Forums > Social Discussion > one thing too many "professionals" forget
Login/Join to ParticipateBRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
i have met too many prima donnas in fire performance, to the point where i feel this statement is necessary. they feel that since they perform with fire, often with all the stage performance of WHITE NOISE, that they are entitled to treat anyone without a regular gig as nobodys, and the audience gets no respect at all, not so much as a bow, or a "thank you."
here's the point i am trying to make: AS PERFORMERS, EVERYTHING WE ARE AND EVERYTHING WE HAVE COMES WITH A DEBT. it is a debt we owe to the audience. we owe it to the people on the drums. we owe it to the person in the DJ booth. we owe it to the person who saw us perform and had the good graces to bring us into their fold by hiring or inviting us to perform for them. it is a debt that we are not done paying until the last memory of who we are and what we do is gone, faded into history. look at elvis. he'll never be done paying. no one will forget the "thank you, thank you very much" with the roguish turn of his lip as he spoke. but if you treat the audience like PVAEMENT to walk all over, never thank the drummers, the dj, or the people that brought you to where you are, you will be forgotten and forgotten quickly. FAME, NO MATTER HOW GREAT OR SMALL, IS FLEETING. never forget that. if fame is not what you're in it for, fine. personally i'm in it for the fun of performing, but fame has come anyway. even if i had no audience, i would still be performing, if only to myself. but i have an audience to please, so i perform to them. i do not use static performance routines, i play TO the crowd, not just IN FRONT of them. i thank them for attending, and call the drummers up to center stage for their rightful bow at the end of the show. i thank the people that brought me in to perform. i never forget. i never will. and neither should any other performer.
i have met too many prima donnas in fire performance, to the point where i feel this statement is necessary. they feel that since they perform with fire, often with all the stage performance of WHITE NOISE, that they are entitled to treat anyone without a regular gig as nobodys, and the audience gets no respect at all, not so much as a bow, or a "thank you."
here's the point i am trying to make: AS PERFORMERS, EVERYTHING WE ARE AND EVERYTHING WE HAVE COMES WITH A DEBT. it is a debt we owe to the audience. we owe it to the people on the drums. we owe it to the person in the DJ booth. we owe it to the person who saw us perform and had the good graces to bring us into their fold by hiring or inviting us to perform for them. it is a debt that we are not done paying until the last memory of who we are and what we do is gone, faded into history. look at elvis. he'll never be done paying. no one will forget the "thank you, thank you very much" with the roguish turn of his lip as he spoke. but if you treat the audience like PVAEMENT to walk all over, never thank the drummers, the dj, or the people that brought you to where you are, you will be forgotten and forgotten quickly. FAME, NO MATTER HOW GREAT OR SMALL, IS FLEETING. never forget that. if fame is not what you're in it for, fine. personally i'm in it for the fun of performing, but fame has come anyway. even if i had no audience, i would still be performing, if only to myself. but i have an audience to please, so i perform to them. i do not use static performance routines, i play TO the crowd, not just IN FRONT of them. i thank them for attending, and call the drummers up to center stage for their rightful bow at the end of the show. i thank the people that brought me in to perform. i never forget. i never will. and neither should any other performer.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
Dude, do you even know what you're arguing about?
We already did the "Yes, we agree with you bit" now we're on to a new track, or did you want more applause?
I like the use of 'proselytizing', am I tryig to convert you to my religion now? Kick ass!
Dude, do you even know what you're arguing about?
We already did the "Yes, we agree with you bit" now we're on to a new track, or did you want more applause?
I like the use of 'proselytizing', am I tryig to convert you to my religion now? Kick ass!
