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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:So I was at a club here in town that was actually playing some decent trance (OK, it was a bit mainstream and whitebread, but it was certainly better than any trance I've heard in a club for a while) and I pulled out my glowsticks. A club staffer descended like a hawk and told me that the cops call glowsticks "drug paraphernalia" and that I had to give her my glowsticks.

OK, I gave her my glowsticks because she's just doing her job, but the ACLU got in a lawsuit with the DEA over this regarding a club in Louisana. Apparently, nobody ever bothered to tell the Ann Arbor Police. So I've printed out a copy of the court ruling from the ACLU's website and wrote a letter to the club management suggesting that they "discuss this ruling's relevance to their venue with the Police." I also asked them to thank their staff member for her professional and appropriate approach (she was nice about it). I'm going to go over and tape it on their front door (the envelope is way too big to mail and it's just a mile away).

I hate this. I hate the way that this country just trashes civil liberties in the name of "safety." Then people wonder why I want to move to another country or why I get irritated at people who call the U.S. "the freest country in the world."

Anyways, I guess I just wanted to say to people that if you run into something like this, please don't try to argue with the club staffer. That just gets you kicked out, and besides, the staffer can't change policy; s/he's just trying to do his/her job. The pen (or the printer) is mightier than the sword in this case. Go home, get information off the ACLU's website, and try to get a letter to the club management. That's the way we win these battles.

I'll keep you all posted as to what happens.

[ 20. April 2003, 05:20: Message edited by: Lightning... ]


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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Astar
member
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
Member Since: 8th Nov 2002
Total posts: 1591
Posted:That's just comical.

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flid
flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire
Member Since: 27th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3136
Posted:quote:A club staffer descended like a hawk and told me that the cops call glowsticks "drug paraphernalia" and that I had to give her my glowsticksYou damn hippies

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Posted:Thats an interesting series of events, can you

please update us when / if you get any followup on this?

Nice one,

Josh


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Slaanneesh
member
Location: Reading
Member Since: 10th Apr 2003
Total posts: 15
Posted:chiwawa?
how messed up is that. next they'll be banning lighters as they're "Drug paraphanalia"
i know i need them when i light up!


Freestyle Walking. its fun and amusing.

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Well..You know....
I love to lick my glowsticks for that really awesome high. I really starting to see things in a shiny whirly way with them.
And when I am done with that...do you know how awesome it is to balance a line on a stick and snort away? Fighting it from rolling away is all part of the fun!
BUT I have to say, the best part is really shooting up the glowy goodness inside. Man! That makes heroine looks like a tootsie roll!

Yes I am being fecitious!

Nice job Mike. Thought it was stupid then with Louisianna, still thinking it is stupid now, but I really like the way you handled it! Perhaps you should also forward a copy of this to your local police with a note about what happened at the bar, just so they both have their story straight!


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)
Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

Enter a "Title" here:
Location: San Diego California
Member Since: 31st Dec 2001
Total posts: 2905
Posted:Pele, you so cuwazy

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Pele:
Perhaps you should also forward a copy of this to your local police with a note about what happened at the bar, just so they both have their story straight! Thanks for the kind words, Pele. I actually thought about forwarding this to the police, but I decided that this is really between the club and the police and that it's not my job. It's possible that the club just doesn't want people to have glowsticks, which is their right, and are using this as an excuse. If they call me and tell me this, I'll be fine with that. They still play good music and they're only $5 to enter, so I'll still go.

But since I can't dance to save my life, I'd rather be able to glowstick if at all possible.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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Prometheus
Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Member Since: 30th Jun 2002
Total posts: 459
Posted:It's too bad some people use that term 'paraphenilia' to connect innocent items to 'unacceptable' activities.

Why can't we identify a campaign button as 'lying paraphenilia,' and thusly ban it. Or a t-shirt as 'wife-beating' paraphenilia. It's so freakin' stoopid.

Not that I'm ready to dictate public policy or anything, I have too many personal prejudices to deal with, like those kids who have their undies peeping outta their pants...


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

Delete

Bram....
member
Location: the arms of the Ganja Goddess
Member Since: 17th May 2002
Total posts: 1551
Posted:America the new age fascist germany, next they will start saying the mexicans are taking all the jobs

You. Its whats for dinner!

As time passes, you realise all the mistakes you amde and the ones you wish you never did make.

