A Bulletin Board for Coca-Cola? And an interesting take on an old idea

Heres a long but very interesting article which looks at the "open source" practices in the most indepth laymen's article I've seen.

http://www.newscientist.com/hottopics/copyleft/copyleftart.jsp

Open Source I see as applying the principle in which this and most other bulletin boards work to a new height of involvement in daily life and business...

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Charles (AKA INFERNO)

newdolbel@hotmail.com
http://juggle.co.nz/fire/fire.html

w00t j00 |5 2 1337 |-|@X0r

Have I missed something?

Heh heh, I'm guessing that Bender didn't actually look at the link, he's using a silly it typing language, that simulates letters by substitution, which i think may be what he thinks its all about.

Or maybe not, but now I've had my say and WAHOOO!, we've confused C@ntus again...

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Charles (AKA INFERNO)

newdolbel@hotmail.com
http://juggle.co.nz/fire/fire.html

j00 5p34k l33t +00?

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[]Dhuong-Vu Truong
== []Dro Spinner ==
==== []Dhunky ===

Mr Offender's post appeared whilst I was writing mine. I was actually wondering what you were on about.

[This message has been edited by Cantus (edited 22 March 2002).]

fear the Penguin, for He shall bring deliverence from Redmond.

Bender, have you and C@ntus been sharing brain tissue lately?

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Charles (AKA INFERNO)

newdolbel@hotmail.com
http://juggle.co.nz/fire/fire.html

[This message has been edited by Charles (edited 22 March 2002).]

Nice digression,

to return. Interesting concept. Could bring about an interesting debate as to whether ideas exist independently from the original generator of the concept.

Also, the idea that ownership of a particular idea is dangerous, because that ownership prevents the idea being used for the good of mankind.

Although I can see the concept of free intellectual property working for the Coca Cola's of the world, in two ways. Firstly it enables them to poach anyones ideas, and they have the resources to exploit them. Secondly, they can start their own forums. For example releasing the receipe for cola, and then encouraging people to post improvements. They then have a whole range of new product ideas to choose from.

Pepsi Marketing Executive promotes the merits of new "pot-pepsi", (its the choice of a new generation) noting it as a marketing coup that will enable them to sell more snacks as well.

R.

[This message has been edited by Rozi (edited 22 March 2002).]

Well thank you Charles for still not explaining it to me. But, instead insulting me.

Thanx.

Ahhhhh, Cantus. We usually just make the assumption that you know everything about everything anyway. (It is that whole aura of intelligence thing - oh, and btw, that is meant absolutely sincerely).

The idea is that there should be no such thing as intellectual property (ie. ownership of ideas protected by law, copyrighting ideas so that no one else can use them). The idea being that intellectual property prevents ideas from being used to benefit people and also prevents the ideas themselves from being developed further by others).

Certain IT communities have taken the idea into a reality by making their ideas and concepts freely available to all. Some of the fun things to come out of this has been programming languages, operating systems (alternatives to Windows etc), freeware (freely available software) and shareware (shared software).

Where it would perhaps be of more benefit is in the pharmeceuticals industry. Where large organisations with the copyright on certain medications will not sell them in particular countries, or will not reduce the price so that others can benefit. As an interesting aside, the question was put to us in the capstone subject for my business degree, as to how we would price just such a drug. What alarmed me was that most people in the class were pricing it at the level that the highest bidder would pay. Scary

R.

So what does he mean in his original post? When he says

quote:

---

Open Source I see as applying the principle in which this and most other bulletin boards work to a new height of involvement in daily life and business...

---

This is where it gets really interesting.

We have some great examples here:

http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/000530.html

And really all the ideas of moves etc, are a great example of this. We share ideas all the time

R.

[This message has been edited by Rozi (edited 22 March 2002).]

Cantus - I guess because we share ideas and thoughts - his concept is that the whole world share thoughts and ideas etc.

Open source is not always feasible. Ideas cannot simply be copyrighted, nor patented or trademarked etc. Each of these concepts are different.

Trademark is a symbol/name or whatever that is associated with a product (Harley could not trademark or patent their motorbike engines, so when other companies were getting closer to copying the Harley image, they trademarked the sound of the engine. In the documentation it is spelled "potato-potato-potato")

Copyright is not something that you apply for. If you write something original you automatically get the copyright to it. No need for the "(C)" symbol even. The tough bit is proof of copyright ownership. Copyright is cancelled 50 years after the death of the author. Thus a lot of classical music is free. (Though recordings by a paticular orchestra are not...)

