Forums > Advanced Poi Moves > Advanced Isolations: Point Isolations and Isolation Weave?

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sazken
Member

Member Since: 25th Aug 2006
Total posts: 5
Posted:I'd say i'm something of a newbie (aren't we all?), and I've recently begun to play with Isolations and such. I can do a somewhat shoddy iso-buzzsaw and various other isolation trickery. No matter how hard I try, I can never get seem to get a point isolation (an isolation in which your hand rotates entirely around the head). They're bonafide impossible. Do you have any pointers for this?

The isolation weave is also positively devilish. Any advice on this as well?

Thanks!


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pineapple pete
pineapple pete

water based
Location: melbourne
Member Since: 20th Sep 2004
Total posts: 5125
Posted:uhm, to the best of my knowledge, its very difficult to get more than 1/2 of a point isolation, and next to impossible to do it continuously. this is because of the speeds your hands would have to reach smile

cheers, pete hug


"you know there are no trophys for doing silly things in real life yeah pete?" said ant "you wont get a 'listened to ride of the valkyries all the way to vietnam' trophy"

*proud owner of the very cute fire_spinning_angel, birgit and neon shaolin*

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fNi
fNi

master of disaster
Location: New York
Member Since: 8th Mar 2004
Total posts: 3354
Posted:if you spin in reverse, then at some point punch through the poi, that's a point isolation...but its odd

kyrian: I've felt your finger connect with me many times
lou kitten: sneaky little meatball..
ezz: please corrupt me more

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mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted: Written by: pineapple pete


this is because of the speeds your hands would have to reach smile



the speed of light?

88 miles per hour, allowing you to travel through space and time?

oh sorry....


"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.

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Cody
Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2003
Total posts: 556
Posted:I've worked quite a bit on isolations striving for more than 1/2 point isolations. My only advice is to try and over eggarate your arm and body movements. You may look like a frog in a blender doing a weve but it helps me. You know you have an isolated weave when the chains stay parallel the entire time and your hands are with the opposite poi head. As you get crossed up doing the weve turn your body and open up to get that stretch. That tricky part makes the isolated weave. IMO biggrin

Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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sazken
Member

Member Since: 25th Aug 2006
Total posts: 5
Posted:Alright. I'll get on it. One last question, though: Are there any tutorial videos for a point isolation or an isolation weave?

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Cody
Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2003
Total posts: 556
Posted:I would love to see a video too. I'd make one but mine aren't perfect. If one doesn't exist maybee I'll give it a shot.

When I was practicing this at Burningman some other spinners approached me. They wanted to see what I was spinning since they had seen me from a distance. First they thought it was a staff, then they thought it was a tri-sectional staff, but in the end were supprised to see it was poi. When I was dead on it does look like a staff. When I was just off and the chains were not quite parallel it looked like a tri-sectioanl staff.

I prefer the reverse weve for isolations. Watch your hands and try to get them to pull apart towards the opposite poi head. You have to slow down the spin but speed up your hand. As your hands start making bigger circles you need to twist your torso for the stretch. I do a dip/twist/open on each side to make that cross. Giant movements. Heavy poi help too. smile


Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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DCpyro
newbie

Member Since: 17th Oct 2006
Total posts: 1
Posted:hey, i saw this one dude totally fre dancin a while ago, but the flame was blue and green. does anyone know how to change the color of the flame when perfoming fire dancin? cause im kinda new to the whole thing, but i really got the hang of it all. cept for this little trick. so, any idea's or knowledge of it?

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kepki2003
kepki2003

Member
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Member Since: 15th Dec 2004
Total posts: 34
Posted:I've been playing with isolations for awhile now, I belive i got the iso weave down (5 beat weave)....



Let me know what yal think about this video. I do a fair amount of isolations in the second burn. ENJOY!!!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8Oz7sT8ho8

EDITED_BY: kepki2003 (1173311840)


Spin More Poi!!!

