• All Purchases made this month instantly go into the draw to win a USD $ 200.00 credit to your HoP account.
 

Forums > Social Discussion > HoP moderation - opinions please

Login/Join to Participate
Page: 123
georgemc
georgemc

Sitting down facing forward . . .
Location: Christchurch
Member Since: 16th Oct 2006
Total posts: 2387
Posted:This is not a place to bitch about or praise the current moderators! What we would like to know is your thoughts on the amount of moderation and how visible you prefer your mods to be.

Currently, we think the Community forum is ticking along fairly nicely with no great visible presence (i.e. posting) by the majority of us Mods and Admin types. However, when something happens that requires Mod/Admin presence we get alerted and it gets actioned as we are all 'lurking' in the background. But some recent comments suggest perhaps that this style doesn't suit everyone. Some people would prefer to see the Mods/Admins visibly present by posting more frequently. And then others perhaps feel that they don't want to see this as it looks like 'Big Brother is Watching' perhaps.

It's a little like the police - do you prefer to see the cops out pounding the beat being seen on the street to give you a sense of security, or do you prefer not to see them at all until you need them so you have a greater feeling of freedom?

Now's you chance to have a say on this important subject. Feel free to vote and add any comments you feel are relevant beyond the vote but please DO NOT use this thread to single out any particular Mods/Admins for specific comment. If you do wish to comment about an individual Mod/Admin, as with any complaints or praise about/for individuals they should be directed to the management in private - so e-mail or PM Malcolm in this case.

Thanks
George


Written by: Doc Lightning talking about Marmite in Kichi's Intro thread

I have several large jars of the stuff. I actually like it... a little. And don't tell anyone I admitted to it.
grin


Charles
Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland
Member Since: 27th Jun 2001
Total posts: 3989
Posted:Boo!

HoP Posting Guidelines
* Is it the Truth?
* Is it Fair to all concerned?
* Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
* Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?


Brenn
Brenn

Will carpal your tunnel in a minute.
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 28th Jun 2004
Total posts: 3286
Posted:Mods shouldn't be scary Charles wink

hug


ॐ

Owner of burningoftheclavey smile
Owned by Lost83spy


Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted: Written by :onewheeldave


As I've mentioned elsewhere, my POV is that whether or not For me, good moderation is about being objective, impartial, diplomatic and knowing when to take strong action- also about liasing with other mods if there's any doubts about objectivity.



That is, I believe, how all the mods are.
Impartial and objective means to make difficult choices regarding those we like as well as those we don't. And we have, all of us, set aside personal feelings for people to act in what we see as the best interest of HoP, including recently.

I know I have even stepped away from situations and asked another mod to handle it because I wanted to make sure my personal feelings did not get involved.

As much as people want to believe I have a vendetta for them, I don't. None of us do. I have locked threads of people I adore as much as those I am impartial to. Hell, I have even moderated my family on here. I can seperate business from personal in that scope, and I *know* the other mods are the same.

Diplomatic means not just representing the majority but also protecting those in the minority. Taking strong action also means standing by those actions, even when being doubted and criticized.

We do that too.

There are also 7 of us all together, so that when a vote is needed, we are also not in worries of a tie...just so you know.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


faith enfire
faith enfire

wandering thru the woods of WI
Location: Wisconsin
Member Since: 27th Jan 2006
Total posts: 3556
Posted:I don't know if a dual key is a good idea, just from experience. I'm sure you guys talk about it. But if there is a thread that could get out of hand or is really really bad, what if there is only one mod around?

Can you unlock a thread? That way if after discussion, you can unlock if it was determined that it did not need to be locked after all. And on the rare occassion there is an emergency need for a lock, a mod doesn't have to worry about tracking down another one.

My 2 cents


Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


FireTom
Stargazer

Member Since: 20th Sep 2003
Total posts: 6650
Posted: Written by : Pele

As much as people want to believe I have a vendetta for them, I don't. None of us do. I have locked threads of people I adore as much as those I am impartial to. Hell, I have even moderated my family on here. I can seperate business from personal in that scope, and I *know* the other mods are the same.



This is exactly how I felt so far and which is why I never felt I had to question your integrity.

A dual key could calm those who don't have a similar level of trust.

However - I reckon this thread made clear that all mods are still around...


the best smiles are the ones you lead to wink


Gayle......!
Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol !!!!!!
Member Since: 9th Jul 2004
Total posts: 2444
Posted:I think Flashfire has got the right idea in the "banned from ukhippy" thread. Just an acknowledgement that she was there and watching. Very good and re-assuring.

Gayle.....!


Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted: Written by :faithinfire


I don't know if a dual key is a good idea, just from experience. I'm sure you guys talk about it. But if there is a thread that could get out of hand or is really really bad, what if there is only one mod around?

Can you unlock a thread? That way if after discussion, you can unlock if it was determined that it did not need to be locked after all. And on the rare occassion there is an emergency need for a lock, a mod doesn't have to worry about tracking down another one.




Yes, threads can be unlocked.
And those moved so that we can discuss them can be moved back if they are deemed appropriate.

My mistake, and I admit it and take responsibility for it, is I should have left a marker when I moved the one thread for review explaining why.
I think this all might have been avoided, but I am not necessarily sorry as some interesting thoughts and points have been made.

Lesson learned. spank


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted: Written by :FireTom


This is exactly how I felt so far and which is why I never felt I had to question your integrity.






Well, that and cause lords know you and I have gone head to head without too much damage to you (I hope) wink


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


faith enfire
faith enfire

wandering thru the woods of WI
Location: Wisconsin
Member Since: 27th Jan 2006
Total posts: 3556
Posted:so then my vote is no dual key

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


pricklyleaf
pricklyleaf

with added berries
Location: Manchester
Member Since: 7th Mar 2005
Total posts: 1365
Posted:I also don't think a duel key is necessary, especially, as its probably only more regular members who would know that such a system existed anyway, and they are likely to know that they can trust the mods anyway!

Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Ralph Waldo Emerson


fanged_angel
fanged_angel

poiromaniac
Location: liverpool, uk
Member Since: 11th Jul 2007
Total posts: 162
Posted:post deleted because it was in the wrong topic...
EDITED_BY: fanged_angel (1209322018)



newgabe
newgabe

what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali
Member Since: 3rd Mar 2005
Total posts: 4030
Posted:Hang on. I just was reading the thread called something like 'response to bluecat's thread that seems unpostable'; cleaned my teeth, thought of something I wanted to say on it cos it was getting pretty flamey in there; with flames coming from an unusual source...came back and now I can't find it.



It's been pulled?!?!??! confused2


.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....


Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:newgabe...it was just moved into the retired members lounge.


newgabe
newgabe

what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali
Member Since: 3rd Mar 2005
Total posts: 4030
Posted:Thanks for letting us know that Stout.

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....


Spanner
Spanner

remembers when it was all fields round here
Location: in the works... somewhere...
Member Since: 27th Feb 2003
Total posts: 2790
Posted:Have asked there why there was no notice or explanation - this kind of thing was why that and bluecat's thread were made in the first place... rolleyes shrug

"I thought you are man, but
you are nice woman.

yay,

:R"


newgabe
newgabe

what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali
Member Since: 3rd Mar 2005
Total posts: 4030
Posted:Visibility of mods.



That is the topic on this thread so I shall make a comment. And, as it seems to be related in previous posts, about flaming of mods. I'm more concerned about flaming BY mods.



I understand the concept and role of mods as being mature members of a community whose job is to ensure fair and clean behaviour between members, maintain general thread appropriateness and set a standard of communication. The qualities I most wish to see, whether they post daily or rarely, is to BE moderate. And to understand the nature of the boundaries that come with the capacity to exercise power, in that they are NOT an ordinary member of the community. For example, a 'moderate' mod would not use PMs to abuse people who disagree with their views on a thread, while claiming to be an 'ordinary member'. Behaving very badly while apparently not even knowing how confused, and confusing, they are.