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
no, the problem is that i have tried being polite with you in explaining my definition of the difference between spinning and practice... and yet you continue to argue it with me. it all comes down to semantics. we won't be changing eachother's idea on what the words mean. so what's the point of your argument? if this thread is done, let it be. it needs not be redirected to a new topic. that is what new topics and threads are for.
no, the problem is that i have tried being polite with you in explaining my definition of the difference between spinning and practice... and yet you continue to argue it with me. it all comes down to semantics. we won't be changing eachother's idea on what the words mean. so what's the point of your argument? if this thread is done, let it be. it needs not be redirected to a new topic. that is what new topics and threads are for.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
I can't even see that there is any arguement
I can't even see that there is any arguement
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
BRONZE Member
1 + 1 = 3
3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
1 + 1 = 3
3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
Posted:
*watches argument from the sidelines*
*orders popcorn*
*watches argument from the sidelines*
*orders popcorn*
Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
I think it's important for any performer to remain in love with what they do.
Some people have said that if you do this for a living you can lose some of the love and passion that first inspired you - I suppose everything becomes monotonous eventually - but spinning for yourself (without an audience) can counteract that.
Not drilling... just dancing. Letting yourself free.
Ermmm... just to point out... I'm only stating my opinion, not getting involved in anything that will require more typing
I think it's important for any performer to remain in love with what they do.
Some people have said that if you do this for a living you can lose some of the love and passion that first inspired you - I suppose everything becomes monotonous eventually - but spinning for yourself (without an audience) can counteract that.
Not drilling... just dancing. Letting yourself free.
Ermmm... just to point out... I'm only stating my opinion, not getting involved in anything that will require more typing
Getting to the other side 
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
a truer statement was never made. i find the only difference in opinion i have is that spinning for myself becomes monotonous, and in front of an audience, or trying new ideas in practice for future audiences counteracts the monotony for me. things come to me in the aftermath of a show. the next practice i often say "hey, is this possible?" and try it. after long bouts of practice with no shows, it gets monotonous. then showtime comes round, and i get renewed.
Written by: Firepoise
I think it's important for any performer to remain in love with what they do.
Some people have said that if you do this for a living you can lose some of the love and passion that first inspired you - I suppose everything becomes monotonous eventually - but spinning for yourself (without an audience) can counteract that.
Not drilling... just dancing. Letting yourself free.
a truer statement was never made. i find the only difference in opinion i have is that spinning for myself becomes monotonous, and in front of an audience, or trying new ideas in practice for future audiences counteracts the monotony for me. things come to me in the aftermath of a show. the next practice i often say "hey, is this possible?" and try it. after long bouts of practice with no shows, it gets monotonous. then showtime comes round, and i get renewed.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Ahhhh.
Ok.
Just different ways to do it, I suppose.
Puh, Americans
Ahhhh.
Ok.
Just different ways to do it, I suppose.
Puh, Americans
Getting to the other side
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
Well I've been polite before, once or twice, like not stating my opinion now f'rinstance, and I can't really say that you have been in this thread. But then, I am British. (and middle class )
Well I've been polite before, once or twice, like not stating my opinion now f'rinstance, and I can't really say that you have been in this thread. But then, I am British. (and middle class
) "the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
And you have fabulous hair
And you have fabulous hair
Getting to the other side
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Posted:
ill second that
although im still wondering where it was MCP was pretending she knew frederick?
still - great thread, i showed off lots the weekend
ill second that
although im still wondering where it was MCP was pretending she knew frederick?
still - great thread, i showed off lots the weekend
"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
that's where, and i think i should have been more clear in previous posts in retrospect.
Written by: mcp_orange
No offense dude, but the way you said it before it sounds like you only drill with non-fire then go and spin with fire...
I think perhaps we have missed some of the meditative side of spinning. Where's andy when you need him?
that's where, and i think i should have been more clear in previous posts in retrospect.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Posted:
still wondering
still wondering
"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
i think perhaps you are reading my posts (except the second two since charles' ) with a bit more of a temperamental inflection... i am a bit more of a "less tact, more point" person. i often speak in a straightforward manner, and it gets taken as being rude or impolite. sorry if you think i am. it's more of a "you gotta actually HEAR the words SPOKEN by the person typing them, as reading them can be done in any emotion, and you'll read what you wish to read into it" situation, really.
