Forums > Social Chat > should children always be told the truth?
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Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
hey right i found alot of stuff out then thought..... would have been nice if i was told the truth...does that mean children should or am i just weird?
loves all
Devilsarmy
xxx
xxx
hey right i found alot of stuff out then thought..... would have been nice if i was told the truth...does that mean children should or am i just weird?
loves all
Devilsarmy
xxx
xxxActually back on HoP guys ...
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Carpal \'Tunnel
4,172 posts
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
4,172 posts
Location: Hastings, United Kingdom
Posted:
After reading that for the fourth time..I understand it now
Perhaps re-writing it so its a little more understandable would be nice..
It really does depend on the situation...
But generally - yes. I think they should be told the truth.
After reading that for the fourth time..I understand it now
Perhaps re-writing it so its a little more understandable would be nice..
It really does depend on the situation...
But generally - yes. I think they should be told the truth.
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
yeah as well big talk with mummy dearest ...seems like kids have tonnes hidden or lied to them about
yeah as well big talk with mummy dearest ...seems like kids have tonnes hidden or lied to them about
Actually back on HoP guys ...
Owned By MiG
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Member
55 posts
Location: Morley, Leeds, United Kingdom
Member
55 posts
Location: Morley, Leeds, United Kingdom
Posted:
OOohhh, big question.
They should always be told the truth, by lying to them they are subconciously being told it's ok to lie.
This could cause problems when the litte blighters do something wrong, if they've figured out it's ok to lie (by being lied to themselves) then they will also figure out that:
a) if they tell the truth they will be definatley be punished
b) if they lie but get found out they will be punished,
and c) that if they lie and they aren't found out they will get away scott free.
It wont take them long to realise that at least by lying they have a chance of getting away with it.
So by lying to them you are starting a circle of deciet and lies which will only end up in a bad way and backfire on you.
My 2penneth (not that it's even worth that much)
OOohhh, big question.
They should always be told the truth, by lying to them they are subconciously being told it's ok to lie.
This could cause problems when the litte blighters do something wrong, if they've figured out it's ok to lie (by being lied to themselves) then they will also figure out that:
a) if they tell the truth they will be definatley be punished
b) if they lie but get found out they will be punished,
and c) that if they lie and they aren't found out they will get away scott free.
It wont take them long to realise that at least by lying they have a chance of getting away with it.
So by lying to them you are starting a circle of deciet and lies which will only end up in a bad way and backfire on you.
My 2penneth (not that it's even worth that much)
life is like a roadtrip.... The idea is not to arrive at your destination in a pristine showroom model, but rather to slide in sideways in a battered jalopy hanging out the window screaming "wow what a ride..."
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Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
wow you lost me.....but i get the idea and totally agree
wow you lost me.....but i get the idea and totally agree
Actually back on HoP guys ...
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Location: Morley, Leeds, United Kingdom
Member
55 posts
Location: Morley, Leeds, United Kingdom
Posted:
Glad you could make sense of it, I've just rereade and confused myself.
oh and in case anyone is interested there is a book called "the Lying Ape" ll about why and how people lie (it's where the above came from)
Glad you could make sense of it, I've just rereade and confused myself.
oh and in case anyone is interested there is a book called "the Lying Ape" ll about why and how people lie (it's where the above came from)
life is like a roadtrip.... The idea is not to arrive at your destination in a pristine showroom model, but rather to slide in sideways in a battered jalopy hanging out the window screaming "wow what a ride..."
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
ahhh i get you heheh well must be a good book ..... well glad im getting answers as people have turned round to me at school and said does it matter? everyone lies to everyone .....that shocked me
ahhh i get you heheh well must be a good book ..... well glad im getting answers as people have turned round to me at school and said does it matter? everyone lies to everyone .....that shocked me
Actually back on HoP guys ...
Owned By MiG
Owns Fyre and Mods_Stole_My_Name
Unofficial Lord Of Confusion And Pirate Extrodinaire
1,363 posts
Location: Nuneaton
1,363 posts
Location: Nuneaton
Posted:
Does it matter of course it blooming does,, well it does to me,, i take most things at face value and generally take it as truth until proved otherwise,, I have to,, its part of me and to change is unthinkable. Yes I've been hurt on occasion and yes I'm sure some people have taken advantage..... but its the way i am,, and the way i shall continue to be
Does it matter
Some men see things and say why....
I Dream of things that never were and say Why Not....?