If a moderator is not in that class; then they lose my respect. I know the PM thing happened to a friend of mine on this site- albeit a few years ago now. I don't know if that particularly unpleasant tactic has happened to anyone else lately, though I did fairly recently advise admin how I felt about some other 'immoderate' things I saw on the public threads.



The flame in the newly pulled (or relocated to private quarters) post was by a mod who I had not seen behave like that before though, and that surprised me. That was what I was going to comment on. To offer some friendly calms to a mod who seemed to have been pushed/pulled over the boundaries. No chance of that now cos I am not able to access the thread anymore.



Now about the 'retired' members lounge. Damned silly name for it if that's where active threads go, presumably to be discussed by active members. Private maybe. But this is getting offtopic so I shall go somewhere else to find out what it takes to be 'senior' nowadays. Though I am not quite yet ready to retire.


.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....


Yakumo
Yakumo

veteran
Location: Oxfordshire
Member Since: 31st May 2006
Total posts: 1237
Posted:I've voted 'other'.



A mods posts should always be considered as being personal opinion and not an exercise of authority in all circumstances, the sole exceptions being when they're explicitly warning someone mod action will have to be taken, or a response after action has been taken.



When it comes to taking such action they should leave their ego at the door. Moderating a attack against them specifically, as an extreme example, should be assessed as and dealt with exactly as an attack against any 'normal' user.



 Written by =onewheeldave

There are many aspects of moderation that are far more to do with being objective, impartial and able to recognise breaches of board rules.





^this, and as an extension, mods should be healthy cross section of people, otherwise it's too easy to end up with a bunch of yes men.



Sorry MCP but I think having a mod account and a non mod account for one user, a suggestion that's come up on many sites before, is a terrible system, and encourages "stealth modding". If the person at the keyboard is a mod, the users have a right to know they're interacting with a mod. It is also healthy for the system to know that they are present. And having to log out and in again to clear spam or worse, an attack, is unnecessary time consuming hassle.



Mods should not be compelled in any way to post any more than any normal user, ie, post only when you feel you have something you actually want to post about.

Them being available on the board to do the job at hand is what matters, if they're not responding to reports, have no entries in the mod logs, or are off-line for weeks/months without a heads up then de-modding them should be considered, if only for security, they can always be re-modded when they return if appropriate.



If it's felt that too much is being missed, or there isn't enough presence, then consider assessing some more users who spend a lot of time online for suitability. They shouldn't have the ability to cause any real damage anyway , this goes again the healthy cross section comment above, and if they turn out to be not suitable for any reason at any time they just go back to being regular user.



A 'who's online' list that only displays mod accounts should perhaps be a consideration. And reduces the 'post lots to show presence' problem.

This may increase PM's to Mods but that's part of what they're there for, many people don't fully realise the use of the report button, or even spot it.


Blinded by Hyperlights, please donate generously grin


Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:In the 4 years I've been on this forum, I've never had any reason to question the integrity of the mods so rather than being a no news is good news kind of guy, I'm going to hand them all gold stars for a job well done.

The NYC issue that sparked all these threads is a unique situation in that those of us who use this forum as a forum and don't really have ( or make ) the opportunity to form personal relationships with other posters and aren't in the "inner circle" read...didn't know anything about NYC's ban until it came up a few weeks ago, don't have any information about what actually led to the ban.

It's been posted here, that NYC's "crimes" happened in PM and there's no way I'm going to fault the mods for not wanting to reveal the content of those PM(s).



Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13919
Posted:I do wonder if behavior in PM's (other than spamming, of course) should be regulated.

After all, you can always just block someone.

Just a thought...


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura


Birgit
Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh
Member Since: 27th Jan 2005
Total posts: 4145
Posted:Yeah you can, but it's a bit like changing your phone if an ex turns stalker. If someone's offensive, threatening, abusive or just likes being mean (not directed at anyone in particular here) it shouldn't be the victim who's got to change their behaviour.

Also as has been said, if such behaviour only occurs once and towards one person, it won't lead to a ban straight away. I've reported one person so far. George asked me to be nice (i.e. non-provocative) and report it again the next time something happened. It did. The person in question got a warning and left me alone (at least on here) after that, so I can attest to it working in that case.