Patents are *often* limited to a country, so you would need one in the US, one in Aus, though I think you can get international ones. A full patent means that you have described an example of the product fully and this info is then freely available to anyone. The patent means that only you can produce/use/license the invention. There are a bunch of criteria a patent must meet.

Patents only last 6 or 20 years (depending on the type). Considering that a new medicinal drug can takes 14 years from initial conception to market - that leaves the pharmaceutical company only a half dozen or so years to make back the millions of dollars they invested in the drug before a cheaper, generic "open-source" equivalent is available. If the company cannot make this money - the initial research will not be performed - the drug will never eventuate.

There are a bunch of other ways to protect intellectual property all with strengths and weaknesses.

So even though open-source is designed to create an open environment where a multitude of variations and products is available, sometimes it can prevent further discovery.

Incidentally - Coca Cola, Coke, "enjoy", "buddy", the dynamic ribbon device and the contoured bottle are all trademarked. The recipe, however, cannot be covered legally and kept the sole knowledge of Coke, except by using "trade secret" laws. If you tell someone that it is a secret then tell the secret - they are obliged (by law) to keep that secret. However, the only defense is litigation. Since Coke would stand to lose a LOT more from the release of the recipe than they would gain from any law suit, the number of people who know the secret is kept to a minimum.

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Where's the foetus gonna gestate? You gonna keep it in a box?

Sorry Cantus, I thought the link itself would make a bit more sense...

My apologies if the thread info and the link don't seem to match up...

I'm trying to say that the BB idea, especially here on HoP, is very simlar to the concept in the article, in that we all contribute to the greater whole, with suggestions ideas etc.

I wasn't intending any of my comments to be insulting, merely commenting that Bender's non-sequiter style comment reminded me on your own sometimes unfathomable (but humouress) comments.

Are we friends again, or do i need to drink vinegar out of the rubber chicken again to prove my regret?

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Charles (AKA INFERNO)

newdolbel@hotmail.com
http://juggle.co.nz/fire/fire.html

I'm not sure if it's nicotine withdrawal that's to blame for my moodiness. I think it's partly because I didn't get to chat to Ros this evening.

I think it's pretty girl withdrawal .

Just a theory (thought i'd share with the group).

awwww........I must admit I was aware the phone didn't ring....

! $|D33|< 2
u 2 $|D33|< |)!##|23|\|+ +|-|()

|<|24z33 |24\/3|2$

NYC baby, didn't we say you'd quit drinking some day ?

Annoyed cause I still don't get that type of writing.

And also very interested in the original subject. Funny enough I saw a doc on TV a short while ago about that and also thought of HoP

shine on
Cassandra

Has anyone tried copyrighting the idea of not copyrighting ideas...

Translations:
"w00t j00 |5 2 1337 |-|@X0r"
Woo(?) you is too leet Haxor

"j00 5p34k l33t +00?"
You speak leet too?

"! $|D33|< 2
u 2 $|D33|< |)!##|23|\|+ +|-|()
|<|24z33 |24\/3|2$"
I speak too.
You two speak different though
Crazy Ravers

(That was a lot harder to read NYC!)
leet = elite
Haxor = Hacker

No fair, NYC is using that site that converts its for you. Bender and I are freewriting it :P

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[]Dhuong-Vu Truong
== []Dro Spinner ==
==== []Dhunky ===

Slightly off topic however on the subject of copyrights; I have heard several times however have not beeb able to find any written information that the large oil companies own the copyrights to parts that could make vehicles more effecient. I've heard everything up to 90 MPG. Just curious if anyone had the take on that.

Love always,
Spanky

MMMmm Bender wishes that he had a dynamic ribbon device. and that he stop talking about himself in 3rd person.

About the leetspeak - is it a raver thing to do in the US? cus although ravers always swap emails (if not saliva), I didn't know that they leetspeak. For me it's a nerd thing (cue high-pitched nasal laughter)

A funny thing about open source/public domain policy - I've completed a Bachelor of Information Systems and have learnt more aboot o/source from the Genome mapping campaign then yewni study.

Ribbon devices RoXorS!
Nasal discharges Suxors!

/gives it a rest.

I also heard that a lot of the patents and designs on alternative fuel (mostly for cars) have been bought and hidden by the major Oil/Petrol companies.. when are they going to learn that there are more important things than money and profit? or are they going to be forced to change when the Arab countries that produce the majority of oil finally hold them to randsom?