The wave crashing on the beach

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LuNcHbOx...(Aka. Nathan)-un-single
member
Location: beneath a cloak of self-tortur...
Member Since: 3rd Oct 2002
Total posts: 536
Posted:glowsticks...drugs?!?
WTF!?!
anyways...
mad props to lightning for bringing this up ...
man i was spinnin with my friends out at the park and some stupid vice cop comes up and jacks all our glowsticks we had spent at least 50 bucks on glowsticks ..anyways..
i gotta go...
l8ters!


-LuNcHbOx, Aka. Nathan...Give a man to fish, and that man knows where to come for more fish...Teach a man to fish and you have just destroyed your market base...

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Durbs
Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Member Since: 23rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 5688
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Lightning...:
why I get irritated at people who call the U.S. "the freest country in the world."
Dude, people actually say this?

That does seem a bit crazy to me though.
I'd have to agree with the "Don't argue with club staff" though. They're just doing their job, and if they're making up a rule, arguing never gets you anywhere...


Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude

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Kittytheravequeen
member
Location: down the bottom of the garden,...
Member Since: 8th Oct 2002
Total posts: 285
Posted:that really sucks, i guess thats one of the few plus points of living in england, there isnt quite so much legislation

i'll draw you a picture ill draw it with a twist ill draw it with a razorblade ill draw it on my wrist and if i do it right a red fountain will appear washing away my sorrow washing away my fear

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:quote:And when I am done with that...do you know how awesome it is to balance a line on a stick and snort away? Fighting it from rolling away is all part of the fun!No you silly person. You put the line in between 2 parallel glowsticks and use em as a lighted runway in a dark room.

Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Prometheus:
like those kids who have their undies peeping outta their pants... In my opinion, that's just crying out for a double handed uber-wedgie


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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Mtn. Girl
member
Location: Santa Cruz, California
Member Since: 28th Dec 2002
Total posts: 65
Posted:Just want to quickly pass along the latest info that I've been sent regarding this BULLSHIT! I need to say it again louder B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T!

It may affect Burning Man and this is when I get involved...here ya go:

Subject: RAVE Act Heading to Floor, Act NOW

THE RAVE ACT IS MOVING!
IT'S NOT TOO LATE TO STOP IT: FAX YOUR SENATORS & EMAIL THIS TO YOUR
FRIENDS

Late on Tuesday, April 8, a Senate and House Conference Committee,
without a hearing, public notice or a debate in Congress, attached
the Illicit Drug Anti-Proliferation Act (formerly known as the RAVE
Act) to the Amber Alert Bill (a child abduction bill).

Representatives John Conyers (D-MI) and Bobby Scott (D-VA) valiantly
opposed this sneaky effort to pass controversial legislation.
Unfortunately they were outvoted and RAVE Act provisions did become
part of the bill. These provisions make it clear that "crackhouse
laws" apply to temporary events, such as concerts, dances or
festivals, and add civil penalties of up to $250,000 to the
statute. If passed, property owners can be punished for any drug
offense that their customers commit - even if they work hard to stop
such offenses. This is likely to deter nightclub and stadium owners
from holding events.

On a more positive note, the word "rave" and an earlier "findings"
section that implied that water, glow sticks and other legal items
could be construed as evidence of drug use have been removed from the
bill. We hope that this will ensure that nightclub and other property
owners will not be prosecuted for having these legal items available
to customers. Your faxes achieved this!

With your help we will continue to fight to remove the RAVE Act
provisions from the AMBER Alert legislation, even if the Senate and
House act and the President signs the bill into law. We urge you to
take immediate action.

Fax your two Senators to let them know that you oppose the inclusion
of RAVE Act provisions in the AMBER Alert Bill.

Let Representatives John Conyers and Bobby Scott know that you
appreciate their fight. Write a thank you note, card, postcard, or
e-mail:

Representative John Conyers
669 Federal Office Building
231 West Lafayette Boulevard
Detroit, MI 48226
John.Conyers@mail.house.gov

Representative Bobby Scott
The Jackson Center
501 N Second Street
Richmond, VA 23219
bobby.scott@mail.house.gov

Thank you to everyone who responded to our earlier e-mail alerts, and
to the hard work of all of our coalition partners in the electronic
dance, beverage and hotel industries, along with freedom of speech
and public health organizations. We especially wish to thank those
people who responded to our sign-on letter - Representative Conyers
read parts of it to the Conference Committee.