"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half


Rouge Dragon
Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction
Member Since: 21st Jul 2003
Total posts: 13215
Posted:As someone who has been on the receiving end of unwelcome PMs, just blocking someone wouldn't always help as receiving these messages can result in someone feeling like they're no longer a welcome member of the community and may wonder who else feels the same aggression towards them. In my situation, I felt that the mods were able to make me feel like I was still welcome on HoP and had their support, whereas until I discussed the problem with them I stopped posting entirely because I thought I wasn't wanted on the boards.

A lot of damage can be done via PM. It's just like bullying via email (something that's been in the media here lately)


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...


Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:I figure PMs should be "regulated"

I am not a lawyer, but from what I've seen on other forums there's concern over liability issues. Personal insults are one thing, but issuing threats is a whole 'nother ballgame.

Just suppose a member started sending out death threats, or talking about committing some horrific crime. I'm sure the admin team would want to be completely on top of issues like that lest they be held somewhat responsible if "something" did indeed happen.

I'm not expecting the mods to be reading through my PMs but if somebody complained about the content of a Pm I sent them, the last thing I'd be complaining about is my "right to privacy" so i make it a habit of never saying anything in a PM that I wouldn't post openly.



Yakumo
Yakumo

veteran
Location: Oxfordshire
Member Since: 31st May 2006
Total posts: 1237
Posted:Private Messages absolutely should be private. mods should have no power to peruse them whatsoever.



Pasting one received verbatim elsewhere by a user should be prohibited by the rules unless both parties consent to them being published.

Edit:(posting one you sent yourself without the other users post quoted in is up to the original author of course)



The sole exception being that either user can forward them to a mod/admin if there is troubling content, to ask for assistance.



Admins can always root them out if necessary for proof. That should be accepted by all, it's inevitable if they're not encrypted, they can access them via the database directly if there's no forum system for it anyway, and they're the ones at risk legally as they host the server.

You just hope that the admins on any site you use act ethically.

EDITED_BY: Yakumo (1210365718)


Blinded by Hyperlights, please donate generously grin


georgemc
georgemc

Sitting down facing forward . . .
Location: Christchurch
Member Since: 16th Oct 2006
Total posts: 2387
Posted:PM's are not accessible to Mods, but as a site Admin I can log in to someone's account and see whatever they see. This is only ever used to assist that person when they have requested it (e.g. strange things happening preventing login [not just simple password trouble]), or to check out a person's actions in the event of a complaint. Example being a few months ago someone complained they had been written a PM that seemed to be a scam. I logged in as the sender, noted they had only just created the account, received no PM's, made no posts, but sent 40 or 50 something identical dodgy scam-like PM's. I banned the user, and sent them an e-mail advising what had happened and why and invited them to reply if they had a reasonable explanation as to why I had assumed the wrong thing. (A user can always be unbanned and protecting the community comes first). And then I advised the Mods the user had been banned for sending Scam PM's. About the only thing I didn't do was to raise a thread about it to let everyone know (but that happened anyway from the ones who had received the PM).

These are about the only times someone's account is accessed or PM's looked at. But I work on the same principle as Stout said above - if there's a complaint, we have the right to check.

I hope this helps answer the questions/concerns about PM's.


Written by: Doc Lightning talking about Marmite in Kichi's Intro thread

I have several large jars of the stuff. I actually like it... a little. And don't tell anyone I admitted to it.
grin


Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13919
Posted: Written by :Yakumo


Private Messages absolutely should be private. mods should have no power to peruse them whatsoever.



Then how do you catch spammers? As George already pointed out.

Look, the mods have used their power around me for good. A long time ago there was a poster on this site who made a number of very homophobic comments directed at me (believe it or not, I was actually still in the closet when I joined this site. You can find the "Lightning comes out" thread if you search for it). After repeated attacks, he was banned.

You don't get banned unless you repeatedly harass/threaten someone.