Oh No I'm going to get Shot Alive if he finds out - DA
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
erm pen by the way i said oh no im going to get shot alive....hehe
erm pen by the way i said oh no im going to get shot alive....hehe
Actually back on HoP guys ...
Owned By MiG
Owns Fyre and Mods_Stole_My_Name
GOLD Member
Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
4,219 posts
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr, United Kingdom
Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
4,219 posts
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr, United Kingdom
Posted:
We're gonna get sucked into that santa claus discussion again.
Nooooooooooooooooo!
We're gonna get sucked into that santa claus discussion again.
Nooooooooooooooooo!
Always use "so's your face" and "only on Tuesdays" in as many conversations possible
BRONZE Member
Macaque of all trades
8,738 posts
Location: wombling free..., United Kingdom
Macaque of all trades
8,738 posts
Location: wombling free..., United Kingdom
Posted:
this was in social discussions a while ago...
"lies to children" is the harsh phrase for a common method of teaching.
you can't always expect a child to "learn" something in 1 bite. too complicated to get into here but it's the truth.
on imoprtant matters..tell the truth. but do you lie so they can have a childhood...or make them old before their time... I would stick with the truth
SANTAS DEAD COZ I KILLED HIM
this was in social discussions a while ago...
"lies to children" is the harsh phrase for a common method of teaching.
you can't always expect a child to "learn" something in 1 bite. too complicated to get into here but it's the truth.
on imoprtant matters..tell the truth. but do you lie so they can have a childhood...or make them old before their time... I would stick with the truth
SANTAS DEAD COZ I KILLED HIM
A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
I always tell kids the truth. However, I sometimes choose my timing. For example, I don't tell the 6-year-old that I'm going to give her a shot until right before I do it. No need to have her wimpering and crying the whole examination.
But I *NEVER* say "this won't hurt" when it will.
I also never say "You're going to be OK" when she won't.
I always tell kids the truth. However, I sometimes choose my timing. For example, I don't tell the 6-year-old that I'm going to give her a shot until right before I do it. No need to have her wimpering and crying the whole examination.
But I *NEVER* say "this won't hurt" when it will.
I also never say "You're going to be OK" when she won't.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
SILVER Member
old hand
784 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
old hand
784 posts
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Posted:
My parents lied to me about stuff when I was little, or changed the subject when I asked questions they didn't want to have to answer. Because of this and the way it made me feel, I have always been honest with my kids. I also answer any questions, no matter how difficult it can be to answer them. Sometimes it's a case of holding some bits back for when they are older, e.g. when I was asked how babies get into mummies tummies.....I didn't lie, or make up any stupid stories, but I thought 4 years old was a bit early to go into graphic sex education!
My parents lied to me about stuff when I was little, or changed the subject when I asked questions they didn't want to have to answer. Because of this and the way it made me feel, I have always been honest with my kids. I also answer any questions, no matter how difficult it can be to answer them. Sometimes it's a case of holding some bits back for when they are older, e.g. when I was asked how babies get into mummies tummies.....I didn't lie, or make up any stupid stories, but I thought 4 years old was a bit early to go into graphic sex education!
XLenX
Devoted although mostly absent owner of the 1, the original... Asena
Internet Hate Machine
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
Posted:
Bah.
Beaten to it.
Written by: Mynci
this was in social discussions a while ago...
Bah.
Beaten to it.
The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
There's a number of very good books on the subject. I recommend Where Did I Come From? by Peter Mayle.
Written by: misscorinthian
My parents lied to me about stuff when I was little, or changed the subject when I asked questions they didn't want to have to answer. Because of this and the way it made me feel, I have always been honest with my kids. I also answer any questions, no matter how difficult it can be to answer them. Sometimes it's a case of holding some bits back for when they are older, e.g. when I was asked how babies get into mummies tummies.....I didn't lie, or make up any stupid stories, but I thought 4 years old was a bit early to go into graphic sex education!
There's a number of very good books on the subject. I recommend Where Did I Come From? by Peter Mayle.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
BRONZE Member
Macaque of all trades
8,738 posts
Location: wombling free..., United Kingdom
Macaque of all trades
8,738 posts
Location: wombling free..., United Kingdom
Posted:
Beaten again eh FRd
No mercy.
see you soon buddy
Written by: Fine_Rabid_DogWritten by: Mynci
this was in social discussions a while ago...
Bah.
Beaten to it.
Beaten again eh FRd
No mercy.see you soon buddy
A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.
SILVER Member
I make my own people.
