than survive. ~Ani

Wow

Posted: 9th May 2001
Java is enabled. Netscape and IE have different Java implementations, so I was hoping if one failed the other would work, but no dice (I even tried it with the Mac-only browser iCab, which also didn't work). I'm sure I wouldn't get the login screen in Netscape if it weren't enabled. It just misbehaves.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

Posted: 9th May 2001
ok when i tried to use netscape 4.75 (mac) it started to load the applet but it was just taking FOREVER. i guess icould try again with explorer and the like but i think my modem is just bogged, or else theres a logjam somewhere. However since i have osx going here I would be willing to be that any sort of weird java/ web thing would probably not work real well on it yet. usually i use omniweb as a browser in osx because the supposedly native explorer sucks, but omniweb does not currently support java applets (or maybe they do today i havn't checked)i will try tomorrow at work i guess.alternatively we could all just post a lot of messages which we do anyway!Pere

Posted: 9th May 2001
adamrice,I had the same problem as well on my website. The solution I found...For IE: Make sure you run Windows Update (https://windowsupdate.microsoft.com) and that you have the newest version of your Java stuff and IE. If you do, try reinstalling Java support. If you tell it to "Show All Components" You should get it as an option to download..For NS: Apparently there was a problem with 4.76 and newer..I'm not sure when the problem started..but 4.6 works fine...well..it's java seems to either be broke or have problems with certain java apps. The solution is upgrade to the newest version. (Which should also install a newer version of your Java Console..)hope this helps..------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

Posted: 9th May 2001
Please, pretty please, can we just use IRC?Java and JavaScript are just not an option for those of us who refuse to use Windows and MS-IE!I'd like to propose #poi on irc.openprojects.net.-p.

Posted: 9th May 2001
pj: but not everyone can access IRC servers due to firewalls and restrictions at work, and i know a lot of people on this board access it from work.I prefer irc and have had #poi on oz.org for a few months just sitting idle.

- Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -

Posted: 9th May 2001
Malcolm,This is a really neat Idea, and although i couldn't get it too work I would love to see this idea realized...I think you're going to find it really hard to please everyone of the HOP members.Best of luck,N8.

Care of other people's approval and you become their prisoner.Live fully, Rave wholly.Fluid are the movements of my strings...

Posted: 9th May 2001
There are a number of IRC->Web gateways. If Malcom were to install one of those, then *everybody* would be happy!I'm not aware of any Web->IRC gateways, however.FWIW, I've gone ahead and created #poion irc.openprojects.net If nothing else, us baltimore unix geeks will be hanging out there. ;-)-p.

Posted: 9th May 2001
FYI...after removing my foot from my mouth...I can say that the chat applet actuallyworks under linux/netscape!That's a first. ;-)-p.

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 9th May 2001
i cant use IRC, and oddly enough java doesnt seem to be working. how exactly do you go about enabling it? i set security setting to low on my tools-options bar (IE 5.5) but it didnt seem to help any

Posted: 9th May 2001
well i hope the problem gets solved somehow. i can't wait to talk to all of you. so far the chat room has been a great idea. good luck------------------the music feeds my soul that glows and grows with every spin i take.

the music feeds my soul that glows and grows with every spin i take.