Finally, we want you to know that regardless of whether these
provisions pass or not, Drug Policy Alliance and our coalition
partners will work with you to mobilize to protect property owners
and prevent the further criminalization of dance or music events. We
will scrutinize law enforcement raids of clubs and properties. We
will work to find ways to help property owners, hotel owners,
nightclub owners and others to keep their customers safe. Finally we
will continue to advocate for legislation that helps ensure the
safety and free speech of the dance and music community and of all
people who are affected by this law.

Please visit http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/managesubscription.asp
br>to learn about lists you can subscribe to

Please join the Drug Policy Alliance: http://www.drugpolicy.org/join


The experience of learning is living.

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SickpuPpy
SickpuPpy

Ninja Rockstar!
Location: Denver, Co. U.S.A.
Member Since: 27th Nov 2001
Total posts: 1100
Posted:If I ran the country for one day the first thing I would do is to make lobbying totally illegal. You always see around election time all the smear campaigns saying things like "Candidate so and so voted against a bill giving money to elderly people so they can buy medication, why don't you call him and ask him why." Of course knowing that americans are inheirantly lazy and maby one percent of one percent of all the people watching the ad will actually call and find out that Candidate so and so voted against it because some one tacked on a lumber subsity to a medicare bill (or medicade, I always forget which is which).

I would also make it illegal to lump issues on a bill together, each item would have to be approved seperately as this is how all those little jems get greased and squirted through congress and the house of representitives, and how the American public doesn't find out about it untill it's too late.

The fact that they tried to attach the RAVE act to the AMBER alert bill is just low.

"Hey, lets take this law that no one will vote for because it's illogical and unconstiutional and attach it to something that everyone is going to vote for..."

The way our government is run is starting to make me violently ill.


Jesus helps me trick people.

Delete

Prometheus
Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Member Since: 30th Jun 2002
Total posts: 459
Posted:The United States Congress is a lot like edible underwear; It's a great idea on paper, but doesn't really work in practice. The reason legislators will lump issues together on one bill is for the express purpose of getting unsavory or low-profile issues through congress and turn them into laws. The orginal practice began in the 50's to save time, as the congress was slowed to a crawl because of legislators pork-barreling and log-rolling their way through sessions. Eventually, in order to get any laws passed, Eisenhower allowed the Senate & House to 'piggyback' several issues on the same bill, rather than vote on 10 different issues. That's why when the President votes on a positive issue, like saving a homeless shelter or fighting drugs, he also lets a corporation destroy a forest preserve, or a gives tax-shelters to people like Bill Gates.

The high-profile, media-backed issue is passed through with Presidential blessings and descreetly eclipses the indiscript yet influential bone of contention, such as tax increases, fiscal infrastructures, even anti-rave legislation.

If anyone's gotta better idea, I'll be the first one in line...


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

Delete

DeepSoulSheep
DeepSoulSheep

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Berlin
Member Since: 25th Sep 2002
Total posts: 2617
Posted:Maybe he thought you were swinging uv reactive bongs round or something.

It must be very frustrating to live there.


I live in a world of infinite possibilities.

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:It is for this reason that I would like to move to another country at the earliest opportunity. Let's face it: I might have to give up a research career, but at least I'd have my freedom back.

And it's not like most other countries have a glut of doctors hanging around and won't take another. I don't think anyone's going to have any trouble giving legal residency to a doctor who is board-certified in the U.S.A. as a pediatric neurologist.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

Delete

coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:does glow juggling equipment count as 'glowsticks'?

i was just thinking how much more it would suck if you got your electroglo/beamers/aerotechs confiscated...

they sell glowsticks in fishing shops in the uk yet i didn't see one in all the coffee shops i visitied in amsterdam. my local crackden certainly doesn't have them. drug related how?


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:Coleman, they didn't "confiscate" them, per se. They gave me the option of taking them back to my car, but since I came with a friend and the car was five blocks away, and the glowsticks were already cracked, I just handed them over.

If they were electroglows or something, they would have to pry them out of my cold, dead hands.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

Delete

NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Well at least banning glowsticks will completely stop illegal drug use.



Hey, I'm pretty sure I can get my school shut down under the RAVE law. Who do I call?


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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SickpuPpy
SickpuPpy

Ninja Rockstar!
Location: Denver, Co. U.S.A.
Member Since: 27th Nov 2001
Total posts: 1100
Posted:Hey, that's a good point. I never thought of that. If this thing starts getting out of hand I will bear that in mind.