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sxsk17
stranger

Member Since: 14th Jul 2005
Total posts: 17
Posted:nice isolated weaves! I've been working on mine for a few months and I'm just starting to get the forwards one.



i worked up to mine by getting the isolated buzzsaw down solid, and then spinning a "buzzsaw" with one poi outside my arms, to get my hands used to isolating with the poi outside. that seemed to help give me a better foundation for moving from the buzzsaw to the weave.



also, I've managed to do something of a point iso by almost stalling the poi vertically and spinning by hand around it really quick. That only works for one beat though. I think I've heard people talk about real point isos somewhere else tho.

EDITED_BY: sxsk17 (1173399737)


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yinyangraver
newbie

Member Since: 28th Jan 2008
Total posts: 8
Posted:I'm looking for some further help/instruction. I may post a new thread because the move I'm wondering, I'm still not sure if it's just a super excellent isolation weave or something else entirely.


At the current moment, I cannot for the life of me figure out in which video Nick mentioned it in, but he mentioned a move called "Rock the Cradle" and he specifically mentioned the poi spinners in Japan, and the only examples I can clearly see of it are in some of yuta's videos:
the first and best is the seminal yuta video seen here:

2:12-2:24

and also here:

1:25-1:31

Is this just a super isolation move or is he crossing chains and doing something called "rock the cradle"?


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glowing_fool
glowing_fool

known to wear fancy pants
Location: New Jersey
Member Since: 30th Jun 2007
Total posts: 11
Posted:might be hybrids or just doing isolations in wallplane

spin happy

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Imbalance
Imbalance

not different, just not the same
Location: Charlotte, NC
Member Since: 9th Sep 2005
Total posts: 263
Posted:in the first vid its a bit easier to see. Anyway looks like one of 2 things, either he's doing some really really good isolations (kinda hybridy for part of the circle...) or he's grabbing the opposite change and keeping the separation. Personally I think its chain grabbing, and the only reason being that I think I see the chains slack a bit at certain points between his hands while the part outside the hands stays taught. But I could be wrong.

I once learned every move that there was,
Every style, Every technique.
Then I woke up, and forgot it all,
So now I struggle to dream.

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yinyangraver
newbie

Member Since: 28th Jan 2008
Total posts: 8
Posted:Imbalance, that's what I thought. And that's what I think Nick Woolsey is referring to when he referred to the "Rock the Cradle" move. A sort of grabbing of the chains and doing an isolation weave with it, but I can't figure out the hand movements.

Is there anyone else out there that has a video of this move, or who does this move, and can explain it?


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simta
simta

compfuzzled
Location: hastings
Member Since: 11th Apr 2006
Total posts: 1182
Posted:surely its jus an isolated fountain?

"the geeks have got you" - Gayle

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Imbalance
Imbalance

not different, just not the same
Location: Charlotte, NC
Member Since: 9th Sep 2005
Total posts: 263
Posted:the hand movements aren't that bad actually, go grab a staff or a pole or something of appropriate length and try and mimic what he's doing. You'll quickly find you just wind up one way then unwind the other. it looks like he's crossing over as well as part of the wind/unwind process.

I once learned every move that there was,
Every style, Every technique.
Then I woke up, and forgot it all,
So now I struggle to dream.

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yinyangraver
newbie

Member Since: 28th Jan 2008
Total posts: 8
Posted:Imbalance:

The problem is I cannot see what he is doing to mimic it, which is why I'm looking for

a. a better specifically written out explanation

or

b. a better video demo of all the hand movements

The reason I'm asking, is because try as I might, I can't figure out where his hands are going. If I knew exactly where his hands were going, I wouldn't be asking for help with this move, I'd be out trying to perfect it smile.


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simta
simta

compfuzzled
Location: hastings
Member Since: 11th Apr 2006
Total posts: 1182
Posted:can you do a fountain? if not learn it, then just isolate that move

"the geeks have got you" - Gayle

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Mr_Chutney
Mr_Chutney

Tosser
Location: Herefordshire
Member Since: 18th Apr 2003
Total posts: 1711
Posted:They're just very clean isolated weaves turned in wall plane... Still very hard, but I don't think there's any chain grabbing going on, just a high level of skill.

