Forums > Social Discussion > domestic violence and the police
Login/Join to ParticipateSILVER Member
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
Posted:
i would like to discuss how good various police services actually are...
last night it took the police 45minutes to get here! had it have beeen far more serious than it actually was i would have been too late. perhaps is this part of the reason why domestiv violence gets so bad on a particular occaison??
have any of you had an incciddent where you called the police and they took there time about getting there, taking i not ccount whether it was a friday or a saturday (days when the police are the most busy)
would like to hear your opinions
i would like to discuss how good various police services actually are...
last night it took the police 45minutes to get here! had it have beeen far more serious than it actually was i would have been too late. perhaps is this part of the reason why domestiv violence gets so bad on a particular occaison??
have any of you had an incciddent where you called the police and they took there time about getting there, taking i not ccount whether it was a friday or a saturday (days when the police are the most busy)
would like to hear your opinions
Proud Co-Owner of PoiBoi
Owned by J.A.C
SILVER Member
water based
5,125 posts
Location: melbourne, Australia
water based
5,125 posts
Location: melbourne, Australia
Posted:
recently two friends got followed when from the bottle shop to their house. once they got home, they started yelling stuff hitting the door etc. they called the police saying 'someone is trying to break into my house right now, theyre threatening to stab us'
over half an hour and one broken windscreen later.. the police arrive
recently two friends got followed when from the bottle shop to their house. once they got home, they started yelling stuff hitting the door etc. they called the police saying 'someone is trying to break into my house right now, theyre threatening to stab us'
over half an hour and one broken windscreen later.. the police arrive
"you know there are no trophys for doing silly things in real life yeah pete?" said ant "you wont get a 'listened to ride of the valkyries all the way to vietnam' trophy"
*proud owner of the very cute fire_spinning_angel, birgit and neon shaolin*
SILVER Member
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
Posted:
yeah i took over half an hour for the police arrive when somone did break into my freinds house and was literally threatening to kill over somthing stupid (this was years ago the guy is now in pirsion) and it took over an hour for them to arrive when some one refused the leave the couryard of their flat after homophobically assualting my friend and breaking their livving room window.
i think this clearly calls for an improvment of police services, although many of them do get to the scene in time and do try hard to get the job done i think its just not good enough!
yeah i took over half an hour for the police arrive when somone did break into my freinds house and was literally threatening to kill over somthing stupid (this was years ago the guy is now in pirsion) and it took over an hour for them to arrive when some one refused the leave the couryard of their flat after homophobically assualting my friend and breaking their livving room window.
i think this clearly calls for an improvment of police services, although many of them do get to the scene in time and do try hard to get the job done i think its just not good enough!
Proud Co-Owner of PoiBoi
Owned by J.A.C
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
I was walking with some friends and saw a guy beating up his girlfriend, who then tried to run away, so he dragged her to the ground and started kicking her.
Us being 3 females (and pretty small) couldnt do anything so we called the police, and they said "so?"
That was a shocking reality check for me.
This was in Eastern Europe, but it was still shockingly scary none-the-less!
I was walking with some friends and saw a guy beating up his girlfriend, who then tried to run away, so he dragged her to the ground and started kicking her.
Us being 3 females (and pretty small) couldnt do anything so we called the police, and they said "so?"
That was a shocking reality check for me.
This was in Eastern Europe, but it was still shockingly scary none-the-less!
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
Now don't be too harsh on the cops. I know it's different overseas but most of the time cops are bored off their asses, so if they're slow getting there believe me they've been busy doing other things. In many cases, if you're more rural, and it's a night shift, they may be the only officer on duty for a *very* large area. Around here, there are times where the county sheriff has maybe two deputies on duty for over 700 sq miles of ground.
And you guys wonder when us Americans say we like having our guns for protection, bet you wish you had one then if things had gotten worse!
Cops can't be everywhere, cut them a break. If the situation was over, than was there really a need to go code to get there asap? Maybe the call they were on before was more serious than yours?
Now don't be too harsh on the cops. I know it's different overseas but most of the time cops are bored off their asses, so if they're slow getting there believe me they've been busy doing other things. In many cases, if you're more rural, and it's a night shift, they may be the only officer on duty for a *very* large area. Around here, there are times where the county sheriff has maybe two deputies on duty for over 700 sq miles of ground.
And you guys wonder when us Americans say we like having our guns for protection, bet you wish you had one then if things had gotten worse!
