Forums > Social Discussion > zimbabwe.....can we make a difference?
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Posted:
To my soul family...Im so driven to write this....I am generally caught up in an amazing and exciting world, filled with fire, music, dance, passion and exceptional friendships. Generally my soul burns a bright flame...fueled by the freedom and inspiration of the world around me.
Today I stopped.....caught in a moment of conscience. The disaster in Zimbabwe, and the blatant abuse of human rights has me struggling to breathe.
How is it that, such a monster, like Mugabe can continue to persecute and snuff the very essence of people like you and me?
Drummers.... dancers..... dreamers.....
And that we know what happens.....each day of our lives, people just like us, are getting up, saying what they think, fighting for freedom, knowing it could be the end of their lives.....but doing it anyway, because what is a life without freedom.
While I am only 1 person.....I choose to do something. I choose to march......to march and play drums and dance and sing for the freedom of people who have no voice living in fear of violence or death.
I am in New Zealand, and I just wanted to know......how do you feel? Would you dance for freedom? For choice? For Life?
To my soul family...Im so driven to write this....I am generally caught up in an amazing and exciting world, filled with fire, music, dance, passion and exceptional friendships. Generally my soul burns a bright flame...fueled by the freedom and inspiration of the world around me.
Today I stopped.....caught in a moment of conscience. The disaster in Zimbabwe, and the blatant abuse of human rights has me struggling to breathe.
How is it that, such a monster, like Mugabe can continue to persecute and snuff the very essence of people like you and me?
Drummers.... dancers..... dreamers.....
And that we know what happens.....each day of our lives, people just like us, are getting up, saying what they think, fighting for freedom, knowing it could be the end of their lives.....but doing it anyway, because what is a life without freedom.
While I am only 1 person.....I choose to do something. I choose to march......to march and play drums and dance and sing for the freedom of people who have no voice living in fear of violence or death.
I am in New Zealand, and I just wanted to know......how do you feel? Would you dance for freedom? For choice? For Life?
GOLD Member
Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
8,428 posts
Location: Wales
Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
8,428 posts
Location: Wales
Posted:
I commend you for your spirit, your wanting to change things and for standing up for what you believe in. I personally feel that Robert Mugabe will never listen to anyone. He has consistently shown this. It makes no odds to him what anyone says or thinks of what he is doing, otherwise he would have stopped long since.
If you feel by marching you are offering the people of Zimbabwe your support and feel you are demonstrating that you have the liberty and freedom of expression to do it, then I say do it, but in all honesty I really don't think it will make a noticeable difference for the average person in Zimbabwe. They probably won't even find out about it going on let alone feel the effects of it.
Having said all that, the more visually we all protest about the situation the more pressure it puts on the countries around Zimbabwe to condemn what Mugabe is doing and the more useful support the local Zimbabweans may feel and maybe that will cause them to up rise en mass. In doing that, I fear there will be a bloodbath, but Mugabe seams to be intent on having that anyway.
I don't know what the answer is. Zimbabwe is a country in crisis and there is one hell of a mess to be sorted out whatever the resolution is. Don't think that just by removing Mugabe the problem is over. Many African countries have huge economical and social problems to over come. Sadly for Zimbabwe they have all those same problems and a power crazy leader that has a taste for blood.
Take heart in the fact he can't live for ever and is already a very old man.
I commend you for your spirit, your wanting to change things and for standing up for what you believe in. I personally feel that Robert Mugabe will never listen to anyone. He has consistently shown this. It makes no odds to him what anyone says or thinks of what he is doing, otherwise he would have stopped long since.
If you feel by marching you are offering the people of Zimbabwe your support and feel you are demonstrating that you have the liberty and freedom of expression to do it, then I say do it, but in all honesty I really don't think it will make a noticeable difference for the average person in Zimbabwe. They probably won't even find out about it going on let alone feel the effects of it.
Having said all that, the more visually we all protest about the situation the more pressure it puts on the countries around Zimbabwe to condemn what Mugabe is doing and the more useful support the local Zimbabweans may feel and maybe that will cause them to up rise en mass. In doing that, I fear there will be a bloodbath, but Mugabe seams to be intent on having that anyway.
I don't know what the answer is. Zimbabwe is a country in crisis and there is one hell of a mess to be sorted out whatever the resolution is. Don't think that just by removing Mugabe the problem is over. Many African countries have huge economical and social problems to over come. Sadly for Zimbabwe they have all those same problems and a power crazy leader that has a taste for blood.
