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Forums > HoP Competitions & Announcements - COL videos etc > COL2007 - it's here!
Login/Join to Participategeorgemc
BRONZE Member since Oct 2006
![georgemc]()
Sitting down facing forward . . .
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Total posts: 2387
BRONZE Member since Oct 2006
Sitting down facing forward . . .
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Total posts: 2387
Posted:The wheels seem to turn slowly when you're waiting for something good, but now it's finally here!
DVD details page
Shop page
Judges and participants copies are being sent out now. People who suscribed to the e-mail notification should also have received their e-mail.
Now you can all prepare to be inspired all over again!
cheers
George
DVD details page
Shop page
Judges and participants copies are being sent out now. People who suscribed to the e-mail notification should also have received their e-mail.
Now you can all prepare to be inspired all over again!
cheers
George
Written by: Doc Lightning talking about Marmite in Kichi's Intro thread
I have several large jars of the stuff. I actually like it... a little. And don't tell anyone I admitted to it. 
Posted:Fire Groove- I have to say something about your routine, I noticed a great improvement in your technical level from last year, well done 
I loved the DVD, great improvement from last year's.
cant wait to hear the results.
The S staff video was great. some of my other favourites were Burning Match, Nick & Yuta, Sandy, Meg, Fire Groove, Flow Garden, noel-ski greg and dave.
by the way, anyone have some criticism on my routine? (asaf & elhanan)
I loved the DVD, great improvement from last year's.
cant wait to hear the results.
The S staff video was great. some of my other favourites were Burning Match, Nick & Yuta, Sandy, Meg, Fire Groove, Flow Garden, noel-ski greg and dave.
by the way, anyone have some criticism on my routine? (asaf & elhanan)
Delete
Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted: Written by: Pele
My favorites were the ones not so contrived. I'm at work so I don't have the exact names in front of me but I love to see people spin in the park in daylight. I love seeing backyard spinners. I love seeing people *spin* more than I care about all of the effects, the stories, the other contrived bit as that is what I thought this was for.
Erm...
Wait a second.
Wasn't it only last year when there was a huge call for "Less people spinning in their back garden"? Even the rules/guildlines suggested thinking about your location and costume etc - as previously the general consensus was that 90% of videos you see (online) are people in their back garden or on a beach spinning as they would normally, and COL was a way of creating something more - something worth paying for.
And now, there's a backlash against "artsy" videos or ones that look like promo reels (Bearing in mind FireGroove made top 3 last year with their actual promo video...)
Mightily confusing.
Have yet to receive my copy, but with regards to the whole "samey" or "x-persons influence" - this can be seen throughout most of the spinning community, so I wouldn't expect it not to be there on a video compilation. Likewise hooping is huge this year, and getting bigger.
Mind you, hooping is still fairly new (well, in it's current wave of popularity) - so people are still picking up the base moves, so to a degree this will look pretty samey. Likewise with contact staff, with the exception of a few pioneers - there are standard moves which people will want to do in a video in a "This is the level i'm at" way. So then it leads on to individual expression - whether by dance, movement or camera-work and effects.
Incidentally, weren't you on the judging panel? Only i'd be quite offended if one of the judges was one of the people leading the criticism...
My favorites were the ones not so contrived. I'm at work so I don't have the exact names in front of me but I love to see people spin in the park in daylight. I love seeing backyard spinners. I love seeing people *spin* more than I care about all of the effects, the stories, the other contrived bit as that is what I thought this was for.
Erm...
Wait a second.
Wasn't it only last year when there was a huge call for "Less people spinning in their back garden"? Even the rules/guildlines suggested thinking about your location and costume etc - as previously the general consensus was that 90% of videos you see (online) are people in their back garden or on a beach spinning as they would normally, and COL was a way of creating something more - something worth paying for.
And now, there's a backlash against "artsy" videos or ones that look like promo reels (Bearing in mind FireGroove made top 3 last year with their actual promo video...)
Mightily confusing.
Have yet to receive my copy, but with regards to the whole "samey" or "x-persons influence" - this can be seen throughout most of the spinning community, so I wouldn't expect it not to be there on a video compilation. Likewise hooping is huge this year, and getting bigger.
Mind you, hooping is still fairly new (well, in it's current wave of popularity) - so people are still picking up the base moves, so to a degree this will look pretty samey. Likewise with contact staff, with the exception of a few pioneers - there are standard moves which people will want to do in a video in a "This is the level i'm at" way. So then it leads on to individual expression - whether by dance, movement or camera-work and effects.
Incidentally, weren't you on the judging panel? Only i'd be quite offended if one of the judges was one of the people leading the criticism...
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
Posted:I'd say that there is a line between the actual judging process and as a HoP members personal views so do not let there be a mix up there.
I think that what Pele is getting at is a general (group viewing) opinion and not a judgemental criticism in regards to being a HoP appointed judge.
As with any judgement of Col, that shouldn't be public knowledge and be kept between the judges and HQ.
I'm looking forward to seeing Col and the entries this year and making my own decision, I have heard so much since it's release and feel that I need to see the dvd for myself.
I think that what Pele is getting at is a general (group viewing) opinion and not a judgemental criticism in regards to being a HoP appointed judge.
As with any judgement of Col, that shouldn't be public knowledge and be kept between the judges and HQ.
I'm looking forward to seeing Col and the entries this year and making my own decision, I have heard so much since it's release and feel that I need to see the dvd for myself.
PK.
"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."
*Francois Couperin.
Posted:Durbs, thanks for your post! Good point re: the relative newness of hooping. I've been pondering this myself...of all these disciplines, hooping in its current incarnation (as opposed to circus-style hooping with lots and lots of hoops) I feel is about where poi was 3 or 4 years ago. There are still many discoveries to be made.
Also: it seems to be only a small subset of hoopers plugged into the general spinning community -- there's more variety of styles of hooping apparent all over YouTube than was represented on the collection, and I think that's because it was mainly fire hoopers that submitted and are tuned in to HoP and COL. At least in San Francisco, I'd say most hoopers don't hoop with fire and aren't part of HoP or the local fire spinning scene at all. As someone part of the two communities (hooping and spinning), I can say that it really is two distinct communities, at least locally. There's some that do cross-over, of course, but many, many more that just hoop and don't light up. So there's lots of styles out there that just weren't submitted.
Also: it seems to be only a small subset of hoopers plugged into the general spinning community -- there's more variety of styles of hooping apparent all over YouTube than was represented on the collection, and I think that's because it was mainly fire hoopers that submitted and are tuned in to HoP and COL. At least in San Francisco, I'd say most hoopers don't hoop with fire and aren't part of HoP or the local fire spinning scene at all. As someone part of the two communities (hooping and spinning), I can say that it really is two distinct communities, at least locally. There's some that do cross-over, of course, but many, many more that just hoop and don't light up. So there's lots of styles out there that just weren't submitted.
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
Posted: Written by: Durbs
And now, there's a backlash against "artsy" videos or ones that look like promo reels (Bearing in mind FireGroove made top 3 last year with their actual promo video...)
Mightily confusing.
Just to clarify ~ we made last years video specifically for COL and then afterwards used it as our promo and we'll do the same this year.
I think it's totally inspiring to see how far people can take this art worldwide. I love all of the live performances that were included like Fire dance with light from Germany, Spiral's Hoop Dance and Poism. I say the more professional, creative and technical, the more inspiring it is to the rest of us.
As far as hooping goes.... I agree with Khan. I live here in Los Angeles where hoop dance is huge. It's been going strong for almost 10 years now and it is amazing to see what people are doing with the hoop. I think fire hooping is only just becoming popular with the fire spinning community. Give it a few years....
And now, there's a backlash against "artsy" videos or ones that look like promo reels (Bearing in mind FireGroove made top 3 last year with their actual promo video...)
Mightily confusing.
Just to clarify ~ we made last years video specifically for COL and then afterwards used it as our promo and we'll do the same this year.
I think it's totally inspiring to see how far people can take this art worldwide. I love all of the live performances that were included like Fire dance with light from Germany, Spiral's Hoop Dance and Poism. I say the more professional, creative and technical, the more inspiring it is to the rest of us.
As far as hooping goes.... I agree with Khan. I live here in Los Angeles where hoop dance is huge. It's been going strong for almost 10 years now and it is amazing to see what people are doing with the hoop. I think fire hooping is only just becoming popular with the fire spinning community. Give it a few years....
Delete
Posted:Durbs, I didn't critique any single thing as a judge publically. I wouldn't do that.
It seems that you are assuming I have anything to do with establishing rules for entry, and I don't. I never have.
The only thing I have ever asked, and even begged for and that has been public and as a judge, is for people to use a light source other than the fire as it is completely inhibitive. It is still a *tremendous* pet peeve of mine on submissions.
I don't mind artsy in this comp, as long as it doesn't look like a promo and as long as the focal point is still the arts. In fact, I rather enjoy it. It is not a judges viewpoint that I say putting pros in with backyard peeps is unfair. If I were to enter, I would feel that way completely.
And whether or not someone came in 3rd last year has no bearings on your attempting to invalidate my *PERSONAL* opinions, since you don't know who I voted for last year, or who I am contemplating voting for this year.
But what I am understanding from your post Durbs is that I am not allowed a personal opinion outside of being a judge.
And let me tell you, my personal opinion varies greatly from the judges eye that I view it with.
I also find it sad that, according to you, I can not feel free to post *constructive* criticism of the over all video here without it being turned around. I offered thoughts on improvement and did address any single act, but instead the overall of the video.
I am a person Durbs, and a member of this forum, and as such am allowed to express those viewpoints. I stand by every single one. Once again, my position as judge (or moderator) does not kill the human part of me or remove me from having personal emotions and opinions, or being able to express them here.
If any single entrant of the video would like to know what criteria I use in judging, and/or my opinion and critique (the positive and the need-improvement) of *only their* submission, I will be more than happy to share it through PM or email.
It seems that you are assuming I have anything to do with establishing rules for entry, and I don't. I never have.
The only thing I have ever asked, and even begged for and that has been public and as a judge, is for people to use a light source other than the fire as it is completely inhibitive. It is still a *tremendous* pet peeve of mine on submissions.
I don't mind artsy in this comp, as long as it doesn't look like a promo and as long as the focal point is still the arts. In fact, I rather enjoy it. It is not a judges viewpoint that I say putting pros in with backyard peeps is unfair. If I were to enter, I would feel that way completely.
And whether or not someone came in 3rd last year has no bearings on your attempting to invalidate my *PERSONAL* opinions, since you don't know who I voted for last year, or who I am contemplating voting for this year.
But what I am understanding from your post Durbs is that I am not allowed a personal opinion outside of being a judge.
And let me tell you, my personal opinion varies greatly from the judges eye that I view it with.
I also find it sad that, according to you, I can not feel free to post *constructive* criticism of the over all video here without it being turned around. I offered thoughts on improvement and did address any single act, but instead the overall of the video.
I am a person Durbs, and a member of this forum, and as such am allowed to express those viewpoints. I stand by every single one. Once again, my position as judge (or moderator) does not kill the human part of me or remove me from having personal emotions and opinions, or being able to express them here.
If any single entrant of the video would like to know what criteria I use in judging, and/or my opinion and critique (the positive and the need-improvement) of *only their* submission, I will be more than happy to share it through PM or email.
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
Posted:Firebabe, it's interesting to hear that part of it was sped up. I had wondered about that. I'll note that when I watch it again. Thanks!
PoiBoy, please PM me if you want my opinion, and please remind me in the PM which ya'll were.
PoiBoy, please PM me if you want my opinion, and please remind me in the PM which ya'll were.
Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Ok ok , i'll back-track a bit here
I fully respect you can have a judges view and a personal opinion - i just personally ( ) feel that a judge shouldn't air either of these publically (There was a lot of "we" in your first post - regardless if it was crit of not). To quote standard competion rules; "No correspondence will be entered into regarding the results blah blah blah". If only for the reason people might take offense.
FireBabe - apologies, I didn't realise that was the case
Aaaaaanyway - my copy arrived this morning, so i'll watch it when I get back home tonight.
I'm fully prepared to eat my own words if I find my self in full agreement.
I fully respect you can have a judges view and a personal opinion - i just personally (
) feel that a judge shouldn't air either of these publically (There was a lot of "we" in your first post - regardless if it was crit of not). To quote standard competion rules; "No correspondence will be entered into regarding the results blah blah blah". If only for the reason people might take offense.FireBabe - apologies, I didn't realise that was the case
Aaaaaanyway - my copy arrived this morning, so i'll watch it when I get back home tonight.
I'm fully prepared to eat my own words if I find my self in full agreement.
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Just watched it 
Nice - best COL yet.
I thought there was a fair amount of variety - though seemed to be much more fire than in past COLs?
Personal highlights:
Zaobab in Africa - Kick ass. More screaming whilst spinning!
MCP - Hmmpf, suppose that was actually quite good. Darn
FireGroove - Nice, good spinning this year as well as nice location. And hot chicks spinning fire is just watchable. (Incidentally, was it filmed in wide-screen?)
Nick & Yuta - Lovely, but would've liked a bit more spinning
M.3.2 - Sandy, nice, almost "Effortless"
Poism - (Was that Yuta again?) Very pretty.
The staff fight one was actually quite amusing
On the whole, the group stuff didn't really do it for me - tended to be more concentration on costumes (or lack of with most girls ) and lots of fire rather than actual spinning. But to each their own
Other general musings - nice layout, good music and the standard overall was very good.
Occasionally I felt the music was added as an after-thought - in a couple of vids there didn't seem to be a relation between the music and spinning style...
UK (yet again) hugely under-represented - though I can't really complain about this, as I'm equally slack.
Erm...
But yeah, i'd for for 4 stars out of 5
Nice - best COL yet.
I thought there was a fair amount of variety - though seemed to be much more fire than in past COLs?
Personal highlights:
Zaobab in Africa - Kick ass. More screaming whilst spinning!
MCP - Hmmpf, suppose that was actually quite good. Darn
FireGroove - Nice, good spinning this year as well as nice location. And hot chicks spinning fire is just watchable. (Incidentally, was it filmed in wide-screen?)
Nick & Yuta - Lovely, but would've liked a bit more spinning
M.3.2 - Sandy, nice, almost "Effortless"
Poism - (Was that Yuta again?) Very pretty.
The staff fight one was actually quite amusing
On the whole, the group stuff didn't really do it for me - tended to be more concentration on costumes (or lack of with most girls
) and lots of fire rather than actual spinning. But to each their own Other general musings - nice layout, good music and the standard overall was very good.
Occasionally I felt the music was added as an after-thought - in a couple of vids there didn't seem to be a relation between the music and spinning style...
UK (yet again) hugely under-represented - though I can't really complain about this, as I'm equally slack.
Erm...
But yeah, i'd for for 4 stars out of 5
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
Posted: Written by: Durbs
I fully respect you can have a judges view and a personal opinion - i just personally ( ) feel that a judge shouldn't air either of these publically (There was a lot of "we" in your first post - regardless if it was crit of not).
Why shouldn't she be able to post her opinions as a person, is she really not a person like you and me or any one else?.
As far as I can see she is really the most active person out of any of the mods. Yes the others are around, but seriously what ever she says she gets shot down for and all she does is post as herself, you should know by now after all of your years service if she would be acting as a mod or as an every day member of the board.
Is she not entitle to use "we" either, as she stated she watched it first time around with friends.
I think that any one, mod or not should have their opinions valued.
I fully respect you can have a judges view and a personal opinion - i just personally (
) feel that a judge shouldn't air either of these publically (There was a lot of "we" in your first post - regardless if it was crit of not). Why shouldn't she be able to post her opinions as a person, is she really not a person like you and me or any one else?.
As far as I can see she is really the most active person out of any of the mods. Yes the others are around, but seriously what ever she says she gets shot down for and all she does is post as herself, you should know by now after all of your years service if she would be acting as a mod or as an every day member of the board.
Is she not entitle to use "we" either, as she stated she watched it first time around with friends.
I think that any one, mod or not should have their opinions valued.
PK.
"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."
*Francois Couperin.
Posted:PELE:
Your feedback didn't literally name performers, but the comment about the more theatrical videos was extremely directed.
You seem to have a very strong idea about what makes a good video, but don't we all, isn't that the point of competitions like this, so people can put forth what they think they have to offer?
I think the theatrical, dance parts of the performance are just as important as the fire itself, and having seen fire for so many years, I get bored of same old and are more interested in an evolution into different interpretations of the fire.
The competition never stated it was primarily about skills first, it seemed a lot more open then that, and the general consensus was that the most technical aren't normally the ones that win, it's the people doing something different.
Shame to seeing a judge try to box in what this should all be about....... I think you've got the word creativity and contrived confused.
So yeh i say bring on over the top
, otherwise i'm going to get damn bored.
EDITED_BY: scatterface (1194331941)
Your feedback didn't literally name performers, but the comment about the more theatrical videos was extremely directed.
You seem to have a very strong idea about what makes a good video, but don't we all, isn't that the point of competitions like this, so people can put forth what they think they have to offer?
I think the theatrical, dance parts of the performance are just as important as the fire itself, and having seen fire for so many years, I get bored of same old and are more interested in an evolution into different interpretations of the fire.
The competition never stated it was primarily about skills first, it seemed a lot more open then that, and the general consensus was that the most technical aren't normally the ones that win, it's the people doing something different.
Shame to seeing a judge try to box in what this should all be about....... I think you've got the word creativity and contrived confused.
So yeh i say bring on over the top
, otherwise i'm going to get damn bored.EDITED_BY: scatterface (1194331941)
Delete
Posted: Written by: scatterface
Shame to seeing a judge try to box in what this should all be about....... I think you've got the word creativity and contrived confused.
My point exactly....
Scatterface [edit] hasn't even read this thread, just piping up with a two cent post. *sigh*
EDITED_BY: PK_ (1194365593)
Shame to seeing a judge try to box in what this should all be about....... I think you've got the word creativity and contrived confused.
My point exactly....
Scatterface [edit] hasn't even read this thread, just piping up with a two cent post. *sigh*
EDITED_BY: PK_ (1194365593)
PK.
"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."
*Francois Couperin.
Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted:PK - Of course she's entitled to an opinion, but is it really so much of a chore not to air these?
Most people (I think) know she's on the judging panel, so regardless of whether it's posted as a "I think" or "The judges thought" - it's still coming from one of the judges.
Meh, i'm not saying she was hugely critical and said lots of horrible things. I just think that aside from praising the DVD layout, it came across as rather negative - "I was dissapointed". I'd be mildly peeved if one of the judges thought that, almost "nothing was very good, here's the best of a bad bunch". This would rather take away some of the warm fuzzy glow you'd get from being put on the DVD.
If someone else criticises the DVD - the entrants can think "ok, they didn't like it - but others will". If a judge posts that it might dent the joy somewhat.
It's only thanks to X-factor and Strictly Come Dancing shows that it's starting to become the norm for judges to offer vocal criticism. And I hardly think these are a good example of best-practise to follow
(I took the "we" to mean the judging panel, not a group of friends - I could well be wrong )
Shorter version:
Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but is it so much of a ball-ache not to post it if you're on the judging panel? There's plenty of others willing to post feedback...
(But yes, I agree Scatterface has possibly taken things a little close to heart after apparently mis-reading one of the rare bits of positivity in Pele's original post...)
Most people (I think) know she's on the judging panel, so regardless of whether it's posted as a "I think" or "The judges thought" - it's still coming from one of the judges.
Meh, i'm not saying she was hugely critical and said lots of horrible things. I just think that aside from praising the DVD layout, it came across as rather negative - "I was dissapointed". I'd be mildly peeved if one of the judges thought that, almost "nothing was very good, here's the best of a bad bunch". This would rather take away some of the warm fuzzy glow you'd get from being put on the DVD.
If someone else criticises the DVD - the entrants can think "ok, they didn't like it - but others will". If a judge posts that it might dent the joy somewhat.
It's only thanks to X-factor and Strictly Come Dancing shows that it's starting to become the norm for judges to offer vocal criticism. And I hardly think these are a good example of best-practise to follow
(I took the "we" to mean the judging panel, not a group of friends - I could well be wrong
)Shorter version:
Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but is it so much of a ball-ache not to post it if you're on the judging panel? There's plenty of others willing to post feedback...
(But yes, I agree Scatterface has possibly taken things a little close to heart after apparently mis-reading one of the rare bits of positivity in Pele's original post...)
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
strugz
BRONZE Member since Mar 2002
![strugz]()
Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., Uni...
Total posts: 3964
BRONZE Member since Mar 2002
Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., Uni...
Total posts: 3964
Posted:
More dark back garden spinning with no effects and no costumes!
COL 1 was and still is the best -
More dark back garden spinning with no effects and no costumes!
COL 1 was and still is the best -
"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."
Delete
Posted:Have many other people in the UK received their copy yet? mine still isnt here and im dying to watch it. Damn postal strike.
Durbs: you noticed that then. They were filmed at the same time but i carefully used different footage for each so as not to break the rules. Its also why effortless is only around a minute long, i saved the best footage for COL.
Durbs: you noticed that then. They were filmed at the same time but i carefully used different footage for each so as not to break the rules. Its also why effortless is only around a minute long, i saved the best footage for COL.
"Don't do it naked!"
Deletemcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
![mcp]()
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
Posted:Yeah, tell me about it. i ain't got mine yet either.
Leaves me lots of time to download anime! yay!
Leaves me lots of time to download anime! yay!
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
pineapple pete
SILVER Member since Sep 2004
![pineapple pete]()
water based
Location: melbourne, Australia
Total posts: 5125
SILVER Member since Sep 2004
water based
Location: melbourne, Australia
Total posts: 5125
Posted:now that the dvds are out i can happily say id been wearing my 'costume' on and off for a week before that, and that there was chocolate topping down one of the legs of my pants
"you know there are no trophys for doing silly things in real life yeah pete?" said ant "you wont get a 'listened to ride of the valkyries all the way to vietnam' trophy"
*proud owner of the very cute fire_spinning_angel, birgit and neon shaolin*
newgabe
SILVER Member since Mar 2005
![newgabe]()
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali, Australia
Total posts: 4030
SILVER Member since Mar 2005
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
Location: Bali, Australia
Total posts: 4030
Posted: Written by: PK_
**** idiot hasn't even read this thread, just piping up with a two cent post. *sigh*
PK I think it is very wrong to swear in this way at someone in a forum.
**** idiot hasn't even read this thread, just piping up with a two cent post. *sigh*
PK I think it is very wrong to swear in this way at someone in a forum.
.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....
Deletemcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
![mcp]()
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
Posted:I thought not-yet-shagging one of the moderators got you special privileges.
I was setting my sights on Dom.
I was setting my sights on Dom.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
_Clare_
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002
![_Clare_]()
Still wiggling
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Total posts: 5967
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002
Still wiggling
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Total posts: 5967
mcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
![mcp]()
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
Posted: Written by: _Clare_
Meg... get back to your anime... muppet
sorry,
I corrected my spellings.
Meg... get back to your anime... muppet
sorry,
I corrected my spellings."the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
_Clare_
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002
![_Clare_]()
Still wiggling
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Total posts: 5967
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002
Still wiggling
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Total posts: 5967
Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted:Wait - there's anime muppets now?
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
Posted: Written by: Durbs
PK - Of course she's entitled to an opinion, but is it really so much of a chore not to air these?
Most people (I think) know she's on the judging panel, so regardless of whether it's posted as a "I think" or "The judges thought" - it's still coming from one of the judges.
Meh, i'm not saying she was hugely critical and said lots of horrible things. I just think that aside from praising the DVD layout, it came across as rather negative - "I was dissapointed". I'd be mildly peeved if one of the judges thought that, almost "nothing was very good, here's the best of a bad bunch". This would rather take away some of the warm fuzzy glow you'd get from being put on the DVD.
If someone else criticises the DVD - the entrants can think "ok, they didn't like it - but others will". If a judge posts that it might dent the joy somewhat.
It's only thanks to X-factor and Strictly Come Dancing shows that it's starting to become the norm for judges to offer vocal criticism. And I hardly think these are a good example of best-practise to follow
(I took the "we" to mean the judging panel, not a group of friends - I could well be wrong )
Shorter version:
Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but is it so much of a ball-ache not to post it if you're on the judging panel? There's plenty of others willing to post feedback...
(But yes, I agree Scatterface has possibly taken things a little close to heart after apparently mis-reading one of the rare bits of positivity in Pele's original post...)
I can see your view point Durbs.
I don't think that there hasn't been a col thread without Pele making criticism though, I'm just narked that people just view her as a Mod and not a person... people kind of miss that there is actually a person there with feelings.
As for mcp's post, go for it with Dom I wish you all the luck in the world... but can you reiterate what special privileges your talking about
..
I'd have said the same if it were Flash, Charles or any other member of HoP... I think your missing some thing there... or just intent on a personal attack.
PK - Of course she's entitled to an opinion, but is it really so much of a chore not to air these?
Most people (I think) know she's on the judging panel, so regardless of whether it's posted as a "I think" or "The judges thought" - it's still coming from one of the judges.
Meh, i'm not saying she was hugely critical and said lots of horrible things. I just think that aside from praising the DVD layout, it came across as rather negative - "I was dissapointed". I'd be mildly peeved if one of the judges thought that, almost "nothing was very good, here's the best of a bad bunch". This would rather take away some of the warm fuzzy glow you'd get from being put on the DVD.
If someone else criticises the DVD - the entrants can think "ok, they didn't like it - but others will". If a judge posts that it might dent the joy somewhat.
It's only thanks to X-factor and Strictly Come Dancing shows that it's starting to become the norm for judges to offer vocal criticism. And I hardly think these are a good example of best-practise to follow
(I took the "we" to mean the judging panel, not a group of friends - I could well be wrong
)Shorter version:
Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but is it so much of a ball-ache not to post it if you're on the judging panel? There's plenty of others willing to post feedback...
(But yes, I agree Scatterface has possibly taken things a little close to heart after apparently mis-reading one of the rare bits of positivity in Pele's original post...)
I can see your view point Durbs.
I don't think that there hasn't been a col thread without Pele making criticism though, I'm just narked that people just view her as a Mod and not a person... people kind of miss that there is actually a person there with feelings.
As for mcp's post, go for it with Dom I wish you all the luck in the world... but can you reiterate what special privileges your talking about
.. I'd have said the same if it were Flash, Charles or any other member of HoP... I think your missing some thing there... or just intent on a personal attack.
PK.
"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."
*Francois Couperin.
mcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
![mcp]()
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
Posted: Written by: PK_
As for mcp's post, go for it with Dom I wish you all the luck in the world... but can you reiterate what special privileges your talking about ..
I'd have said the same if it were Flash, Charles or any other member of HoP... I think your missing some thing there... or just intent on a personal attack.
errrr... you called someone a fuckin idiot! Does that not count as abusive in your book?
By special privileges I meant the right to break the rules / guidelines of hop with impunity. ie:
"You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this BB to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law. "
But yeah, if you think I'm intent on a personal attack. Go for it.
As for mcp's post, go for it with Dom I wish you all the luck in the world... but can you reiterate what special privileges your talking about
.. I'd have said the same if it were Flash, Charles or any other member of HoP... I think your missing some thing there... or just intent on a personal attack.
errrr... you called someone a fuckin idiot! Does that not count as abusive in your book?
By special privileges I meant the right to break the rules / guidelines of hop with impunity. ie:
"You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this BB to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law. "
But yeah, if you think I'm intent on a personal attack. Go for it.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
Posted:Yeah as it was...
So there is an edit function and I used it.
So by saying that then you had no point to make at all in your previous post...
EDITED_BY: PK_ (1194365762)
So there is an edit function and I used it.
So by saying that then you had no point to make at all in your previous post...
EDITED_BY: PK_ (1194365762)
PK.
"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."
*Francois Couperin.
Posted:Scatterface, really? Which of the multitudes of theatrical videos was it directed at? I can think of numerous that fit into that category off the top of my head. Care to clarify what I was thinking then?
Yeah..moving on. English is my first language. I know the difference between creative and contrived. I used the word I felt most appropriate. I stand by it.
Durbs, I believe I did say "one of the people sitting in my living room" and it is no secret that I live in the US, so um....explain how I saw this with the rest of the judges? And no, not common knowledge that I'm a judge. Hell, I'm not even sure who the rest of the judges are to be honest, or how many.
Next, yes, it really is hard. Why shouldn't I give feedback? My feedback is pretty much about the DVD on the whole here. And I said, and stand by, that I think all the entrants did a great job.
Standing back and being silent doesn't get anyone anywhere. And concidering I offered constructive criticism and feedback..just as I have always done publically. Why is it only now that I am being called out on it? Why should I stop now and not years ago? My issues with it weren't with the individual submissions, as I think everyone did the best they could and did a bang up job. I also said that.
No one learns from silence. I'd be pissed if I put into this and everyone just patted me on the back and said good job. I'd be pissed if I put time and effort into a video and everyone just said "Oh that's nice. Best yet!" Really? Why? I want to know why it's better. I want to know what can be improved next time. I want to progress and this is the only way to do it, and in this case..where I was making *BLANKET* statements quite on purpose, public is the best place to do it because it gets people thinking about next time around. If I do it in private, who learns? Only specific people. Not people thinking of putting in next year. And honestly, I've already had emails and pm's from people who said they want to what I've said for submissions next year.
Yes it is one persons opinion. I admit that and I've never said I was an authority but I won't sit and be quiet either.
I find it interesting how you are focussing so hard on the "bad" that you are failing to see any good or benefit. I find that sad and limiting to the experience.
PK- newgabe is right. Everyone is entitled to their opinion without attack.
mcp- crass, rude and disgusting much? Very uncool and uncalled for and just as far offbase and unwarrented as PK's name calling.
Pineapple Pete, 'kay...now that is really funny. I think you did it on purpose to tease people to come lick it off! Now I have to look for it! Wanna make it easier on me? Which leg?
Yeah..moving on. English is my first language. I know the difference between creative and contrived. I used the word I felt most appropriate. I stand by it.
Durbs, I believe I did say "one of the people sitting in my living room" and it is no secret that I live in the US, so um....explain how I saw this with the rest of the judges? And no, not common knowledge that I'm a judge. Hell, I'm not even sure who the rest of the judges are to be honest, or how many.
Next, yes, it really is hard. Why shouldn't I give feedback? My feedback is pretty much about the DVD on the whole here. And I said, and stand by, that I think all the entrants did a great job.
Standing back and being silent doesn't get anyone anywhere. And concidering I offered constructive criticism and feedback..just as I have always done publically. Why is it only now that I am being called out on it? Why should I stop now and not years ago? My issues with it weren't with the individual submissions, as I think everyone did the best they could and did a bang up job. I also said that.
No one learns from silence. I'd be pissed if I put into this and everyone just patted me on the back and said good job. I'd be pissed if I put time and effort into a video and everyone just said "Oh that's nice. Best yet!" Really? Why? I want to know why it's better. I want to know what can be improved next time. I want to progress and this is the only way to do it, and in this case..where I was making *BLANKET* statements quite on purpose, public is the best place to do it because it gets people thinking about next time around. If I do it in private, who learns? Only specific people. Not people thinking of putting in next year. And honestly, I've already had emails and pm's from people who said they want to what I've said for submissions next year.
Yes it is one persons opinion. I admit that and I've never said I was an authority but I won't sit and be quiet either.
I find it interesting how you are focussing so hard on the "bad" that you are failing to see any good or benefit. I find that sad and limiting to the experience.
PK- newgabe is right. Everyone is entitled to their opinion without attack.
mcp- crass, rude and disgusting much? Very uncool and uncalled for and just as far offbase and unwarrented as PK's name calling.
Pineapple Pete, 'kay...now that is really funny. I think you did it on purpose to tease people to come lick it off!
Now I have to look for it! Wanna make it easier on me? Which leg? Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK
mcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
![mcp]()
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
PLATINUM Member since May 2003
Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Total posts: 5276
Posted: Written by: PK_
Yeah as it was...
So there is an edit function and I used it.
So by saying that then you had no point to make at all in your previous post...
I didn't? Man, I've said some thing on hop that bend the spirit of the rules but I don't think I've actually swore at somebody. And If I hadda done, that post would have probably been deleted. Or at least I might have put an apology in it's place and an explaination. [ Or got banned, y'know whichever seemed more fun at the time. ]
Does editing it make it all better? Did I know you'd done that till you told me? Do I care this much?
... no.
Written by: Pele
mcp- crass, rude and disgusting much? Very uncool and uncalled for and just as far offbase and unwarrented as PK's name calling.
Yeah, pretty much all the time. It's actually much funnier than the original post I made so if you want to, go and delete it.
Oh man, I'm too sprung up on caffiene for this level of thinking...
Yeah as it was...
So there is an edit function and I used it.
So by saying that then you had no point to make at all in your previous post...
I didn't? Man, I've said some thing on hop that bend the spirit of the rules but I don't think I've actually swore at somebody. And If I hadda done, that post would have probably been deleted. Or at least I might have put an apology in it's place and an explaination. [ Or got banned, y'know whichever seemed more fun at the time. ]
Does editing it make it all better? Did I know you'd done that till you told me? Do I care this much?
... no.
Written by: Pele
mcp- crass, rude and disgusting much? Very uncool and uncalled for and just as far offbase and unwarrented as PK's name calling.
Yeah, pretty much all the time. It's actually much funnier than the original post I made so if you want to, go and delete it.
Oh man, I'm too sprung up on caffiene for this level of thinking...
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
ben-ja-men
GOLD Member since Jun 2003
![ben-ja-men]()
just lost .... evil init
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Total posts: 2474
GOLD Member since Jun 2003
just lost .... evil init
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Total posts: 2474
Posted: Written by: Pele
And considering I offered constructive criticism and feedback..
I think this is the point where the misunderstandings are coming from. I'm not sure if its a cultural difference or that some meaning is getting lost in the text only communication. Pele perhaps you could provide some clarification on your constructive criticism as I am a little bit puzzled.
Written by: Pele
I have to agree with the DVD itself, the menus, the artist selection, etc being better than before.
The music as well.
Props for that!
Beyond that, I was disappointed.
can you elaborate as to how this is constructive for the performers? I fail to see how this can help them to produce a better entry next year.
Written by: Pele
There was a severe lack of diversity on this thing. The staves, all done to varying skills, were all done extremely similarly. Same with the hoops. And the fact that it was sooo completely heavy in these areas as well. Watching these every year one can not only determine the hot topic of what prop to use but also what the newest focus of movement groups with that group are.
This also reflects back to another discussion I've been in about how so many HoP spinners now look alike because of the common influence. I could literally look at people and go "Oh, that's Nicks influence"
im a little confused as to what the suggestion was for how to fix this? seeings as the entrants don't see each other submissions im not sure how they can avoid this short of going off to spin in isolation for the next year?
Written by: Pele
Story driven was another hot thing this year, in several videos we felt, to the detriment of actually showing spinning skill. There were a few I can think of where the story was far more emphasized and skills were shown but a fraction of the video time. That was *extremely* disappointing, since this is actually a spinning/skill video, not a- as one of the viewers in my living room put it- freshman film class project.
My understanding of constructive criticism is that generally instead of saying you've done a rubbish job you would suggest perhaps using a camera boom, getting some film students to borrow a rig/have input into how to shoot it.
Written by: Pele
I understand that HoP worked with the videos they were given and they did a bang up job with it.
I was a bit surprised by this comment, perhaps this wasn't the intention but when I read this i thought it implied that what they had to work with was under par
Written by: Pele
However, we (as we had a large group viewing it) would have prefered to see more diversity, in styles and in tool list.
i can see how thats constructive feedback for the editors, im not really sure how it translates over to the individuals?
ps meg nice work with the full staff on fire, but where was the head spin?
And considering I offered constructive criticism and feedback..
I think this is the point where the misunderstandings are coming from. I'm not sure if its a cultural difference or that some meaning is getting lost in the text only communication. Pele perhaps you could provide some clarification on your constructive criticism as I am a little bit puzzled.
Written by: Pele
I have to agree with the DVD itself, the menus, the artist selection, etc being better than before.
The music as well.
Props for that!
Beyond that, I was disappointed.
can you elaborate as to how this is constructive for the performers? I fail to see how this can help them to produce a better entry next year.
Written by: Pele
There was a severe lack of diversity on this thing. The staves, all done to varying skills, were all done extremely similarly. Same with the hoops. And the fact that it was sooo completely heavy in these areas as well. Watching these every year one can not only determine the hot topic of what prop to use but also what the newest focus of movement groups with that group are.
This also reflects back to another discussion I've been in about how so many HoP spinners now look alike because of the common influence. I could literally look at people and go "Oh, that's Nicks influence"
im a little confused as to what the suggestion was for how to fix this? seeings as the entrants don't see each other submissions im not sure how they can avoid this short of going off to spin in isolation for the next year?
Written by: Pele
Story driven was another hot thing this year, in several videos we felt, to the detriment of actually showing spinning skill. There were a few I can think of where the story was far more emphasized and skills were shown but a fraction of the video time. That was *extremely* disappointing, since this is actually a spinning/skill video, not a- as one of the viewers in my living room put it- freshman film class project.
My understanding of constructive criticism is that generally instead of saying you've done a rubbish job you would suggest perhaps using a camera boom, getting some film students to borrow a rig/have input into how to shoot it.
Written by: Pele
I understand that HoP worked with the videos they were given and they did a bang up job with it.
I was a bit surprised by this comment, perhaps this wasn't the intention but when I read this i thought it implied that what they had to work with was under par
Written by: Pele
However, we (as we had a large group viewing it) would have prefered to see more diversity, in styles and in tool list.
i can see how thats constructive feedback for the editors, im not really sure how it translates over to the individuals?
ps meg nice work with the full staff on fire, but where was the head spin?
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
DeleteDurbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
![Durbs]()
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001
Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Total posts: 5688
Posted:
Nice to know i'm not utterly alone
(Meg doesn't count as she's technically insane)
Nice to know i'm not utterly alone
(Meg doesn't count as she's technically insane)
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
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