Forums > Advanced Poi Moves > Isolated Forward 3 beat weave

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
Umm, that's nowhere near fully isolated. And as far as I know, no one can do one fully isolated, and I'm not entirely sure if it's possible. Hits to give you, just practice it, it just gets smoother over time, that's generally how isolations work.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
First, I don't want to sound too weird, but it's been that kind of day; Je pense que vous etes mignon.

Secondly, I've been working on this too for a bit, I think you're further along than I am though. Looks pretty good except for a completely 3bt you need to get rid of the transitional isolation in the middle there. (not sure what else to call it really).

As Spinner there said, just keep working on it. =)

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
Entirely possible.

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
It comes out of isolation a bit on the sides. It's still in isolation, but it's not a unit-circle isolation. That I believe is what constitutes a "perfectly isolated" anyhting is that it stays in a unit-circle isolation the entire time. Am I right or no? But, that is a pretty sweet lookin one, I already saw that video.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
yeah i knew it wasnt completely right..
which is why i posted it to see what people said about it.
its kinda hard to do something that youve never seeen anyone do because you cant use others as an example and learn from them
haha
but thanks for the feedback!
i appreciate it.

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
Nifty video, hadn't seen that one.

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
thanks for the feed back. thats all i wanted out of posting this.. just wanted to get tips on how to make it better and what i was doing wrong.

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 4th Apr 2010
A lot of times with isolations, the only thing you do wrong is not completely isolating. Which only comes from practice.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
Try to get the motion with your hands but WITHOUT poi.

The issue I see in your video is that you're slipping in and out of the isolation altogether.

Getting the motion without the poi will help immensely.


Try it while actually holding your poi heads, you'll note that when you do it, the heads will actually be behind your hands at all times.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
I've seen both Ronan and Cyrille do very clean Isolation Weaves fully isolated. Definitely possible. I'm getting there with those

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
hold one poi, one hand at either end. keeping the body or string tight, spin your hands in a weave motion.

This is your required hand motion.you'll find to keep the body tight, your hands have to make quite a large circle. you'll get it.

Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
ive actually been holding the one poi with both hands and it has helped tremendously! thank you for the reply though, i really do appreciate it.

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
hey poiboy! i remember seeing you do one (or dayum close) in one of your videos and i was looking for it to see how the hell you were managing to isolate the transitions and i couldnt find it again! do you remember what vid its on?

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
Yep definitely possible, specially with heavier and longer poi. Follow the advice given above and also move your torso out of the way of the isolation as much as possible. Some people find the reverse weave isolation easier but I found it's the same difficulty for both ways.

Once you can do it on both directions try isolating the isolation by moving your body around the pattern.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
I find it easier in reverse to keep it isolated. I've been getting better at it. Coming out of isolation less and less.

The only luck is bad luck.

Shut up before I stall my poi up your ass

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
I'm working on my isolated weaves aswell. What helped me was to practice doing a basic figure-8 isolated. That gets you to the feeling of crossing the poi from one side to the other, like you need to do in the isolated weave. After having a feeling for the figure-8 (and checking from the mirror that it's isolated well), add an extra beat to the other side so that you have the pattern for the 3 beat weave for one poi.

Going from 1 poi to 2 can be a bit tricky though. Your arms need to move quite a bit, and they seem to annoyingly get into each other's way. Practicing isolating your poi with crossed arms is a huge help. What helped me considerably was twisting my body a fair amount to the opposite side of where the poi are (in the end the body ends up making a kind of a figure-8). And when crossing, the hand needs to cross considerably earlier than in a regular weave. This also helps with the arms not hitting each other. When the isolated weave is good, there should always be a space of one poi length between the hands in the profile. Check yourself in the mirror and see where you come out of isolation. Then focus on fixing that part (try twisting your body more, try with one poi again, see if you need to move your arm more.. etc just try whatever works)

My iso weaves are nowhere near perfect, but I figured I'd tell everything that helped me get to this point incase it helps somebody. I'm certain that a "perfect" iso-weave is not impossible.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
thank you very much! i actually have a video up of me trying one so maybe you could look at it and tell me how to improve? that would be awesome!
i know that its not fully isolated and its nowhere near perfect but a video would help understand what i need help with. and i find it wayyyyy easier to isolate when you bend the planes instead of having the wheel plane straight vertical.. if that makes since. ive messed around with moving around my body and i can change the 3 beat iso to an isolated atomic kinda.. hahah and then throwing in pendulums (have one in my vid) kinda flows right with it.. but once again i know that mine has a lot of work to be "perfect". my name on youtube is hero417 so it would be cool if you could check it out! heres a link my brothah

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 5th Apr 2010
thank you for the feed back!
i actually have a video up if your interested in lookin and maybe giving some pointers.. but like i said to revo, i know its not nowhere near being perfect.. just easier to give advice if you can see what im doing. and the moving around your body is a great tip. it seriously does flow once you have the basics of the 3 beat iso down.. ive managed to transfer into an atomic iso pattern also but once again i know its not completely right. haha but any feedback on the video would be lovely!

