Forums > Other Toys > So - hackysack - whats your view?

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strugzBRONZE Member
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom


Posted:
after a weekend with the boy G me and meg have been arguing about this artform..........

whilst i recognise is does require skill we cant seem to pin down the argument we keep having on msn so a little help would be appreciated:

"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."


faith enfireBRONZE Member
wandering thru the woods of WI
3,556 posts
Location: Wisconsin, USA


Posted:
you forgot
for stoners...i'd vote for that one for sure

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed


mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
clueless! what a great film!

er, yeah.

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


StoutSILVER Member
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
I picked great. It's really good exercise, lots of fun, and helps with coordination and balance. The only problem is....I can't do it. I mean, I practiced almost daily for two years ( freestyle ) which is a lot harder than simply kicking the bag around with friends, and unfortunately, I failed in my efforts to get anyways decent at this.

Maybe it was an age thing, I'd never kicked a footbag until I was 38, but I did have some of the best players in the world to play with, so I can't use the excuse that I didn't know what to do and I'll just have to face the fact that I didn't have the aptitude for it.

I did manage to get "not too bad" at playing the bag over a net

Then I discovered poi, I still have to practice that daily, but hey, at least I can do it. It'll be interesting to see if I can pull off the whole contact staff thing this year, I'm giving it a year, then I'll decide whether it sucks / I suck at it.

But footbag as an artform ? I dunno, IMO you really have to know what you're watching in order to appreciate it, and unfortunately, the activity suffers from a ( deserved ) image problem.

SymBRONZE Member
1,858 posts
Location: Diss, Norfolk, United Kingdom


Posted:
 Written by: Stout

I dunno, IMO you really have to know what you're watching in order to appreciate it, and unfortunately, the activity suffers from a ( deserved ) image problem.



I feel the same about Staff smile

There's too many home fires burning and not enough trees


Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
from a diffrent thread

 Written by: strugz



proves by his use of hacky sack that staff is for men and hackysack isnt wink





come outside and say that to my face. Here's the deal you leave your staff behind and I'll leave my hacky sacks behind. OK?



Seriously though. As those, like Strugz and Meg, who have seen me at any point in the last 4 months or so can testify I am a hacky-sack addict. I bought 5 hacky sacks at the Bristol juggling convention and since then I have played with little else. I've tried almost every discipline under the sun in the past- juggling, devilsticks, poi, staff, contact...so why hacky sacks?



3 Reasons



1- Cheap

I lose a lot of kit, I'm just generally disorganised and forgetful. At about 1 a pop my footbag habbit isn't breaking the bank, even though in the four months since I started I've bought a total of 27 hacky sacks. I have six left currently, the others I've either lost or given away as presents.



2- Portable

hacky sacks (or footbags for the pedants out there) fit nicely into your pocket so you can easily carry them around everywhere you go. this means that you need never be bored or caught without juggling props. Waiting for the bus? In a queue for the till at a supermarket? On a long flight? there are moves that you can practise even while seated.



3- New and Untapped potential

There is so much new material I have been working out since I started with these things. They open up a class of tricks I've never seen before, based not on spinning or throwing and catching but balancing and throwing things from one balanced position to another.



A note on freestyle hackysack;



freestyle hackysack for those that don't know consists chiefly of catching a small deflated bag on your foot, throwing youself into the air as your legs flail at insane speeds around said small deflated ball and then catching the small ball on one of your feet again. It doubtless takes great skill to master but it doesn't appeal to me at all. It's hard to follow what people are actually doing and i think it looks ackward and jerky.

I say this with the greatest respect for those who have dedicated a lot of time to the art, it's not for me thats all.



I prefer what might be termed "Foot-juggling", integrating your feet (and knees and elbows and head) into juggling. I'm working on a lot of moves where you have three or four hacky sacks in diffrent stable positions and then throw each to another stable position at once. For instance, one on your head, one on your elbow and one on your foot. You then flick the one from your foot to your head, looking down so the one on your head falls to your elbow and dropping the one from your elbow to your foot. the hacky-sacks just rotate step by step. then try alterantely on the left and right sides.......



In summation- Great

so there ubbloco
EDITED_BY: the boy g (1168009393)

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
Oh and as for it being an attempt to make up for my inadequacy with a staff.