Posted: 10th May 2001
Oh boy..alright..here's what I found out kiddies. (I have done technical support for all.com[online technical support provider], I was also the Technical Support Mgr at a local ISP.) So let me clear a few things up.First, there are java-apps that are WEB gateways to IRC servers. This is probably the most common type of java app. Then there are java apps that contain their own servers. Because this particular chat program that we use, uses java, EVERYONE, regardless of platform, browser, whatever should be able to access it. If you can't, then you have a configuration problem. It's as simple as that. Java was originally created by Sun, as a language that could be used platform-independant.Ok..now on to the good stuff. I'll separate this stuff out into an IE section and a Netscape section...Internet Explorer:The first step you want to take to ensure that you have your computer configured correctly is to make sure you have the Microsoft Virtual Machine enabled. By default, I believe this is turned OFF in Internet Explorer.* Pull down Tools and choose Internet Options.* Click the Advanced Tab* Look for the section titled 'Microsoft VM'* Verify that all three are checked. If not, check them, Close IE and reboot.If they are already checked, the next thing you want to make sure is that you have the latest version of IE and Microsoft VM. You can do this by following these steps:* In the Address field type: https://windowsupdate.microsoft.com*
This will bring up Microsoft's Update Site.* Click 'Product Updates'* First verify that you DONT have anything listed under 'Critical Updates' If you do, select it and hit the download button at the top. Note: If you have to download a critical update, you need to repeat these 'Windows Update' steps from the top until you don't have anything listed under Critical Updates.Once you have all the critical updates downloaded, look for 'Microsoft Virtual Machine' (or Microsoft VM) If you see it listed, select it and hit the download button at the top. You will have to reboot once it is installed.Once you do this, try the chat out. If it STILL doesn't work, go back to the windowsupdate.microsoft.com site and click the 'Internet Explorer 5.5 service pack 1' link off of the main page. If you STILL can't get in, email me: shouden@guilds.comOk...Netscape. Netscape uses a similar piece of software to Microsoft's Virtual Machine. Netscape's is called Java Console. I've found that with certain versions of Netscape(older versions), some java apps don't work. So my first recommendation would be to download the newest version from their site. If you still are having trouble, email(or leave a message here), and I'll look into the Netscape issue further.Malcolm,You can buy(I may even be able to find you a freeware one) IRC server software that runs on servers. If you do this, then, yes indeed, everyone would need an 'IRC Client' to access it. However there are java apps out there that allow you to connect to IRC servers from a web page. If you are interested in pursuing this, please email me, and I'll hunt down/provide more information. Seems as though you picked a decent one..(except for it's cost!!)..very easy to use..which of course, is the most important feature, as the people that would be using it have a vast difference in levels of experience with chatrooms/computers, etc..Hope this helps guys!!Happy Twirling!------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

Posted: 10th May 2001
sheesh..what a long post!

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

Posted: 10th May 2001
This thing is great!!!Thanks to Endangered, Tiki and Girl from Mars for the fire-type chat.Ahhhhh fellow fire people.Hey, I have to ask. Who's going to be the first to cyber on it? Oh dear, someone just lowered the tone of the whole thing.Practice safe chat out there boys and girls.------------------Don't dream it, be it.

Don't dream it, be it.

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 10th May 2001
hey therejust wanted to say that at my collage i cannot seam to get on, it tells me it cannot connect to the port.... argh, thats the admin for you, any suggestions to get on the chat, and as the chat does not seam to work on macs i wont attempt to try that one.thanksEnjoy - Angus

Posted: 10th May 2001
C-R-D:The advice you gave me up there in the middle is Windows-specific, and I'm on a Mac.My suspicion is that the chat software Malcolm is using is just buggy. I've used other java-based chat systems that worked OK.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

Posted: 10th May 2001
ajtag,PLEASE try it with Mac. It should work on ANY platform..adamrice,Correct. I'm no Mac expert by any means. However, I do believe this script is using java v2. This might explain why other java-chat programs have worked. (They might be java v1) So you might want to check your java runtime files to verify that they are the latest. If you aren't sure how to do that..just try downloading the newest version of Netscape. It should come with the newest version of Netscape's java console. ------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

Posted: 10th May 2001
OK, here's an update.I updated Netscape to 4.77, as suggested. Doesn't help--I get the same result. After I log in, the applet seems to get hung up on the "identifying the server" phase, and if I click anywhere on it, Netscape just vanishes. Poof. (And if you think I'm upgrading to 6.0, guess again.)I updated MacOS Runtime for Java, which IE 5 depends on, from 2.2 to 2.2.3. That seemed to work. When I logged in, there were several other familiar nicknames present, but I didn't see any traffic other than what I typed in. There were a few other features that didn't seem to be doing anything (the "visiting cards", "about"), just popped up little blank windows.For some reason, I couldn't even get the HoP front page to load in iCab.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

Posted: 10th May 2001
My god its really weard talking live to people that you usually just leave messages for.Am looking forward to some stimulating chat later with you guys.he hepeace outgarbo

quote:

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"Be the change"Mahatma Ghandi

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be excellent to each other: safe:

Posted: 10th May 2001
Time to clarify a few technical issues:1. IRC is completely free. There are many free IRC clients for all computer platforms. Although IRC server software is also free, one does not even need to install an IRC server to create an IRC channel. IRC servers are provided for free use by those who choose to host them.2. IRC traffic is occasionally blocked or restricted within some organizations. However, depending on the type of filter or firewall, Java chats may be blocked as well.Anyone located behind a proxy firewall will probably not be able to use the Java chat.3. IRC does require additional software to be installed on a user's machine. Although this is not difficult, it will cause some users some degree of difficulty.4. Although Java is a standard, it is not a very standard standard. ;-) There are numerous flavours of Java and incompatibilities are notorious. For example, 50% or more of Java applets crash Netscape under Linux.5. To make matters worse, Microsoft no longer supports Java... in a manner of speaking. Java is no longer part of the default install of MS-IE. Installing Java in a running MS-IE may actually be more difficult than installing an IRC client.6. Java chats force the user into exactly one client. With IRC, there are dozens to choose from. I am spoiled because I use a very powerful IRC client. By comparison, the afny Java client sucks. I cannot resize the window, the font is tiny and cannot be changed, and the text entry window shows only about 20 characters, and it will use a yellow font on a white background that is completely unreadable.7. It appears as if the afny chat is only free for < 10 users in the chat room. To allow for additional users, it seems as if a license must be purchased.8. Although there are IRC->WEB gateways available, I have never personally used any, and I am not sure if any are free.Although my preference is obvious, I am obviously not in any position to make any decisions. But I think I have provided a fair assessment of the technical issues.-p.

Posted: 10th May 2001
pj,Well phrased and explained. A few clarifications.. There IS IRC Server software for unix and windows that IS free. However most of the windows versions are for charge. Alot of the reason why IRC service is blocked is because of Denial Of Service attacks that some select IRC users use. You say, Java chats for the user into one client. Well..just like you can choose an IRC client to use..the web provider can choose the Java App to use(thus..the java chat client) so it is just as flexible there. However the difference is, with java, only the provider can choose the client that everyone uses. Which IRC client do you use? I commonly use mIRC. I have no problems resizing my window when afny is running. As for the font being tiny..maybe you have your resolution set really big. :P In IE, you have an option to change the text size with just a pulldown button. If you customize your toolbar..I believe it is called 'Size' As for the yellow color. I'm at a loss there as to what your talking about. Mine types black on white. And I can change the color of text. (I prefer blue) I definately agree with you that afny isn't the greatest in the world and it CERTAINLY is not full of features. But in this application..the simpler, the better. I HAVe used HTTP -> IRC gateways before, there ARE free ones available. However in order to do this, you have to have an IRC server with a channel on it. I prefer NOT relying on other people's servers. (if their internet connection goes down..there goes our chat) However again, the big problem with using java IRC clients is that if anyone is behind a proxy or a firewall, it most likely will not work. A *LOT* of people are behind them..especially at work. (I used to do internet installs for local companies..)I would have to say though, that you did point out all the important things with regards to the two ways of doing it. I think we can find a better java program, for less money. I have emailed Malcolm a link to a site with a few java chats. Maybe some experimentation is in order. If any of this can across like I'm attacking anyone or anything, PLEASE don't be offended. I don't mean to come across like that. I come from a technical background, so I'm very nit picky about things PLUR!------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 10th May 2001
Well, my org's firewall is tighter than a frogs butt, and I can still use the chat.a couple of things I'd like cleared up by the 'Gurus';-Is / Can IRC be served through HTTP? (ie same ports and protocol as Web?)-Is / Can Java chats?The problems with incompatability are not due to Java the language. the language *is* cross platform. the problems are due to the buggy Java Virtual Machines - each vendor seems to have written a different one.Perhaps it's time for the Linux community (which seems to love holding their DIY software above the heads of mere windows / mac users) to get off it's collective ass and write a decent Java Virtual Machine for Mozilla? They spend enough time putting down windose users, saying how fucking cool their platform is, and how great their software is... now dont tell me they are whinging about java not working on their web browser?Josh

Posted: 11th May 2001
Josh,LOL! Answering your questions..IRC can be served through HTTP using a java-based chat only with an app that supported HTTP tunneling. And yes, just Java allows chats usually via a small mini-server java program that runs(called a servlet). I have also located a very decent PHP chat program that uses mySQL as a backend. It is at least as good as the one we have now. And since it is PHP it is *ALL* server-interpreted. So it "should" be easily cross-platform.------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=ÇrazyRaverÐude=-