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 6th Apr 2010
looking at your vid i'd say you're inclined not to isolate once your hands are crossed which breaks the pattern, try just crossing your arms into a crosser and get your isolations good in that position, then try it in both direcions/with both hands that should break through the block(i had the same problem when i was learning it )

even chuck norris can't pin you down if your on fire

Posted: 6th Apr 2010
Drex was working on these for a while, so if you go through his tech blog you might find some hints there as well.

'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland

Posted: 6th Apr 2010
thanks man!
i have a huge mental block where its not wanting to allow me to move the hand going under along with the isolation.. and as much as i focus on doin it its not wanting to let me. hahah its mainly my right hand going under that i cant get at the moment but thats to be expected because im left handed.. im sure most people have trouble with their left hand going under. but anyways hopefully ill get it one day and everyones replies have helped me tremendously so i appreciate everyones help!
ill definitely be practicing the iso with crossed hands.. i have before but obviously it needs more work.

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 6th Apr 2010
ive been watching his vid over and over!
hahah
he really does have a good breakdown but id love to see a new vid from him about this trick because i think hes probably progressed with it and theres a few new ideas goin around that could be added into the breakdown.. many of them have been mentioned in the comments on the video.
thanks for the info though!
:b

Chyeah I'm high, How you think a brothah mane's supposed to survive.

Posted: 6th Apr 2010

Drex talks about them in his video blog:

Posted: 7th Apr 2010
He talked about them for ages. At least, it seemed like it.

'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland

Posted: 7th Apr 2010
Still though.... is there some sort of conspiracy where everyone who tries to learn it automatically goes for rerverse?

Posted: 7th Apr 2010
i almost learned it forwards and cant even attemp it reverse *shrugs*

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able, and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" - Epicurus

Posted: 9th Apr 2010
was playing around with unbending the figure eight the other day and isolated weaves felt easier with that then they do with the more parallel, bent planes.

Posted: 11th Apr 2010
Some things to consider:

A "3-beat weave" is like a compressed 2-petal inspin flower: your hands and arms can never occupy exactly the same space at the same time, and need to move over and under each other, creating incredibly slight petals. If you do it small and clean it isn't too noticeable.
Same is true for cleanly isolated weave. It is never truly conformed to one unit circle, because the arms need to move over and under each other... but you can get it close enough that it is hard to tell it's not perfect.

Dito on Ronan and Cyrille. On a good day I can get it too, forwards and reverse. Been working on behind the head isos for iso fountains >_<.

Next important point:
When isolating, your hand and the poi head are in a split-time-same-direction relationship.
This means that your hand and poi move through your cross-point in an offset time.
This also means that either the hand can lead and poi can follow, OR the poi can lead and hand can follow (via a subtle plan-bend and immediate correction on the other side as your hand catches up). Andy House posted about this back in 2004 I think.

This means that there are actually a few flavors of isolated 3-beat weaves that can be done. The conical Arasi version has the hands always leading and dragging the poi behind them... I find this one hard to keep clean.

The version where the poi head always leads involved a lot of flicking and plane-bend corrections, and I just stopped bothering.

I find a combination of hand leading and head leading to be the cleanest. I'll have to revisit it later to verbosely define the sequence of hands and poi heads.

Last important point:
Your hands are mostly leading the poi heads around the unit circle, by half a turn (1pi aka 180deg). This means that in order to take your poi heads through 3 rotations your hands need to get more twisted up by half a turn.
In other words you need to get your hands right on the edge of going into a 5-beat position, but with at least 1 poi length of separation between them. This is where LTC's great suggestion of keeping a poi tether held taught between the hands helps.

To do a 3-beat iso weave, your hands approach a 5-beat, but don't flip plane-facings in the same sequence as a 5-beat. To isolate a 5-beat you need to approach a 7beat.

+Alien Jon

Posted: 15th Apr 2010
*laughs* Wow...take a break from the forums for a few weeks and something comes up I can actually help with

So yeah...AJ's really got all the theory you need right up there. I don't know if you've gotten that far in the blogs yet, but the key really wound up being practicing doing isos with arms crossed. Once I got this down, the rest just slid into place.

It's a key point AJ makes about hand leading vs. poi head leading with this move...I'd LOVE to see a demo of the latter if anyone's seen a video of it. As for a good demo of the isolated weave done clean, Zan does it at 4:14 in the Arizona Transmission vid:



My iso weave still isn't terribly clean and I'm still having a bitch of a time getting in and out of it, so it might not pop up in a flow vid for a while...even I was sick of doing vids on it by the end

Peace,
Drex

Posted: 16th Apr 2010
I thought it interesting watching how you broke stuff down to learn.

Must catch up with your blog again. Sporadic high bandwidth is annoying.

'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland