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tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:I thought i would start a thread for people interested in fire staff juggling,i am really interested to see any videos of people throwing two or more staffs,and in particular anyone taking it in new direction.
I am currently working on routines with two and three staffs and contemplating a serious attempt at the four staff shower,



bluecat
bluecat

geek, level 1
Location: everywhere
Member Since: 15th Dec 2002
Total posts: 5300
Posted:er. juggling can be done with one prop, meg.

Holistic Spinner (I hope)


mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:no it can't. Manipulation can be done with one prop. juggling has to have two at least. (and then it can only use one hand)

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


bluecat
bluecat

geek, level 1
Location: everywhere
Member Since: 15th Dec 2002
Total posts: 5300
Posted:i disagree.

*sulk*


Holistic Spinner (I hope)


bastl
bastl

member
Location: vienna / austria
Member Since: 22nd Aug 2004
Total posts: 123
Posted: Written by: tim_marston


seb what does phu mean??



michi means: shaking hands with open finger
david means: mouth slightly a ajar

hope that hepls wink


_told the fishfable to wes peden
_heard gloria gaynors "i will survive" 3 times live allready....in the same 20 min performance!


imakokode
imakokode

member
Location: Paris
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 121
Posted:Not really a question of number of object I think... but maybe more of distance from the body.
I think "manipulation" should be used for acting with one or several objects that stay in contact or close to the body so it's still a quite intimate atmosphere; knowing this, the "launch and catches" world could be in the "juggling" and the "manipulation" universe in the same time, but with different degrees, according to the height.

But "throws" are definitely not manipulation anymore because it induces strength therefore more height, and it could be "juggling" if there is rhythm and control.

Oliver (1st on the video) is doing some manipulation/launches and catches with one staff, then combine manipulation, launches and catches (throw and transfer between the legs etc). On a perfect rhythmic pattern, so I guess we can say it's "juggling".
Who doesn't agree?
I like words it's confusing

Meg, if you feel frustrated because you could have been part of it (well actually, you're in! somewhere in the background of Tommi's set lol) there should be a "vol.2" maybe next year when people will find more and more crazy tricks, and you'll be most welcome

I thought also that we could do a "[contact] staff only" video pretty soon, based on the same idea, what do you think?


>> all is full of love <<


mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:not frustrated... just y'know, messed with.



Plus I wouldn't have entered, cos I can't juggle staffs.



Yeah, maybe a [contact] staff compilation video would be nice. But I think maybe a [triple manipulation] staff compilation would be more interesting...


"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


Olive
Olive

enthusiast
Location: Paris 19e
Member Since: 9th Jun 2004
Total posts: 286
Posted:yess for the triple manipulation vid .. biggrin ubbrollsmile
there's enough gay video on the internet .. so I don't think we need any contact staff compilation nana

toss juggling definition .. well Meg gave the juggler definition, and Julien/Rob gave the spinner definition
I like both



darimoth
darimoth

member
Location: italy,.Tuscany-pisa
Member Since: 19th Jun 2005
Total posts: 62
Posted:Anyway i think that Olive's underleg is amazing(totally fully inspiration!)..watch out for family jewles when attempting it :-P

--Late biosas---
tired to watch videos,let's go juggling in the street.


Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:meg... rob definition of juggle make of it what you will I'm not opening that can of worms ubblol

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:mynci: unfortunately I appear to be in agreement with luke burrage. http://www.jugglingdb.com/faq/index.php?question=1

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:so am I meg I think there should be more items than appendages but rob knows where I live wink

besides you can juggle tasks and that involves no hands and no objects shrug but is still the orientation of a given number of variables by an individual which I would class jufggling as


A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


imakokode
imakokode

member
Location: Paris
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 121
Posted:I guess we should trust a dictionary that focus on "circus" or "juggling" rather than a general dictionary.
But most dictionnary are not updated as quick as the activity changes. and I don't like dictonaries tongue.

I was thinking about the direction of the eyes on the object (s): looking up should be more juggling than looking down, but, I still think it's a question of distance from the body or more precisly from the part of the body that throw the object:

One ball bouncing on the head (look up) or on the foot (look down) are both juggling.

my conclusion: Juggling start with rythm and throws controled of one or more objects.

contact staff cannot be juggling but with several regular fish tails or steve throws (for exemple). Clubs and balls manipulation is not juggling but with several regular launches.
One or 2 staffs throws are juggling because most of the time there is several regular throws wink


>> all is full of love <<


tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:sort yourself out,who's gives a foooooking toss what word you call it?im bored of maths and english discussions about something which in ((my very important opinion)) should be art not education,
die geeks die!!!

bastl you speak in fork toungues my friend!!!

as for a three staff video,its a great idea,unfortunatly i have only two patrterns on three staffs so my bit will be preety pooh!



mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:Tim I wish you'd stop disparaging yourself! You're a good spinner! I saw you doing that four staff fountain in the hall at the BJC, and I think you got a lot of "holy smoke!" looks from jugglers too. Maybe your negative view of yourself helps to push yourself to practise more, but i wish you would just quit it for a bit and so something positive that isn't practise to give you a better view of yourself.

Er, yeah. Sort it out. biggrin hug


"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


_Clare_
_Clare_

Still wiggling
Location: Belfast
Member Since: 22nd Oct 2002
Total posts: 5967
Posted:biggrin

Lol... Meg... you realise that you're telling people to be nice?

Hehehehe... what happened to you in the US?!

Hurrah biggrin

hug2


Getting to the other side smile


mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:Yeah, but I'm doing it in an agressive manner, so it's alright. win! biggrin

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:mcp,good response as always,thanks for telling me im good,your not bad yourself!, weavesmiley
i have never done a four staff fountain by the way,you dreaming about meast again? wink
joking aside,i try very hard to be positive on hop especially on this thread cos i love staff juggling,it just really concerns me that intelligence seems to be valued higher than expression,i find using siteswaps,theories,systems,etc complelty foriegn to my way of thinking,it also appears to create a situation where everbody seems to have very similar styles.I have great respect for the intelligent way in which you and others approach this fire thing of ours(as you well know cos ive made a point of telling you)i just find it confusing that people dont go on about words like freedom,creativitiy,self-expression etc.

as well as my ego and insecurities one of the main driving forces behind my wish to be better is the deep feeling of fullfillment i get from being able express my feeling through my performance,i dont need to understand a trick i just need to be able to do it fluidly and then put a bit of soul into it,with or without a crowd this feeling of expression fills me with good feelings and love,
ive had some very heavy stuff to deal with in the last 5 or so years,the massive realease of pent up anger and frustration i get from hammering bmy staffs for a few hours has helped keep me sane and out of trouble..

as for putting myself down i wasnt aware i was,im very happy with my staff progress,i try and let crowds judge me not other twilers,but fair point taken on the chin...and once again thanks for the compliment.



mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:no probs. (fountain, doh! I meant shower. They both involve water, so they're the same, in my mind.)



All this siteswap is is powerful tool for understanding juggling patterns, and helping epople to map out the entier range of possible juggling patterns. Even thou it's very powerful, it uses hte simplest of maths. (unless you start getting into that side of it) I'm sure anybody could learn siteswap theory, without much effort. Intelligence doesn't come into it. wink



And agreed: expression is an oft forgotten part of spinning on these boards.... Not forgotten by all thou. biggrin hug


"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:i know you aint forgotten expression cos i saw you getting your groove on in one of the vids you posted,
i loved it.bounce2:
anyway back to the thread,you posted on your staffs goals thread that you were gonna learn some 3 staff juggling,any progress? :



imakokode
imakokode

member
Location: Paris
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 121
Posted:I understant Meg and Tim point of view as I just allowed side swap to enter my brain, and I still think there is a time for both point of view, it depends if you feel like "i want to work side swap" or "i want my body to practice and I don't care about anything, i just free my mind" or something. alterante both and you'll feel better i guess.