Maybe the staff is an attempt to make up for some of your own inadequacies eh?

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
do it with a stage ball, and then you can be as cool as morgan.

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


Neon_ShaolinGOLD Member
hehe, 'Member' huhuh
6,120 posts
Location: Behind you. With Jam


Posted:
Hmmmmm, War, Captial Punishment, Environmental Concerns, permanent disability....

Nope this thread isn't in the wrong section at all! tongue

One way to Settle this - Strugz - you are banned from staffing for a week and concentrate soley on hackysacking. Boy G - no hackysacking and pick up the staff...

See what the other person can do within a week! tongue

Failing that there's always mudwrestling...

"I used to want to change the world, now I just wanna leave the room with a little dignity..." - Lotus Weinstock


monseratSILVER Member
737 posts
Location: waaaay south of heaven, United Kingdom


Posted:
neon, that's your solution to everything! ubblol

Chaos is the natural state of the universe

Some days I'm the pigeon, some days I'm the statue.

honourary militant margerine ninJAH

If it wasn't for displacement activity I wouldn't get half as much done


Neon_ShaolinGOLD Member
hehe, 'Member' huhuh
6,120 posts
Location: Behind you. With Jam


Posted:
You seemed to have got that confused with the nutella wrestling and jelly wrestling...

"I used to want to change the world, now I just wanna leave the room with a little dignity..." - Lotus Weinstock


monseratSILVER Member
737 posts
Location: waaaay south of heaven, United Kingdom


Posted:
there's a definite pattern of wrestling in substances that end up with everyone involved being sticky and/or slippery...

not that it's a bad thing wink

Chaos is the natural state of the universe

Some days I'm the pigeon, some days I'm the statue.

honourary militant margerine ninJAH

If it wasn't for displacement activity I wouldn't get half as much done


SpannerBRONZE Member
remembers when it was all fields round here
2,790 posts
Location: in the works... somewhere..., United Kingdom


Posted:
Strugz in 2 social discussion threads shocker cool

When I was in Montpellier last year we met some Swiss guys, one of which carried a hacky sack with him everywhere, so they'd often have an inpromptu kick about.

Easier to carry around than a football
No silly football rules like offside to misunderstand
Overall better than football because football is rubbish
Not much to do with football, generally

Verdict: hacky sack is lush smile

"I thought you are man, but
you are nice woman.

yay,

:R"


YakumoSILVER Member
1,237 posts
Location: Oxfordshire, United Kingdom


Posted:
you missed the 'for people that can't CJ' option smile

though some tricks BoyG (get a real name!) pulled off were really impressive, or had me in stitches, it's daft as hell smile

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Mr MajestikSILVER Member
coming to a country near you
4,693 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia


Posted:
eek

as IF thats even a valid argument!

straight, male, does staff, asian and great. of that doesnt solve the argument i dont know what will. smile

"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley


Mr MajestikSILVER Member
coming to a country near you
4,693 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia


Posted:
that whole video only has three moves in it (known as a "sick three") wink

imo its hypocritical to insult footbag and then say staff is totally different. they both take dedication, lots of practice and look really impressive when you're good.

"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley


M33k0BRONZE Member
78 posts
Location: Denver, Colorado, USA


Posted:
I used to play hackysack when I was in middle school, the guys loved it since I was the only girl that could somewhat play, although I still sucked, lol

Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
 Written by: Yakumo


you missed the 'for people that can't CJ' option smile

though some tricks BoyG (get a real name!) pulled off were really impressive, or had me in stitches, it's daft as hell smile



Um.......

Whats wrong with my name?
What does it mean to CJ?

And yes haccy sack is daft, I think thats part of the appeal. Yes it's silly- revel in the sillyness. You need quite a comic persona to pull it off. There are definitely quite a few moves I'm working on just for comic effect, impressions and old-school disco moves with haccy-sacks.

I concede you don't want people to be thinking
"Thats insanely skillful but are you aware that it makes you look like an epileptic man dancing on a hot-plate?".

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
Just realised that "CJ" is contact juggle

I can do quite a bit of contact and some staff actually. My isolations and butterflies are decent and I can do a pyramid too. With a staff I can do a snes and some other contact bits and bobs that I don't know the names of.

