Forums > Social Discussion > Air conditioning, global warming and the American *cough* Western way
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playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
This is a rant more than a debate. For more focused global warming threads please use the ones already available, this is just for the air-conners and inspired by Doc Lightnings [Old link] thread in Social Chat. A thread I was surprised to read after reading this quote from the Doc himself
Now this isn't a pop at the Doc, he's lovely, it's just an example that even those who are environmentally aware still put their own convenience before reducing their global impact. Something I am also guilty of
And this isn't just about our lovely Yankie doodle dandy friends over in the New World, but their excessive use of global energy for short term national (read personal) benefit is unrivalled.
I'd like to say I love america(n's) so it's nothing personal, raised a certain way you know no better
(yes that is my tongue firmly wedged in my cheek)
So on with the post
I have a problem with Air Con, infact with most things that pollute the earth but especially air con. Even tho I have it in my car (not by choice) I only really use it if it's been sat in the sun for a few hours (in public so the windows/sunroof were closed) and I need to reduce the 50degree heat so my <1yo son can get into it. If I have a few minutes spare I will open the windows/sunroof and vent as much heat as possible without the unnatural intervention of aircon.
Our world is increasing it's average temperature faster than it ever has before. Regardless of natural cycles in weather patterns the rate of increase is far far more rapid than has ever been recorded in recent years (hundreds since records began) or proven by science over the past few millenia.
When the temp goes up so many people like to crank their air con up, in America the annual Gasoline (Petrol) consumption JUST to run vehicle air con units is equal to Indonesia's total oil consumption!!! Now seeing as Indonesia has 245m people and America has only 50m more at 295m there is an obvious and astounding imbalance.
How can indonesia, and indeed the rest of the world prior to Willis Haviland's 1902 invention, survive the heat so well without it when so many in present day think they need it just to be slightly more comfortable or because "they just can't take it" *puts back of hand to forehead and mock faints onto a sofa* regardless of the severly high carbon output from these heat transferring environmental disasters.
I agree there is a place for air con; some surgeries; essential equipment cooling etc but it's far far less than the amount we use.
50 years ago there was barely a demand, now the demand has been conveniently created by the sellers of these devices the world is being driven even further into long term environmental chaos in return for very very short term benefits and profiteering.
Ultimately air con is self propogating; leaving an air con building and entering 30 degree heat makes it feel more like 40 degrees. Once you've crossed the road to the deli or dohnut shop you're back into air con and appreciating is because "it's so damn hot outside" and so the cycle continues. After growing in this world it's easy to understand that so many people think they can't survive without it, if only they'd think outside the box a little, or even just think a little and realise what huge damage is being caused for our and our future generations in return for such miniscule personal benefit.
I'm no saint myself, I have a carbon footprint far bigger than it should be and I work everyday to try to reduce it. Born into a western capitalist world I need certain tools to survive daily life, I also know no better, but I'm trying my best to live in harmony with mother nature and reduce my carbon consumption every day. After all she's the boss, I'm just a little bug that lives on her, if I kill her I won't have anywhere to live any more
The modern use of comfort air con as apposed to process air con is bascially fuelled by economy. Putting the profit penny before the health of the world, it's sick.
If you have time please read THIS article. It's quite long but very well written and detailed.
I don't really expect many replies to this thread, but feel free to rant against the airconners with me if you want to
If anyone feels they can justify their house hold or workplace (ie office not process) air con please do so, I'd like to hear it.
[/rant]
This is a rant more than a debate. For more focused global warming threads please use the ones already available, this is just for the air-conners and inspired by Doc Lightnings [Old link] thread in Social Chat. A thread I was surprised to read after reading this quote from the Doc himself
Written by: Doc Lightning 11th Dec 03
Whether you believe that global warming is happening as dramatically as some would have us believe, you cannot ignore the fact that we have been pulling a lot of extra carbon out of the ground and reintroducing it into the biosphere. In the mean time, we are destroying ecosystems that could help to buffer that excess carbon.
We can't undo what we've done. That carbon we've introduced is going to stick around for millions of years. But we can slow, and eventually stop our use of fossilized carbon for fuel and start using renewable sources
Now this isn't a pop at the Doc, he's lovely, it's just an example that even those who are environmentally aware still put their own convenience before reducing their global impact. Something I am also guilty of
And this isn't just about our lovely Yankie doodle dandy friends over in the New World, but their excessive use of global energy for short term national (read personal) benefit is unrivalled.
I'd like to say I love america(n's) so it's nothing personal, raised a certain way you know no better
(yes that is my tongue firmly wedged in my cheek) So on with the post
I have a problem with Air Con, infact with most things that pollute the earth but especially air con. Even tho I have it in my car (not by choice) I only really use it if it's been sat in the sun for a few hours (in public so the windows/sunroof were closed) and I need to reduce the 50degree heat so my <1yo son can get into it. If I have a few minutes spare I will open the windows/sunroof and vent as much heat as possible without the unnatural intervention of aircon.
Our world is increasing it's average temperature faster than it ever has before. Regardless of natural cycles in weather patterns the rate of increase is far far more rapid than has ever been recorded in recent years (hundreds since records began) or proven by science over the past few millenia.
When the temp goes up so many people like to crank their air con up, in America the annual Gasoline (Petrol) consumption JUST to run vehicle air con units is equal to Indonesia's total oil consumption!!! Now seeing as Indonesia has 245m people and America has only 50m more at 295m there is an obvious and astounding imbalance.
How can indonesia, and indeed the rest of the world prior to Willis Haviland's 1902 invention, survive the heat so well without it when so many in present day think they need it just to be slightly more comfortable or because "they just can't take it" *puts back of hand to forehead and mock faints onto a sofa* regardless of the severly high carbon output from these heat transferring environmental disasters.
I agree there is a place for air con; some surgeries; essential equipment cooling etc but it's far far less than the amount we use.
50 years ago there was barely a demand, now the demand has been conveniently created by the sellers of these devices the world is being driven even further into long term environmental chaos in return for very very short term benefits and profiteering.
