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Forums > Other Toys > Dai's Buugeng (S-Staffs) Impressions

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akgraphics
akgraphics

member
Location: Churchill College, Cambridge
Member Since: 25th Jun 2006
Total posts: 133
Posted:I'm the happy owner of one of Dai's amazing Buugeng:

Where to buy them:
http://www.zaobab.com/buugeng_about.html

Home of Poi lessons:
http://www.homeofpoi.com/lessons_all/teach/Library-Staff-S-Staff-Buugeng-4_48_0

I received the smaller version, which, with shipping to UK, came to about 60. A fantastic birthday present smile And you get two of them with a really nice bag, so 30 each with bag isn't *so* bad. (I will note here that before buying them with my birthday money I tried to make my own out of plywood ... it was a disaster redface)

Some people have been asking me about the quality of them, whether it's worth buying them all the way from South Africa. I'll try and give my opinion of them here. I'm not gonna say anything about spinning the damn things, as the technique thread is here:

http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubbthreads/show...5/o/all/fpart/1

First of all, the wood-working quality is excellent, they have an excellent 'heft' to them. The colour is nice and shiny too. I can't describe just how good it feels to spin something that truly feels "crafted" rather than mass-produced, injection moulded, etc. I feel like I'm spinning something with value, rather something that could just be replaced with a quick click on a fire toys website.

A note about the mechanism. From Dai's tutorial videos you can see that they unfold out from a banana-shape. In the folded position, the curves are held in place by strong magnets - they require a strong flick of the wrist to unfold, and the motion is very smooth - the pivot works great, without any creaking. The only trouble I'll mention here is that if you keep 'unfolding' the buugeng in the same direction, you'll gradually unwind the pivot (which is a thread screw with a washer that bores itself into the wood). I guess just a little care will prevent this from becoming a major concern. Even if this pivot does work itself loose, once the buugeng 'snap' into position, the magnets make sure the prop stays steady. When I drop the staff in the 'unfolded' position, the buugeng does not fold up, it stays in its proper shape. These magnets are great - but they're not so strong such that it's difficult to close.

The weighting is a lot lighter than I imagined it would be - there is not any extra weight towards the tips of the S-curves, making keeping in plane extremely difficult (or more fun to learn, depending on how you look at it!).

I hope this has been clear, if you guys want any more info I'll try my best to answer. Though do give Dai a call through his website, that would be a better way of going about it. I even got a beautiful hand-written note with my buugeng. The attention to detail he's put into this props is stunning, and they were well worth the money. I wish everyone here would go out and get some, so we can all start thinking of new tricks to do with them!

Thanks Dai hug !


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FireTom
Stargazer

Member Since: 20th Sep 2003
Total posts: 6650
Posted:Yeah, somehow a pity that there are not too many online tut's about this... Will mention it to him.

the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8737
Posted:I did get out my card today but when I got to Dai's site it said "SOLD OUT" eek I waas gonna squeeze the money and survive how I could I worried now the money will be gone because stuff will come up when i move in 2 weeks that I need to spend out for frown

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.

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FireTom
Stargazer

Member Since: 20th Sep 2003
Total posts: 6650
Posted:??? Little bit of a cryptic post (to me), Mynci.

You bought the Buugeng? (despite it said "sold out"?) You're moving international?

Sorry, can't make too much sense of your post, but I would say that you can contact Dai (or his representative) and change the shipping address...


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:I believe Mynci means that he got as far as getting access to pay for a set of buugengs just as they were sold out again, and then explained how tough it was gunna be to miss the money.

Unfortunately, Dai may not be able to do P.R. on HoP because as i understand it he's one of the twirling equipment vendors attending EJC.

There certainly is a healthy interest in buugengs! I feel for u Mynci, and will trust that you will do what is best for ya mate!
b


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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:I was just about to buy some, also! Folding up to be transportable is what sells me 1000 times over. my staff doesnt get much of a workout as I'm too limited in where I can take it and the amount of effort I need to get it there. It can't just be something part of my usual kit.

I'm in the same position as Mynci... just got the money together, but as I'm a student it'll probably disappear by the time they're back on sale again... Well... Dai's site is my homepage now so I'll be able to leap on his site when they're back in stock...

Potentially the EJC is the reason he's sold out? Taken the remainder of his stock TO the EJC? Could he potentially come back from the EJC with stock left?? *Crosses fingers for Mynci*


hug

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FireTom
Stargazer

Member Since: 20th Sep 2003
Total posts: 6650
Posted:Hmm, so I briefly talked to Dai and he promised to check his eMails - there are some tutorials available here on HoP - you should be busy enough to learn these lessons before screaming for more.

Also I doubt that Dai will come back from the EJC with too much stock... btw I have seen his new design, that is even more intriguing than the present one (if you like tribal designs that is).

So there is something more to hold your breath for...

And if you can't keep your money together, why not handing it to mom and asking her to do it for you? wink


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:I've got ideas pumping through my mind already, I need those buugeng! Doing the same kinds of play with the space in the S in waistwrap positions, i just can't wait to get my hands on a pair!!!