Cops can't be everywhere, cut them a break. If the situation was over, than was there really a need to go code to get there asap? Maybe the call they were on before was more serious than yours? #homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored 
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
I just knew someone was going to bring the gun argument into this
I just knew someone was going to bring the gun argument into this
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
Oh, and if you're calling the police, how are you supposed to know that the previous call was more important? If I was being threatened by my partner than I wouldn't think "oh, gee, maybe the cops are investigating a murder...I'll call them later"
Oh, and if you're calling the police, how are you supposed to know that the previous call was more important? If I was being threatened by my partner than I wouldn't think "oh, gee, maybe the cops are investigating a murder...I'll call them later"
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
alright, ignore the gun comment, you have every right to call the police. But you have no reason to expect them to show up in 2 minutes. Granted that would always be the ideal response but look at how many officers, to people there are. They may very well be tapped out on something "more important." Most cops get on the job because they genuinely want to help people, they don't just sit around and stall for 30 minutes before they decide to go to a domestic
alright, ignore the gun comment, you have every right to call the police. But you have no reason to expect them to show up in 2 minutes. Granted that would always be the ideal response but look at how many officers, to people there are. They may very well be tapped out on something "more important." Most cops get on the job because they genuinely want to help people, they don't just sit around and stall for 30 minutes before they decide to go to a domestic
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
GOLD Member
Rock is dead, long live paper and scissors
197 posts
Location: The sea, United Kingdom
Rock is dead, long live paper and scissors
197 posts
Location: The sea, United Kingdom
Posted:
20 minutes response to a 999 call, the person involved was enraged, armed, voilent, had threatened to stab two people stabbed himself in the leg an was still hysterical. But fair play when the cops turned up there was
hundreads of 'em. Well two sqaud cars an a meat wagon about 7 cops in total.
What shocked me was that the ambulance took another 15 mins after that and the guy had been reported as havin possible arterial bleeding.
If he had, he'd have been brown bread, deffo.
The next time he kicked off the cops were there in force in 5 mins. I have a lot of respect for coppers. They do a crummy job get very little respect or recognition an have to work with the scum of society.
I wager most of them would much rather be out on the beat chasing real crooks instead of interviewing people who haven't paid paring fines but the level of buracracy andpaper work involved in police work is what takes up their time and stops them getting away with beating suspects.
Double edged sword i guess, do you want a controlled regulated police force or one with a two minute response time that go's judge dread on your ass?
20 minutes response to a 999 call, the person involved was enraged, armed, voilent, had threatened to stab two people stabbed himself in the leg an was still hysterical. But fair play when the cops turned up there was
hundreads of 'em. Well two sqaud cars an a meat wagon about 7 cops in total.What shocked me was that the ambulance took another 15 mins after that and the guy had been reported as havin possible arterial bleeding.
If he had, he'd have been brown bread, deffo.
The next time he kicked off the cops were there in force in 5 mins. I have a lot of respect for coppers. They do a crummy job get very little respect or recognition an have to work with the scum of society.
I wager most of them would much rather be out on the beat chasing real crooks instead of interviewing people who haven't paid paring fines but the level of buracracy andpaper work involved in police work is what takes up their time and stops them getting away with beating suspects.
Double edged sword i guess, do you want a controlled regulated police force or one with a two minute response time that go's judge dread on your ass?
Eagles may soar but weasles don't get sucked into jet engines.
Telepath wanted, you know where to apply.
now comes with skydiving license
1,627 posts
Location: In your head. (Tasmania, Australia)
1,627 posts
Location: In your head. (Tasmania, Australia)
Posted:
A group of guys gate crashed a party, smashed a window, stabbed my cousin, beat a guy with a baseball bat, threw a guy off the second story of a house.. 'Twas alltogether quite violent and the police took half and hour to arrive, it was an emergency call too.
I just have to assume there was something more pressing to attend to.. I must say, i do have respect for the cops.. But sometimes you've got to wonder about response times and the like...
A group of guys gate crashed a party, smashed a window, stabbed my cousin, beat a guy with a baseball bat, threw a guy off the second story of a house.. 'Twas alltogether quite violent and the police took half and hour to arrive, it was an emergency call too.
I just have to assume there was something more pressing to attend to.. I must say, i do have respect for the cops.. But sometimes you've got to wonder about response times and the like...
Proudly owned by the very cute Pineapple Pete. Owner of Noddy. Joint owner of Mr Majestik.
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
actually that's pretty fast for our area
domestic violence calls take at least 2 hours...i mentioned someone reported me dead and it took them 5 hours, but I guess I wasn't going any where
they did show up in a timely fashion for the home invasion and battery, but they didn't do anything but to seperate us
actually that's pretty fast for our area
domestic violence calls take at least 2 hours...i mentioned someone reported me dead and it took them 5 hours, but I guess I wasn't going any where
they did show up in a timely fashion for the home invasion and battery, but they didn't do anything but to seperate us
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
SILVER Member
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
Posted:
i know that there may be more pressing things to attend to, but surely arnt they supposed to have enough officers in the service to attend to more then one emergency at once???
yea i do know they try very hard and usually do a good job, but still response to an emergency 999 call should not take 45 minutes.
i wonder are there any area in the UK with especiial good emergency services? or the world for that matter, or is it generally given that youll have to wait??
i know that there may be more pressing things to attend to, but surely arnt they supposed to have enough officers in the service to attend to more then one emergency at once???
yea i do know they try very hard and usually do a good job, but still response to an emergency 999 call should not take 45 minutes.
i wonder are there any area in the UK with especiial good emergency services? or the world for that matter, or is it generally given that youll have to wait??
Proud Co-Owner of PoiBoi
Owned by J.A.C
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
I can't speak much for the UK, but funding for the police around here is dependent on the local taxes and such. There most certainly *should* be enough police to go around, everyone says that, but not many people are truly willing to give up the money for it.