Take heart in the fact he can't live for ever and is already a very old man.
Feed me Chocolate!!! Feed me NOW!
SILVER Member
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Posted:
Sadly, not much you can do. This one is a little above individuals really.
The most you can do is get your government involved. Gods only know that mine has been.... less than helpful to the people suffering.
And re: the bloodbath.
I do not really see a way around it. Not to mention that Zim is going to need a good decade or so to *start* turning around from where it is now.
And I do know a bit of what I am talking about, I have a fair amount of friends and acquaintances from Zim. None of them have too much optimism either.
I have marched and would again. So far, no difference. Keep trying I guess.
Sadly, not much you can do. This one is a little above individuals really.
The most you can do is get your government involved. Gods only know that mine has been.... less than helpful to the people suffering.
And re: the bloodbath.
I do not really see a way around it. Not to mention that Zim is going to need a good decade or so to *start* turning around from where it is now.
And I do know a bit of what I am talking about, I have a fair amount of friends and acquaintances from Zim. None of them have too much optimism either.
I have marched and would again. So far, no difference. Keep trying I guess.
'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
So Mugabe has been sworn to be the next President of Zimbabwe as of today...
There is a lot to learn in this.
One thing to learn (for me) is that the colour of skin does not make any difference. Also the history of a country or continent does not mean that it cannot be repeated by other means...
What Zimbabwe (for me) clearly shows, is the problem which Africa is truly suffering from: within. After all we are all humans, regardless of skin or cultural background and the "black=good, white=bad" attitude is simply erroneous.
Don't get me wrong, please - I believe that western governments need to step up actions, N.O.W... and they do start. Mrs. Merkel and Mr. Brown are pushing for sanctions against the regime and I feel that it will have some effect to freeze foreign (private and gov't) funds, just to name a a start.
IMO violent force can only be used as a last resort, all democratic and political opportunities need to be exhausted first.
I understand the call for armed resistance, but that will result in civil war - there are other examples (in Africa) that clearly show: this is not the right way (and might last a long time).
Side that...
So Mugabe has been sworn to be the next President of Zimbabwe as of today...
There is a lot to learn in this.
One thing to learn (for me) is that the colour of skin does not make any difference. Also the history of a country or continent does not mean that it cannot be repeated by other means...
What Zimbabwe (for me) clearly shows, is the problem which Africa is truly suffering from: within. After all we are all humans, regardless of skin or cultural background and the "black=good, white=bad" attitude is simply erroneous.
Don't get me wrong, please - I believe that western governments need to step up actions, N.O.W... and they do start. Mrs. Merkel and Mr. Brown are pushing for sanctions against the regime and I feel that it will have some effect to freeze foreign (private and gov't) funds, just to name a a start.
IMO violent force can only be used as a last resort, all democratic and political opportunities need to be exhausted first.
I understand the call for armed resistance, but that will result in civil war - there are other examples (in Africa) that clearly show: this is not the right way (and might last a long time).
Written by : aston
Keep trying
Side that...
the best smiles are the ones you lead to 
BRONZE Member
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Insert Champagne Here
13,215 posts
Location: without class distinction, Australia
Posted:
Something that concerns me in regards to this is the damage that other countries can accidentally do.
Placing trade restrictions on Zimbabwe isn't going to hurt the regime, only the people. Evil despots will get their luxuries on the black market regardless of legal trade, so it's the general population who will suffer.
I know that wasn't a constructive post, I just wanted to voice a concern I have.
Something that concerns me in regards to this is the damage that other countries can accidentally do.
Placing trade restrictions on Zimbabwe isn't going to hurt the regime, only the people. Evil despots will get their luxuries on the black market regardless of legal trade, so it's the general population who will suffer.
I know that wasn't a constructive post, I just wanted to voice a concern I have.
i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey
Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
No - very valid aspect, Rouge. No question that sanctions hurt the general public too and might even harden the political support for despots (just like in Iraq and for Saddam Hussein).
However they will show that Mugabe has crossed a line - just as he did in the past - that the international community is not supporting such abuses. It's unlikely to show much effect, but I feel the need to emphasize that - prior to any violent intervention - all diplomatic and peaceful means should be utilized...