Ultimately air con is self propogating; leaving an air con building and entering 30 degree heat makes it feel more like 40 degrees. Once you've crossed the road to the deli or dohnut shop
you're back into air con and appreciating is because "it's so damn hot outside" and so the cycle continues. After growing in this world it's easy to understand that so many people think they can't survive without it, if only they'd think outside the box a little, or even just think a little and realise what huge damage is being caused for our and our future generations in return for such miniscule personal benefit. I'm no saint myself, I have a carbon footprint far bigger than it should be and I work everyday to try to reduce it. Born into a western capitalist world I need certain tools to survive daily life, I also know no better, but I'm trying my best to live in harmony with mother nature and reduce my carbon consumption every day. After all she's the boss, I'm just a little bug that lives on her, if I kill her I won't have anywhere to live any more
The modern use of comfort air con as apposed to process air con is bascially fuelled by economy. Putting the profit penny before the health of the world, it's sick.
If you have time please read THIS article. It's quite long but very well written and detailed.
I don't really expect many replies to this thread, but feel free to rant against the airconners with me if you want to
If anyone feels they can justify their house hold or workplace (ie office not process) air con please do so, I'd like to hear it.[/rant]
Let's relight this forum 
BRONZE Member
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
Posted:
I don't like air con either... wouldn't put one in my house (well duh, I live in Scotland now, but you know what I mean! Rather build a house with a proper basement so you can go there if it's too hot!)
My lab has air con because if the experiments don't run at a certain temperature they won't work, them involving enzymes which work very much dependent on temperature and all... Also things have to be stored at a halfways constant temperature.
I wish we could just open the windows but that's a no-no, first of all we don't have windows, second that's no use if it's too hot outside, and third a small breeze isn't too good for all the lovely nanoparticles that'd go flying everywhere. And we don't want flies and wasps to get into the sterile places either...
I don't like air con either... wouldn't put one in my house (well duh, I live in Scotland now, but you know what I mean! Rather build a house with a proper basement so you can go there if it's too hot!)
My lab has air con because if the experiments don't run at a certain temperature they won't work, them involving enzymes which work very much dependent on temperature and all... Also things have to be stored at a halfways constant temperature.
I wish we could just open the windows but that's a no-no, first of all we don't have windows, second that's no use if it's too hot outside, and third a small breeze isn't too good for all the lovely nanoparticles that'd go flying everywhere. And we don't want flies and wasps to get into the sterile places either...
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
GOLD Member
What a Bummer
3,224 posts
Location: Shatfield, Hertfordshire, United Kingdom
What a Bummer
3,224 posts
Location: Shatfield, Hertfordshire, United Kingdom
Posted:
Sooooooooooo agree with you. I work in a lovely office air conned to the max... and when I leave those revolving doors after work, it feels like I'm stepping off a plane in a foreign country!
The saddest thing is our cantene is having its floor re-done and so they've put up a huge Marquee (SP?!) outside as a substitute... which has its own air con as well!
Its like, its a giant tent! Its not gonna work that well!!
But *sigh* I have to admit... I do prefer working in a nice temperature... especially when I get stressed with the work load...
Written by: Dunc
Ultimately air con is self propogating; leaving an air con building and entering 30 degree heat makes it feel more like 40 degrees. Once you've crossed the road to the deli or dohnut shop
Sooooooooooo agree with you. I work in a lovely office air conned to the max... and when I leave those revolving doors after work, it feels like I'm stepping off a plane in a foreign country!
The saddest thing is our cantene is having its floor re-done and so they've put up a huge Marquee (SP?!) outside as a substitute... which has its own air con as well!
Its like, its a giant tent! Its not gonna work that well!!
But *sigh* I have to admit... I do prefer working in a nice temperature... especially when I get stressed with the work load...
SILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,384 posts
Location: mancunian, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,384 posts
Location: mancunian, United Kingdom
Posted:
i agree with you dunc, my mums been in qatar for the past 4 months and with it being up to 50 odd degrees she has aircon in her villa, but its set quite cold, and so now when she came to visit in the last few weeks and its been hot, shes put the air-con on here because she's so used to it.
i agree with the fact that, if people continue to use it, it makes it feel warmer than it is outside, making people more dependable on it.
IMO stop using aircon and enjoy the sun and warmth! theres too much emphasis on 'comfort' and making money and its just shaping the way people live, and how mother nature is affected.
money does not make the world go round, it makes the world go 'pop'
i agree with you dunc, my mums been in qatar for the past 4 months and with it being up to 50 odd degrees she has aircon in her villa, but its set quite cold, and so now when she came to visit in the last few weeks and its been hot, shes put the air-con on here because she's so used to it.
i agree with the fact that, if people continue to use it, it makes it feel warmer than it is outside, making people more dependable on it.
IMO stop using aircon and enjoy the sun and warmth! theres too much emphasis on 'comfort' and making money and its just shaping the way people live, and how mother nature is affected.
money does not make the world go round, it makes the world go 'pop'
Disclaimer:im not responsible for what i say or do whether it be before,during and after drinking alcoholic substances (owned by BMVC).
Creater of Jenisms(TM)
Virginity like bubble,one prick all gone.
GOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia
Posted:
There is, i think, a border that needs to be drawn regarding airconditioning use. It being 27 degrees c outside, and that being 'too hot' and putting the a/c on to bring it down to 22 is, imho, stupid.
But when it's 50 degrees in the shade outside, and the house you're in doesn't get much cooler during the night, there's only so much a wet towel and a fan can do. And that's not much. Yes, 50 years ago, there wasn't much demand for aircon. but 50 years ago, there weren't any home computers, either, and look at how much stuff 'needs' them nowadays.
Not sure if the computer bit is on topic, so disregard at will.
There is, i think, a border that needs to be drawn regarding airconditioning use. It being 27 degrees c outside, and that being 'too hot' and putting the a/c on to bring it down to 22 is, imho, stupid.