How long you'll have to wait would generally be determined by the severity of the call. If the domestic you've called in is done and over with, they're just showing up to take statements and probably haul one of you off for the night. (if the other will press charges, which sadly doesn't happen nearly enough) There isn't so much of an 'active threat' where as they may be on a BAE call, or a violent fight still in progress. Personally I never really expect anything from a police officer. I understand their job, and know that they don't have any duty to risk their life for me. Their primary goal is just to make sure they live through their shift.
Not that I would recommend it but this does remind me of a joke....
A man was going to bed one night when his wife told him that he had left the light on in the shed. She could see the light was on from the bedroom window. As the man looked for himself he saw that there were people in the shed taking things.
The man phoned the police, but they told him that no one was in the area to help him at that time, but they would send someone over as soon as they were available.
He said "OK," hung up, and waited one minute, then phoned the police back. "Hello" he said, "I just called you a minute ago because there were people in my shed. Well, you don't have to worry about them now 'cause I've shot them."
Within five minutes there were half a dozen police cars in the area, an Armed Response unit, the works. Of course, they caught the burglars red-handed.
One of the officers said: "I thought you said that you shot Them!" The man replied, "I thought you said there was nobody available!"
I can't speak much for the UK, but funding for the police around here is dependent on the local taxes and such. There most certainly *should* be enough police to go around, everyone says that, but not many people are truly willing to give up the money for it.
How long you'll have to wait would generally be determined by the severity of the call. If the domestic you've called in is done and over with, they're just showing up to take statements and probably haul one of you off for the night. (if the other will press charges, which sadly doesn't happen nearly enough) There isn't so much of an 'active threat' where as they may be on a BAE call, or a violent fight still in progress. Personally I never really expect anything from a police officer. I understand their job, and know that they don't have any duty to risk their life for me. Their primary goal is just to make sure they live through their shift.
Not that I would recommend it but this does remind me of a joke....
A man was going to bed one night when his wife told him that he had left the light on in the shed. She could see the light was on from the bedroom window. As the man looked for himself he saw that there were people in the shed taking things.
The man phoned the police, but they told him that no one was in the area to help him at that time, but they would send someone over as soon as they were available.
He said "OK," hung up, and waited one minute, then phoned the police back. "Hello" he said, "I just called you a minute ago because there were people in my shed. Well, you don't have to worry about them now 'cause I've shot them."
Within five minutes there were half a dozen police cars in the area, an Armed Response unit, the works. Of course, they caught the burglars red-handed.
One of the officers said: "I thought you said that you shot Them!" The man replied, "I thought you said there was nobody available!"
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
BRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posted:
Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed
SILVER Member
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
old hand
865 posts
Location: Sunderland, UK
Posted:
haha!! in fact thats brightened my day.... ill tell my mum when she gets up i think shell appreciate it.!
haha!!
in fact thats brightened my day.... ill tell my mum when she gets up i think shell appreciate it.! Proud Co-Owner of PoiBoi
Owned by J.A.C
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
nice one 
nice one the best smiles are the ones you lead to 
SILVER Member
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posted:
What? ...Scuse me, but WHAT??
So... what then? You just shrugged, said 'we don't have anything dangly between our legs, so we can't possibly deal with this situation', and walked off, or something? You have GOT to be kidding me.
Even alone, there's PLENTY you could do in a situation like that, 'female' or not.
Written by: Rouge Dragon
I was walking with some friends and saw a guy beating up his girlfriend, who then tried to run away, so he dragged her to the ground and started kicking her.
Us being 3 females (and pretty small) couldnt do anything so we called the police, and they said "so?"
What? ...Scuse me, but WHAT??
So... what then? You just shrugged, said 'we don't have anything dangly between our legs, so we can't possibly deal with this situation', and walked off, or something? You have GOT to be kidding me.
Even alone, there's PLENTY you could do in a situation like that, 'female' or not.
"Ours is not to question The Head; it is enough to revel in the ubiquitous inanity of The Head, the unwanted proximity of The Head, the unrelenting HellPresence of The Head, indeed the very UNYIELDING IRRELEVANCE of The Head!" --Revelation X
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
Oh really? And what would have have done? Alone? And with no "dangly bits"?
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182042032)
Oh really? And what would have have done? Alone? And with no "dangly bits"?
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182042032)
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
... which is why I am proposing every female to train in unarmed self defence - if they want to break the cycle of getting victimized.
But GC is right that there is a lot you can do, even if you are not trained in martial arts. Especially if there is more than one of you.
Problem is - as Lurch stated in the gun law thread - that people react to violence with utter panic. This problem is dealt with in self defence classes - which on the other hand can't fully dilute the emotional chaos. However I still think that Romania offers a different scenario in general.
But in the case of [Old link]...
... which is why I am proposing every female to train in unarmed self defence - if they want to break the cycle of getting victimized.
But GC is right that there is a lot you can do, even if you are not trained in martial arts. Especially if there is more than one of you.
