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Rouge Dragon
Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction
Member Since: 21st Jul 2003
Total posts: 13215
Posted:Should kids get a vote?

Definitely in two minds. And if it were to be brough in, then I think there would need to be an age limit as well; a 16 year old is going to have a more informed vote than a 5 year old.

 Written by: Thornley


"A family of five or six has no more say in our democracy than a couple of two - yet their needs and potential contribution are greater.


this really bothers me, but I can't quite put my finger on why. I suppose it's because the number of kids you have should have nothing to do with your needs.
I also think that there is a big political swing in this. Sorry to be stereotypical, but with the number of kids per family decreasing because more women are chosing a career over raising lots of kids, then it's a certain demographic of family who is going to have lots of kids (assuming one family member theyre staying home). More votes to religion where contraception is banned?

 Written by: Thornley


"So, we could consider parents being given the responsibility to cast additional votes on behalf of their kids until the kids turn 18 when they cast their own vote."


Nothing, absolutely nothing is going to stop the parents from forming their own political agendas here. Many people vote differently to their parents (I vote differently to my mother, and before I was old enough to vote I would have voted differently to my father, even though currently we vote the same).

Sure, some parents our there would be responsible enough to discuss the options and candidates and policies with their children, and kudos to them for it. But many will just force ideas down their kids' throats. And that is NOT democracy.

relevant side information:
when I was 16 I voted in a referendum to make Australia a republic. (As you would have noticed; we lost it) I still remember my father handing the ballot paper to me and saying "it's your future more than mine". And I believe that if more young people had voted in that referendum (Australia has an ageing population) then we'd no longer have a foreign head of state. And Dad's right; it's OUR future, not the oldies.

Discuss.


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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scosh
scosh

non stop uber rocking electro rock party
Location: hastings
Member Since: 15th Aug 2007
Total posts: 122
Posted:i havent actually everything is very grey over here in england ur voting sounds like more fun or at least more stimulating smile

"im quite depressed, im quite a mess, so beat me up, beat me down, mess me up beyond all recognition"

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Fireina
member
Location: Broomfield, Colorado
Member Since: 14th Aug 2007
Total posts: 143
Posted:When i was in elementary school, they had this program thing called "Kids Vote" where during election years they taught us all about the US electoral process then we got to go down by the real voting machines on election day and cast our kids ballots. They actually got counted and it was kinda fun.

The problem is most kids really don't care and only unless a candidate tanks their campaign by saying "I'll legalise weed" or "I'll lower the drinking age" will they solidly get the teenage vote. Obviously that candidate won't win though. Teenagers are very much single issue voters, not to mention very pop influenced.


"Watch those explosions in the sky and you'll go blind, but not this time. Will you live in hope or dark desire? What can I say? F*ck love give me fire." ~Cities Of Night by Blaqk Audio (Davey Havok)

Proudly MCRmy

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alien_oddity
alien_oddity

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: in the trees
Member Since: 31st Dec 2004
Total posts: 7193
Posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8O17VYGcM0
br>

this is how i see the future ending up if kids ever got the vote ubblol


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TastesLikePurple
TastesLikePurple

addict
Location: Nottingham
Member Since: 18th Aug 2005
Total posts: 498
Posted:that is genius!!! what's that from? i may have to waste money on it ubblol

Thoughts arrive like butterflies...

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fanged_angel
fanged_angel

poiromaniac
Location: liverpool, uk
Member Since: 11th Jul 2007
Total posts: 162
Posted:i think everbody in the world should be sterilised at birth and not aloud to breed or vote until the pass a test, we all know of chav v y girls with far too many children and people that vote without due care and attention

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Fireina
member
Location: Broomfield, Colorado
Member Since: 14th Aug 2007
Total posts: 143
Posted:^^^
So you propose a giant uterus and testicle storage facility being built or something to house all the reproductive bits and pieces of these steralysed children? What do you suggest we do with all the bits of children NOT allowed to vote or breed? Should we burn them or turn them into animal feed perhaps? Would the line for voting and reproduction be the same score or would it be different numbers? If it is different numbers, how do you propose giving half-rights? :P


"Watch those explosions in the sky and you'll go blind, but not this time. Will you live in hope or dark desire? What can I say? F*ck love give me fire." ~Cities Of Night by Blaqk Audio (Davey Havok)

Proudly MCRmy

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fanged_angel
fanged_angel

poiromaniac
Location: liverpool, uk
Member Since: 11th Jul 2007
Total posts: 162
Posted:no just a high dosage hormone injection like the pill only much more impacting, it would stop the women from being able to get pregnant but i think guys should get it aswel so they dont hit puberty until there mature enough to handle it.

and yes it would be a different test for voting and breeding =D


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Fireina
member
Location: Broomfield, Colorado
Member Since: 14th Aug 2007
Total posts: 143
Posted:Indeed, but how exactly do you propose half-sterilysation for people who pass one test but not the other? Do you allow them to vote but leave them steralysed or reverse their sterilysation but forbid them from going near voting booths? Would it be like a Chinese style one-child rule for those who only half pass?