607 posts
Location: Nashville, Tennessee, USA
I make my own people.
607 posts
Location: Nashville, Tennessee, USA
Posted:
There is a difference between telling the truth, and giving them more information than is good for them. For example, if my child asks "What does the word [insert word for some disgusting act the child heard from a freind who watches southpark] mean?" I will not say "it means doing the laundry" because that would be a lie. However, I may say "it means something bad and you shouldn't say it."
There is a difference between telling the truth, and giving them more information than is good for them. For example, if my child asks "What does the word [insert word for some disgusting act the child heard from a freind who watches southpark] mean?" I will not say "it means doing the laundry" because that would be a lie. However, I may say "it means something bad and you shouldn't say it."
I Doubt, Therefore I Might Be
1,007 posts
Location: Horsham
1,007 posts
Location: Horsham
Posted:
im glad my parents were always really honest with me.
if i ever wanted to know something my parents would tell me what it meant, or how it works often in Laymen's terms. Even if i was too young to understand the explanation properly.
At the time it bored us silly, but somehow it seeped into my brain and im really glad they took the time.
As for the sex questions my parents explained them too, for which i am also glad. And i have to say it came in useful when my peers began to discuss these things, and you know what they are talking about and dont have to be the one to say "ooh, i thought that was another word for doing the laundry".
so, i think that parents shouldnt lie to their kids because it only adds to problems when they grow up...
im glad my parents were always really honest with me.
if i ever wanted to know something my parents would tell me what it meant, or how it works often in Laymen's terms. Even if i was too young to understand the explanation properly.
At the time it bored us silly, but somehow it seeped into my brain and im really glad they took the time.
As for the sex questions my parents explained them too, for which i am also glad. And i have to say it came in useful when my peers began to discuss these things, and you know what they are talking about and dont have to be the one to say "ooh, i thought that was another word for doing the laundry".
so, i think that parents shouldnt lie to their kids because it only adds to problems when they grow up...
Owner of Dragosani's right side.
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nut.
756 posts
Location: Bouncing off the walls., England (UK)
nut.
756 posts
Location: Bouncing off the walls., England (UK)
Posted:
I found out my parents lied to me. it turns out, when I was playing pass-the-parcel, I didn't just win becuase it was my birthday and everyone knows birthday-girls are lucky.. they.. they CHEATED!
Personally, I think you shouldn't lie about serious stuff, but feel free to try convince them ridiculous rubbish. It's fun, and it'll just give them something to get annoyed about when they're older- which every teenager needs.
I found out my parents lied to me. it turns out, when I was playing pass-the-parcel, I didn't just win becuase it was my birthday and everyone knows birthday-girls are lucky.. they.. they CHEATED!
Personally, I think you shouldn't lie about serious stuff, but feel free to try convince them ridiculous rubbish. It's fun, and it'll just give them something to get annoyed about when they're older- which every teenager needs.
THE MEEK WILL INHERIT THE EARTH!
If that's okay with you?
enthusiast
237 posts
237 posts
Posted:
Lying is a natural and healthy part of mental development. There are tests that show that if by about 4 years old kids don't lie that they haven't yet reached a point of learning where they are trying to figure out lying's place in social interaction.
That being said I TRY to tell my kids the truth the majority of the time but at 4 and 6, there's a few things I tell them not to worry about so I guess I don't actually lie to them on the issues that I percieve to be important.
.....although they are CONVINCED I can pull my thumb off, make the interior light in the car come on by saying "Abracadabra!" and Santa is a real entity in our house still.
As an aside, I actively tell them that I don't know everything and that I will get a lot of things wrong. I ask them to tell me if they find out I'm wrong or percieve me to be wrong. Hey, at least if I get caught out there's aprocess in place for us to discuss it.
:-)
Lying is a natural and healthy part of mental development. There are tests that show that if by about 4 years old kids don't lie that they haven't yet reached a point of learning where they are trying to figure out lying's place in social interaction.
That being said I TRY to tell my kids the truth the majority of the time but at 4 and 6, there's a few things I tell them not to worry about so I guess I don't actually lie to them on the issues that I percieve to be important.
.....although they are CONVINCED I can pull my thumb off, make the interior light in the car come on by saying "Abracadabra!" and Santa is a real entity in our house still.
As an aside, I actively tell them that I don't know everything and that I will get a lot of things wrong. I ask them to tell me if they find out I'm wrong or percieve me to be wrong. Hey, at least if I get caught out there's aprocess in place for us to discuss it.
