Terminology question - antispin vs ?????

"Inspin" we trust, in "spin" we can't trust !!!

Russia poll ???
Japanese? if i understood well, "Lock-out" means the little arm-stops we're making during the big circle spin rotation, as a kin of quick break isolation, so the petal with the tool is more visual, right?

We're only trying to find a name for:
arm and tool spinning in the same direction.

I agree with Kev too, we should get rid of "spin" before we have to explain why again, i wish it could be obvious for everybody now, but i don't think it's possible on the forum unless we start a new poll.

tell your friends! we need more votes!!

for me, 'with spin' and 'prospin' have the exactly the same meaning

'spin spin' sounds too much like encouragement, not a term to me: more like 'spin! spin!'

I've been trying to put it into a sentence to see how it fits:

'do a long arm wallpane with spin'
'do a long arm wallpane prospin'
'do a long arm wallpane inspin'
etc...

double spin

So where does Subspin fit in?

you'll have to explain to me what a subspin means.

spin should have been an immediate no-go, since even anti-spin is still a spinning of one sort.

Double spin would be a bit limiting on how many rotations the poi is allowed to make before your arm completes its own larger rotation.

I agree that the sound of in-spin makes me visualize inversions and inside planes. While the concept is valid, its similarity to the other terminology can leave it open to misinterpretation.

If we agree with Ima's definition of a lock out, then that can be a type of multiple rotation in same direction, but not all multiple rotations need to have a momentary stop/hesitation to achieve that effect. You could simply have the poi spin very rapidly while your arm moves at a much slower rate. You could keep the poi spinning at a constant rate and alternate the speed that you rotate your arm.

soo.... me likes the pro-spin best.


oh and super spin? That should be saved for comments regarding a fantastically well done job by the performer. "Super spin, baby!!, Now rock that next spin with a 3petal anti-spin flower into a 4petal pro-spin flower followed by a wallplane'd barrel roll in-spin, with-spin(aka: same time). But it don't really matter, cause that was a damn super-spin!! Yeha!" *(walks away to refill the coffee pot, head spinning all the while)

I've been using inspin lately and so has Nick Woolsey... but I'm not entirely happy with it.

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*technical blather warning*

I'd like to get a handle on what everyone thinks of as compound circles/flowers, antispin and "inspin", along with trammels/ various 1:1 patterns.

I like to model things in my mind (and 3ds max) from an external observer's point of view (say a camera on a tripod) rather than a 1st person view of what your wrist is having to do. This allows focus on the geometric relations, and you figure out how your body is supposed to do that. I also like to pay attention to "phase":
the orientation of the staff at the beginning of the pattern's cycle. Usually I find 4 possible phases are adequate to use: Horizontal or vertical, with staff ends A-B or B-A. I'll describe things from this point of view:

Non-compound circling:

You have a static spin, where your hand stays at a point but the staff rotates.

You have R-types/flats or whatever they are called:
The hand/center of staff makes a circle, but the staff stays vertical or horizontal. This is a 1:0 ratio of hand orbit to staff rotating, but each head does still make a circular orbit... so in terms of circular orbits, is it a ratio of 1:1?!

Linear hand movements:
Move your hand in a line wile you spin and you get variations on a cycloid.

You have things in the Trammel/1:1 family:
There are plenty of these beyond the one where end A makes a line, the center makes a perpendicular line, and end B makes an ellipse.
I consider a 1:1 staff antispin a form of trammel. Some of these patterns have circular hand paths, some have ellipses, some have linear hand paths, but it's all a ratio of 1 hand cycle to 1 staff rotation. Some of these have an antispin quality to them, some don't. Staff isolations, extensions, and "rockets" (90 off phase with a staff iso) are all 1:1 as well.

Then we have compound circles:
This is like a spirograph: The hand cycles on a circular path at a different rate than the staff is rotating.

So, you have a set of patterns where the staff is rotating slower than the hand cycle. This can happen in "anti-spin" or "in-spin". I've seen these referred to as super-anti-spin and super-spin. Can anyone clarify this? Does the "super" indicate the faster-than-staff hand speed?

Then you have the set of staff-rotating-faster than hand cycle. This can of course be "anti-spin" or "in-spin".

So it seems to me that "anti-spin" and "in-spin" are attributes that aren't necessarily synonymous with "flowers" or compound circles alone.

Further, you can take linear hand movements and assemble them together to form polygon hand paths and complex geometric hand paths, ala Cyrille and Zan. If they are closed paths, that your hand s repeatedly cycle, they have a path directionality, so can these be described as "anti-spin" or "in-spin", even though they can have moments that look like both?

Also, when you fold your staff from point to point, or both heads trace the same polygon, your hand path is actually "asteroid"-like, ie a star of N points made of N equal arcs of a circle, then flipped inside out. If we look at the entire hand path then we would say the former has a quality of "anti-spin", wile the latter a quality of "in-spin"... but if you look at only one arc, for that moment the staff is doing the recipricol, ie "folding anti-spin" is made up of fractions of point isolation, or "polygon tracing" is made up of fractions of "anti-spin".

In summation, good luck on naming this shiz in an accurate, meaningful, yet not-to-wordy way!!

+Alien Jon

ehh ... thanks

well i think i understood about half of it...
But, i still don't know if this is because i'm too frenchy or not geek enough

rofl

I think it's cuz Jon's geek level ranks him at a 12 out of 10 =P

I think Jon meant to say "asterisk" not "asteroid" in the last paragraph.

Superspin is what i've always used. But rockout is probably what i will use from now on. Excellent result

I started using a lot of these terms in reference to contact but use them more often in talking about flowers now. If you are describing relationships rather then content, it's valid in both cases. You can antispin your shoulder and elbow for example.

rockets are perpindicular spinning right? I would have called them aero-planes but rockets are simi-lar.

I voted other and I call it SpinSpin.
Maybe a little hard and repetitive to say, but it explains what originally happens : Your hand do a Spin, what you manipulate do a Spin in the same direction.

I'd just call it spin or regular spin or if used for the specific move I'd call it regular flower or just flower.

In fact, I meant astroid.

I just added an 'e' because sometimes you need more vowel than is actually neeeededed!
But contextually, an asterisk i vaguely related as a hand path.

hypocycoids.

Ahhhhhhhhh.

How right was cole?

The squished one looks interesting, I'll have to program that...

I like Hyperspin, it coincides with medical jargon to mean "over"

you could then have hypospin. If you arm and poi are both rotating Hyperspin would mean more rotations and hypo mean less although you could technically have hyper-anti-spin which would mean antispin with extra beats. Hypo spin would be if you rotated your arm more than the prop rotated i.e when you do arm rotations with the poi hanging or the poi spins slowly compared to movement. the Hypercycoid would hyper because it is 3 full poi rotations compared to 1 arm roatation. Hyper loops would fit too because they are rotating more than the arm

I have always used Inspin