Once I get mine they'll be wood polish rather than coloured, so what comes back from EJC won't fuss me too much since it'll all be coloured anyway...

But still fingers crossed for Mynci, whats left in the world if not hope, FireTom?

I'm just hoping I can lay my hands on a pair before Common Ground...

Money isn't the issue anymore, delicious tax check.


hug

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:hmm buugeng need to be held in a specific manner, with an open fingered grip rotated ~45 in the direction of movement. A lot of my twirling happens at waistwrap and I'm experiencing difficulty doing the more advanced double figure-of-8 moves with the added demand on agility the new grip involves.
backwards figure-of-8 has almost taken my eyes out, especially with backwards rotating throws.
Toy looks great though, it is a worthwhile challenge - though much of my twirling with it is based on doubles, it's wonderful to feel like i'm playing with something new that manages to open up so many options.

There are 9 buugeng lessons on Dai's youtube channel:
www.youtube.com/user/buugeng
what a charismatic dude! smile

FireTom, does the new tribal design mean a new shape to the buugeng or a new pattern on the wood? sounds interesting.


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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:Yeah, I understood it was incredibly different, but thats why I'm so eager to get my hands on them! I need to learn how to use them and I daresay it'll take a while having had no experience with doubles... but I've been pretending my single staff is one buugeng lately, holding it differently... though I didnt know the 45 degree angle thing... I guess thats only something I'll understand once laying my hands on a pair.



I know what you mean about him being charismatic, I smile every time I watch his videos.



I think after I buy my buugeng I'll hack off my left arm in frustration... it never does do what its told!



Also, bender, what're your thoughts on length? I'm a rather tall guy so I thought I'd just opt for the large ones for that reason, do you think there'd be much difference? Any benefit in going for the smaller ones at all or benefits for the larger ones? Sorry... I'm just getting excited thinking about them! I always got close to buying doubles but transportation always stopped me, folding these babies up has sealed the deal!!

EDITED_BY: Mother_Natures_Son (1218417312)


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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:re: angle of finger-grip that was only my personal take on it, coming from the perspective of a 1m straight doubles twirler adapting to curved 96cm buugeng.
I throw low/technical alot, so the angle of release is so important to me - since adjusting to curved staves my noggin has taken abuse!

everyone's gunna have different experience on equipment with so few established practices involving it. What you will have to do is take from others what makes sense to you and form your own technique to practice practice practice. Josh has tried out a set of buugeng in SA, so maybe u can ask SA people nicely for a practice - if you're in melbs, mebbe we can organise a practice sesh at a sunday meet.

We will have alot to talk about at CG smile I have been considering adapting a set for fire, however the curved points have been just coming short of poking me in the eyes with backwards spinning turning throws and 96cm buugeng are too small if wick up even half length of the curved edges with kevlar.
I would prefer a less curved, longer s-shaped-staff for fire - and playing with a new toy without setting it on fire (the buugeng instructions are signed off with a 'more fire!' exclaimation) would for me be like climbing a mountain without reaching the summit.


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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:I'm in Geelong so once I've got my hands on a pair I'll come up and I'll see what you've been doing with them... I'll probably wander over to a sunday meet sometime soon, perhaps this week with my poi clutched in my hand and say hello, finally to someone, anyone who can spin poi better than I can. (It hasn't happened yet! This is why I'm so excited for CG, its gonna be an overload!)

Buugeng!!!

My real hope is that I can latch onto it reasonably easily having had enough experience with staff to understand the basics of how it turns, but not having used it enough to embed into myself habits that will give me a hurdle when using buugeng.

On the topic of fire buugeng... You could always get an LED strip of some kind to attach to your current buugeng until fire buugeng could become a reality.


hug

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keyarghah
keyarghah

Woodford is Goodford..!
Location: Sydney at heart.
Member Since: 6th Jun 2007
Total posts: 241
Posted:hey bender.. just spying on this thread.. i know dave from circus mystique uses something similar - before i ever knew that the buugeng existed. it was handmade, and like a curved fully wicked staff with small grip in the middle, very restrictive.. but looked awesome, similar to a double ended but bendy fire sword in a way?

'FREE HUGGIES!!'

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:I am putting together a review at the moment and a comprehensive answer will only come after i spend a substantial amount of time with it. Suffice to say that for my experience at least that the shape will need alot of adaptation if you are a doubles twirler. Correct grip is imperative.

As for S-Staves, I believe a few HoPpers were inspired by Moschen's s-staves. For myself at least I'd not have thought of such an shape before that video and before dai I'd not have thought of a folding mechanism.

Please come to common ground, there are so many new movements that open up with a folding, s-shaped staves.

Buugengs make breaking planes look graceful, all my other toys are straight, curved toys can spiral fluidly - particularly if you turn or pirouette alot.


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Brenn
Brenn

Will carpal your tunnel in a minute.
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 28th Jun 2004
Total posts: 3286
Posted:*joins the queue of avid buugeng staff buyers* grin

ॐ

Owner of burningoftheclavey smile
Owned by Lost83spy

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:*Jostles Brenn in the line*

Have you got the staves Brenn or looking to?