Problem is - as Lurch stated in the gun law thread - that people react to violence with utter panic. This problem is dealt with in self defence classes - which on the other hand can't fully dilute the emotional chaos. However I still think that Romania offers a different scenario in general.
But in the case of [Old link]...
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly what it is that can be done.
As for the drowning thing, I read it when it was posted and it is most commendable. However, over here we are taught that to save someone drowning it is best to throw them a line unless you're a trained life guard.
When I was in school, government primary schools had 4 weeks a year of compulsory swimming. And guess what got drilled into us? Yes, what I just said above.
I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly what it is that can be done.
As for the drowning thing, I read it when it was posted and it is most commendable. However, over here we are taught that to save someone drowning it is best to throw them a line unless you're a trained life guard.
When I was in school, government primary schools had 4 weeks a year of compulsory swimming. And guess what got drilled into us? Yes, what I just said above.
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
SILVER Member
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posted:
Marched right up and done my best to stop him. First by taking a very firm, assertive tone/stance and telling him to stop, probably something along the lines of "HEY! GET YOUR HANDS OFF HER!". Then, if given any lip, I'd kick his ass or get put in the hospital trying. I wouldn't stop to even debate the matter, and in fact it would be very difficult to STOP me. I once found an intruder in my house, and rather than running, I attacked him on the spot, so I do have some idea how I behave in emergency situations. Granted, I'm larger than the average woman, and I have martial arts training, but frankly the single most important thing is how you carry yourself and how you approach people. Size is irrelevant next to that-- any man on earth will pause and think twice when approached by someone with intent, no matter what the contents of their pants are. And there were THREE OF YOU. Counting the girlfriend, pummeled or not, that's FOUR. And in a public place. You have so much, much more power than you realize.
I'm still waiting to hear what happened to this poor woman. Did you just leave her there? Did you at least try to involve other people? Did ANYONE help??
Written by: Rouge Dragon
Oh really? And what would have have done? Alone? And with no "dangly bits"?
Marched right up and done my best to stop him. First by taking a very firm, assertive tone/stance and telling him to stop, probably something along the lines of "HEY! GET YOUR HANDS OFF HER!". Then, if given any lip, I'd kick his ass or get put in the hospital trying. I wouldn't stop to even debate the matter, and in fact it would be very difficult to STOP me. I once found an intruder in my house, and rather than running, I attacked him on the spot, so I do have some idea how I behave in emergency situations. Granted, I'm larger than the average woman, and I have martial arts training, but frankly the single most important thing is how you carry yourself and how you approach people. Size is irrelevant next to that-- any man on earth will pause and think twice when approached by someone with intent, no matter what the contents of their pants are. And there were THREE OF YOU. Counting the girlfriend, pummeled or not, that's FOUR. And in a public place. You have so much, much more power than you realize.
Written by: Rouge Dragon
I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly what it is that can be done.
I'm still waiting to hear what happened to this poor woman. Did you just leave her there? Did you at least try to involve other people? Did ANYONE help??
"Ours is not to question The Head; it is enough to revel in the ubiquitous inanity of The Head, the unwanted proximity of The Head, the unrelenting HellPresence of The Head, indeed the very UNYIELDING IRRELEVANCE of The Head!" --Revelation X
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
You just said yourself that you are larger than average and have martial arts training. I'm smaller than average and my friends were smaller than me and we have zero martial arts training. Seeing a massive difference? Maybe for someone of your size, saying that to a guy will make him worry, but trust me, if I do that to someone they will probably laugh...and then hit me.
did you ignore the part where I said we called the police?
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182046700)
You just said yourself that you are larger than average and have martial arts training. I'm smaller than average and my friends were smaller than me and we have zero martial arts training. Seeing a massive difference? Maybe for someone of your size, saying that to a guy will make him worry, but trust me, if I do that to someone they will probably laugh...and then hit me.
Written by: CG
Did you at least try to involve other people?
did you ignore the part where I said we called the police?
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182046700)
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
I think it's time for my original post that I initially deleted:
YOU have got to be kidding ME!
The best thing we could do was call the police. We did not shrug. We dealt with the situation as we thought best. BY CALLING THE POLICE!
How about I actually tell you the FULL version of what happened:
*I* was shocked and scared and wanted to call the police (I am Australian). My two friends shurgged their shoulders and said "why bother". Why? Because it was Romania and Romania is not here!
I protested and said we should call the police (I couldn't do it because my Romanian was not good enough to call emergency services) and my friends were like "no, this always happens, in Romania people don't care". Might I also add here that I think one of my friends was abused by her boyfriend who was also a friend of mine. But this is only a suspicion.
They finally gave into my plea and called the police. And the police responded with "and what are we supposed to do about it?" "Intervene!" "maybe".
I then said that I wanted to call our guy friends to come and stop it themselves. But the girls wouldn't let me do that. Like I said, one of the mates I would have called I suspected of beating his girlfriend anyway. And besides, there was a very good chance they would have felt the same way as the police. In the end, my friends had to practically drag me away because they knew better than me that nothing could be done.
