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Forums > Social Chat > Beach fire permit bullshit

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nomad
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

nomad

retired
Location: Paris, France

Total posts: 356
Posted:Sometimes i really hate Massachussetts and the tight-assness of people here... Here's my story:Some people from a drumming group are organizing an open drum circle that's gonna take place every saturday on a Cape Cod beach (in a town called Brewster) during the entire summer. I figured that would be the perfect place to spin fire and got really excited, especially because i love to hand-drum and because i've never spun fire along with 10-20 people drumming together. So I called the local fire department to find out what i needed to do in order to get a fire permit for the occasion. I was told that I would need to own the property to use any kind of fire. Obviously, this is a public beach... First, the guy thought i wanted to do a bonfire! So I try to explain that it was a very minimal-sized fire but that didn't make a difference, i have to own the property to start with.What is wrong with people here????? A beach, with no trees, tons of sand, and the freakin' OCEAN nearby, what is the danger?I was wondering if anybody had a similar experience. How do you SF people do for the beach burns?(a very pissed off) Nomad

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Shouden-CrD
SILVER Member since Apr 2001

Veteran Member
Location: Tampa, FL, USA

Total posts: 495
Posted:You think THAT'S bad...In Florida, they won't allow ANY permits for ANYWHERE until our drought goes away...damn..we've only been in a drought for at least 5yrs now...------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=razyRaverude=-

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Twist


member


Total posts: 160
Posted:Luckily, there's a beach here in Seattle that permts large bonfires... you can find people playing fire there almost any night of the week. Last summer, I heard things became a little tense with police as the popularity of the spot increased, but never had any problems myself.I think I read somewhere... did I read that? Burningman newsletter? That the original, "not-official official" Burningman monthly beach burn in San Fran got k-bashed by the Feds/Park Protection Services?

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Shouden-CrD
SILVER Member since Apr 2001

Veteran Member
Location: Tampa, FL, USA

Total posts: 495
Posted:K-bashed?????------------------ [PLUR]-=Crazy Raver Dude=-

-=razyRaverude=-

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Twist


member


Total posts: 160
Posted:Heheheh...... I dunno how to spell it... you know when someone shuts something down... it sounds like..."kAY-Bosh".... heheh... or... um.......
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...I guess I should have been more careful with that given the recent Ketamine thread......um... but... yeah..."Kay-Bosh"->->->to ruin something or shut it down to the dismay of others...yeah...


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Posted:Funny you should mention. We've just been whapped for the BMan beach burns here in SF. They've threated them with heavy fine if they continue to promote beach burns. So, it's degenerated to each individual thinking "hmmmm, this would be a great night to go out to the beach for a camp fire." all on the same night. I'm sorry those folks are being so stodgy (sp?). These kinds of rules vary from area to area and vary in enforcement from person to person. I was playing with a troupe in a local park once when the police came up. They happened by when we were practicing a fairly involved three person acro/fire bit. We chatted with them politely, addressed them professionally about what we were doing. They moved on. Remember that treating the authorities like humans is invaluable. But I digress, rules here are if your fire is move than 3 feet in diameter or there's more than 25 people gathered, you need a permit. I'd say keep talking to the authorities. Sometimes people will tell you something just to put you off. If you can find where this info is written down in law, that can be your ally. You may want to go to another town if all doors are closed there. SorryDiana

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Frenzie
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

member
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 515
Posted:Wow, i love Australia, not to sound like im gloating, but where we practise is around the corner from both the police station and the fire station and both drive by quite often and never worry about us! Beach bonfires are always an issue though, i think its more along the lines of inciting drunkeness and perhaps the safety issue of someone falling into the fire.

- Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -

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Twist


member


Total posts: 160
Posted:ha...'s not gloating....as far as i can tell this country is relatively unique in its need to babysit its citizens... well, aside from some relatively strict middle-eastern nations.......anyway... yah...i can very much appreciate a need to keep large groups of fire throwing individuals from gathering in public places unregulated but shit... you get 100 people playing with whip cream and water balloons and someone might get hurt in the chaos anyway... but beyond that... jeez...i think half of the violence and idiocy that foes on in these parts comes from the parent child relationship government seems to want to assume...