Written by: mcp_orange
Well I've been polite before... and I can't really say that you have been in this thread.
i think perhaps you are reading my posts (except the second two since charles' ) with a bit more of a temperamental inflection... i am a bit more of a "less tact, more point" person. i often speak in a straightforward manner, and it gets taken as being rude or impolite. sorry if you think i am. it's more of a "you gotta actually HEAR the words SPOKEN by the person typing them, as reading them can be done in any emotion, and you'll read what you wish to read into it" situation, really.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
never mind. there is officially no point any longer in trying to explain it.
Written by: strugz
still wondering
never mind. there is officially no point any longer in trying to explain it.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Posted:
thats where things help or 
things or things, makes for more understanding reading IMO rather than huge blocks of txt.
Written by: Frederick the Reckless
"you gotta actually HEAR the words SPOKEN by the person typing them, as reading them can be done in any emotion, and you'll read what you wish to read into it" situation, really.
thats where
things help or things or things, makes for more understanding reading IMO rather than huge blocks of txt. "...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
it's never worked in the past for me, why should it work now?
it's never worked in the past for me, why should it work now?
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
SILVER Member
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
Posted:
Hows this one?: I like cheese.
*is also quite confused about where Meg was pretending to know FTR*
Written by: FTR
a truer statement was never made.
Hows this one?: I like cheese.
*is also quite confused about where Meg was pretending to know FTR*
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
that's where, UCoF... my previous attempt at qouting was a bit long. and again, i should have been more clear about how i practice.
Written by: mcp_orange
No offense dude, but the way you said it before it sounds like you only drill with non-fire then go and spin with fire.
that's where, UCoF... my previous attempt at qouting was a bit long. and again, i should have been more clear about how i practice.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
SILVER Member
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
Posted:
"but the way you said it before it sounds like"...
A.K.A
"gives the impression"
A.K.A
"I assume/ Im guessing"
"but the way you said it before it sounds like"...
A.K.A
"gives the impression"
A.K.A
"I assume/ Im guessing"
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
..........what the hell ever. are you done nitpicking?
..........what the hell ever. are you done nitpicking?
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
SILVER Member
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
Posted:
Im not nitpicking Frederick. I was trying to make clearer something you (I assume) misunderstood.
I suggest you have a re read of this entire thread, looking at how people are answering.
Im not nitpicking Frederick. I was trying to make clearer something you (I assume) misunderstood.
I suggest you have a re read of this entire thread, looking at how people are answering.
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
the "nitpicking" statement was not directed at you, but rather to everyone who just takes bits and pieces of the whole and uses them to make snap judgements and jump to conclusions. sorry, but again, i should have been more clear. i have read this thread again, and my thoughts on the matter are still the same. as it stands this thread has strayed so far off topic, i think it's pointless to even continue it. it went from the first post being about my belief that we as performers have a debt of respect to pay when it comes to shows where you ARE the show (which i didn't clarify from the beginning, my bad) to nitpicking over semantics, to trying to figure out exactly where i am coming from in stating that someone's pretending to know me. i think it's time to stick a fork in this thread. it's done like dinner.
the "nitpicking" statement was not directed at you, but rather to everyone who just takes bits and pieces of the whole and uses them to make snap judgements and jump to conclusions. sorry, but again, i should have been more clear. i have read this thread again, and my thoughts on the matter are still the same. as it stands this thread has strayed so far off topic, i think it's pointless to even continue it. it went from the first post being about my belief that we as performers have a debt of respect to pay when it comes to shows where you ARE the show (which i didn't clarify from the beginning, my bad) to nitpicking over semantics, to trying to figure out exactly where i am coming from in stating that someone's pretending to know me. i think it's time to stick a fork in this thread. it's done like dinner.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Boys. Stop it
Boys. Stop it
Getting to the other side
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom
Posted:
oooo do that again claire..... youve got such firm hands
oooo do that again claire..... youve got such firm hands
"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Heheheheheeh...