And WHY was the attitude like this? Because this was a small town in Romania where everyone knew everyone else. Domestic violence was very common. Which is why the police didn't care. So was rival groups and gangs. Which, had my male friends been called, they would have then been at risk of those gangs then coming after them.
The man in the flat oppoiste my friend beat his wife frequently and none of the neighbours did a thing.
A guy I knew pushed his girlfriend down a flight of stairs and lander her in hospital. And he got away with it, despite the fact that half of the school saw him do it.
Do you think I liked it? Of course I didn't! But there was absolutely NOTHING I could have done about it.
Welcome to living in a less fortunate country. Life is very different there. You can't bring your rose-coloured glasses with you.
Therefore, I am interested as to what "PLEANTY" is when you are a lone 'female'. Attack the guy back? Apart from being incredibly stupid because I would have gotten hurt myself, I was in a foreign country, meaning that had I been hurt in a situation like that, my embassy and my travel insurance would not have covered me because *I* attacked him.
To save someone drowning, you don't jump in after them because that leaves two people drowning. You throw them a line from the safety of the bank.
edit: oh, and I might also meantion that this was all happening out the front of a church
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182047429)
I think it's time for my original post that I initially deleted:
YOU have got to be kidding ME!
The best thing we could do was call the police. We did not shrug. We dealt with the situation as we thought best. BY CALLING THE POLICE!
How about I actually tell you the FULL version of what happened:
*I* was shocked and scared and wanted to call the police (I am Australian). My two friends shurgged their shoulders and said "why bother". Why? Because it was Romania and Romania is not here!
I protested and said we should call the police (I couldn't do it because my Romanian was not good enough to call emergency services) and my friends were like "no, this always happens, in Romania people don't care". Might I also add here that I think one of my friends was abused by her boyfriend who was also a friend of mine. But this is only a suspicion.
They finally gave into my plea and called the police. And the police responded with "and what are we supposed to do about it?" "Intervene!" "maybe".
I then said that I wanted to call our guy friends to come and stop it themselves. But the girls wouldn't let me do that. Like I said, one of the mates I would have called I suspected of beating his girlfriend anyway. And besides, there was a very good chance they would have felt the same way as the police. In the end, my friends had to practically drag me away because they knew better than me that nothing could be done.
And WHY was the attitude like this? Because this was a small town in Romania where everyone knew everyone else. Domestic violence was very common. Which is why the police didn't care. So was rival groups and gangs. Which, had my male friends been called, they would have then been at risk of those gangs then coming after them.
The man in the flat oppoiste my friend beat his wife frequently and none of the neighbours did a thing.
A guy I knew pushed his girlfriend down a flight of stairs and lander her in hospital. And he got away with it, despite the fact that half of the school saw him do it.
Do you think I liked it? Of course I
didn't! But there was absolutely NOTHING I could have done about it. Welcome to living in a less fortunate country. Life is very different there. You can't bring your rose-coloured glasses with you.
Therefore, I am interested as to what "PLEANTY" is when you are a lone 'female'. Attack the guy back? Apart from being incredibly stupid because I would have gotten hurt myself, I was in a foreign country, meaning that had I been hurt in a situation like that, my embassy and my travel insurance would not have covered me because *I* attacked him.
To save someone drowning, you don't jump in after them because that leaves two people drowning. You throw them a line from the safety of the bank.
edit: oh, and I might also meantion that this was all happening out the front of a church
EDITED_BY: Rouge Dragon (1182047429)
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
SILVER Member
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posted:
I'm... frankly I'm rather speechless. I don't understand how people can go through life feeling like that-- so powerless, so fearful. It's.... sad beyond words. I'm really sorry. Hun, you don't have to live with this kind of helplessness. And I'm dead serious, here.
You were in an incredibly unpleasant situation-- being in a place without any good friends or even halfway trustworthy acquaintances to call on, in an unfamiliar country. Those friends who were with you... the whole thing stuns me, really. The way this ugliness perpetuates itself. Women who've been victimized, hurrying away while the same thing happens to others, because in their world they don't see any other option. This sort of thing continues because of this sort of attitude. This accepted impotence, this assumed helplessness. Victims by default, before you even start. Actually, you're right-- people (male or female) who tried to intervene in this situation, with that attitude.. yeah... they would get laughed at, and possibly hurt.
But it doesn't have to be that way. This isn't rose-colored idealism-- I did acknowledge I could end up in the hospital... or conceivably, worse. So I'm kinda tall for a chick, big deal-- I'm no Bruce Lee, that's for damn sure. The thing is though, I accept that risk, and still would rather do something, with some confidence that I could at least try. And violence is definitely NOT the best or only option. Take a self-defense course. I'm completely with FireTom on this one, I can't express it enough. The idea is not becoming some kung fu master-- the important thing is learning that in nearly any situation, you do have abilities, OPTIONS, some of which are very simple. You gain coordination, strength... and confidence. Ideally you would not ever, ever have to actually use any physical techniques you learn. In many instances, just the difference in attitude is enough. Predators can smell fear. If you don't give it to them, the whole situation changes. Just the -concept- of a woman talking back and meaning it is often a bizarre enough idea to these people that it will make them think twice. I enrolled in a martial arts class at the beginning of high school and the difference in how people treated me was noticeable within a few months.