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yinyangraver
newbie

Member Since: 28th Jan 2008
Total posts: 8
Posted:simta:

so basically... an isolated fountain without the overhead motion?

chutney: thank you, that makes more sense. I think i need to video myself to see how close I'm getting. I'll let you guys know when I do that.

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

p.s. - if yuta isn't grabbing the chains in these videos... then what was nick saying in regards to "rock the cradle"? has anyone else ever heard of that move?


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AlienJon
AlienJon

enthusiast
Location: Everywhere
Member Since: 7th Mar 2002
Total posts: 290
Posted:I don't think Yuta is "rocking the cradle" in either vid. I tried to find which of Nick's youtube tutorials I remembered "rock the cradle" mentioned, but I haven't located it yet... if I do I'll post a link.

I think he is talking about going into some form of 1st degree inversion (barrel roll), and stalling both poi on the arms to reverse directions. It is a bit like the windup that Rovo is so fond of... but Rovo's is an airwrap tangle to stall on both arms... Rock the cradle is barrel roll to stall on both arms (my best guess).

Arashi showed me something like that like 4+ years ago when he was showing me isolations and inversions... at the time it just melted my mind.

-Alien Jon


+Alien Jon

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simta
simta

compfuzzled
Location: hastings
Member Since: 11th Apr 2006
Total posts: 1182
Posted: Written by: yinyangraver


simta:

so basically... an isolated fountain without the overhead motion?

chutney: thank you, that makes more sense. I think i need to video myself to see how close I'm getting. I'll let you guys know when I do that.




well in the first video looks like he brings it up and over when it comes from the right side as oppose to if it was simply isolated weave it should stay level

but there is def no chain grabbing involved


"the geeks have got you" - Gayle

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yoni
yoni

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bideford and Bath
Member Since: 4th Jun 2005
Total posts: 3099
Posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npWNx_YaDOE
br>This is the video which mentions the rock the cradle move, which seems to be more based around inversions to me but I'm not sure. Incidentally the video is about isolated weave smile


UCOF "evolution: Poi -> stick -> hoops -> devil stick -> juggling club -> juggling ball -> crayons."

Supergroovalsticprosifunkstication
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yinyangraver
newbie

Member Since: 28th Jan 2008
Total posts: 8
Posted:Yoni - thank you! that was the video indeed. And Nick specifically mentions yuta. And he is grabbing the string/chain... at least nick is.



Edit: I think yuta might be cradling the chains at some point. Found this video on youtube which slows down the isolation.






Okay here is my beat count:

One front wallplane

Two opposite side regular beat (with body turned to match wallplane)

One front wallplane

One same side regular (with body turned to match wallplane)

repeats...



And he's just doing it with insanely good precision.



Does that seem right everyone?

EDITED_BY: yinyangraver (1204502787)


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16.15.8
16.15.8

I cant think therefore Im not
Location: In my backpack
Member Since: 16th Jul 2005
Total posts: 291
Posted:He dosnt touch or grab the chain once, he`s doing isolations if he grabed the chains he`s arm wouldn`t have the same motion.

This is 2005 so the isolations is not the best ones but surerly he doesn`t grab the chain but he touches it by misstake once when he`s doing reversed weave but that is becase it`s god damn difficult to keep the planes and not hit your arms with the other poi when doing reversed.

That`s my 5 cents, but on the other hand it`s not me playing so to get a fefinitly answer, ask Yuta smile


"I dont like shoes, definitely not spinning with shoes, they make my feet feel flat, my feet are not flat...."

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jaiko
jaiko

newbie
Location: caldera
Member Since: 16th Aug 2007
Total posts: 19
Posted:no yuta isn't grabbing the chain's, it's just that his control is absolutly perfecto. i've seen this technique of his live and his not touching the chains

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PCPaul
newbie
Location: Portland, OR
Member Since: 23rd Jan 2005
Total posts: 4
Posted:Various colors of flame can be accomplished using various fuel mixes, though these can be extremely dangerous and cause chemical burns if handled improperly; definitely an advanced practice but one I hope to pursue eventually, get me some flashy protective gear ;-)

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