Why is haccy sack for people thats can't do other things? I think it's pretty much the hardest discipline to get started with of any of them (except cigar boxes maybe).

It makes no sense to say haccy sack is for people who can't do staff because the basics are harder. If anything Staff is for people who can't do haccy-sack. ubbloco

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


Mr MajestikSILVER Member
coming to a country near you
4,693 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia


Posted:
 Written by: the boy g


It makes no sense to say haccy sack is for people who can't do staff because the basics are harder. If anything Staff is for people who can't do haccy-sack. ubbloco



damn straight

(its the sport of footbag, not the brandname hackie sack wink)

incidentally i think i broke my toe yesterday si i cant play any more frown and i only recently got brand new footbag shoes for christmas!

"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley


StoutSILVER Member
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
I'm with the boy g on the difficulty issue. Footbag is extremely difficult to get going with ( I only started playing with a few others as a means to stay warm in an outdoor art market in the chilly early part of the season ) , not to mention it really is very physically demanding.

Unlike poi, footbag is one of those activities where people drop out right away, quite often after their first session, as a lot of the kicks could be described as "unnatural" and, even if your in decent shape, footbag is easy to overdo, and a good way to hurt yourself. ( sez me with a driveway full of blood and teeth from learning contact staff wink )

mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
I think hacky sack is the easy version of chinlone. Chinlone is the absolute win.



And hacky sack hard? Not compared to catching an acrylic on your foot or any small hard round ball. I'm much more impressed with people that juggle with their feet than hacky sackers. footbags just drop on your foot and stay there. You barely need to match speed or get it in the right spot on your foot.



But then I prefer things that are hard to things that are soft (easy). and not just in the literal sense.



and I prefer things that at least pretend to look nice or graceful, (like chinlone) rather than things which don't care about looking like a epileptic man dancing on a hot-plate, and invariably it's a skinny white guy with no top on, sweating, and tiny tight shorts on. Unnatural.



I wish that video of morgan was still online.

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


strugzBRONZE Member
3,964 posts
Location: Southampton - Possibly..., United Kingdom


Posted:
whoa this thread has been taken seriously........ not my intention at all rolleyes

nice one guys - keep debating biggrin

Meg i think your like hacksack! wink

ubbangel

"...We don't stop playing because we get old, we get old because we stop playing......."


mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
Drugz I think you're unnatural. tongue wink

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


StoutSILVER Member
1,872 posts
Location: Canada


Posted:
I'd never heard of chinlone before, so I did a little research and found this really cool video clip. Maybe it's been on Drew's blog thread before ?

Anyways, from a just kicking the thing around perspective, the big rattan ball is marginally more difficult for the average player than a regular sand filled footbag, and about the same difficulty level when compared to a regular bead filled footbag.

Freestlying with a sandbag is a completely different game, more like doing contact when compared to regular spinning. but one thing these disciplines have in common is they're all harder ( IMO ) than poi.

I'll agree that catching a hard acrylic ball on your foot is harder than catching a sand filled bag, but really, how many people can juggle with their feet ? It's not the time killing "lets go out and have some fun kicking the bag around" activity that a hack circle is.

I've played the Thai equivalent if chinlone quite a bit in Thailand, I was judged an above average player due to my footbag experience and I really didn't find the skills of the Thais, playing their game, anywhere near the skill level of the people in the above video. So from a " amature" perspective, I'm going to judge the traditional hacky sack, and chinlone ball as about the same.

Hint for Thailand travellers, carry one of the rattan balls around with you, strap it to the outside of your backpack even, guaranteed, the Thai locals will think of you just a little bit better than they do the "average" tourist.

If you really want a challenge, try one of those golf ball sized rattan balls.

mcp, that's about the best, and most accurate description I've ever read of freestyle footbag, epileptic on a hotplate.... ubblol

mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
I think it was in the very early days of drews thread. I think it's an awesome sport and majorly more impressive than FS footbag cos it's an actual sport, grace is part of the sport, and it's not predominantly done by sweaty almost naked skinny white boys.