And CG is sold out! shocked! 28 days off!


hug

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Brenn
Brenn

Will carpal your tunnel in a minute.
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 28th Jun 2004
Total posts: 3286
Posted:I'm looking to smile I got to play with some at uber and would love to have them in time for CG, but given the sold outness that doesn't seem likely. In time, though. In time smile

You coming to CG MNS? grin


ॐ

Owner of burningoftheclavey smile
Owned by Lost83spy

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:Yeah, I am... and I too wanted a pair of buugeng in time for CG... I only JUST missed out on the last allotment. I think in order to be sure that we'd get the buugeng in time for CG they'd have to go on sale within the next few days... and even then its iffy.

I guess I'll run into you at CG, Brenn, since we'll both be hovering around other peoples buugeng!!! We'll have to flood the sunday night meets with buugeng when summer rolls around!!

Edit : Hahaha, I'm surprised you didn't notice I'm going to CG, its CG CG CG everywhere posted on the boards! ! ! Excited excited excited!!!!

EDITED_BY: Mother_Natures_Son (1220578426)


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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:I think it was pretty cool that a COL winner would put the equipment in his unique entry into production - big kudos there.

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:Indeed a large kudos... I hadn't been aware he was the COL winner, I haven't looked at the COL videos just yet... but I really should! shocked!

I've speculated on the motivation behind him producing the buugeng... Obviously there is monetary gain, but I'd like to think that he would like to share it with the community... he's clearly put a lot of effort into the design of it and I'm thinking he would want to see what everyone else can come up with... but thats just my inferences there...

Also... how are all the other buugeng owners out there faring? Has anyone altered their opinion after having spent some more time with them??

EDITED_BY: Mother_Natures_Son (1220579979)


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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:The paint seems to stay nice after about 3 drops on solid ground like concrete. still looks nice, however makes behind-the-leg moves scrape if your wrist is not high enough transitioning into the move.

make sure your hands are clean when you play cus the paint gets a little sticky after a while. An open grip helps greatly with the stickiness issue.


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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:Wouldn't it be the gloss that makes it sticky??? I only ask because if its possible I'm going to annoy dai for a woodgrain finish (Just no paint, with the gloss only)

hug

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:There's possibly a tribal design coming out - i thinkin light of that the potential users will be wanting more glam if anything.

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Basstones
Basstones

Do you do the poiz?
Location: Brisbane
Member Since: 24th Mar 2006
Total posts: 530
Posted:Had the opportunity to have a play with these at uber, very cool prop! (kudos to the owner who let me have a play on friday!sorry have forgotten got your name redface)

Definitely on my wish list...


EDITED_BY: Basstones (1220592865)


"In the end there is only fire and a waterfall"

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georgemc
georgemc

Sitting down facing forward . . .
Location: Christchurch
Member Since: 16th Oct 2006
Total posts: 2387
Posted:Originally Posted By: Mother_Natures_Son
I've speculated on the motivation behind him producing the buugeng... Obviously there is monetary gain, but I'd like to think that he would like to share it with the community... he's clearly put a lot of effort into the design of it and I'm thinking he would want to see what everyone else can come up with... but thats just my inferences there...
Having spoken to Dai about his design and trying to get them available in the HoP shop, I can tell you that he made them available primarily because he believes in the prop and wants to see it advance. Hence also the lessons he did for the HoP Library. And also why they're not available in HoP as Dai wants to be able to have the direct contact with each customer.


Written by: Doc Lightning talking about Marmite in Kichi's Intro thread

I have several large jars of the stuff. I actually like it... a little. And don't tell anyone I admitted to it.
grin

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marianikolaeva
stranger

Member Since: 19th Sep 2008
Total posts: 1
Posted:Please help! I'd like to buy a pair of buugeng but it sold out frown on Dai's site...
Do you know where to bue some? I'll be realy happy if you shere info with me


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aston
aston

Unofficial Chairperson of Squirrel Defense League
Location: South Africa
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2007
Total posts: 4061
Posted:As far as I know, you will need to wait until they are back in stock. Sorry.

'We're all mad here. I'm mad, you're mad." [said the Cat.]
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "Or you wouldn't have come here."
- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:i wonder if michael moschen is watching all this demand for curved staves...

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:marianikolaeva tell me if you find out and I will slaughter everyone before me in the line for this alternate buugeng source and then I will have bloodstained buugeng.

hug

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Mother_Natures_Son
Mother_Natures_Son

Rampant whirler.
Location: Geelong, Victoria, Australia!
Member Since: 1st Aug 2007
Total posts: 2418
Posted:I've heard a whispering that buugeng MIGHT be going back on sale soon. Keep watch on his site. smile

hug

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bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:3 months and alot of play later...
Cons
my buugeng are wearing on a little. i compared mine to other people's buugeng and there is a substatial difference in handling. I practice only over soft surfaces and throw low and still there are dents in the plywood and the paint is cracked in several places. There is slight strucutural cracks appearing near one of the hinges, however the main issue is that the sticky paint attracts dirt to the point where my hold on the buugeng is noticeably more cumbersome than with a set in better condition. Pros
I love playing with it. people love seeing it. I'm doing so many new moves that I couldn't do with straight staff! mega!


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