But when it's 50 degrees in the shade outside, and the house you're in doesn't get much cooler during the night, there's only so much a wet towel and a fan can do. And that's not much. Yes, 50 years ago, there wasn't much demand for aircon. but 50 years ago, there weren't any home computers, either, and look at how much stuff 'needs' them nowadays.
Not sure if the computer bit is on topic, so disregard at will.
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"master"
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NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
I'm sorry Dunc, you've got a great point and it's relevant and logical and scientific but...
With all due love and respect, it's hard for me to take seriously when someone from the UK tells me to turn off my AC. I've just managed to live through the HOTTEST JULY IN THE HISTORY OF THE UNITED KINGDOM and guess what, it was prettymuch like a warm spring day in New York. And New York is not even that hot a place. For a country that goes into absolute panic when it gets above 30C (people die, the news can't talk about anything else and apparently your entire rail system explodes ) I find it a bit silly to suggest compromise fromthose in climates of the US where it gets MUCH hotter and MUCH more humid (it's not so much the heat but the humidity ).
There are places that use AC that NEED it (keep in mind, people actually die during power outages due to no AC), and there are MANY places that OVERUSE AC.
As usual, someone from the UK has written a post with a GREAT underlying point and RELEVANT and IMPORTANT topics and rather than focusing on just the evils of specific acts they're going to fall into steriotypical Ameribashing because it's the trendy thing to do.
I guess if you blame me it's easier to feel better about yourself.
I'm sorry Dunc, you've got a great point and it's relevant and logical and scientific but...
With all due love and respect, it's hard for me to take seriously when someone from the UK tells me to turn off my AC. I've just managed to live through the HOTTEST JULY IN THE HISTORY OF THE UNITED KINGDOM and guess what, it was prettymuch like a warm spring day in New York. And New York is not even that hot a place. For a country that goes into absolute panic when it gets above 30C (people die, the news can't talk about anything else and apparently your entire rail system explodes
) I find it a bit silly to suggest compromise fromthose in climates of the US where it gets MUCH hotter and MUCH more humid (it's not so much the heat but the humidity ).There are places that use AC that NEED it (keep in mind, people actually die during power outages due to no AC), and there are MANY places that OVERUSE AC.
As usual, someone from the UK has written a post with a GREAT underlying point and RELEVANT and IMPORTANT topics and rather than focusing on just the evils of specific acts they're going to fall into steriotypical Ameribashing because it's the trendy thing to do.
I guess if you blame me it's easier to feel better about yourself.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
SILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom
Posted:
Its not so much ameribashing, more 'whoever uses AC alot bashing'. Which is unfortunatly america. So, what can you do?
Its not so much ameribashing, more 'whoever uses AC alot bashing'. Which is unfortunatly america. So, what can you do?
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Firstly,
And as for more Humid? I doth think not sire. We're often in the 90%+ humidity here, I have friends from SA who love the 40 degree heat there but can't bear it when it's 28degrees here because we have such a humid climate. Although in fairness the average humidity for July was far lower than normal even tho the temperature was higher than normal. A unique occurance and I'm sure you wouldn't judge an entire nations normal summer weather from just one visit during one axceptional month now would you?
Yes it was our hottest July ever
and yes our trains explode but most of the comotion in the papers is just lip service to sell more papers and fill TV airtime. People aren't really running around or collapsing apart from those so old they only had weeks left anyway/so ill a brush against a radiator could kill them/so stupid they don't deserve to steal rations of our oh so precious sunlight 
People die from not having AC in power outs? I think not. Surely it's more because they're not used to living in heat because of the AC? In Arabia they don't have power available like we do so how do they survive?? They probably died during the power out because they were conditioned to surive only with AC.
Like they say, if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. If an area really is so hot it kills people then surely it's uninhabitable and shouldn't be populated by anything other than scientific research people of those guys from Dune who ride the sand worms and live on spice.
The American way isn't only carried out in America you know, it's like a nasty desease spreading throughout the entire globe quite successfully.
And I don't need to blame you to feel better about my self, I'm happy with my contribution to the environment and my efforts to reduce my carbon footprint thanks
Firstly,
Written by: Me
And this isn't just about our lovely Yankie doodle dandy friends over in the New World, but their excessive use of global energy for short term national (read personal) benefit is unrivalled.
And as for more Humid? I doth think not sire. We're often in the 90%+ humidity here, I have friends from SA who love the 40 degree heat there but can't bear it when it's 28degrees here because we have such a humid climate. Although in fairness the average humidity for July was far lower than normal even tho the temperature was higher than normal. A unique occurance and I'm sure you wouldn't judge an entire nations normal summer weather from just one visit during one axceptional month now would you?
Yes it was our hottest July ever
and yes our trains explode but most of the comotion in the papers is just lip service to sell more papers and fill TV airtime. People aren't really running around or collapsing apart from those so old they only had weeks left anyway/so ill a brush against a radiator could kill them/so stupid they don't deserve to steal rations of our oh so precious sunlight People die from not having AC in power outs? I think not. Surely it's more because they're not used to living in heat because of the AC? In Arabia they don't have power available like we do so how do they survive?? They probably died during the power out because they were conditioned to surive only with AC.
Like they say, if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. If an area really is so hot it kills people then surely it's uninhabitable and shouldn't be populated by anything other than scientific research people of those guys from Dune who ride the sand worms and live on spice.
Written by: NYC
As usual, someone from the UK has written a post with a GREAT underlying point and RELEVANT and IMPORTANT topics and rather than focusing on just the evils of specific acts they're going to fall into steriotypical Ameribashing because it's the trendy thing to do.
I guess if you blame me it's easier to feel better about yourself
The American way isn't only carried out in America you know, it's like a nasty desease spreading throughout the entire globe quite successfully.