:-)
I Doubt, Therefore I Might Be
1,007 posts
Location: Horsham
1,007 posts
Location: Horsham
Posted:
very true, i remember a case study where children had to hold a small object in one fist and get people to guess which hand the object was in.
in the case of the younger children this didnt work. they showed the object before the person had a chance to guess or such like. they assumed that if they knew something then everybody did.
this however, dosent explain why when asked if they played with my lipstick they always say "no," even when there is lipstick all over their faces and the wall!!
Written by: BEZERKER
Lying is a natural and healthy part of mental development. There are tests that show that if by about 4 years old kids don't lie that they haven't yet reached a point of learning where they are trying to figure out lying's place in social interaction.
very true, i remember a case study where children had to hold a small object in one fist and get people to guess which hand the object was in.
in the case of the younger children this didnt work. they showed the object before the person had a chance to guess or such like. they assumed that if they knew something then everybody did.
this however, dosent explain why when asked if they played with my lipstick they always say "no," even when there is lipstick all over their faces and the wall!!
Owner of Dragosani's right side.
SILVER Member
addict
475 posts
Location: Van Diemans Land, Australia
addict
475 posts
Location: Van Diemans Land, Australia
Posted:
I think they should allways be told the truth yes.
I would have rathered my parents told me the truth about things like santa claus.
that its a corporate method of control
I think they should allways be told the truth yes.
I would have rathered my parents told me the truth about things like santa claus.
that its a corporate method of control
Fair luna bright, fair luna moon
it shines at night but fades too soon
fair luna moon, fair luna bright
forever we dance
we dance under starlight
enthusiast
255 posts
Location: Melbourne - home of pirates
255 posts
Location: Melbourne - home of pirates
Posted:
Kids deserve the truth. At the level they can understand. I never got presents from Santa Claus, I got them from my family. As a result of that, I knew they were given with love, and I knew that when my presents weren't as expensive as my peers, there was a good reason for it.
I don't believe there is any valid reason for screwing with kids heads - a lie to a child is still a lie.
Kids deserve the truth. At the level they can understand. I never got presents from Santa Claus, I got them from my family. As a result of that, I knew they were given with love, and I knew that when my presents weren't as expensive as my peers, there was a good reason for it.
I don't believe there is any valid reason for screwing with kids heads - a lie to a child is still a lie.
"You've gone from Loey the Wonder Lesbian to everyone wondering if you are a lesbian." - Shadowman
Yesterday is yesterday. If we try to recapture it, we will only lose tomorrow.
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
So suppose you hear your child use the word "F
k".
My mom's solution was to make me look it up in the dictionary and then to ask me if that's what I really meant to say.
Written by: Patriarch917
There is a difference between telling the truth, and giving them more information than is good for them. For example, if my child asks "What does the word [insert word for some disgusting act the child heard from a freind who watches southpark] mean?" I will not say "it means doing the laundry" because that would be a lie. However, I may say "it means something bad and you shouldn't say it."
So suppose you hear your child use the word "F
k".My mom's solution was to make me look it up in the dictionary and then to ask me if that's what I really meant to say.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
GOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Posted:
Bill Cosby, who I believe is an authority on children
, says that this is is because all children have brain damage.
Exhibit A: A glass of Coke. You put the coke down and tell the child not to touch the coke. You turn your back and there's the kid with the glass of coke!
"WHAT DID I JUST SAY?"
"You said not for me to touch the coke?"
"Then WHY did you touch the coke?"
"I DUNNO!!!" <---That's brain damage!!!
Written by: Pretz
this however, dosent explain why when asked if they played with my lipstick they always say "no," even when there is lipstick all over their faces and the wall!!
Bill Cosby, who I believe is an authority on children
, says that this is is because all children have brain damage. Exhibit A: A glass of Coke. You put the coke down and tell the child not to touch the coke. You turn your back and there's the kid with the glass of coke!
"WHAT DID I JUST SAY?"
"You said not for me to touch the coke?"
"Then WHY did you touch the coke?"
"I DUNNO!!!" <---That's brain damage!!!