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adamrice


adamrice

poo-bah
Location: Austin TX USA

Total posts: 1015
Posted:I think Diana gave some very useful advice, but just to play devil's advocate (sorry, I can't help it), if you get on the cop's bad side, he can always cite you for something vague like "criminal mischief," even if there's no specific law against what you are doing. Which goes back to Diana's point about "treating authorities like humans", I guess.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

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firefly


member
Location: germany

Total posts: 52
Posted:feel sorry for you!!!welcome to the states!take it easy!!!keep the fire burning....

frank bentzin

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LiquidNinja


member
Location: Brookline, MA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Joe...There is NOOO way we can spin fire around here??!!?!? God danm i hate life, more specificly those danm ppl who try to protect us from killing are selves... danm them all!!!LiquidNinja...aka....Nick..aka...mad...aka...dinner?p.s. Im not really screaming..... :P

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Posted:whoah turbo, simmer down.this conversation reminds me of my relationship with certain authorities at school (some authorities at my school however, are incredibly cool). the question is, do they intentionally try to provoke me, or are they just unable to respect a student. still though, i try to be respectful to them and do what they say (Jesus taught to submit to authority). sometimes though, it is just plain difficult.

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Posted:Hey Red, Maybe it's a little of both. Sometimes adults get into a trip of "I'm the adult and he's the child". Sometimes they take this, and particularly when they see a self-possessed younger person, and want to remind them "who's in charge". Be as kindly to them as possible without getting yourself trampled on. Above all, don't be reactive. If you've got hot buttons, don't let them be pushed. If you can hear their points and address them directly, you may open up an dialog that will help you get along better. Remember, too, the moneychangers in the temple. Jesus rebelled when things were wrong. Diana

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LiquidNinja


member
Location: Brookline, MA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Umm guys, I was only joking around. Don't take this so seriously .... geeze.-Nick

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Finn


member
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 341
Posted:I know you guys are going to slam me for this......but seeing as Adam started the 'playing devils advocate' thing!Isn't America supposed to be the home of the free?All feedback welcome
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[This message has been edited by Finn (edited 14 May 2001).]


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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:Finn,That's what they put in the travel brochure to get you here, then once here you find out there are so many strings attached you feel like a marionette!!!!
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Nope, no patriotic love from me......------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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nomad
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

nomad

retired
Location: Paris, France

Total posts: 356
Posted:Finn, i won't slam you for this. I've always felt freer in some developping countries and in my home country (France). I like Pele's marionnette comparison. The US (a.k.a. United States of Advertising) want you to live and grow in a box. TV maybe? Sad.To quote the incredible comedian Bill Hicks: "Freedom of expression.... for those who have the money".nomad[This message has been edited by Nomad (edited 15 May 2001).]

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Twist


member


Total posts: 160
Posted:Sure, you're free to buy whatever you want here!Wait... you mean people might want to be free to do other things than... buy stuff?Wait... what do you mean "slave to money?"America is a capitalist plutocracy. The richer you are the freer you are.

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firelegend


member
Location: atlanta

Total posts: 6
Posted:If owned a beach I would let you all come and spin there.. with that said.. hehe everyone put together money and buy a beach! That would be cool! (expensive?) weird man.. what if erosion took away your beach, would you then own an area of water?? How can one own water?? It's hard enough just to own land.. wack junk..*dizzy head*-------------------firelegend

-firelegend

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Posted:what if you made a big raft type of thing, or got like a large boat with a big flat area, and had a big spin party out in the middle of the water? it's the ocean, the U.S. doesnt own the ocean so can they really tell you what you can or can't do while your in the ocean? i wonder if they would send the coast guard out to yell at you. i think people just see your doing something different and so they feel the need to come down on you. i got in trouble (well told i could not use them in the school, only in the gym) for using my comet poi in my school. but they are pretty cool about my Crystal/Flower sticks, of course im also really good at those and never send them flying or anything (not that i do with poi) i think people just find them more entertaining and less threatening since they don't move in a large sphere around you, but seem to be more controlled (that is the hugest run on sentance i have ever written).