This is what I would call: "making a difference". Instead of either: just stand aside and look, or jumping in without thinking...
EDITED_BY: FireTom (1214816432)
No - very valid aspect, Rouge. No question that sanctions hurt the general public too and might even harden the political support for despots (just like in Iraq and for Saddam Hussein).
However they will show that Mugabe has crossed a line - just as he did in the past - that the international community is not supporting such abuses. It's unlikely to show much effect, but I feel the need to emphasize that - prior to any violent intervention - all diplomatic and peaceful means should be utilized...
This is what I would call: "making a difference". Instead of either: just stand aside and look, or jumping in without thinking...
EDITED_BY: FireTom (1214816432)
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
SILVER Member
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Posted:
Thought that there were actually sanctions in place already?
Just not from SADC, where they might have an effect. Sadly, only on the people that we want to help.
Thought that there were actually sanctions in place already?
Just not from SADC, where they might have an effect. Sadly, only on the people that we want to help.
'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
Next thing is that the African Congress would have to show Mugabe that his support is running out. There is a conference in Egypt shortly and observers expect nothing to happen as Mugabe has been an icon for the struggle for freedom.
He might not be more than a sad old man who got way over the top... He needs to get shown limits by the presidents of the AU...
The entire thing displays the true dilemma in which Africa is caught up for ages...
Next thing is that the African Congress would have to show Mugabe that his support is running out. There is a conference in Egypt shortly and observers expect nothing to happen as Mugabe has been an icon for the struggle for freedom.
He might not be more than a sad old man who got way over the top... He needs to get shown limits by the presidents of the AU...
The entire thing displays the true dilemma in which Africa is caught up for ages...
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
SILVER Member
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
4,061 posts
Location: South Africa
Posted:
Well, the thing is that he was just that: he was an icon in the early days of (and the struggle for) independence from the UK in Zimbabwe.
Unfortunately he has gone the wrong way since then. I know that a few of my lecturers admired him about 20 years ago or so and have since turned that around entirely.
Well, the thing is that he was just that: he was an icon in the early days of (and the struggle for) independence from the UK in Zimbabwe.
Unfortunately he has gone the wrong way since then. I know that a few of my lecturers admired him about 20 years ago or so and have since turned that around entirely.
'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland
Stargazer
6,650 posts
6,650 posts
Posted:
That's exactly the point, Aston - some ppl think just because they have dun something great in their lives once, it will give them a free pass for the rest of it. People change, political climate changes. One moment they have the power - the next moment they loose it.
The international community needs to show these people that political power can only be obtained in harmony with the general population - through democratic vote and on a four year term.
As it's in the news right now, the Munich based printing company Giesecke now complies to political pressure and stops supplies of banknotes. This is important to note, as they would have liked to continue business as usual - Zimbabwe is the country with the highest inflation rate on the planet: officially 100.000% in-officially they surpassed the one million % already.
It's a critical moment for the Mugabe-regime - they either need to get resupplies fast, or the inflationary economy could collapse.
Whilst it might be true that sanctions hit the general population (first) they also hurt the people in power and their supporters.
It's just not all that polished imagery as before.
If Hitler would not have had the Olympics in Berlin 1936, more people would have started thinking. It might not have stopped WWII or the Holocaust, but it might have encouraged more ppl to stand up against the regime or to help those who needed protection from the regime.
That's exactly the point, Aston - some ppl think just because they have dun something great in their lives once, it will give them a free pass for the rest of it. People change, political climate changes. One moment they have the power - the next moment they loose it.
The international community needs to show these people that political power can only be obtained in harmony with the general population - through democratic vote and on a four year term.
As it's in the news right now, the Munich based printing company Giesecke now complies to political pressure and stops supplies of banknotes. This is important to note, as they would have liked to continue business as usual - Zimbabwe is the country with the highest inflation rate on the planet: officially 100.000% in-officially they surpassed the one million % already.
It's a critical moment for the Mugabe-regime - they either need to get resupplies fast, or the inflationary economy could collapse.
Whilst it might be true that sanctions hit the general population (first) they also hurt the people in power and their supporters.
It's just not all that polished imagery as before.
If Hitler would not have had the Olympics in Berlin 1936, more people would have started thinking. It might not have stopped WWII or the Holocaust, but it might have encouraged more ppl to stand up against the regime or to help those who needed protection from the regime.
the best smiles are the ones you lead to
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