Plus, the difficulty of something depends on how you look at it. If you think poi isn't difficult it's because the entry level difficulty is low, not because you can't do difficult things with it. Plus obviously the difficulty level is different for different people. The difficult of gymnastics and XMA tricks for me is very high, but for others it's not so. And yes, I'd much rather be able to do XMA flips and tricks, than contact staff. eek I know!

er, so which is the 'above video' you refer to? the one in your post or the kid on a hotplate one in someone elses post?

plus what is a hacky sack? bead or sand filled? and what is a normal footbag filled with?

these things will help your post make sense. like you say that the thai's weren't as good as the people in the chinlone video, hence you're going to class them in the same skill level as 'traditional' hackysack? why? what does that mean?

And yeah just because many people don't do foot juggling, doesn't mean it's ridiculously hard... I think thou that being able to curl up your toes lots really helps, something I can't do... frown

I've learnt to catch and kickup a juggling beanbag, a stiff one, a stage ball and had a tiny bit of experience with a hackysack of some type and the hacky sack was way easier than the juggling balls. (I haven't tried catching hard CJ balls yet) So I assume a hard ball of a size slightly bigger than 100mm would be much much harder than a hackysack. (Or freestyle football skills of the same ilk.)

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
I would argue that when discussing the relative difficulty of disciplines it only makes sense to refer to the entry-level difficulty as any prop worth picking up has an almost infinite number of moves that can be mastered so could be said to be almost infinitely difficult. the entry level matters because most people who use the prop will be close to the entry level. Setting a high entry level thus makes the prop less accessible and those who use it more skilled on average. If I hear that one person can do poi and another can do flying trapeze I know who I'd think was more dedicated and skillful. I could be wrong, but it would be rare indeed.



Chinlone doesn't seem to me to be a sport because it doesn't really have a competitive element. to me a sport should have a competitive element. If Chinlone is a sport then so is club-passing and haccy-sack. The WJF aside I think most people consider these a past-time. This is not to belittle Chinlone, hell we're all jugglers here.



A normal footbag is filled with sand, for catching and throwing.



A haccy-sack is filled with beads for kicking between friends and the two are very diffrent.



And I think foot-juggling is ridiculously hard. I can move footbags around quite profficiently but I can barely catch an acrylic. It is indeed much harder and thus much more impressive. As to actualy juggling with your feet, it's just possible with footbags, but even then there's only one or two people that have ever managed to get more than a few cycles. The entry level to foot-juggling is undoubtedly higher than the entry level to footbag. On the other hand you can do much more with a footbag, things that simply wouldn't be possible with a hard ball. It's a diffrent discipline.
EDITED_BY: Mascot (1168282480)

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


Mascot 301 posts

Posted:
 Written by: mcp


Plus, the difficulty of something depends on how you look at it. If you think poi isn't difficult it's because the entry level difficulty is low, not because you can't do difficult things with it.





 Written by: mcp


I assume a hard ball of a size slightly bigger than 100mm would be much much harder than a hackysack. (Or freestyle football skills of the same ilk.)

Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes


YakumoSILVER Member
1,237 posts
Location: Oxfordshire, United Kingdom


Posted:
 Written by: strugz

Meg i think your like hacksack!



Meg's beneath Jea9's feet? biggrin

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YakumoSILVER Member
1,237 posts
Location: Oxfordshire, United Kingdom


Posted:
incidentally I don't beleive there's anything stopping you doing XMA (god I hate that term tbh) tricks MCP, if you have the determination, and if you really feel you'd rather do that than staff, I know you would, after all you had the determination for that to an amazing level smile. Unlike most you've got access to most of the kit you'd need to start in you're own home too! (I seem to remember seeing a big crash mat?).

the hardest part for most is the various mental blocks, mostly based on a healthy fear for ones own safety, even with all the padding and crash mats in the world. The next is just dogged determination, that builds up the muscles you'd need if you don't have them yet, but I'm sure you knew that, and there must be someone arround there doing something like that that can help?

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YakumoSILVER Member
1,237 posts
Location: Oxfordshire, United Kingdom


Posted:
chinlon is a sport then, there is a competitive element to it, from what I read. you don't score points though, the winner is who impressed the crowd the most.

( I'm sure I read that somewhere, but wiki doesn't mention a winning clause, though it does mention a competetive version with a net https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinlone
)

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