Anyway, don't mean to hijack this thread... but when you get down to it, there's only so much the police can do. They won't always be there on time. They won't always be the good guys. We can't depend totally on them to take care of everything. I guess you have to keep out of the way if you really aren't capable of helping, but with some effort, and faith in yourself, you can be.
I'm... frankly I'm rather speechless. I don't understand how people can go through life feeling like that-- so powerless, so fearful. It's.... sad beyond words. I'm really sorry. Hun, you don't have to live with this kind of helplessness. And I'm dead serious, here.
You were in an incredibly unpleasant situation-- being in a place without any good friends or even halfway trustworthy acquaintances to call on, in an unfamiliar country. Those friends who were with you... the whole thing stuns me, really. The way this ugliness perpetuates itself. Women who've been victimized, hurrying away while the same thing happens to others, because in their world they don't see any other option. This sort of thing continues because of this sort of attitude. This accepted impotence, this assumed helplessness. Victims by default, before you even start. Actually, you're right-- people (male or female) who tried to intervene in this situation, with that attitude.. yeah... they would get laughed at, and possibly hurt.
But it doesn't have to be that way. This isn't rose-colored idealism-- I did acknowledge I could end up in the hospital... or conceivably, worse. So I'm kinda tall for a chick, big deal-- I'm no Bruce Lee, that's for damn sure. The thing is though, I accept that risk, and still would rather do something, with some confidence that I could at least try. And violence is definitely NOT the best or only option. Take a self-defense course. I'm completely with FireTom on this one, I can't express it enough. The idea is not becoming some kung fu master-- the important thing is learning that in nearly any situation, you do have abilities, OPTIONS, some of which are very simple. You gain coordination, strength... and confidence. Ideally you would not ever, ever have to actually use any physical techniques you learn. In many instances, just the difference in attitude is enough. Predators can smell fear. If you don't give it to them, the whole situation changes. Just the -concept- of a woman talking back and meaning it is often a bizarre enough idea to these people that it will make them think twice. I enrolled in a martial arts class at the beginning of high school and the difference in how people treated me was noticeable within a few months.
Anyway, don't mean to hijack this thread... but when you get down to it, there's only so much the police can do. They won't always be there on time. They won't always be the good guys. We can't depend totally on them to take care of everything. I guess you have to keep out of the way if you really aren't capable of helping, but with some effort, and faith in yourself, you can be.
"Ours is not to question The Head; it is enough to revel in the ubiquitous inanity of The Head, the unwanted proximity of The Head, the unrelenting HellPresence of The Head, indeed the very UNYIELDING IRRELEVANCE of The Head!" --Revelation X
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
And there is that fine red line, between victimizing yourself and arming yourself (out of fear to get victimized). If I am now stating that there is a co-relation between perpetrator and victim, certainly I get
but I believe there is. Not just in physical violence, but all along.
It's got nothing to do with "blame". Actually victims tend to blame themselves too much, perpetrators tend to blame themselves not enough... - which is part of that process.
I cannot tell you what you should have done, but if you have the feeling that you are incapable and too weak, small, shy, untrained to do anything then the only advise I can give you is to take self defence classes. Because this feeling is part of that "victimisation process" - and the circumstances are always odd.
Living in countries like Romania - which are very male dominated, stricken by poverty and unemployment - is not a pleasant experience, I bet. Which is exactly when - as a woman, trained in self defence - you can make a great difference by seeding this knowledge into other women's heads... Personally I would love to see more women, who have more self esteem.
And there is that fine red line, between victimizing yourself and arming yourself (out of fear to get victimized). If I am now stating that there is a co-relation between perpetrator and victim, certainly I get
but I believe there is. Not just in physical violence, but all along.It's got nothing to do with "blame". Actually victims tend to blame themselves too much, perpetrators tend to blame themselves not enough... - which is part of that process.
I cannot tell you what you should have done, but if you have the feeling that you are incapable and too weak, small, shy, untrained to do anything then the only advise I can give you is to take self defence classes. Because this feeling is part of that "victimisation process" - and the circumstances are always odd.
Living in countries like Romania - which are very male dominated, stricken by poverty and unemployment - is not a pleasant experience, I bet. Which is exactly when - as a woman, trained in self defence - you can make a great difference by seeding this knowledge into other women's heads... Personally I would love to see more women, who have more self esteem.
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
yes but self defence is exactly that, self. I don't see how self defence classes is supposed to help unless it's me being attacked.
And even without self defence training, I honestly believe that I made a difference to the lives of the girls I encountered there.
yes but self defence is exactly that, self. I don't see how self defence classes is supposed to help unless it's me being attacked.
And even without self defence training, I honestly believe that I made a difference to the lives of the girls I encountered there.
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Certainly you did fellow Geminisque...
Thanks for challenging my mind now join "self defence" with "martial arts"...