Having been protected by a banning (and I got a stern warning of my own in the process, from Malcolm himself), I fully appreciate this power. And I would ask people to remember that there is more to this story than meets the eye.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura


jo_rhymes
jo_rhymes

Momma Bear
Location: Telford, Shrops
Member Since: 10th Apr 2005
Total posts: 4525
Posted:Doc, that's an awful thing to happen, I'm sorry to hear that hug


 Written by :Yakumo



The sole exception being that either user can forward them to a mod/admin if there is troubling content, to ask for assistance.





Yakumo never said that PMs should be totally private full stop.

I agree, I think PMs should be 'PRIVATE messages' unless someone crosses that line and becomes bullying or unkind, in which case the Admins and Mods have got our backs and can help smile


Hoppers are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly.


hamamelis
hamamelis

nut.
Location: Bouncing off the walls.
Member Since: 5th Jan 2006
Total posts: 756
Posted: Written by :Doc Lightning


Look, the mods have used their power around me for good.



I did get an.. interesting mental image of all the mods in superhero outfits from that.. biggrin

I've personally had no issues with any moderation here.. and I don't think anyone should be expecting superhuman mods- just funky lycra costumes- and it really does follow that stuff's going to happen that not everyone agrees with. I don't think you'd get every single person on this board to agree to anything with the possible exception of 'poi can be fun'..

Yeah, you could add extra checks into everything mods do, but that would make everything slower and considerably more annoying for the people who'd have to do it (waiting for second opinions in different timezones etc..) and how many people really do have the time, the dedication, and the right temperament to join the mods and counter the extra work?


THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH!


If that's okay with you?


ThelemicPotter
newbie
Location: Buffalo NY
Member Since: 8th Aug 2007
Total posts: 29
Posted:I have to say, this is one of the most poorly moderated professional forums I've ever seen, especially considering the danger of the topic at hand. The sheer number of useless one liners, off topic posting, "Me too!" posts, posts consisting of nothing but smileys, threads three pages long that do not in fact even have an answer to the original post.

Do the moderators here do anything? I've never seen one redirect a conversation, or remove useless posts. Right now I'm looking for threads on steel wool poi and out of 10 threads discussing them, for a total of over 20 pages, I've found ONE post with a picture of their construction. One thread discusses some fuel for fire breathing that has been off the market for a decade for an entire two pages.

This forum NEEDS to be cleaned up. The shear number of mis-placed posts, in this sub forum alone is utter unmanageable. When people post to the wrong forum, or start a new thread on a topic that has been covered a million times, those threads need to be moved and consolidated. Dangerous advice needs to be removed. Posts like "thanks" or "I like poi" need to be removed. One should be able to use the search engine to find a thread with answers in it, not page after page of idle chatter.

There is good stuff here, but it is impossible to find in any sort of reasonable manner.



Malcolm
Malcolm

HOP admin
Location: HOP
Member Since: 18th Nov 2003
Total posts: 981
Posted:This forum belongs to the community and is quite old compared to many others (12 years). Hence some will become outdated.

Firstly it is up to the community to self-moderate not hope someone will follow up later.

Our Mods volunteer their time and like most people are very busy.
If you see something needing moving/checking etc please use the "Notify" link below each post.
These always get dealt with straight away by the Moderators.

With over 900,000 posts it would take forever to go through each one and check.

We are completing a new site which will I hope have a better search engine and the ability to push better topics to the top of search results. And even show more recent topics first.

HoP is a huge monster, but like you said it has a lot of good in it.


"May your balls always burn"


Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:I'm pretty happy with the mods, It's nice to see them join in once in a while in something but it's not necessary. I know if I see spam or something dodgy I can click the "notify" button and it will be dealt with promptly.

So Malcolm any prizes for the 1,000,000th Post landmark?

Or maybe a little celbratory announcement grin


A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


Page: 123

Similar Topics

Using the keywords [moderation opinion*] we found the following similar topics.
1. Forums > Art discussion (plz giv ur opinion) [43 replies]
2. Forums > HoP moderation - opinions please [62 replies]
3. Forums > Motivations and Opinions [10 replies]
4. Forums > UK- NHS and second opinions [3 replies]
5. Forums > outside opinion [1 reply]

     Show more..