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
SILVER Member
coming to a country near you
4,696 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia
coming to a country near you
4,696 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia
Posted:
there was an interesting show by the BBC last year about children behaving like that. they got children of two age groups and said "you can eat a piece of chocolate now, or you can have three pieces in five minutes" and they discovered at what age on average children have the patience to wait and get more.(VERY simplistic explanation)
there was an interesting show by the BBC last year about children behaving like that. they got children of two age groups and said "you can eat a piece of chocolate now, or you can have three pieces in five minutes" and they discovered at what age on average children have the patience to wait and get more.(VERY simplistic explanation)
"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"
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BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
yeah i mean i watch the nanny 911 and on one of the shows the kids were lied to about everything then the parents were like my kids are hell why are they like it? i sat there and was like because you! when the nanny said that they were like but we raised them like we should .... lieing isnt raising them like you should.....my parents lied to me about a few things.......when i said i know the tooth fairy isnt real mum said i was lieing
cheek!
yeah i mean i watch the nanny 911 and on one of the shows the kids were lied to about everything then the parents were like my kids are hell why are they like it? i sat there and was like because you! when the nanny said that they were like but we raised them like we should .... lieing isnt raising them like you should.....my parents lied to me about a few things.......when i said i know the tooth fairy isnt real mum said i was lieing
cheek! Actually back on HoP guys ...
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enthusiast
237 posts
237 posts
Posted:
RE Santa Clause: "that its a corporate method of control"
"I never got presents from Santa Claus, I got them from my family. As a result of that, I knew they were given with love, and I knew that when my presents weren't as expensive as my peers, there was a good reason for it."
I respect these points of view (particularly wonderloey) but I kind of get frustrated when people spout the line about Santa being a marketing tool to jip families out of their fortune.
Some of my fondest memories were of the whole leaving Santa some cookies and a port deal when I was a kid. My mum STILL dishes the odd 'Santa' present out. She and I know who gave it but exchange a knowing smile while me kids think it's all fantastic.
Always puzzled at some people's bitterness and feelings of betrayal over being told Santa was real. It's a lark for goodness' sake. What good is the naievety of youth if not to experience some magic? If you can't explain WHY these things were done (IE to add to the fun of the occasion) then you must be nuts.
There's a guy at my work who even still has his 8 year old convinced because he goes on the roof on Christmas eve and bangs around to make noise like Santa's visiting. Fantastic IMO.
RE Santa Clause: "that its a corporate method of control"
"I never got presents from Santa Claus, I got them from my family. As a result of that, I knew they were given with love, and I knew that when my presents weren't as expensive as my peers, there was a good reason for it."
I respect these points of view (particularly wonderloey) but I kind of get frustrated when people spout the line about Santa being a marketing tool to jip families out of their fortune.
Some of my fondest memories were of the whole leaving Santa some cookies and a port deal when I was a kid. My mum STILL dishes the odd 'Santa' present out. She and I know who gave it but exchange a knowing smile while me kids think it's all fantastic.
Always puzzled at some people's bitterness and feelings of betrayal over being told Santa was real. It's a lark for goodness' sake. What good is the naievety of youth if not to experience some magic? If you can't explain WHY these things were done (IE to add to the fun of the occasion) then you must be nuts.
There's a guy at my work who even still has his 8 year old convinced because he goes on the roof on Christmas eve and bangs around to make noise like Santa's visiting. Fantastic IMO.
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
hehe so you had alot to say
hehe so you had alot to say
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Owned By MiG
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643 posts
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643 posts
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Posted:
I salute your mum.
In regards to lies, as with anyone, getting them to believe something contrary to reality will only get you someone who dosen't understand the world as accurately as they could, and that gets them all kinds of dumb things to do.
Worse still is where the basicly fun myth of something like Santa is used as a means of blackmail.
AnynomonyousParentalFigure: Be good* or Santa won't come.
Gereric Child:But, but, but I want milk in thew wineglass...
*read obedient
Written by: Doc Lightning
My mom's solution was to make me look it up in the dictionary and then to ask me if that's what I really meant to say.
I salute your mum.
In regards to lies, as with anyone, getting them to believe something contrary to reality will only get you someone who dosen't understand the world as accurately as they could, and that gets them all kinds of dumb things to do.
Worse still is where the basicly fun myth of something like Santa is used as a means of blackmail.
AnynomonyousParentalFigure: Be good* or Santa won't come.
Gereric Child:But, but, but I want milk in thew wineglass...
*read obedient
Chucks nuns
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Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,984 posts
Location: Nuneaton, United Kingdom
Posted:
i heard the most funnest thing some parents told there children that when the ice ceam man plays the music it means he has run out of ice cream made me laugh
i heard the most funnest thing some parents told there children that when the ice ceam man plays the music it means he has run out of ice cream made me laugh
Actually back on HoP guys ...
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