So I'm told
Heheheheheeh...
So I'm told
Getting to the other side
SILVER Member
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Liquid Cow
2,629 posts
Location: High Wycombe, England
Posted:
Maybe it's a little late to join this thread, but now I'm curious...
Frederick, I get the impression that your definition of practise encompasses drilling your routines and performance, as well as just spinning in your garden with no-one watching, purely for the sake of enjoying the spinning.
If that's the case, how do you distinguish between drilling your routines and just playing when you're in a casual conversation with someone?
*disclaimer - I've never met Frederick and I don't know him at all. Nor am I trying to nitpick - merely trying to clear something up in my own head
Maybe it's a little late to join this thread, but now I'm curious...
Frederick, I get the impression that your definition of practise encompasses drilling your routines and performance, as well as just spinning in your garden with no-one watching, purely for the sake of enjoying the spinning.
If that's the case, how do you distinguish between drilling your routines and just playing when you're in a casual conversation with someone?
Written by: imaginary conversation
- yeah, I spend about 10 hours a day practising
- wow - you must have your routine down pat
- er... no, I spend 9 of those hours just screwing about in the garden with my poi
*disclaimer - I've never met Frederick and I don't know him at all. Nor am I trying to nitpick - merely trying to clear something up in my own head
But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.
Sometimes sword wofter
199 posts
Location: Edinburgh
199 posts
Location: Edinburgh
Posted:
Yo Fredrick the berk, or whatever you name is, this is "social discussion" forum. Let us look at the word discussion:
"1. Consideration of a subject by a group; an earnest conversation.
2. A formal discourse on a topic; an exposition."
So you went on the "discussion" forum and are now upset with people talking about your opinion? You need to find the "dictating to" forum...
Yo Fredrick the berk, or whatever you name is, this is "social discussion" forum. Let us look at the word discussion:
"1. Consideration of a subject by a group; an earnest conversation.
2. A formal discourse on a topic; an exposition."
So you went on the "discussion" forum and are now upset with people talking about your opinion? You need to find the "dictating to" forum...
IMPORTANT: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of a sane person.
"just get the f**k on with it and make me the anti-christ already!"
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
No need to make it worse
No need to make it worse
Getting to the other side
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
no, i define that as practice, too...
Written by: TheBovrilMonkey
Maybe it's a little late to join this thread, but now I'm curious...
Frederick, I get the impression that your definition of practise encompasses drilling your routines and performance, as well as just spinning in your garden with no-one watching, purely for the sake of enjoying the spinning.
If that's the case, how do you distinguish between drilling your routines and just playing when you're in a casual conversation with someone?Written by: imaginary conversation
- yeah, I spend about 10 hours a day practising
- wow - you must have your routine down pat
- er... no, I spend 9 of those hours just screwing about in the garden with my poi
*disclaimer - I've never met Frederick and I don't know him at all. Nor am I trying to nitpick - merely trying to clear something up in my own head
no, i define that as practice, too...
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
BRONZE Member
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Troupe Leader and founder, Fire and Steel
241 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
ah, and now we begin with the name calling... and funny how you spelled "Frederick" wrong, it's only ONSCREEN for you to read... consider yourself ignored from here on out. sod off.
Written by: Zauberdachs
Yo Fredrick the berk, or whatever you name is, this is "social discussion" forum. Let us look at the word discussion:
"1. Consideration of a subject by a group; an earnest conversation.
2. A formal discourse on a topic; an exposition."
So you went on the "discussion" forum and are now upset with people talking about your opinion? You need to find the "dictating to" forum...
ah, and now we begin with the name calling... and funny how you spelled "Frederick" wrong, it's only ONSCREEN for you to read... consider yourself ignored from here on out. sod off.
Frederick the Reckless,
Troupe Leader,
Fire and Steel
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