And I don't need to blame you to feel better about my self, I'm happy with my contribution to the environment and my efforts to reduce my carbon footprint thanks
Let's relight this forum
GOLD Member
hehe, 'Member' huhuh
6,120 posts
Location: Behind you. With Jam
hehe, 'Member' huhuh
6,120 posts
Location: Behind you. With Jam
Posted:
Hong Kong also uses ALOT of air conditioning and the population as FAR denser than in america. High-rise appartments are very much standard living accommodation and every apartment has A/C. It does get sweltering hot but sometimes the AC can get a bit much and I'd prefer if they cooled it down to 'mildy'.
It's definitely not just an American thing, it's a thing for densely populated cities in hot countries...
I don't have one but does an air conditioner produce heat as a side effect as well? (Like the back of a fridge) if that's the case is this not creating a vicious cycle in which the heat generation by millions of air conditioners raises the temperature and eventually the climate? People complaining that's it's hot outside but maybe it has only gotten that hot because the a/c units are spewing out tonness of hot air? Rending the use of a/c as a luxury item?
That coupled with the use of a/c as draining on the country's power supply, further adding to the need for fossil fuels and adding to global warming to actually generate the electricity needed?
Just a few thoughts...
Hong Kong also uses ALOT of air conditioning and the population as FAR denser than in america. High-rise appartments are very much standard living accommodation and every apartment has A/C. It does get sweltering hot but sometimes the AC can get a bit much and I'd prefer if they cooled it down to 'mildy'.
It's definitely not just an American thing, it's a thing for densely populated cities in hot countries...
I don't have one but does an air conditioner produce heat as a side effect as well? (Like the back of a fridge) if that's the case is this not creating a vicious cycle in which the heat generation by millions of air conditioners raises the temperature and eventually the climate? People complaining that's it's hot outside but maybe it has only gotten that hot because the a/c units are spewing out tonness of hot air? Rending the use of a/c as a luxury item?
That coupled with the use of a/c as draining on the country's power supply, further adding to the need for fossil fuels and adding to global warming to actually generate the electricity needed?
Just a few thoughts...
"I used to want to change the world, now I just wanna leave the room with a little dignity..." - Lotus Weinstock
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Yes, like refrigerations, on a global scale air con is a nasty vicious cycle.
I like sweat, sweat and a hand fan are the best way to cool down Preferably a big hand held egyptian fan like these
Non-Https Image Link
sorry I mean like these
Non-Https Image Link
Yes, like refrigerations, on a global scale air con is a nasty vicious cycle.
I like sweat, sweat and a hand fan are the best way to cool down
Preferably a big hand held egyptian fan like theseNon-Https Image Link
sorry I mean like these
Non-Https Image Link
Let's relight this forum
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
Then why use "American" in the title? Why single out America at all? If the issue is consumption of energy then focus on that.
And I know there's always the "American Diclaimer" posted in the vein of "I've got nothing against Americans..." the same way that you hear racist people say "I've got nothing against black people..." right before they say something completely offensive.
[As an aside, I do think it's quite funny that the only people I've ever heard the phrase "I've got nothing against black people..." come from are the most racist people I've met. And it's usually evident by the other half of the sentence following "I've got nothing against black people..."]
The irony is, I'm one of the LAST people to wave an American flag out of honor. There are plenty of things that are wrong in America.
My fundamental point is:
"The relevant points of a valid argument are often lost when one overgeneralizes America."
Some of the largest groups working for change of evil "American policy" (as you might say) are Americans. Some of the largest opponents of some of the evils that are going on in America are Americans. Using a phrase like "the American way" to describe things that populations of Americans are working against is a disservice to the Americans that agree with you.
Written by: Dunc
Firstly,Written by: Me
And this isn't just about our lovely Yankie doodle dandy friends over in the New World,
Then why use "American" in the title? Why single out America at all? If the issue is consumption of energy then focus on that.
And I know there's always the "American Diclaimer" posted in the vein of "I've got nothing against Americans..." the same way that you hear racist people say "I've got nothing against black people..." right before they say something completely offensive.
[As an aside, I do think it's quite funny that the only people I've ever heard the phrase "I've got nothing against black people..." come from are the most racist people I've met. And it's usually evident by the other half of the sentence following "I've got nothing against black people..."]
The irony is, I'm one of the LAST people to wave an American flag out of honor. There are plenty of things that are wrong in America.
My fundamental point is:
"The relevant points of a valid argument are often lost when one overgeneralizes America."
Some of the largest groups working for change of evil "American policy" (as you might say) are Americans. Some of the largest opponents of some of the evils that are going on in America are Americans. Using a phrase like "the American way" to describe things that populations of Americans are working against is a disservice to the Americans that agree with you.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
veteran
1,359 posts
Location: London/ Surrey
1,359 posts
Location: London/ Surrey
Posted:
Having camped in Florida in August... uncomfortable, yes, but I survived without the air con
Having camped in Florida in August... uncomfortable, yes, but I survived without the air con
The optimist claims that we are living in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this is true.
Always make time to play in the snow.
GOLD Member
organic creation
246 posts
Location: earth, Wales (UK)
organic creation
246 posts
Location: earth, Wales (UK)
Posted:
*agrees with NYC*
Written by: NYC
Some of the largest groups working for change of evil "American policy" (as you might say) are Americans. Some of the largest opponents of some of the evils that are going on in America are Americans. Using a phrase like "the American way" to describe things that populations of Americans are working against is a disservice to the Americans that agree with you.
*agrees with NYC*
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Fair enough NYC, I don't see it as a personal attack as you seem to do but maybe that's because I'm not an American.
It was a generalisation of over consumption for increased personal comfort at the expense of the entire globes future as a habitable planet. Being that America as a nation is by far and away the best at this (see I'm being positive ) leading the world in over consumption/pollution I think citing it in the title as "The American Way" was very relevant, non abusive in either a racial or prejudicial manner and made people take interest and read the thread. Anyone who does read it can clearly see within the first sentance or so that it is not pointed in anyway at individual members of the American nation be they good, evil or indifferent, but pointed towards the trend to follow such a mass consuming nation like America and it's impact on the rest of the earth.