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Knagi


member
Location: Brunswick, Ohio

Total posts: 397
Posted:Hehe I've had two chances to spin fire on a boat and I passed them both up
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The first is a small 15 footer with a 6 gallon gas tank directly under where I'd be standing so that was a no go. And the other time it was a small paddle boat out on a small pond. I could hardly keep my balance at the time so I had to pass that chance up too. I'll get it though. If nothing else for the laughs I'd get falling in
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The beach here in in Downtown cleveland hasn't bothered me about it yet. I have only been there once and didn't spin to many times, could be that there just didn't happen to be a ranger at that moment. I'd say go for it nomad if nothing else the approcing officer will just ask you to stop. 2 days until my first 20+ drum circle! WEE this is gonna rule so much. ------------------We are all in the cosmic movie. That means the day you die you watch your whole life repeating for eternity. So you'd better have some good things happen in there and have a fitting climax. --Jim MorrisonMost Memerable crowd saying "Hey look that dude's gonna set himself on fire again!"


We are all in the cosmic movie. That means the day you die you watch your whole life repeating for eternity. So you'd better have some good things happen in there and have a fitting climax. --Jim MorrisonIt's going to come from a direction you didn't predict at a moment of chaos which you didn't see coming. -- NYC

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RavingLunatic


member


Total posts: 286
Posted:Just to throw my 2 cents in..Where I live, we have a gathering every friday night, not too many people between 5 and 30, drummers, and fire spinners..the police come by sometimes, dump out peoples alcohol, and then leave.But now, the city is passing a new bylaw that sets a 10 o clock curfew in the park where we meet. I interpret this as a direct action against us. Bastards.And whoever mentioned bill hicks, bravo.He was a brilliant man, rest his soul.------------------~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

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Donia


member
Location: Seattle, WA USA

Total posts: 0
Posted:We had a little rumble with the fire department here in Seattle regarding fire and the beach after a news article kind of announced what we were doing. What it comes down to with our Fire department is that they are concerned with the audience not understanding the risk that is involved in watching a fire performance. And there is a risk....I have witnessed poi go flailing of into a crowd cause someone did not check their equipment and other such dangers at the beach. We are now required as fire artists to permit ourselves if we are doing fire at the beach.Twist..If you get caught at golden gardens with out a permit you could be fined.I also think that some of us take for granted the distructive nature of fire. And when it comes down to it..the job of the Fire department is to endure that it does not ever get distructive, cause thats when thousands of acres burn and people die.For everyone in the states, I suggest contacting your local fire department and start developing a relationship with them. Have them contact other Fire departments where there is a big community and ask questions and get some feedback from their peers. We have an awesome relationship with the fire department here. Thanks to those that came before us and to our own persistance, we have worked with the fire department to create a fire friendly environment in Seattle.Cheers,Donia LoveIgnis Devoco Industrial Fire Circuswww.Ignisdevoco.com"Where there is sorrow, I seek the flame."Rumi

Donia Love
Ignis Devoco Industrial Fire Circus

Where there is sorrow, I seek the flame.
Rumi

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SteelWngs
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

SteelWngs

member
Location: Malden, Massachusetts United S...

Total posts: 169
Posted:OK back to the ORIGIONAL post. Nomad,First and foremost.. It's Cape Cod.. One of the MOST political areas in New England what did you expect.
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Second, Maybe you should talk with the organizers of the drum circle they might have a city ordinance in place for the public gathering. I.E. one of the members of the drum circle could OWN part of the beach that you are performing on.As for spinning with a large group of drummers ... Ummmmmmm...youre going to want to bring something to ground after. I have found chocolate a good thing, or taking a swim works wonders.
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Because of the fact that your going to be WIRED for about an hour afterward. Unfortunately, I haven't made it to the fire stage of spinning yet. So my spinning experience has been quite limited, but I go to a HUGE neopagan/new age/American Indian festival every year and the drum circle is huge, so is the bonfire.
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I would really like to meet up with another "MAsshole" sometime. LOL------------------Blessings to all, Peter "There is a rhythm that unites us with the natural world. The more we learnto feel that rhythm and get it into the mainstream of our lives, thestronger can be our spirit."--- Robert Rodale


Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

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