NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:This isn't really something I knew much about despite the fact that it's pretty well known.

I found this popular Princeton video.

And this article.

I dunno. I thought at least Coleman would get a kick out of it. Right blend of geeky and political. wink

I was impressed by both the video and the article for giving logical, fact based arguements rather than the usual "THE SKY IS FALLING!" rants.

Hey, at least with voter fraud I won't have to live with the depression of knowing that my country actually VOTED for the current president. wink


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:They just ran stuff on this on Yahoo and CNN too.

I have yet to believe we actually voted in this Bush. Not after the whole "Florida" debacle have I actually believe in the vote. shrug


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Heh... just go read an AOL forum and you'll be convinced that there are plenty enough Bush Backers to go around.

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Oooh...see, I avoid AO-hell for that reason. The fact that the southern contingent of my family is on there is enough for me to say "No thanks!" in my best Northern Dialect.

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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jenster
jenster

member
Location: where butterflies fly
Member Since: 3rd Oct 2002
Total posts: 57
Posted:you should check out a documentary called invisible ballots, its about the fraud in the American voting system...very enlightening!!

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alien_oddity
alien_oddity

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: in the trees
Member Since: 31st Dec 2004
Total posts: 7193
Posted:pele and NYC (as your both americans)..... what was all the fuss about with the "chads" incident??? i never really paid much attention to it at the time but it was something along the lines of they had to re-count the ballots so many times as there was lots of confusion about the results of the election.







not sure either if it was bush or clinton


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Ravehead...are you talking about the Florida re-count/screw up? The first GWB election?

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Way way way too much information about chads.

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alien_oddity
alien_oddity

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: in the trees
Member Since: 31st Dec 2004
Total posts: 7193
Posted:i think it was the florida re-count screw up pele ubblol

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:I've never heard the Votomatics called Chad. Just the little hole punches, which are also from any hole punch thingy, not just voting. It screwed me up. Sorry. :blush:

That was 2000 in Florida with the vote for Bush's first term.

The media stated twice who the winner was *before* realizing that the votes in Florida were so close they needed to be recounted (First they said Gore, then they said Bush THEN they called recount). Bush *didn't* win the Popular Vote (that of the people) but did win the Electoral College vote (the politicians) and so won based on that.

Anyway, Gore called for *manual* recount in three counties, Bush sued stating that the machined recount picked up on innaccuracies and the US Supreme Court had to waste thier time on this, tell Florida to stop all recount process due to lack of spotted inaccuracies and told Florida to just issue the statement of the winner.

Investigations found:

Part of the problem is that many in the media assumed that all of Florida polls closed at 7. They didn't. That is where the inaccurate assumptions and announcement came from with them.

Then there is no standardized voting in Florida.
There were inaccurately filled out and over 100,000 missing Absentee Ballots.
Jeb Bush was governer so that came into question.
Gov't issued road blocks were put up in mostly democratic counties (Bush is republican).
The State Secratary came under investigation because she did alot of underhanded things supporting Bush.
A man who had been ousted from mayoral status on Vote Fraud charges was actually working for the Bush campaign in dealing with absentee ballots, and actually filled in some of the absentee ballots.
Bush's cousin was working for the media, was speaking with the Bush's on the phone and is the one who told the media to claim Florida Bush country.
My favorite: The Republican Party paid to bring in protesters from other states to protest the recount.

One of the counties in Florida have "butterfly ballots". Lists on two sides, set up symmetrically, and where punch holes are utilized. They found when looking at these that there was an inordinate amount of votes for candidate Buchanan, and think that people, not understanding how these ballots work, voted for Buchanon instead of Gore...who was in a similar line, but due to hole placement would have allowed someone who was thinking they were voting for Gore to actually vote for Buchanan and never know it.
Thus, this form of ballot has been seriously scrutinized since.

The thing is, I think if they were to investigate the vote in ANY state, they would find underhanded and dirty politics like this. It was just looked into in Florida because it was too close and I think because Bush had too many relatives and blatant supporters for Gore to allow it to just go.

And just so you know, I'm not sure if anyone is aware of how voting is supposed to work here but the rough outline of it is...people vote. That is the popular vote. The electoral college are state politicians. They are *supposed* to represent the popular vote and they are actually what determines the winner (for anyone who wants to smack me down for leaving out this or that, I said this was the rough outline ie: grade school summary).
The fact that that does not happen, probably more than we know, is what makes Americans not believe at all in the voting system.

Did that help ravehead? wink


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:You lived in America during that election and did not hear the little whole punchy things called "chads"?!

confused


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Nope. I stopped paying attention to it after the media-debacle. I read up on it during the investigations later.

I don't listen/watch the news, I carefully choose the news-docs I do watch and pick and choose online what I read and have since the 90's.

I know Votomatics and Butterfly Ballots, both of which evidentally result in chads. But they are not actually called chads system. Therefore I had no reason to know what the hole punch was called. shrug


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:But if you don't watch the news, how do you know what products to buy?

wink


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted: Written by: NYC


But if you don't watch the news, how do you know what products to buy?

wink



ubblol No problem. Net ads tell me everything I need.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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