Also more people use AC in america than anywhere else, fact. The spread of AC has come directly from America and it's attempted domination in the AC global industry. This also makes it more relevant to the title and I think it's well within the site rules
Fair enough NYC, I don't see it as a personal attack as you seem to do but maybe that's because I'm not an American.
It was a generalisation of over consumption for increased personal comfort at the expense of the entire globes future as a habitable planet. Being that America as a nation is by far and away the best at this (see I'm being positive
) leading the world in over consumption/pollution I think citing it in the title as "The American Way" was very relevant, non abusive in either a racial or prejudicial manner and made people take interest and read the thread. Anyone who does read it can clearly see within the first sentance or so that it is not pointed in anyway at individual members of the American nation be they good, evil or indifferent, but pointed towards the trend to follow such a mass consuming nation like America and it's impact on the rest of the earth. Also more people use AC in america than anywhere else, fact. The spread of AC has come directly from America and it's attempted domination in the AC global industry. This also makes it more relevant to the title and I think it's well within the site rules
Let's relight this forum
Pooh-Bah
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
Posted:
In Arabia they majority of houses that I saw in cities were armed with AC units to the teeth. The reason that people survived withouth them in the past was because they designed and built their houses with consideration to the climate that they lived in. With the advent of 'civilisation' western architecture has been adopted creating building that act more like ovens.
Maybe you meant the Arabia of Lawrence fame though, with nomads and camels and cool bedouin tents.
EDITED_BY: Molly (1154609874)
Written by: Dunc
In Arabia they don't have power available like we do so how do they survive??
In Arabia they majority of houses that I saw in cities were armed with AC units to the teeth. The reason that people survived withouth them in the past was because they designed and built their houses with consideration to the climate that they lived in. With the advent of 'civilisation' western architecture has been adopted creating building that act more like ovens.
Maybe you meant the Arabia of Lawrence fame though, with nomads and camels and cool bedouin tents.
EDITED_BY: Molly (1154609874)
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Yup that's the one, that's it exactly Molly!
Since is was Westerised it's become like every other energy sucking nation poluting the globe. Pumping out oil and pumping in steel. They even take it to such an extreme that they've extended their costline by something stupid like 500% so they can fit even more devices to add even more pollution to the world.
What is Civil about moving away from living in tents and wearing traditional clothing that does the job better than AC ever could?? No longer building houses that compliment and are considerate to their local climate and environment is hardly civil in my book.
Maybe I should have said The "Western" way to keep the over sensitives happier
Yup that's the one, that's it exactly Molly!
Since is was Westerised it's become like every other energy sucking nation poluting the globe. Pumping out oil and pumping in steel. They even take it to such an extreme that they've extended their costline by something stupid like 500% so they can fit even more devices to add even more pollution to the world.
What is Civil about moving away from living in tents and wearing traditional clothing that does the job better than AC ever could?? No longer building houses that compliment and are considerate to their local climate and environment is hardly civil in my book.
Maybe I should have said The "Western" way to keep the over sensitives happier
Let's relight this forum
Second wave. DIVE!
132 posts
132 posts
Posted:
As a person that prefers a cooler climate, I find it much easier to work on a hot day if I'm in an air conditioned office. But I can also see that it is not environmentally friendly, perhaps aircon should have to run off solar energy where possible?
As a person that prefers a cooler climate, I find it much easier to work on a hot day if I'm in an air conditioned office. But I can also see that it is not environmentally friendly, perhaps aircon should have to run off solar energy where possible?
Hello?
Pooh-Bah
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
Posted:
I dont' think building a city out of tents is really the way forward, but using traditionally suitable styles of housing with courtyards and small windows to keep the sun out might be a better idea
Saudi did actually have some really cool architecture, with an extra 'latticed layer' built around the building to act as a shade. However, the regency house style seemed a much more popular option with giant windows that were both inappropriate to their climate and their culture (they had put up 12 foot corrugated iron sheets so that no one could see in the windows from the house next door but the sun could still beam into their rooms)
And I know that this is veering horribly off topic but I'm sure I've got a lifetime of Saudi-rants in my head.
BUT "wearing traditional clothing that does the job better than AC ever could??"
GRRR.
Perhaps for the men in their flowing white robes, but for the women bundled in not only "modest" clothes but also black robes, head scarves, often full face veils and, for the devout, thick black socks and gloves too I think AC might offer a better deal!
You really are going all out on the stereotyping other countries today aren't you Dunc 
PS. A related rant you could easily have on the Saudi's is their use of giant desalination plants to provide enough water for, amongst useful things such as drinking, massive fountains and roadside landscaping.
I dont' think building a city out of tents is really the way forward, but using traditionally suitable styles of housing with courtyards and small windows to keep the sun out might be a better idea
Saudi did actually have some really cool architecture, with an extra 'latticed layer' built around the building to act as a shade. However, the regency house style seemed a much more popular option with giant windows that were both inappropriate to their climate and their culture (they had put up 12 foot corrugated iron sheets so that no one could see in the windows from the house next door
but the sun could still beam into their rooms)And I know that this is veering horribly off topic but I'm sure I've got a lifetime of Saudi-rants in my head.
BUT "wearing traditional clothing that does the job better than AC ever could??"
GRRR.
Perhaps for the men in their flowing white robes, but for the women bundled in not only "modest" clothes but also black robes, head scarves, often full face veils and, for the devout, thick black socks and gloves too I think AC might offer a better deal!
You really are going all out on the stereotyping other countries today aren't you Dunc
PS. A related rant you could easily have on the Saudi's is their use of giant desalination plants to provide enough water for, amongst useful things such as drinking, massive fountains and roadside landscaping.
activist for HoPper liberation.
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
Posted:
ha ha, quite right, the architecture of globalisation, plonk it wherever it's bound to work... why? because we've forgotten about the centuries it took to develop our own vernacular styles of architecture perfectly suited to each individual climate, in favour of something shiny and new, with idealist visions. (please refer to any book on modernism/international style which claims that skyscraping steel and glass structures are buildings for universal use that encourage community living, then look at all the copycat buildings that have subsequently been knocked down for failing to achieve community vision, and then think about living and working in one of such buildings in the centre of western sahara... like a ant under a magnifying glass!!....) i've forgotten what my point was now i got into my little architectural rant.... but unfortunately it is now representative of lots of power and money and replicates itself like a germ in every city of the world... therefore i propose that architectural trends are a conspiracy by aircon manufacturers...