"Watch those explosions in the sky and you'll go blind, but not this time. Will you live in hope or dark desire? What can I say? F*ck love give me fire." ~Cities Of Night by Blaqk Audio (Davey Havok)

Proudly MCRmy

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_Poiboy_
_Poiboy_

bastard child of satan
Location: Raanana, Israel
Member Since: 12th Jan 2004
Total posts: 1113
Posted: Written by: TastesLikePurple


that is genius!!! what's that from? i may have to waste money on it ubblol



that's from Idiocracy, it's really an incredible movie. I love my brother so much for telling me about it. go watch it now!


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alien_oddity
alien_oddity

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: in the trees
Member Since: 31st Dec 2004
Total posts: 7193
Posted: Written by: fanged_angel


i think everbody in the world should be sterilised at birth and not aloud to breed or vote until the pass a test, we all know of chav v y girls with far too many children and people that vote without due care and attention




sounds a bit 1883 to me ubblol i think the stigma of parents giving a kid a clip round the ear if they are naughty should be removed. sometimes kids do desevrve a slap (i dont mean beating 7 shades of sh*t out of them)


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robnunchucks
robnunchucks

enthusiast
Location: manchester uk
Member Since: 14th Jul 2004
Total posts: 363
Posted:Pyrolific fair enough you weren't acualy saying what i thought you were that sounds alot more resonable. your saying that reasoning doesn't naturaly progress after 15 and to progress from that point requires specific training.



also your statment



Additionally the education system is currently training every person to think that every argument is valid (teachers seem to confuse valid with valued...big mistake) as its the person's opinion (also a mistake).



couldn't agree more i think you've hit the nail right on the head there personaly i recon its a case of polical correctness spilling over into education.

EDITED_BY: robnunchucks (1187654955)


My nunchucks vital statictics biggrin

weight: 500g
handle lenght: 16 inches
chain length: 2 inches

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Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8737
Posted:it's teachers who have to get results so instead of educating a child to think they teach them how to pass an exam based on a strict and rigid syllabus.



It does make it harder to instill original and cognative thought when a teacher has to spend the whole lesson trying to teach something complicated to 30 students because the next lesson they have to move on to something new...there's no space for discussion. Especially when the syllabus says it's true the teacher cannot afford to tell students that as they need to know it as fact for an exam...even if there is controversy.


A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.

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Fireina
member
Location: Broomfield, Colorado
Member Since: 14th Aug 2007
Total posts: 143
Posted:I wish they had a class that tought you real wordl survival stuff, cause a lot of parents don't teach kids about like, what a good loan rate is or how to fillout the papers to get an apartment. I think they used to teach those things in schol a bit, but now they're not on a standardised test so there's no "need" or time to teach them.

"Watch those explosions in the sky and you'll go blind, but not this time. Will you live in hope or dark desire? What can I say? F*ck love give me fire." ~Cities Of Night by Blaqk Audio (Davey Havok)

Proudly MCRmy

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Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8737
Posted:that's where kids should ask opinions, loan rates etc are substantive and should be more easily recognised as "good" or "bad" politicians promises are just so much air

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.

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Fireina
member
Location: Broomfield, Colorado
Member Since: 14th Aug 2007
Total posts: 143
Posted:See! Nobody teaches us to ask oppinions of loan rates! Kids these days are severely lacking in normal skills like that. Hell, everybody i know with a bank account has a debit card but not a single one of us ever writes purchases in a check register to keep track of how much money we actually have.

The current generation is more than a little [censored] if we don't even do check registers, lol. Think the people foreclosing with subprime loans are unfortunate...just wait a couple years!


"Watch those explosions in the sky and you'll go blind, but not this time. Will you live in hope or dark desire? What can I say? F*ck love give me fire." ~Cities Of Night by Blaqk Audio (Davey Havok)

Proudly MCRmy

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Pyrolific
Returning to a unique state of Equilibrium
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Member Since: 10th Jan 2001
Total posts: 3288
Posted: Written by: robnunchucks


your saying that reasoning doesn't naturaly progress after 15 and to progress from that point requires specific training.





yep thats it in an nutshell. and if reasoning doesnt progress (ie people dont get any better at figuring out who is telling the truth or making promises they cant keep etc etc), why cant we give the vote to kids at that age?

Experiencing the hardship of paying tax doesnt help if you cant tell which politician is lying about reducing tax - if anything it makes you more prone to believing the biggest liar - because they are promising the biggest gains.

smile


--
Help! My personality got stuck in this signature machine and I cant get it out!

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robnunchucks
robnunchucks

enthusiast
Location: manchester uk
Member Since: 14th Jul 2004
Total posts: 363
Posted:ok fair point but reasoning alone isn't enough to make informed decisions that takes experiance as well. experiance is the raw data that reasoning needs to operate (maby not in things like matmatics where pure reasoning is enough) but in real life situations where things are alot less clear cut



past experiance is important to good decision makeing. so even if kids reasoning skills are fully developed they still need time to build up the experiance that there reasoning needs to work well.



infact after writing that im inclined to say the vote age should be raised

EDITED_BY: robnunchucks (1187883954)


My nunchucks vital statictics biggrin

weight: 500g
handle lenght: 16 inches
chain length: 2 inches

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Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8737
Posted:So I think the gist of rob's post is reasoning AND knowlegdge are required...and Experience.

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.

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Page: 123

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