Certainly you did
fellow Geminisque...Thanks for challenging my mind
now join "self defence" with "martial arts"... the best smiles are the ones you lead to
SILVER Member
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posted:
The FIRST and main thing self-defense training does, and I'll repeat this again, is it changes the way you carry yourself. Just the knowledge that you have options, an idea of your own capabilities, confidence-- shows in every step you take during the day. Someone who is capable of defending themselves walks differently, speaks differently, looks different. As a kid I was tormented nonstop in school-- I went through every day cringing from everyone, expecting more abuse from everyone I met. I may as well have painted VICTIM in huge letters on my own forehead. Within a few months of enrolling in the martial arts class in high school, the way people responded to me started to change-- I didn't beat anybody up, I didn't threaten anyone, I didn't brag about or even mention the class I was taking. But people started simply ignoring me and leaving me alone-- and that's while I'm not thinking about it or doing anything. If I actively approach someone with powerful intent, they take notice.
Bullies are weak and nervous people. A man faced with a woman who isn't doing what she's supposed to, a woman who isn't quiet or meek, but stepping up to him with confidence, will often be frightened. Sometimes this results in an immediate escalation of hostility, in those who are used to pummeling things that won't behave-- and then self-defense becomes a literal and immediate need. More often, it will result in him going on the defensive, at which point you have every opportunity to get between him and his victim, and back him down, with words and presence alone.
Written by: Rouge Dragon*brain cramp!* eh? How is defending someone else any different?? And honestly, it was your own skin that you're really worried about to begin with, right? If you approach a dangerous man, you're assuming his hostility is going to get turned on you next, and that's what stops you.
yes but self defence is exactly that, self. I don't see how self defence classes is supposed to help unless it's me being attacked.
The FIRST and main thing self-defense training does, and I'll repeat this again, is it changes the way you carry yourself. Just the knowledge that you have options, an idea of your own capabilities, confidence-- shows in every step you take during the day. Someone who is capable of defending themselves walks differently, speaks differently, looks different. As a kid I was tormented nonstop in school-- I went through every day cringing from everyone, expecting more abuse from everyone I met. I may as well have painted VICTIM in huge letters on my own forehead. Within a few months of enrolling in the martial arts class in high school, the way people responded to me started to change-- I didn't beat anybody up, I didn't threaten anyone, I didn't brag about or even mention the class I was taking. But people started simply ignoring me and leaving me alone-- and that's while I'm not thinking about it or doing anything. If I actively approach someone with powerful intent, they take notice.
Bullies are weak and nervous people. A man faced with a woman who isn't doing what she's supposed to, a woman who isn't quiet or meek, but stepping up to him with confidence, will often be frightened. Sometimes this results in an immediate escalation of hostility, in those who are used to pummeling things that won't behave-- and then self-defense becomes a literal and immediate need. More often, it will result in him going on the defensive, at which point you have every opportunity to get between him and his victim, and back him down, with words and presence alone.
"Ours is not to question The Head; it is enough to revel in the ubiquitous inanity of The Head, the unwanted proximity of The Head, the unrelenting HellPresence of The Head, indeed the very UNYIELDING IRRELEVANCE of The Head!" --Revelation X
GOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom
Posted:
Spiritually and emotionally weak, yes- bit it's important to remember that they can often be physically capable of causing great harm to their victims.
Muggers, thugs etc, can, and do, end peoples lives and it's not just those who project a 'victim aura' or feel like victims.
Even the most realistic self-defence training simply shifts the odds of surviving encounters in your favour.
Much of realistic self-defence training is about how best to avoid getting into situations where violence is going to kick off.
Very pertinent to Rouge Dragons example is that, in general domestics are something that you should be very wary of getting involved in.
Cos most violent incidents between partners are part of a long-term dysfunctional relationship consisting of a habitual bully and a conditioned victim.
And it's a fact that, if a stranger intervenes and the bully kicks off, the partner who you're trying to help, is quite likely to join in against you- that's two against one on the street, not a ggod scenario for you.
(The reasons they join in to help their partner are complex, but, in these kind of relationships, abuse is what they are both used to, and scared off, by joining in against the individual trying to help them, they feel they gain the approval of the partner they are so intimidated by).
That's not to say you shouldn't try to assist if you feel you're up to it and that you can help, but clearly Rouge Dragon didn't and I'd say she did exactly the right thing (ring the police)- it's not her fault the police didn't care.
IMO, she had every right to not get directly involved and, had she received realistic self-defence training, she would have been well aware of the advice to not get involved in street domestics.
IMO, Rouge Dragon, you did the right thing and should not feel at all ashamed about wht you did.
That's domestics in the UK etc- for a domestic in Romania, a place where even the police don't get involved, getting into a domestic is probably even less advisable.
Having said that, in many ways women do have an edge over men in easing developing violent situations, as there's no ego gain in hitting a woman- however, given that in this example, the guy was beating his girlfriend up, it's quite likely that he's going to be less inhibited about hitting women in general.
Written by:
Bullies are weak and nervous people.
Spiritually and emotionally weak, yes- bit it's important to remember that they can often be physically capable of causing great harm to their victims.
Muggers, thugs etc, can, and do, end peoples lives and it's not just those who project a 'victim aura' or feel like victims.