I'm just waiting for major chain stores to start carding people for vapo-rub, and passifiers....


Jesus helps me trick people.

Delete

Flynt
Flynt

Intrepid Penguin

Member Since: 12th May 2002
Total posts: 5635
Posted:quote:Originally posted by -{Lightning}-:
It is for this reason that I would like to move to another country at the earliest I hear Australia has no problems with Glowsticks or Glow paraphanalia of any sort.....



Currently on the right side up of the world.

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Valura
Valura

Mumma Hen
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Member Since: 25th Apr 2002
Total posts: 6391
Posted:Yeah flynt. I want Mikey GEE to move here too....but believe me I have been booted from three clubs for glow stuff matey....
Just because they are "dangerous flying objects" as one burley bouncer grunted as he dragged me out the door.... Sigh...I even had them on short strings...whats the go?!?!?!


TAJ "boat mummy." VALURA "yes sweetie you went on a boat, was daddy there with you?" TAJ "no, but monkey on boat" VALURA "well then sweetie, Daddy WAS there with you"

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Kaji
Kaji

Quantum Theorist
Location: Vansterdam
Member Since: 12th Dec 2002
Total posts: 564
Posted:Looks at pile of dead glo-sticks from last rave on my desk....
Man I love Canada


In the 60's people took acid to make the world weird, now the world is weird and they take prozac to make it normal again.

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DJ Dantana
veteran
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA
Member Since: 15th Aug 2001
Total posts: 1495
Posted:I still can't belive they won't let you take in pocket knives but they let in hard, sharp cornered plactic things filled with water, on long stings. I have never seen someobody get knifed at a rave (even ones where people didn't get searched first) but I have seen glowsticks draw blood on at least four occations.

Oooo I have a good idea! lets get together with a bunch of speed freaks in a dark room with loud music and disorienting, flashing lights and start handing out hard objects on long stings so they can spin them as fast as possible with utter disregard for human safety! And let's let those same people walk up behind eachother without paying attention to where they are going.....

Don't get me wrong, I love swinging glowsticks at raves, it is just the utter contradiction that makes me laugh. I mean, glow sticks are _deadly_ in the hands of an inexperienced spinner (esp if they are on speed) because everybody knows that if a person can only do one move, they are going to do it REALY fast!

I guess the only thing worse would be if they let in BEAMING POI!!!


we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

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Psyri
Psyri

artisan
Location: Berkshire, UK
Member Since: 2nd Apr 2003
Total posts: 1576
Posted:They'll probably worry abt glowsticks explodin all over em wi the chemicals n all. LOL
Hey at least u can spin comets in a club.. my residen club wont let me... stand outside n do it still.


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SickpuPpy
SickpuPpy

Ninja Rockstar!
Location: Denver, Co. U.S.A.
Member Since: 27th Nov 2001
Total posts: 1100
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Prometheus:
The United States Congress is a lot like edible underwear; It's a great idea on paper, but doesn't really work in practice. The reason legislators will lump issues together on one bill is for the express purpose of getting unsavory or low-profile issues through congress and turn them into laws. The orginal practice began in the 50's to save time, as the congress was slowed to a crawl because of legislators pork-barreling and log-rolling their way through sessions. Eventually, in order to get any laws passed, Eisenhower allowed the Senate & House to 'piggyback' several issues on the same bill, rather than vote on 10 different issues. That's why when the President votes on a positive issue, like saving a homeless shelter or fighting drugs, he also lets a corporation destroy a forest preserve, or a gives tax-shelters to people like Bill Gates.

If anyone's gotta better idea, I'll be the first one in line... I have a better idea.
Vote Libritarian. Vote Green Party. Vote communist party.
Vote whatever, but vote down the sons of bitches that are making America the Cesspool that it is.


Jesus helps me trick people.

Delete

cede
member
Location: hobbs NM
Member Since: 13th Nov 2002
Total posts: 42
Posted:hey mike what club was that? i know city club doesn't allow glow sticks anymore, but that was because of morons who broke them open and flung the glow juice all over the walls...but you mention a mile away so it must have been necto...luckily here in flint there are no glow stick bans...in fact they encourage it here...at the purple moon they cleared the dance floor for me and another kid to battle, and when the owner of celebrations saw it they asked us to come spin at thier club the following night...wierd

posi vegan straight edge

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Page: 12

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