On a more positive note, investigate the work of Mr. Balkrishna Doshi, whose work might be best described just be the title of this book about him:
James Steele. Rethinking Modernism for the Developing World : The Complete Architecture of Balkrishna Doshi. Watson-Guptill Publications (September 1998).
I'm not saying it's perfect, but at least he's trying. Any building in any location could in theory be designed to not need air conditioning, unfortunately they didn't think of that at the time....
/end architecture rant
More on topic, yes aircon is bad, but it's uses more energy to cool down a temperature of 27C to 22C, than it would to cool down 27C to 25C, which over a longer period of time will happily make the room into a comfortable temperature and it will be less of a shock when you get outside!
Ok i'm another brit living in a temperate climate, but personally i don't like air-con environments, it's like an artic flippin' winter in some places...
ha ha, quite right, the architecture of globalisation, plonk it wherever it's bound to work... why? because we've forgotten about the centuries it took to develop our own vernacular styles of architecture perfectly suited to each individual climate, in favour of something shiny and new, with idealist visions. (please refer to any book on modernism/international style which claims that skyscraping steel and glass structures are buildings for universal use that encourage community living, then look at all the copycat buildings that have subsequently been knocked down for failing to achieve community vision, and then think about living and working in one of such buildings in the centre of western sahara... like a ant under a magnifying glass!!....) i've forgotten what my point was now i got into my little architectural rant.... but unfortunately it is now representative of lots of power and money and replicates itself like a germ in every city of the world... therefore i propose that architectural trends are a conspiracy by aircon manufacturers...
On a more positive note, investigate the work of Mr. Balkrishna Doshi, whose work might be best described just be the title of this book about him:
James Steele. Rethinking Modernism for the Developing World : The Complete Architecture of Balkrishna Doshi. Watson-Guptill Publications (September 1998).
I'm not saying it's perfect, but at least he's trying. Any building in any location could in theory be designed to not need air conditioning, unfortunately they didn't think of that at the time....
/end architecture rant
More on topic, yes aircon is bad, but it's uses more energy to cool down a temperature of 27C to 22C, than it would to cool down 27C to 25C, which over a longer period of time will happily make the room into a comfortable temperature and it will be less of a shock when you get outside!
Ok i'm another brit living in a temperate climate, but personally i don't like air-con environments, it's like an artic flippin' winter in some places...
Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006
if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.
NYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Posted:
It's sad that people will always assume I am being overly sensitive because I'm American.
My frustration is that it is INEFFECTIVE to generalize everything evil as 'American' because it alienates the people that can actually make a difference.
I also think it's hypocritical because singling out any other group is so quickly frowned upon by this community. It's not as bad as the UK hippy protesting American big buisiness with the Marlboro hanging out of his mouth, but almost.
Written by: Dunc
Maybe I should have said The "Western" way to keep the over sensitives happier
It's sad that people will always assume I am being overly sensitive because I'm American.
My frustration is that it is INEFFECTIVE to generalize everything evil as 'American' because it alienates the people that can actually make a difference.
I also think it's hypocritical because singling out any other group is so quickly frowned upon by this community. It's not as bad as the UK hippy protesting American big buisiness with the Marlboro hanging out of his mouth, but almost.
Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
I was only talking of the functional clothing that blows nice draughts around your body as you take steps, I couldn't care less for the idiot clothing that makes their life intolerable. I don't really understand it roots or requirements nor do I wish to learn them.
A city of tents :dream: I think it'd work lovely! But that wasn't really what I said, I said "No longer building houses that compliment and are considerate to their local climate and environment is hardly civil" again I couldn't care less what their houses are made of so long as they 'work' environmentally.
No not sterotyping today at all, getting miss read and miss understood quite a bit tho
I was only talking of the functional clothing that blows nice draughts around your body as you take steps, I couldn't care less for the idiot clothing that makes their life intolerable. I don't really understand it roots or requirements nor do I wish to learn them.
A city of tents :dream: I think it'd work lovely!
But that wasn't really what I said, I said "No longer building houses that compliment and are considerate to their local climate and environment is hardly civil" again I couldn't care less what their houses are made of so long as they 'work' environmentally.No not sterotyping today at all, getting miss read and miss understood quite a bit tho
Let's relight this forum
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
I didn't assume your were oversensitive because you're American, it was because of your knee jerk reaction to a post that clearly said it wasn't American bashing or focused soley at Americans within the first few sentances.
Same as how I used Lightning in the first post but I'm not blaming him directly for Air Con damaging the earth either.
Not being the over sensitive sort you picked that up straight away tho of coruse
And where America was cited as a prime example it was because of being the world leader of consumption and pollution, or am I being against forum rules by posting that little truth too?
I didn't assume your were oversensitive because you're American, it was because of your knee jerk reaction to a post that clearly said it wasn't American bashing or focused soley at Americans within the first few sentances.
Same as how I used Lightning in the first post but I'm not blaming him directly for Air Con damaging the earth either.
Not being the over sensitive sort you picked that up straight away tho of coruse
And where America was cited as a prime example it was because of being the world leader of consumption and pollution, or am I being against forum rules by posting that little truth too?
Let's relight this forum
SILVER Member
addict
449 posts
Location: Australia
addict
449 posts
Location: Australia
Posted:
I went to an interview for engineering work experience at an oil/gas company. I wasn't serious at all about it; i just wanted to know what they were all about.
They guy tried to convince me that global warming was all a big political scam, used by the government to control people. Sure, buddy. He then went on and on about how oil & gas reserves aren't even close to being depleted. Whatever. He's probably convinced himself...
In regards to the airconditioning, pffft, who needs em?