Even the most realistic self-defence training simply shifts the odds of surviving encounters in your favour.
Much of realistic self-defence training is about how best to avoid getting into situations where violence is going to kick off.
Very pertinent to Rouge Dragons example is that, in general domestics are something that you should be very wary of getting involved in.
Cos most violent incidents between partners are part of a long-term dysfunctional relationship consisting of a habitual bully and a conditioned victim.
And it's a fact that, if a stranger intervenes and the bully kicks off, the partner who you're trying to help, is quite likely to join in against you- that's two against one on the street, not a ggod scenario for you.
(The reasons they join in to help their partner are complex, but, in these kind of relationships, abuse is what they are both used to, and scared off, by joining in against the individual trying to help them, they feel they gain the approval of the partner they are so intimidated by).
That's not to say you shouldn't try to assist if you feel you're up to it and that you can help, but clearly Rouge Dragon didn't and I'd say she did exactly the right thing (ring the police)- it's not her fault the police didn't care.
IMO, she had every right to not get directly involved and, had she received realistic self-defence training, she would have been well aware of the advice to not get involved in street domestics.
IMO, Rouge Dragon, you did the right thing and should not feel at all ashamed about wht you did.
That's domestics in the UK etc- for a domestic in Romania, a place where even the police don't get involved, getting into a domestic is probably even less advisable.
Having said that, in many ways women do have an edge over men in easing developing violent situations, as there's no ego gain in hitting a woman- however, given that in this example, the guy was beating his girlfriend up, it's quite likely that he's going to be less inhibited about hitting women in general.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
SILVER Member
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
member
186 posts
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posted:
You're quite right on all fronts, dave.
However, there's still something fundamental to this situation-- and all others like it-- that really, profoundly bothers me. The way it's spoken of, the overall attitude about it, so cold. Defensive, resigned, apologetic, coddling. People-- particularly women-- take it for granted that calling the police is the ONLY thing a person in her position could ever possibly do, and that it's acceptable to simply walk away. That woman could have died in that parking lot that night. And if the same situation arises again? The same thing will happen. And the next time. And the next time. How long is it okay to go through life content with and accepting of your own fearful uselessness? All over the world, some men still treat women like cattle. And why? Because we LET THEM.
Truth is, personally... I'd much rather take some punches than try to sleep at night after walking away.
Anyhow, sorry if I offend anybody or seemed too harsh, I'll hush up now.
You're quite right on all fronts, dave.
However, there's still something fundamental to this situation-- and all others like it-- that really, profoundly bothers me. The way it's spoken of, the overall attitude about it, so cold. Defensive, resigned, apologetic, coddling. People-- particularly women-- take it for granted that calling the police is the ONLY thing a person in her position could ever possibly do, and that it's acceptable to simply walk away. That woman could have died in that parking lot that night. And if the same situation arises again? The same thing will happen. And the next time. And the next time. How long is it okay to go through life content with and accepting of your own fearful uselessness? All over the world, some men still treat women like cattle. And why? Because we LET THEM.
Truth is, personally... I'd much rather take some punches than try to sleep at night after walking away.
Anyhow, sorry if I offend anybody or seemed too harsh, I'll hush up now.
"Ours is not to question The Head; it is enough to revel in the ubiquitous inanity of The Head, the unwanted proximity of The Head, the unrelenting HellPresence of The Head, indeed the very UNYIELDING IRRELEVANCE of The Head!" --Revelation X
BRONZE Member
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
old hand
929 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
I fully agree Gnarly, I said I wouldn't go into my thoughts on guns and self defense, but the further this thread goes the more I feel it should tie into the gun control thread.
There is something very wrong with a system (any system) where a victim feels helpless. Even more so when the population sees nothing wrong with that. It is the right and honorable thing to do *something* even if that is only calling the police. I would not want to get involved in a domestic, especially if I lived in the neighborhood and would be open to 'street justice' afterwards. The only time I would physically get involved would probably be if it looked like the victim was going to die as a result of the attack. Getting too involved can put you in a very bad place, doing nothing can do the same (emotionally and morally, sometimes legally) Dave speaks wise words.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." (Edmund Burke)
I fully agree Gnarly, I said I wouldn't go into my thoughts on guns and self defense, but the further this thread goes the more I feel it should tie into the gun control thread.
There is something very wrong with a system (any system) where a victim feels helpless. Even more so when the population sees nothing wrong with that. It is the right and honorable thing to do *something* even if that is only calling the police. I would not want to get involved in a domestic, especially if I lived in the neighborhood and would be open to 'street justice' afterwards. The only time I would physically get involved would probably be if it looked like the victim was going to die as a result of the attack. Getting too involved can put you in a very bad place, doing nothing can do the same (emotionally and morally, sometimes legally) Dave speaks wise words.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." (Edmund Burke)
#homeofpoi -- irc.newnet.net Come talk to us we're bored
Warning: Please Do Not Jump On The Seals
Similar Topics
Using the keywords [domestic violence police] we found the following existing topics.
- Forums > domestic violence and the police [31 replies]
Show more..
© 1998 - 2024 Home of Poi
All prices converted to United States dollars using XE.com