about a 3 staff juggling video, well, you remember how long this last vid took to be posted (even without this hard drive prob [sorry again])
what's the point of doing nearly the same thing? confused
and don't tell me about the trailer, it's still lot of work ubbloco

we should concentrate on some [contact] or [isolation] or even [antispin] [hybrids] staff only (or [Chuu chuu] staff only !!) we have a lot of things to do. 3 staff juggling video could be the [juggling] staff only part. 2 next year, when everyone will have a better level and more things to show, and when we've done some more of others stuff.

Yes, we are in the staff juggling thread, and i proposed a version of what it means that is diferent that this theard :

http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubbthreads/show...5/o/all/fpart/1

Tim, even if you learn side swap theory and bases, you can still play (i hope you like this word) with you tools in the way you're used to wink I wish I can talk to you about side swap directly, when do me meet again? smile


>> all is full of love <<


mcp
mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow.
Member Since: 20th May 2003
Total posts: 5276
Posted:what's the point of doing another 3 staff video? I think olive will agree with me that there is more to 3 staffs than juggling.

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


imakokode
imakokode

member
Location: Paris
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 121
Posted:Ouuuuuh yep, sorry i didn't understand it this way biggrin

>> all is full of love <<


entheogen
entheogen

member
Location: Berlin
Member Since: 4th Mar 2005
Total posts: 173
Posted:Yeah, isnt it even called 3 staff juggling? To be honest I was a bit confused that the vid had so much 1 and 2 staff tricks; I thought it was already supposed to be 3 staff juggling exclusive.

'There are two mantras in life, yum and yuk. I choose yum.'


tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:3 staff contact from kyle.
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-1123519965984155103
personally i just wanted the video and the thread to stimulate debate about throwing and catching sticks in repetitive patterns,as for the next video surely we should have FIREstaff juggling cos that is the mutts nutts for me!!
Ima i dont have a big problem with siteswaps,i totally agree there is a place for them as well as more instinctive juggling,it does concern me that the balance seems to be much more in favour of technical rather than expressive juggling/twirling,
i dont know when i will see you again because im very busy performing and working.im not gonna make many festivals this year frownim sure will meet soon,
i think this will be my only fire festival this summer
http://playfestival.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=12&Itemid=40
smile



Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:does anyone have 3 staff mills's mess yet? I could do with a couple of pointers as I'm finding it quite tricky biggrin doable but still tricky

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


bluecat
bluecat

geek, level 1
Location: everywhere
Member Since: 15th Dec 2002
Total posts: 5300
Posted:i've had a few rounds. bastls solid.

get better planes. (thanks josh)


Holistic Spinner (I hope)


Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:cheers dude ubblol

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


bastl
bastl

member
Location: vienna / austria
Member Since: 22nd Aug 2004
Total posts: 123
Posted:yeah 3 staff mills mess goes everywhere biggrin



i can also perform following patterns which are based on mills mess:

_rubensteins revenge

_mikes mess

_showermills (dont know appropriate name...)



on the "staff juggling only" vid, i do them all, but just half parts of them, mixed together wink



currently i am working on

531 out of mills mess (just got the right side, so fare frown )

boston mess confused

and if we ever meet again (august ubbrollsmile august ubbrollsmile august) josh and me gonna keep on working on mills mess passing for sure ubblol



mynci: are you at play? -as i looks, i am gonna teach a 3 staff mills mess workshop there...


_told the fishfable to wes peden
_heard gloria gaynors "i will survive" 3 times live allready....in the same 20 min performance!


Mynci
Mynci

Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:bounce yes, yes I am biggrin sweet I can only do a few patterns and I need to improve my consistancy (damn rain stoppit)

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


tim_marston
addict

Member Since: 16th May 2006
Total posts: 614
Posted:beerchugPLAYbeerchug bounce bounce2 bounce


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