I went to an interview for engineering work experience at an oil/gas company. I wasn't serious at all about it; i just wanted to know what they were all about.
They guy tried to convince me that global warming was all a big political scam, used by the government to control people. Sure, buddy. He then went on and on about how oil & gas reserves aren't even close to being depleted. Whatever. He's probably convinced himself...
In regards to the airconditioning, pffft, who needs em?
Pooh-Bah
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
2,354 posts
Location: Away from home
Posted:
A happy note
Here is an example of functional, modern architecture that takes inspiration from traditional solutions:
The Haj terminal at Jeddah airport
[image]https://www.nbm.org/images/scully/HajjTerminal.jpg">
[/image]
A happy note
Here is an example of functional, modern architecture that takes inspiration from traditional solutions:
The Haj terminal at Jeddah airport
[image]https://www.nbm.org/images/scully/HajjTerminal.jpg">
[/image]
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Wow!
Now that's what I'm talking about!
But yes, it's a shame it is for an airport Step in the right direction tho so long as the huge amount of energy it took to build it is saved in the life of the building
Wow!
Now that's what I'm talking about! But yes, it's a shame it is for an airport
Step in the right direction tho so long as the huge amount of energy it took to build it is saved in the life of the building Let's relight this forum
activist for HoPper liberation.
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
Posted:
There was a debate on the radio the other day about whether it was moral to make jokes about global warming... especially as in the UK it make global warming, title something like, "global warming: bring it on". The whole debate irritated me somewhat, as it inevitably was headed towards people making stupid and selfish statements along the lines of 'who cares about the rest of the world, it's nice weather here, hur de hur hur hur...'
off! eejits. And they were all british...
if you want to hear some really rubbish arguments pro global warming, listen again https://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/shows/vine/
, i think it was tuesday...
there was another one about air-con too but i can't remember if it was the same programme or another day...
EDITED_BY: NOn (1154615317)
There was a debate on the radio the other day about whether it was moral to make jokes about global warming... especially as in the UK it make global warming, title something like, "global warming: bring it on". The whole debate irritated me somewhat, as it inevitably was headed towards people making stupid and selfish statements along the lines of 'who cares about the rest of the world, it's nice weather here, hur de hur hur hur...'
off! eejits. And they were all british...if you want to hear some really rubbish arguments pro global warming, listen again https://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/shows/vine/
, i think it was tuesday...
there was another one about air-con too but i can't remember if it was the same programme or another day...
EDITED_BY: NOn (1154615317)
Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006
if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.
BRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada
Pooh-Bah
1,872 posts
Location: Canada
Posted:
I don't see Mr .NYC as being overly sensitive. I've noticed lots of "blame America" sentiment on these boards over the past couple of years.
A relevant topic might be to question the carbon footprint of events like Play and the EJC and the contributions that "global travelling, firespinning, hippies" make to the degradation of the environment.
Given the choice between living in a tent or living in a house with aircon, what would you pick? Really. You would expect others to do otherwise?
Idealogy can be a wonderful thing at times, but how much are you willing to compromise your lifestyle in order to actually live it ?
I don't see Mr .NYC as being overly sensitive. I've noticed lots of "blame America" sentiment on these boards over the past couple of years.
A relevant topic might be to question the carbon footprint of events like Play and the EJC and the contributions that "global travelling, firespinning, hippies" make to the degradation of the environment.
Given the choice between living in a tent or living in a house with aircon, what would you pick? Really. You would expect others to do otherwise?
Idealogy can be a wonderful thing at times, but how much are you willing to compromise your lifestyle in order to actually live it ?
GOLD Member
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
playing the days away
7,263 posts
Location: The Middle lands, United Kingdom
Posted:
Well you haven't seen a Blame America sentiment in this thread!
How much would I comprimise? Lots, infact nearly all of it, certainly at least 90% of it. But like most westerners I'm just to cowardice to do so.
And I would pick a tent everytime so long as it came with enough land so me and my family could be self sustained
There's a festival right by PLAY called Workhouse Festival and they're currently drawing up plans to base ticket prices on your festival jounrey carbon footprint. The bigger the footprint the more you pay. So all those hippies in clapped out old vans better watch out! I think they'll be working out performers rates on it too. The bigger the footprint the bigger the discounts on their rates will be.
Once they've finished it off I'll be in talks with them to see how it's actually maintained and managed for a sustainable festival. Who knows maybe 2008 PLAY Festival tickets will be based on this system too
We haven't calculated the footprint of play but we will be. We're also doing what we can to reduce our direct footprint by introducing lots of solar power and fingers crossed eliminately portable toilets for the compost ones we so desperately wanted on site but couldn't
Well you haven't seen a Blame America sentiment in this thread!
How much would I comprimise? Lots, infact nearly all of it, certainly at least 90% of it. But like most westerners I'm just to cowardice to do so.
And I would pick a tent everytime so long as it came with enough land so me and my family could be self sustained
There's a festival right by PLAY called Workhouse Festival and they're currently drawing up plans to base ticket prices on your festival jounrey carbon footprint. The bigger the footprint the more you pay. So all those hippies in clapped out old vans better watch out! I think they'll be working out performers rates on it too. The bigger the footprint the bigger the discounts on their rates will be.
Once they've finished it off I'll be in talks with them to see how it's actually maintained and managed for a sustainable festival. Who knows maybe 2008 PLAY Festival tickets will be based on this system too
We haven't calculated the footprint of play but we will be. We're also doing what we can to reduce our direct footprint by introducing lots of solar power and fingers crossed eliminately portable toilets for the compost ones we so desperately wanted on site but couldn't
Let's relight this forum
activist for HoPper liberation.
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
Posted:
Re: the America issue, i would point out that in the UK, we are constantly being fed such statistics as 'if everyone in the world used as much carbon as the UK average, we would need 3 planets to sustain it, if everyone lived at the USA average, we would need 8' I have no idea if this is true and i have no desire to work it out, i'm just saying that this is the type of information we are given by the media with regard to global warming, possibly only with the intention to making british people feel better about themselves, but the fact remains that it's everybody, it's built into the prevailing dominant lifestyle choice on this planet. A lifestyle choice that the most populated country in the world is currently falling in love with (China), and unless everybody stops passing the buck and actually DOES something, the planet's f**ked anyway.
