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Forums > Social Discussion > USA Presidential Election Coverage 08!

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KaelGotRice
KaelGotRice

Basu gasu bakuhatsu - because sometimes buses explode
Location: Angel's Landing, USA
Member Since: 21st Jul 2003
Total posts: 1584
Posted:Primaries are on! Winner will be the representative of their party in the national presidential elections this fall.



Obama takes Iowa for the Democrats!

Huckabee takes Iowa for the Republicans!



Good independent site to browse that covers their issues:

http://www.issues2000.org/Barack_Obama.htm

http://www.issues2000.org/Mike_Huckabee.htm





http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/state/#IA



GWARRRRRRRRRRRR!



4 days until New Hampshire vote for democrats! and 3 days for Wyoming's republican vote-



Discuss. biggrin


To do: More Firedrums 08 video?
Wildfire/US East coast fire footage
LA/EDC glow/fire footage
Fresno fire

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ubbrollsmile.gif" alt="" />

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_khan_
_khan_

old hand
Location: San Francisco, California, USA
Member Since: 17th Nov 2004
Total posts: 768
Posted:I held out hope and held out hope and on some level didn't believe it could happen but it did! He won! and by no small margin.

It feels weird for me to say, but I have faith in my country again.


taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:Originally Posted By: _khan_
It feels weird for me to say, but I have faith in my country again.

I am, for the first time in my adult life, proud to be an American.

Except for one thing: the anti-gay ballot measures that snuck through. It's going to have to go to the U.S. Supreme Court. And I hope that gay rights organizations have the sense to wait until President Obama (OMG, it's real, isn't it) appoints some new justices.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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roarfire
roarfire

comfortably numb
Location: The countryside
Member Since: 8th Jul 2004
Total posts: 2676
Posted:I am so happy that he won. I was watching it every chance I could at work today. Good on him!

Let's hope he lasts.


.All things are beautiful if we take the time to look.

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Mr Majestik
Mr Majestik

coming to a country near you
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear
Member Since: 9th Mar 2004
Total posts: 4693
Posted:Epic win.

and what a speech! very nicely spoken, we can only hope he is more than words come january 20.


"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Originally Posted By: Mr MajestikEpic win.

and what a speech! very nicely spoken, we can only hope he is more than words come january 20.

Here's the issue, he's in a catch .22 that he forged himself.

First, the power of his "change and hope" speeches was amazing, obviously. They were powerful enough to inspire alot of people to believe in him and his ability to create change.
Many people believe change will happen immediately.
It won't.
It can't.
Change of the levels he was talking will take alot of time, and people aren't so patient. We're fed up and want it now.
No matter who won, that's a sucky catch.

Obama is a lofty dreamer, and he shared those dreams and got people to believe in them.
Did he get the House and Senate to believe in him? Concidering the Senate is still half Republican, he is going to have to work extra hard to get them to buy into it. He can do little without their approval.
People often forget that too.

Now, I've mentioned his plans for change are lofty, and they come with a MASSIVE price tag.
One that will drive us further into deficit.
I've spoken with many people who didn't know that.
Personally, knowing this, I think it goes along with the "spend money to make money" thing. We have to spend it to make things better.
BUT there are those who won't get that and will have a fit.

Yet, because of the loftiness of his goals, he may have to cut some out of the plans completely because of inability to make it happen or lack of funding.
Then it would make him appear as if he made empty promises, and also piss people off.

There is *no* way he can follow through on every single "promise" he made. No elected official ever has. If he can do a third of it I will be damn impressed and thrilled, truthfully. He's really in a damned if he does, damned if he doesn't position.
A position I would not want and do not envy, to be sure.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:Cheers America...I'm gloating and I don't even live there.

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Originally Posted By: StoutCheers America...I'm gloating and I don't even live there.





Please know I mean no offense at all, but why?

There's nothing to gloat or celebrate yet.
We were going to get a new president either way the vote went. Both had their plusses and their minusses to be sure.
I voted Obama and I'm not celebrating yet.
He only has words and promises thusfar, and won't be taking office until Jan 20th.
We have nothing to go on except words and "hope" with whether he will be better or not.

Roosevelt did so much in his first 100 days that now what a president accomplishes in that time is concidered the standard measurement of success. I will be waiting until the end of April to celebrate.

It is widely and often been said that in this country a black will become president over a woman. That was proven.
And about this whole "civil rights" crap. Blacks have very successfully held positions of power for some time now, in politics and otherwise. Jesse Jackson ran for presidential nomination and lost because he's a twit, not because he's black.

All this means is that we, as a country, unified under the voice of change.
Gloating can only happen when we actually see and feel the change. Until then it's just promises made with baited breath.

Again, don't get me wrong. I am very happy he won, but until he is able to take action, there is no real victory...only a cease fire.


EDITED_BY: Pele (1225920740)


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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BansheeCat
veteran
Location: lost
Member Since: 29th Jul 2005
Total posts: 1247
Posted:I agree with you Pele, for the most part. We dont know if Obama will do better, but I hope so. I do like how he is such an inspirational motivational speaker, hopefully he will be able to help the populace generate and enact a vision of their country.

The reason I am celebrating is not cause Obama "may" do better-- rather, because the ***american people*** collectively, just did. They overcame years of negative stereotyping , racism and white old boy club style indoctrination and fear, and voted in a young hopeful half black man who talks about unity.

I would not underestimate the power of that choice to create change, whether Obama manages to do so in the White house, or not. Lots of youth, right now, all over the USA, are going to be making some different choices in their own lives, inspired by a new sense of possibility being modeled for them .

That is worth celebrating!

But yeah, womens rights are still lagging behind. Sara Palin did not really inspire too many of us, i dont think?

I do hope Obama acts a suitable channel for all those hopes and dreams that were laid into his hands with such idealism. I am so glad someone is even going to try!

One strong point in Obamas favor appears to be his ability to get people motivated and participating, acting together with him. That way he does not personally need to be able to do everything himself, he can draw on the power energy and wisdom of the collective, and simply guide the vision.

Now we have a cease fire, at least peope will be able to hear themselves think without ducking for cover...


"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."

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Pyrolific
Returning to a unique state of Equilibrium
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Member Since: 10th Jan 2001
Total posts: 3288
Posted:yeah I think the Americans (and by that I mean *all you guys*) really need to give yourselves a big pat on the back.

two thumbs up!

Lets hope Obama doesnt get poli-ticked off before he can get the ball rolling back in the right direction.

J


--
Help! My personality got stuck in this signature machine and I cant get it out!

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:Originally Posted By: Pele

Please know I mean no offense at all, but why?



Originally Posted By: Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. We are now, according to virtually every poll, the most hated nation and feared nation on earth.

Mostly because I like Americans as a people and I don't feel they deserve their federal government nor the international reputation that government has brought to them.

Quote:Gloating can only happen when we actually see and feel the change. Until then it's just promises made with baited breath.

Yes, I fully agree but what they hey. Why not indulge in a little premature gloating based strictly on future possibilities ?


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Stone
Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne
Member Since: 13th Jun 2001
Total posts: 2830
Posted:
Congratulations, America. What a momentous and historic day. Well done.

Originally Posted By: Barack Obama. change has come to America.

I think change brings hope and peace to the free world.


Cheers smile


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Originally Posted By: Stout
Yes, I fully agree but what they hey. Why not indulge in a little premature gloating based strictly on future possibilities ?


Gloating is a sign of arrogance.
Americans are called arrogant for doing far less (and more) and historically, it's a correct assesment I think.
Why play into a stereotype?
Acting in such a manner tends to bite people in the arse like a viper bites a mouse, hard, fast and venomously.

I prefer to lean on the side of caution and restraint.
I'll party, if he earns it, in the end of April when his 100 days is up.

Besides I trust politicians only slightly less than I trust agents and producers. wink


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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simta
simta

compfuzzled
Location: hastings
Member Since: 11th Apr 2006
Total posts: 1182
Posted:Originally Posted By: PeleConcidering the Senate is still half Republican, he is going to have to work extra hard to get them to buy into it. He can do little without their approval.
People often forget that too.


people do often forget the power that the senate hold, but as obama managed to get quite a few bills passed whilst he was a senator, it is promising that with a greater democrat majority this would carry on.

this is still more an iconic achievement rather than a measure of actual political change.


"the geeks have got you" - Gayle

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Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:Arrogant ? Yea, sure I'll give you that.

We could try happy that the American public finally saw the light and voted Bush's party with all it's paranoia out of office and decided that a change is needed.

I suppose it's arrogant to be happy about the GOP's loss, but that's all there really is right now. Like you said, Obama's got to prove himself and that still remains to be seen.

Should I be concerned about playing into an American stereotype ? I'm, not, after all American. I'm Canadian and people on other continents sometimes fail to make that distinction preferring instead to think of everyone who lives on this continent as being from "America" and therefore..an "American".

Kind of like how Kiwis don't like being called Australian.


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Mr Majestik
Mr Majestik

coming to a country near you
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear
Member Since: 9th Mar 2004
Total posts: 4693
Posted:and we dont like kiwis reducing our average intellect tongue2

but seriously, completely agree with you pele, which is why i said what i said on the previous page.

he has been SO successful in raising hopes with his, i dare say, idealistic speeches. i find myself feeling a little sheepish in that i 'supported' him (as little as on can in australia...) purely based on his actions and manner in public over those of McCain, but i really know little of his actual plans for office. as you said pele even if he does a third of what he's talked about i'd be impressed, well he has talked so idealistically (as reported in australian media) that i know little about what he is actually going to act on and how he will go about it.

i think congratulating the US now only serves our own egos by saying, 'good, they picked the guy i wanted' and little more. it really will depend on what happens after january 20 that dictates how good a choice he was.

that said i still went to the pub last night to celebrate grin but i also finished exams on tuesday so i would've done it regardless of the US election.


"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley

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Stone
Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne
Member Since: 13th Jun 2001
Total posts: 2830
Posted:Originally Posted By: PeleAgain, don't get me wrong. I am very happy he won, but until he is able to take action, there is no real victory...only a cease fire.

Hi Pele, I understand what you are saying about Obama having to make good on his election promises, and thats ok as long as it doesnt come across as negativity. By that I mean you dont seem happy he won.

As far as Obamas lofty ideals go. Im reminded of an old quote that goes along the lines of "Aim at the stars, and you may hit the top of the gatepost; but aim at the ground and you will hit the ground (Voltairine De Cleyre).

Sure it will be difficult, and as Obama said there is still a long way to go on the road to change. However, change wont happen if the people who voted for him are already starting to judge his performance. Its like people are starting to stand back expecting him to do it all on his own. McCain understood this, and thats why he put his full support behind Obama, in his most excellent concession speech.

Originally Posted By: McCain. A little while ago, I had the honor of calling Senator Barack Obama to congratulate him.

I urge all Americans ... I urge all Americans who supported me to join me in not just congratulating him, but offering our next president our good will and earnest effort to find ways to come together to find the necessary compromises to bridge our differences and help restore our prosperity, defend our security in a dangerous world, and leave our children and grandchildren a stronger, better country than we inherited.

Whatever our differences, we are fellow Americans. And please believe me when I say no association has ever meant more to me than that..

I wish God speed to the man who was my former opponent and will be my president. And I call on all Americans, as I have often in this campaign, to not despair of our present difficulties, but to believe, always, in the promise and greatness of America, because nothing is inevitable here.

Americans never quit. We never surrender.

We never hide from history. We make history.

Thank you, and God bless you, and God bless America. Thank you all very much.

The bit that sticks out in McCains speech is when he says ..(Obama) will be my president. Thats a very strong endorsement coming from a republican senator.


Cheers smile


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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faith enfire
faith enfire

wandering thru the woods of WI
Location: Wisconsin
Member Since: 27th Jan 2006
Total posts: 3556
Posted:it's a strong endorsement that is typical of a concession speech

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

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_khan_
_khan_

old hand
Location: San Francisco, California, USA
Member Since: 17th Nov 2004
Total posts: 768
Posted:I was impressed by McCain's concession speech. It was conciliatory and respectful -- if that had been the John McCain we saw for most of the campaign, things might have turned out differently.

I'm trying to keep my expectations grounded with regards to President-elect Obama, but it's strange as this is the first time ever I've actually felt inspired by a politician. I've spent the time since hearing his acceptance speech wondering not "can he pull it off?" but "what can I do? what contribution can I make?"

It feels like a certain passivity has been pulled back.


taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco

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faith enfire
faith enfire

wandering thru the woods of WI
Location: Wisconsin
Member Since: 27th Jan 2006
Total posts: 3556
Posted:what's that saying, if dreams were horses..?

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

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Lurch
Lurch

old hand
Location: Oregon
Member Since: 1st Nov 2003
Total posts: 929
Posted:Then we'll be the horseshoes as they walk on us to achieve their goals? wink
EDITED_BY: Lurch (1226011951)


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