Admittedly the British media does need to wake up and realise that, but so does everybody else, including the populations of both the Europe and the USA, global warming is not a nationalist issue, the keyword is GLOBAL!!
//end rant, i hope that comes across right, i haven't proof read it...
EDITED_BY: NOn (1154616300)
Re: the America issue, i would point out that in the UK, we are constantly being fed such statistics as 'if everyone in the world used as much carbon as the UK average, we would need 3 planets to sustain it, if everyone lived at the USA average, we would need 8' I have no idea if this is true and i have no desire to work it out, i'm just saying that this is the type of information we are given by the media with regard to global warming, possibly only with the intention to making british people feel better about themselves, but the fact remains that it's everybody, it's built into the prevailing dominant lifestyle choice on this planet. A lifestyle choice that the most populated country in the world is currently falling in love with (China), and unless everybody stops passing the buck and actually DOES something, the planet's f**ked anyway.
Admittedly the British media does need to wake up and realise that, but so does everybody else, including the populations of both the Europe and the USA, global warming is not a nationalist issue, the keyword is GLOBAL!!
//end rant, i hope that comes across right, i haven't proof read it...
EDITED_BY: NOn (1154616300)
Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006
if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.
BRONZE Member
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)
Posted:
hmmmm... some thoughts
- if you can build houses for a hot climate, why not do it? Maybe not 50 years ago, but with energy prices going up it might be worthwile investing in alternative architecture
- if you can't cope with the heat and need an ac, does it have to be all the way up so it's 20°C inside, or wouldn't it be tolerable if it was set to, say, 27 or so, and a bit cooler in the bedroom?
- I agree with NYC in that UK heat is not much compared to the heat in some parts of the USA. It's not much compared to other European countries, either. And people are dying because of the heat, think about France in 2003 with thousands of mostly old people dying because of the heat. But I'd still argue (judging from the 4 months I've spent in the USA and Canada during summer) that a lot of ac isn't necessary or could be tuned down quite a bit.
hmmmm... some thoughts
- if you can build houses for a hot climate, why not do it? Maybe not 50 years ago, but with energy prices going up it might be worthwile investing in alternative architecture
- if you can't cope with the heat and need an ac, does it have to be all the way up so it's 20°C inside, or wouldn't it be tolerable if it was set to, say, 27 or so, and a bit cooler in the bedroom?
- I agree with NYC in that UK heat is not much compared to the heat in some parts of the USA. It's not much compared to other European countries, either. And people are dying because of the heat, think about France in 2003 with thousands of mostly old people dying because of the heat. But I'd still argue (judging from the 4 months I've spent in the USA and Canada during summer) that a lot of ac isn't necessary or could be tuned down quite a bit.
"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)
Owner of Dragosani's left half
activist for HoPper liberation.
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
1,643 posts
Location: ffidrac
Posted:
good point, and really new builds should consider these things but there are a number of reasons why it is not happening as much as it should;
first of all there are simply not enough architects using their knowledge in this way, demand for ever cheaper costs and space saving buildings is high. Especially as development tends to push people towards the cities where the jobs are supposedly at, and thus this is where the new buildings are needed, but as we all know cities are crammed, and if their not they spread in a kind of unhealthy way (google MUR's, mega urban regions, and see what you can find out about the southern chinese urban region of Guangdong which is expected to have something like 20million residents by 2010...)... going off topic, so next reason...
Planning new buildings in order to keep them cool, involves a very thorough understanding of the local environment in which it is being placed, such as things as angle of sunlight and exposure of the site are factors in keeping a building cool, and in order to maximise this potential you would have to understand these movement across all four seasons... now on this count i don't know whether it's the architects who choose not to spend the time on this, or the funders, or whoever, but it certainly doesn't fit with the desire for rapid urban development...
Locational issues could also be an issue for the design of the building, for example if there was a housing estate, each individual house would have to be planned in respect of it's variance in position on the site, alternative architecture like this doesn't really have a cut-out, drop-in philosophy, not if it's going to really work... As a result, more time is spent on the design of each individual building and the costs are higher...
possible reasons for starters... i'm not an architect, but it's something i'm interested in, and i could ramble for a while except i'm finishing work now and i don't have time
Written by: Birgit
hmmmm... some thoughts
- if you can build houses for a hot climate, why not do it? Maybe not 50 years ago, but with energy prices going up it might be worthwile investing in alternative architecture
good point, and really new builds should consider these things but there are a number of reasons why it is not happening as much as it should;
first of all there are simply not enough architects using their knowledge in this way, demand for ever cheaper costs and space saving buildings is high. Especially as development tends to push people towards the cities where the jobs are supposedly at, and thus this is where the new buildings are needed, but as we all know cities are crammed, and if their not they spread in a kind of unhealthy way (google MUR's, mega urban regions, and see what you can find out about the southern chinese urban region of Guangdong which is expected to have something like 20million residents by 2010...)... going off topic, so next reason...
Planning new buildings in order to keep them cool, involves a very thorough understanding of the local environment in which it is being placed, such as things as angle of sunlight and exposure of the site are factors in keeping a building cool, and in order to maximise this potential you would have to understand these movement across all four seasons... now on this count i don't know whether it's the architects who choose not to spend the time on this, or the funders, or whoever, but it certainly doesn't fit with the desire for rapid urban development...
Locational issues could also be an issue for the design of the building, for example if there was a housing estate, each individual house would have to be planned in respect of it's variance in position on the site, alternative architecture like this doesn't really have a cut-out, drop-in philosophy, not if it's going to really work... As a result, more time is spent on the design of each individual building and the costs are higher...
possible reasons for starters... i'm not an architect, but it's something i'm interested in, and i could ramble for a while except i'm finishing work now and i don't have time
Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006
if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.
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